[Tactical Alerts] How To Conclave Limit Like A Boss

[dadaddadada]

The previous tactical alert has received mixed feedback, with people approving the additional challenge but criticizing the sheer execution of the idea.
In fact, the system could very easily cheated by unequipping any other weapon and keeping that one almost fully-modded Brakk and just steamroll through everything.
Many players have also disliked the idea of downgrading their arsenals... for ethical reasons... while another part of the playerbase was attacking those same people with accusations of not geing able to take the challenge.

How do we make a challenging conclave-based game mode without it feeling too artificial?

My heaviest two-cents yet.

Instead of just capping everything to a given conclave limit, lets scale the rewards with the conclave rating of the weapons used to accomplish an objective.
Completing the mission is an objective. Killing a single enemy is an objective too.

Examples.
A Ferrite cache dropped by a mob killed by a fully modded boltor prime currently yields N Ferrite.
If you kill the same enemy with an unmodded Lato the dropped cache would yield more Ferrite. 5xN ferrite for istance.
The actual amount of ferrite depends on the conclave rating of said Lato, compared to the level of the mob.

The end mission rewards have drop tables with items sorted by rarity, as we all have experienced at least 10^4 times before.
The rare rewards would have a buffed chance to drop depending on how well the team has performed (= the most used weapons/frames of all team members are low-conclave).

I'm intentionally avoiding "if" statements, as the system is supposed to auto-correct itself smoothly down to floating point precision, so no "if the team has surpassed a certain score/value/threshold" statements apply.

This system gives full freedom on how you want to play, without hard caps.
You can setup a team of 2000+ conclave rhinos and do the mission over and over, or you can go smart on it. Your choice.
Applies best in key-based missions, as the players can plan ahead their arsenals.
In random public matches, if you find a troll you are screwed. Until votekick gets implemented ofc :p

Further notices:
- you CANNOT cheat by unequipping weapons to lower your total conclave. Total conclave is meaningless in this system.
- you CAN equip a fully modded weapon just for critical situations. As far as you mostly use low-conclave weapons throughout the mission, the dynamic tables aren't going to punish you too much for a room cleared with a soma swing.

- I include warframe abilities in the definition of "weapons", but I rely on DE's creativity about how warframes are managed exactly. Suggestions are welcome.

[MechaTails]

I think taking away our ability to "clear rooms with a soma swing" is the whole point of the tactical alerts. Why even do the tactical alerts when you always have a safety blanket with you.

However, a new mission type where rewards scale with your conclave rating sounds cool.

[dadaddadada]

I think taking away our ability to "clear rooms with a soma swing" is the whole point of the tactical alerts. Why even do the tactical alerts when you always have a safety blanket with you.

However, a new mission type where rewards scale with your conclave rating sounds cool.

 

Lemme put things in the right perspective.

The first tactical alert was like: "unequip secondary, melee and sentinel and feel free to do all the soma swings you like".

It did nothing to take away that ability. I appreciate DE's effort tho.

The new system is more like: "you can prolly afford a soma swing. Don't abuse it or the end-mission rewards get severely debuffed".

Feels a lot more tactical to me. Its a real-time choice that adds gameplay depth.

[BrazilianJoe]

OR much more simply:

 

Besides that Conclave overall cap, make Tactical Alerts impose a additional limit PER EQUIPMENT. The numbers are already there, it's what they sum to get the final conclave rating. 

 

200 conclave per item, 150 conclave rating, 100 conclave rating. You' d have to wind down that build and there would be no Soma-wipes-out-the-whole-room-on-a-single-swipe. 

 

There could be more nasty stuff in Tactical like:

 

Every time a level 4 skill is used, enemies gain 1 level. Explanation: energy signatures are detected and better troops are sent to deal with the Tenno, stmulant injections are instantly administered to the soldiers on field. Infested Overmind feels the ultimate power and send a psychic scream frenzying the infested in mission, making them stronger. 

Edited October 9, 2014 by BrazilianJoe

[Macdermott]

You used the word "ethical".

