MetaMortred Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 (edited) Removing pro is a silly idea, and pay to win is considered a mean to some players with rather low budget. Having platinium drop by chance in Alerts is also not a good idea because it makes you run them only for plats. Now my idea is to create Platinium Blueprints: What is a Platinium Blueprint? it creates a single platinium, and it can only be used once. The ingrediants are as following: Platinium Blueprint: 2 Gallium 2 Morphics 1000 Salvage 25,000 Credits 6 Hours They drop from bosses, and are occarionally rewards from alerts. If you have multiple Platinium BluePrints you can make about 6 Plats at the same time. They can drop from all the bosses but are extremely rare. Even rarer than the default Blueprints the Bosses are supposed to drop. Accroding to my calculations, if balance is right, this will be exactly enough to encourage playeyrs to play more in order to get more plat and unlock some of their equipment, however since the process is rather slow some may prefer to simplify the solution by paying for buy it. In this way the power will be with those that play more. The more you play, the more plats you will make. Of course to make 100 plats it may take a few weeks, but hey! . . . free things are not cheap! In my opinion this is an extremely balanced way to create and earn plats in game. rather than by luck get plats, this is much more appealing to all the players, including those that pay to earn them. This is the solution to all our problems, even the people who dont want to support pay to win. If you also think the same, then support the idea so the devs might consider and include it in the game. NOTE: It is either this, or removing the pro all together. The idea of paying platiniumss to get some items is a universal idea you cannot fight with, but not the Unlock Pro Items and Warframs is not. I think that is bad - but I cant ask the devs to remove it, the only way is to come up with ideas to compensate the gap. A change in the idea would be to reduce the price from 25K to 5K and the drop rate to be 50%-100% depending on the boss. and ingredients should be perhaps half? or some of them removed or replaced by more general ones. Edited January 6, 2013 by TheNexusCloud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargeron Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 absolutely disagree with this proposal. If they were to implement a model like this, there is no way DE can ever be sure they'll make a profit on ANYTHING they release whether it's platinum-only or not. It's been mentioned before but mise well be said again, anything cosmetic that doesn't directly impact gameplay should be purchased using the real-world currency because they're items of convenience - you like looking different, or you like having a niche tool. I only have to assume you're suggesting a platinum blueprint because of the PRO versions of weapons and warframes, and at that point i CAN understand, but the real root of the problem lies in the fact that PRO armors and weapons shouldn't require platinum to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfySoul Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Rather than making people grind for resources, I think its better to make daily quest giving 1 platinum. First you need to do 5 or 10 missions to unlock it (random planets each day), but with more unlocked planets and missions it will become a bit easier. Besides, making high-ranked players visit starting planets will help new players alot - they will see what they will achieve if they continue playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetaMortred Posted January 6, 2013 Author Share Posted January 6, 2013 absolutely disagree with this proposal. If they were to implement a model like this, there is no way DE can ever be sure they'll make a profit on ANYTHING they release whether it's platinum-only or not. It's been mentioned before but mise well be said again, anything cosmetic that doesn't directly impact gameplay should be purchased using the real-world currency because they're items of convenience - you like looking different, or you like having a niche tool. I only have to assume you're suggesting a platinum blueprint because of the PRO versions of weapons and warframes, and at that point i CAN understand, but the real root of the problem lies in the fact that PRO armors and weapons shouldn't require platinum to begin with. I - not suprisingly - disagree with you, and I believe your disagreement is for the lack of understanding my proposal. Let me open it up a bit. I believe PRO is a good idea, and the Platinium BluePrints can make DE a thousand fold more money than before. How? PRO - creates a perpetual way to spend the plats. The Bluprint creates an opportunity for people to taste the gain. Remember, it will take hours to only get a single drop. People will say to themselves, wow! it is easier to simply pay for the damn thing. JUST imagine, you have to farm hours to get a drop, and then 6 hours and a lot of cash to get a single one. So before dropping the bomb, completely analyze the situation. I believe that this can help DE make more money insted of putting freebe plats randomly. I despise the concept of luck, it make the game boring, there has to be a level of getting what you work for. and also you have to spend all the cash you make on something. Rather than making people grind for resources, I think its better to make daily quest giving 1 platinum. First you need to do 5 or 10 missions to unlock it (random planets each day), but with more unlocked planets and missions it will become a bit easier. Besides, making high-ranked players visit starting planets will help new players alot - they will see what they will achieve if they continue playing. Terrible! 