Petition To Restore Overheat To Ember

[GolDraG]

agree with this, 

WoF is fine, accselerant is fun and interesting stuff to hawe,

 

rest 2 abilitys is kinda worthless.

would lowe if overheats could come back instead of one of them. or as a fifth mod :P

 

 

there is no much of a discution if ember is usefull lategame. basicly she has aoe dmg, sure it might be great when comboed, but is it still beter than Novas ult? then, no mobility skills, squishy caster ... 

 

i like ember, and the only reason why i still play with her is becouse i like her, otherway, i would newer touch her most likly considering other frames

Edited March 23, 2014 by GolDraG

[rroorr]

I made Ember as my second frame cause she looked nice and I was pretty happy at first. But then I built some more frames and realised that there is no reason to use her for anything but the looks. She's like a handicapped Nova, she even sprints slower which makes no sense seeing how her ult requires some running around - and besides, just look at those thighs, why is she so slow? I can't really say anything on the topic of Overheat as it was already gone when I started playing, but she really needs some love.

[Nyxcha]

question...why does ember burn.

 

i'm serious. she sets stuff on fire. throws fire. lights herself on fire(world on fire) 

 

and then she walks over some fire on the ground and takes dmg.

 

is her suit fireproof or not

[NikolaiLev]

Frames don't have roles in this game; everyone shoots things.  Frame abilities are for fun, flavor, and cheese.  Also you can't compare any frame to Nova; she is the best at all "roles."

 

Frames do have roles.  Trinity fills a supportive role.  Rhino fills an assault role.  And just because Nova is overpowered doesn't mean I can't compare things to her.

[Riasiru]

ember without overheat = a frame that shouldnt even be allowed in lv 30+ missions, much less void...

 

why? cause without overheat she can't res a downed ally without being mauled herself.

 

why did they nerf ember. Rhino is the OP one with so much speed/armor/hp/dmg res

Yeah, I'm gonna stop you there... Accelerant causes a 100% panic proc when used. You know, like how enemies panic when they're on fire? You pop Accelerant and rez. I usually run it overextended with maximum power efficiency. You shouldn't have any trouble getting them up before enemies stop panicking but if you feel like they might, pop it again to reset the debuff and continue rezing. It's a surprisingly powerful move. A lot of people also thing that Radial Disarm is worthless, though. What can you do...

 

I'm not defending her 1 or 3... In fact, real quick I'd like to put Fireball's flavor text here.

 

"Launches a fiery projectile. It deals high fire damage on contact and moderate fire damage to any who enter the lingering flames."

 

What are these lingering flames and why have I never seen them? Seriously. This sounds like it was already suppose to be a combination of Fireball and Fire Blast and DE couldn't think of a fourth move at the time and decided to split it into two horrible moves instead... Well it does!

 

We have accelerant now, they can fuse the two halves back together and make a whole.

Edited March 28, 2014 by Riasiru

[LukeAura]

That's not really interesting at all.  Saryn is already beefy, but that's not the point of her.  Ember had Overheat, but it didn't mean she was a tank.  Pigeonholing both of them into the tank and caster roles respectively is just dull design.

It's just as interesting to Saryn as it is to Ember. Both have skills that could benefit from extra defensive bulk and close range support. WoF, and Contagion.

Saryn's intention isn't really clear. She's a bulky-long range mass chain DoT-melee-aggro drawer-short range nuker. Her intention might exactly be to be beefy with a little bit of AoE/DoT as a back up.

 

Molt is an outlier in Saryn's kit, it's not really castery, it's not really melee. Replacing it with an 'Overheat' would give her two close range/melee/tank abilities. And two DoT/AoE/castery oriented abilities. It would make her more flexible, not less.

Ember's already been stated by DE to be frail. She doesn't have to be a pure caster, but bulky is not at all an option for her. I'd think it more apt for her get a more direct boost to her mobility. Fire tends to be an excellent archetype for nimble mages. And that's what Ember should more be around, a Fire mage/Scout hybrid.

 

[theammostore]

Nah. I'm good OP. Ember doesn't really need Overheat, people just need to not get in close. She needs tweaks, but she does not need overheat.

[RealPandemonium]

It's just as interesting to Saryn as it is to Ember. Both have skills that could benefit from extra defensive bulk and close range support. WoF, and Contagion.

Saryn's intention isn't really clear. She's a bulky-long range mass chain DoT-melee-aggro drawer-short range nuker. Her intention might exactly be to be beefy with a little bit of AoE/DoT as a back up.

 

Molt is an outlier in Saryn's kit, it's not really castery, it's not really melee. Replacing it with an 'Overheat' would give her two close range/melee/tank abilities. And two DoT/AoE/castery oriented abilities. It would make her more flexible, not less.

Ember's already been stated by DE to be frail. She doesn't have to be a pure caster, but bulky is not at all an option for her. I'd think it more apt for her get a more direct boost to her mobility. Fire tends to be an excellent archetype for nimble mages. And that's what Ember should more be around, a Fire mage/Scout hybrid.