 

I do not think that word means what you think it means...

[dadaddadada]

OR much more simply:

 

Besides that Conclave overall cap, make Tactical Alerts impose a additional limit PER EQUIPMENT. The numbers are already there, it's what they sum to get the final conclave rating. 

 

200 conclave per item, 150 conclave rating, 100 conclave rating. You' d have to wind down that build and there would be no Soma-wipes-out-the-whole-room-on-a-single-swipe. 

 

There could be more nasty stuff in Tactical like:

 

Every time a level 4 skill is used, enemies gain 1 level. Explanation: energy signatures are detected and better troops are sent to deal with the Tenno, stmulant injections are instantly administered to the soldiers on field. Infested Overmind feels the ultimate power and send a psychic scream frenzying the infested in mission, making them stronger. 

 

While your suggestion constitutes a direct upgrade over the current hard cap scheme, I really wanted to focus the attention on systems that would not strictly require hard caps at all, supporting smooth scalings and such.

[BrazilianJoe]

Oh, the idea of scaling rewards is nice too, but only work for common resources.

 

Rare resources would be counted in the fingers, so you'd have a stair-stepping of power levels too. Making it nebulous to know the power level you need to be at or below to be awarded the prize would be bad. 

 

So even though you have a continuous power ladder, you'd still have to communicate at which power level you cease to be worthy of 2 orokin cells and get only 1 for example. 

[dadaddadada]

Oh, the idea of scaling rewards is nice too, but only work for common resources.

 

Rare resources would be counted in the fingers, so you'd have a stair-stepping of power levels too. Making it nebulous to know the power level you need to be at or below to be awarded the prize would be bad. 

 

So even though you have a continuous power ladder, you'd still have to communicate at which power level you cease to be worthy of 2 orokin cells and get only 1 for example. 

 

Nah thats barely an issue. My idea is not supposed to cancel out the RNG from the equation. With any equipment, you always have a chance to get 2 cells, only thing, if your power is high, that chance is very low. In the other hand, if your conclave is very low you will end up having a 30% chance for 1 cell, 50% chance for 2 cells and 20% chance for 3 cells. As you see, all the drop rates will eventually dither out nicely, as the RNG still plays a prominent role.

[BrazilianJoe]

 

Nah thats barely an issue. My idea is not supposed to cancel out the RNG from the equation. With any equipment, you always have a chance to get 2 cells, only thing, if your power is high, that chance is very low. In the other hand, if your conclave is very low you will end up having a 30% chance for 1 cell, 50% chance for 2 cells and 20% chance for 3 cells. As you see, all the drop rates will eventually dither out nicely, as the RNG still plays a prominent role.

Nah I am (almost) totally agianst more stuff using RNG. THings should be deterministic so that we know what we are getting. 

 

There would be a standard reward (e.g. 1000 polymer bundle) at a standard conclave level (e.g 600 conclave/150 per load). Each nudge up or down would shift the amount of the reward. 

[dadaddadada]

Nah I am (almost) totally agianst more stuff using RNG. THings should be deterministic so that we know what we are getting. 

 

There would be a standard reward (e.g. 1000 polymer bundle) at a standard conclave level (e.g 600 conclave/150 per load). Each nudge up or down would shift the amount of the reward. 

 

Well RNG is legitimately used here to better distribute the rewards for smoother transitions. In the grand scheme of things, there should be very little difference between my system and your suggestion (direct conversion between mob level and conclave rating for common drops).

But while your system only applies for enemy resource drops, my one allows also end mission rewards to be averaged in the exact same way as the resource drops, for an easier implementation dev-wise. Prolly implying too much on that last one, but meh. After all, any more advanced system will do great things to replace the current Tactical alerts cheese.

Edited October 10, 2014 by dadaddadada

[BrazilianJoe]

I'd rather have a series of increasing difficulty levels with better rewards. The player would go as far up the ladder as he/she wishes, picking up the rewards, but never a "% chance to get reward X"