10 missions? are you crazy? do you want to make the game a torture? forcing your self playing any game that long in a day can make it into a repetitive bore, no matter what the game is! My idea encourages players to do levels other than bosses to farm for ingredients, have you see VENUS? it is filled with players now, because everyonei s farming the alloy for LEK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyfle Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Let's see...morphics are hard to come by, at least at my level, and we're talking about single plats here. That is an extreme grind fest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargeron Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 (edited) Unless the majority of Warframes community is going to be extremely patient at grinding out something that isn't guaranteed and that they'll need multiple of, they're either going to a) as you suggested, buy plat b) hit a dead end and stop playing At this current stage, you and me disagreeing with each other is just a direct extraction from a more important argument: is this game going to use a standard f2p model or p2p model. I'll add a little elaboration: - If the game is going F2P, there shouldn't be any sort of limitation on maximizing gear potential, at the same hand too any cosmetics should cost plat and plat should not be accessible in any way other than real-world currency. - If the game is going P2P, they can obviously balance whatever prices they deem fit for their gear and future mission releases. They could add minor ways to earn plat but they'd have to be extremely arduous and generally not worth the time (your plat blueprint suggestion) so it would bait people into taking the shortcut and buying. Your point is basically, you're accepting that they're going to keep the best gear away from those who will either not pay, which is OK, but that's really limitting the community down (especially with how much they're already charging plat for how little you get). So instead you want a workaround that basically means you'll grind your face out for hours for very little gain. My point being, I would rather see this game head towards a F2P model where some players will not spend any money and others will spend hundreds. It's a system that has proven to work consistently. If they decide to stick to their guns with the whole, "ok the game IS free to play, but if you wanna be the best and play the rest you gotta spend," they'll likely fall into the same hole that Hellgate: London fell into. tl;dr you accept a P2P model and want a workaround, I dont and would prefer a F2P model. Edited January 6, 2013 by Sargeron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ12 Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Actually the solution to all our problems would be a billionaire with a lot of money who really likes videogames deciding "hey Mr. Digital Extremes, I would like everyone to enjoy this awesome videogame. Have 10 million dollars." So you know, if any of you guys are that billionaire... (Otherwise we can keep talking about monetization until the cows come home) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyfle Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 You keep using BF Heroes as an example, but Battlefield is a big name and Heroes grew for a while before becoming pay2win. This is an indie game, an obscure title, that started out as pay2win. BF Heroes already had a large community, so EA didn't need to worry about deterring away newcomers. Warframe is still small, so pay2win could already shoo potential players away. There are already a couple players here who are unwilling to spend another cent if the game stays with the pro system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prowler6784 Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 i kinda like the idea of plat blueprints but dont at the same time :\ i like the idea of real money going on looks and to speed up making something only not for weapons or warframes, its bad enough ash cost 375 plat -.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenart Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 idea is good but... 25k credits for 1 platinum ? no way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neKroMancer Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 It's not good. Apart from large amount of ingredient required to make one platinum, the drop rate of platinum blueprint will eventually lead into a grindfest which is no different from forcing yourself to play 5-10 games per day. Hell, no. How much platinum do I need to buy a starter frame? 75 plat. Which means 75*25000 credit to buy one starter frame. Now we have 2 starters to buy with 75 more for color scheme upgrade and a few weapons which worth a few hundred plats each. Even if platinum blueprint has 100% drop rate from boss, you'll need a very, very long time to unlock the most basic stuffs. Like other posters above me posted, F2P must give an equal chance for free players to maximize their gameplay without trying to suck money out of their pocket. Make a good extra contents like cool skin for warframes and weapons and eventually players will spend money on them. Using real money should allow players who pay get what they want faster, not better. It doesn't have to follow the BF example. Look at ME3 MP, the game doesn't really encourage buying stuff with real money but players who want to get the contents faster will eventually use real money to buy packs, which are subjected to RNG just like other non-payer. The game still up and running with multiple MP DLC released for FREE which drew new players while keeping old players around without dividing playerbase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagudman Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Unless I get 2 platinum blue prints and 100% drop rate from the boss I would not play this game any more. It just becomes an useless grind fest. I am not against grinding, but when you add the same looking levels and same looking enemies and grinding together, you are not going to play this game for long. They should just ditch the go pro or make it so that we have to pay something like 30,000-50,000 credits to buy it for free. Also they are going to make a lot of money from the waiting time of the blueprints, I have to wait 3 days for a warframe blueprint to complete, or just spend a little cash. This