 

I'm not disagreeing with anything in particular here but what's stopping Ember or any of the other frames of similar durability (300/300/15) from equipping Redirection and Vigor?  Additionally, what about the stun on Accelerant?  Doesn't that stun, combined with its ability to make her skills lethal, actually make ember safer than, say, Banshee? The main difference between Ember and Saryn is that Ember actually has to interact with enemies to kill them (talking about 25+ enemies here, anything lower is trivial) whereas Saryn just copters to the center of the group and presses 4 once or twice. 

[Khallisto]

My old Ember loadout:

 

Fireball (as filler only) - Fire Blast - WoF (spam)

 

My loadout now:

 

Fireball (great combo with Accelerant) - Accelerant - Fire Blast (good combo too) 

Add Ignis and I have a funny frame to use.

 

 

I don't use her ultimate anymore. 

[LukeAura]

I'm not disagreeing with anything in particular here but what's stopping Ember or any of the other frames of similar durability (300/300/15) from equipping Redirection and Vigor? 

Nothing at all. But it isn't natural bulk, which tends to be the defining trait of whether or not a frame is bulky. And an Ember loaded up with all the defensive mods will never reach Saryn loaded up with all the defensive mods. 

 

 

The main difference between Ember and Saryn is that Ember actually has to interact with enemies to kill them (talking about 25+ enemies here, anything lower is trivial) whereas Saryn just copters to the center of the group and presses 4 once or twice. 

well, all frames should have to interact more when using their powers while fighting. If Ember's most effective fighting style is doing that, we're progressing somewhere with her.

If Saryn's most effective style isn't doing that, she needs more to pull her out of the simple spam 4 to win zone.

[kubbi]

I personally think Embers powers are good and they should stay. They just need to be buffed.

The thing I dont agree with is the way she's designed. She's a damage frame so she has fragile stats. The problem with Ember is her powers don't scale with high level enemies and in order to deal good damage she must get close. But she can't get close because she's fragile. Nova on the other side works perfectly being a damage frame and fragile.

Ember should be a damage frame with tank stats. High shields, health and armour. Everything of her needs a massive buff.

[Nyxcha]

It's just as interesting to Saryn as it is to Ember. Both have skills that could benefit from extra defensive bulk and close range support. WoF, and Contagion.

Saryn's intention isn't really clear. She's a bulky-long range mass chain DoT-melee-aggro drawer-short range nuker. Her intention might exactly be to be beefy with a little bit of AoE/DoT as a back up.

 

Molt is an outlier in Saryn's kit, it's not really castery, it's not really melee. Replacing it with an 'Overheat' would give her two close range/melee/tank abilities. And two DoT/AoE/castery oriented abilities. It would make her more flexible, not less.

Ember's already been stated by DE to be frail. She doesn't have to be a pure caster, but bulky is not at all an option for her. I'd think it more apt for her get a more direct boost to her mobility. Fire tends to be an excellent archetype for nimble mages. And that's what Ember should more be around, a Fire mage/Scout hybrid.

 

except she can't scout.

to slow

rhino prime is faster...

[LukeAura]

except she can't scout.

to slow

rhino prime is faster...

That was why I was suggesting she get a mobility skill?

[RealPandemonium]

You can equip Redirection and use Accelerant for defense.  You can also just play well and mitigate damage by avoiding it.  I feel like people want the game to play itself sometimes.  This is a fun game with a relatively high skill ceiling but people don't care for its gameplay, it seems.

[Nyxcha]

You can equip Redirection and use Accelerant for defense.  You can also just play well and mitigate damage by avoiding it.  I feel like people want the game to play itself sometimes.  This is a fun game with a relatively high skill ceiling but people don't care for its gameplay, it seems.

lets see how well you do "avoiding" a machine gun...or a ice leader...or a survival mission

 

lets also see how well you do in a lv 60+ mission with 15 armor, no speed, and the enemy shooting you from outside of accelerant's range.

 

while your teammates are all w8ing for you to revive them, while a room full of enemies are standing between you and them.

[GTG3000]

I personally think Embers powers are good and they should stay. They just need to be buffed.

The thing I dont agree with is the way she's designed. She's a damage frame so she has fragile stats. The problem with Ember is her powers don't scale with high level enemies and in order to deal good damage she must get close. But she can't get close because she's fragile. Nova on the other side works perfectly being a damage frame and fragile.

Ember should be a damage frame with tank stats. High shields, health and armour. Everything of her needs a massive buff.

 

Or, you know, a skill that could open her an opportunity to survive close encounters with enemies, who actively try and damage her. Oh wait...

 

Ember was AMAZING before the change. She had survivability (which needed a hardcap), she had damage (which needed tweaking), she had two skills of dubious usefullness. No one is saying she can't be amazing again the way she is now, with CC and damage (and same two skills of dubious usefullness), we're just saying that we liked her better before.

 

And I am saying that we could as well just fuse Accelerant with Fireblast to create a nice little debuffing/damaging kill cage, and bring back Overheat with some downsides to it (like lower damage and range of other skills while it works).

