Syndicates Should Be All About Missions.

[Kruglov]

If you knew how best to change something you wouldn't put it unchanged in alpha-form on the beta. 

 

 

Welcome to Digital Extremes!

This is how they've done it always.

1.) insert new thing into game without really testing

2.) drink beer

3.) check forums

4.) oh wow people are angry, better change everything

5.) and now the new thing is ok and fun

 

I hate to sound Eeyore from Winnie the Pooh, but you'll be less surprised if you assume every new thing added to Warframe wont have least a dozen horrible things wrong with it that will slooooowwwlllllyyy get fixed.

 

I've seen one of the Syndicate Death Squads (4 eximus ancient infested) spawn UNDER THE MAP.

I wasn't even surprised. I've come to expect new things to barely function with updates.

 

Best thing to do is vote with your game time.

If DE see players arent using Syndicates, it'll get changed.

[fractal_magnets]

Because if it doesn't change, the fanbase (which includes me, and I'm sure you as well) will complain to high heaven that the system sucks.

DE are VERY slow but they do fix things. Look at Ash and Oberon. They sucked @$$ for nearly 2 years with people whining (justified whining, obviously) the ENTIRE TIME. Now they are good. Hell, Oberon is like a god now, striding amongst insects.

 

Same goes for melee. Yeah melee 2.0 isn't amazing, but they did eventually make melee slightly better after nearly 2 years of it being just awful and people begging for it to not be so awful.

 

Syndicates might suck for who knows how long but as long as people don't try to grind for the rewards DE will eventually wisen up and go "wow nobody is using this" and change it.

The problem will be is if people start doing dumb stuff (like actually paying the ridiculous prime/catalyst fees) DE will see them doing it and think "our system works, yay" and not change it.

 

But again, I have enough faith in the playerbase that this wont be happening and change will come (if it isn't coming already which I believe it is).

 

The costs of syndicates ARE fair and people will pay them.

Want a catalyst and 1 million credits? sure. Take it.

Want 2.5 million Alloy Plate as well? I think it's affecting the gravity on my ship. Take it all.

 

The problem I have with syndicates is the stupid balancing act.

1 pisses off the other on a 1:1 ratio so I have to play those other guys that get pissed off about that group that likes that group and BOOM... My brain says log off.

Join a hard mission on a low conclave to scam the system by just spamming my powers. Yeah that sounds fun and balanced.

Start a syndicate mission and Lotus chimes in? Who knew Lotus also supported them? >____>

Too rushed. Not worth my time.

[Kruglov]

The costs of syndicates ARE fair and people will pay them.

 

I dunno, man.

Even with Catalyst Alert notifier addons, invasions with potato rewards get SWAMPED and die in 5-10 minutes.

Maybe if DE were planning on making reactors/catalysts even slightly more common or obtainable but...ech.

Doesn't seem fair to me.

[hijinks_the_turtle]

The costs of syndicates ARE fair and people will pay them.

Tell that to the thread with about 12709 views and 321 replies.  A lot of the replies there show their dislike for the system.

Edited November 3, 2014 by hijinks_the_turtle

[fractal_magnets]

I dunno, man.

Even with Catalyst Alert notifier addons, invasions with potato rewards get SWAMPED and die in 5-10 minutes.

Maybe if DE were planning on making reactors/catalysts even slightly more common or obtainable but...ech.

Doesn't seem fair to me.

 

They have regular alerts every 2 weeks. They are up for 24 hours.

I don't think I've ever bought more than one potato.

Use http://deathsnacks.com/wf/ and you'll never miss a potato invasion either (as long as you are online :P)

[fractal_magnets]

Tell that to the thread with about 12709 views and 321 replies.  A lot of the replies there show their dislike for the system.

 

DE_Steve said in the last dev stream that it is meant to be a sacrifice. You are meant to feel the loss.

I agree with his idea. You can get all of these "sacrifice" items for free. Yes, they would be great on that new gun of mine but I can get a bunch of goodies if I spend it here. It's an investment.

I don't have to read the loud minority to know that they just want a free ride.

I want a fair and balanced system.

In terms of cost... it's fair.

In terms of balance... It's broken.

[Kruglov]

They have regular alerts every 2 weeks. They are up for 24 hours.

I don't think I've ever bought more than one potato.

Use http://deathsnacks.com/wf/ and you'll never miss a potato invasion either (as long as you are online :P)

 

Oh I do.

I have little problems getting potatoes, tomatoes, and all the other veg that this game poots out.