is the perfect game for skins, We have space ninjas, and you can buy even better looking super cool space ninjas with real money. It's a winning situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetaMortred Posted January 6, 2013 Author Share Posted January 6, 2013 Problem is that you see this as a way to make plats for buying a full fledged frame. That is wrong! I only mean this to unlock weapons and frames you buy! It is either this, or removing the pro all together. I like the idea of paying plats to get some items, but not the pro item part. I think that is bad - but I cant ask the devs to remove it, the only way is to come up with ideas to compensate for the loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingway Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Oh yeah, let's make it a super grind fest that takes 6 hours to complete on top of it all... Not really a good idea, that will only add repetition to the table on a alredy repetitive game at the current state, that will only make people get bored extremely faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ12 Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 You keep using BF Heroes as an example, but Battlefield is a big name and Heroes grew for a while before becoming pay2win. This is an indie game, an obscure title, that started out as pay2win. BF Heroes already had a large community, so EA didn't need to worry about deterring away newcomers. Warframe is still small, so pay2win could already shoo potential players away. There are already a couple players here who are unwilling to spend another cent if the game stays with the pro system. BF:Heroes didn't exactly have a very large community around the switch and there was no deterrence effect. Of course there's people unwilling to spend any money on free to play games. Part of the monetization of a free to play game is to remove those people from circulation by converting them into paying customers. If this causes them to leave... unless there is a mass exodus (which no study has ever shown happening from 'pay to win' games) or mass discouragement of players, some guys leaving isn't too relevant. Warframe isn't coming from an 'indie' dev (DE made games like UT/UT2k3/UT2k4/DarkSector/Darkness II, all of which are pretty high-budget, high-revenue, well-reviewed games) and is being marketed reasonably well as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seventhwolf Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 absolutely disagree with this proposal. If they were to implement a model like this, there is no way DE can ever be sure they'll make a profit on ANYTHING they release whether it's platinum-only or not. It's been mentioned before but mise well be said again, anything cosmetic that doesn't directly impact gameplay should be purchased using the real-world currency because they're items of convenience - you like looking different, or you like having a niche tool. I only have to assume you're suggesting a platinum blueprint because of the PRO versions of weapons and warframes, and at that point i CAN understand, but the real root of the problem lies in the fact that PRO armors and weapons shouldn't require platinum to begin with. Totally agree with this guy. It's an F2P game and most weapons are available. People who spend money on this game actually buy the "Limited Edition" of Warframe and they support the developers of the game as well which is necessary since the game is still in its closed beta. I agree that the pro upgrade should be available without using platina, but removing it completely is not sensible. By the way, stop talking about BF Heroes because this is a PvP game and not a co-operative game. I play BF Heroes a lot and I can tell you that P2P totally broke the game. But as long as Warframe stays on PvE, I think it's better to let the Platina System as it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Shadow Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Sorry OP but I agree with Sargeon. A very rare random drop plat might not be a bad idea in the long run but I wouldn't drop all those mats on making it. Also the main point of this issue stems from the Pay to Win model the devs have chosen. That will cost them more than it makes them. What they need to look at and follow the example of is companies like Riot Games and LoL. You can unlock everything in game with in game points but if you don't want to burn your in game points on a new champion you can buy it. The same concept should apply here and Pro does not currently fit into that concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggh Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 (edited) I'd rather see crafting for specific things you could buy with platinum. Ex, you could craft a pro upgrades/weapon slots/warframe slots/ etc. etc. Having them require a variety of different crafting materials would mean that you couldn't just grind for everything at them same time like you would if you could craft platinum. The real question is how much does DE need to value play time. I've seen games value it at anywhere from 5 cents to 80 cents an hour or so in terms of in game currency, but with the way credits are so easy to get atm, crafting is the only way to do this. They're already doing it with war frames as it is, it seems natural to apply it to other aspects ofthe game as well. Edited January 6, 2013 by Aggh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kfoolu Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 There's no way this would ever be considered a good idea. Especially given the amount of materials and credits you suggest to make ONE platinum. Who in their right mind would actually farm that? This is most certainly not a solution to anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ced23Ric Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 With the advent of Reactors and Catalysts, the need for out-of-game money has been put in check. All content is open. /thread PS: Necroposter!1132121 ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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