 

Also, would be kind of fun to turn Fireball into ranged explosive CC.

[RealPandemonium]

lets see how well you do "avoiding" a machine gun...or a ice leader...or a survival mission

 

lets also see how well you do in a lv 60+ mission with 15 armor, no speed, and the enemy shooting you from outside of accelerant's range.

 

while your teammates are all w8ing for you to revive them, while a room full of enemies are standing between you and them.

If you keep moving and take advantage of cover there are ample opportunities to use Accelerant to stun and make your move.  There is no such thing as a "level 60 mission."  T3 defense into wave 40 is not what the game is balanced around.  Accelerant also has plenty of range and if enemies are that far away from you you should be able to just walk sideways and avoid 90% of fire. Seriously, if there is a roomful of enemies in between me and my downed teammate I will throw a Fireball at the bulk of them and copter over them into an Accellerant, then copter past them to res my teammate.  You aren't supposed to face-tank damage in this game.  More durable frames give the player a greater margin for error but they don't play radically differently unless using a skill that allows them to do so.  Saryn isn't gonna last that much longer than Ember if she takes every bullet. She can take more stray hits to her HP but she still has to mitigate damage by being evasive.  

[LeoLeonardoIII]

I do wish Overheat was still there.. I ditched Accelerant after trying it a bit, i now use its vacant slot for any other random mod that'll fit in an off polarity -w-

+1 for Overheats return!

[Frostmire]

I like Accelerant , it opens more options for Ember , i dislike the other abilities though , they are just damage damage and more damage , as least Accelerant interacts with other abilities and weapons

[Kakarot-MUI]

I'm for this petition. Overheat never made her tanky to begin with, just made it so she wasn't so fragile. I wish to see overheat restored as well.

[SIDESTRE4M]

Accelerant is like Radial Blind... it seperates the noobs from the pros. xD (don't take this too serious...)

 

Accelerant is a decent CC. Much appreciated for a frame having S#&$ty defense overall.

[RealPandemonium]

I'm for this petition. Overheat never made her tanky to begin with, just made it so she wasn't so fragile. I wish to see overheat restored as well.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Dav36rye/Overheat_Vs_Iron_Skin_vs_Blessing

 

Read this. Overheat was the best defense in the game short of Blessing.  If you don't think it made her tanky then you don't know what you're talking about. 

[Nyxcha]

she went from tanky(for a limited time which is also dependant on energy.  and it doesnt give you immunity to knockback or energy loss)

 

to....S#&$

 

yeah...S#&$...take her into a nightmare mission...you'd better keep her in the last room you've cleared and hope she can get people through the wall. and hope enemys dont have punch through.  cause as she is now. if she is hit by one enemy in nightmare mode.

 

then your dead

[RealPandemonium]

she went from tanky(for a limited time which is also dependant on energy.  and it doesnt give you immunity to knockback or energy loss)

 

to....S#&$

 

yeah...S#&$...take her into a nightmare mission...you'd better keep her in the last room you've cleared and hope she can get people through the wall. and hope enemys dont have punch through.  cause as she is now. if she is hit by one enemy in nightmare mode.

 

then your dead

How is that different for any other frame aside from Rhino and Valkyr?

[Nyxcha]

well.

 

nyx's chaos means she has a oh fk button to get out of there while enemys out of range shoot the enemys that were affected

she also has absorb to protect her

 

vauban has the paralysis field as a oh fk button to get out of a place alive. or res a team mate

 

ash has smokescreen to res a teammate, or an oh fk button

 

frost...yeah i dont evne have to name it do i? snow globe

 

loki's radial disarm works as well  or u got decoy

 

mag is a bit troublesome. but her ultimate makes her invincible for its duration

 

banshee. ultimate makes her invincible for the duration

 

saryn's molt gives her the chance to escape an enemy, or res a team mate

 

trinity. link. enough said

 

excalibur has slash dash to escape enemys, or super jump.  or radial blind to take them out of the picture for 15 secounds to res a team mate

 

 

 

see the pattern? all frames either have armor, an invicible ultimate, or some ability that gives them enough time to either escape, stealth, and res team mates

 

what does ember have.

she used to have overheat, nearly invicible for the duration, though it didnt do much dmg. and it let her res team mates. or run away

 

now what does she have? 

lets go through them 1 by 1

firebolt. any help for escaping or ressing a team mate. nope

accelerant. stuns enemies for what? 1 to 3 secounds? 5 at max? you still ressing and enemies are all unstunned now.  gratz. you dead

fire blast. any help for escaping? enemy units run straight over and stick a fork in you.

world on fire. 2.2 cast time(not invincible) with cool looking skill, but no dmg res for you. no inviciblility (and your team mates are cursing you for not ressing them.   oh and you dead cause u couldnt get away from the angry mob of enemys that take 3 hits of world on fire's explosions to kill)

 

 

game, set, match. you lose

 

Edited March 31, 2014 by Arenta