 

But I'm also a big fat nerd who works from home and is online the majority of the day.

 

It's fair for me, sure.

But for people who don't have good internet access, work abroad, or simply don't play this game that much, the system seems....kind of not that good.

 

Plus we have to focus on the biggest problem of all:

 

- okay so I'm Jerry McJerrison, I play Warframe casually and I'm not at home all day

- I've needed a catalyst for a while cause I just got me a bronco prime and I heard that thing is totes chief. #coolgun.

- I happen to be at home at JUST the right time to catch the last 20 or 30 seconds of an alert or invasion and got a catalyst blueprint.

- I have a choice now.

- I can use this catalyst on my fancy new bronco and pretend I'm the guy from No Country for Old Mean

- or...

- I can give it to a syndicate for mediocre rewards

 

The numbers just don't seem to add up.

Like I have ALOT of guns. I have a flux, boltorprime, gorgon wraith, viper wraith, vulkar, amprex, boar prime, detron,  grinlok, stug, ak stilleto, quanta, angstrum, gremlins, and my baby babaloo, the Nukor <3.

I'm sure theres other guns I've forgotten.

 

By all means, I could spend a potato on the syndicates.

I've potato'd and forma'd all my weapons.

 

I don't NEED this potato.

 

 

But I might.

And why give it up if the rewards don't seem worth it?

sure theres a few highlights but...they are lifeboats in a sea of meh.

 

a sea, nay an ocean.

 

like if every reward was BALLIN' OUT OF CONTROL I'd gladly become an irish potato farmer and throw them at syndicates.

 

But as it is, I'd rather save them for the next fun gun to pop out from DE.

I mean hell, the OPTICOR just came out and it looks fun.

 

Why not spend my potato on that? Something I KNOW will be more useful than a 1-weapon-only mod or a slightly different version of a warframe power I don't use much anyway?

 

It seems too rinkadink to be worth the price.

 

Yeah it's a sacrifice, but when you think of sacrifice you think of like taking a bullet for someone and dying with honor.

Here it's more like you took the bullet, then the target you protected just sort of laughs at you while you bleed on the ground.

[Ghengis_Khan]

I agree. Playing solo is the only way I play most missions. "but what if you die?" You waste a revive, or you get better.

 

But syndicates are useless. If they changed the way you gained favor (maybe they could give you missions) than they would have a purpose.

[fractal_magnets]

*snip*

 

filthy casuals have to pay and they know it.

f2plyf

[Rakshal]

Syndicates are not mastery locked...

Actually they are locked at level 3 from my understanding.

[fractal_magnets]

Actually they are locked at level 3 from my understanding.

 

So, one week?

Would hardly call that a lock.

Prove you are an actual player and welcome to syndicates.

[Kruglov]

What they should do is put unobtainable items in the Syndicate tables.

 

Things like the original boar, original strun, the wraith vipers, gorgon wraith, braton vandal, snipetron vandal etc etc.

 

On top of that add new mods that don't exist in the normal drop tables and can be used by all frames/guns.

 

- dual stat precombined mods  (like a mod that adds blast damage or a mod that adds corrosive)

- accuracy mods (a mod that is the opposite of heavy calibur) like EXTENDED BARREL - +150% accuracy -20% damage

- mods like THUNDERBOLT but for rifles and secondaries

- mods that cause an area-of-effect 'cleave' on melee weapons

- mods that change the base damage type of warframe powers (like making Vaubans abilities all do poison instead of magnetic/electric or Ember to ice)

- mods that decrease the amount of upkeep a Kubrow needs (DOGFOOD BOWL MOD)

- mods that make your warframes shields have more utility (like a chance to reflect incoming damage, or proc an effect when hit)

 

 

THAT is stuff I'd give up a potato for.

Edited November 3, 2014 by Kruglov

[fractal_magnets]

- mods that decrease the amount of upkeep a Kubrow needs (DOGFOOD BOWL MOD)

 

I'd give up my spare Arcane Vanguard Helmet for a Captain Vor chew toy.

XD

[Kruglov]

I'd give up my spare Arcane Vanguard Helmet for a Captain Vor chew toy.

XD

 

They could always let you use the Vor bobblehead as a chew toy.

[fractal_magnets]

They could always let you use the Vor bobblehead as a chew toy.

Now I just want more Liset decorations -___-

Beaded curtains between bulkheads. awww yeah. Where's my incense? 

[fatpig84]

What they should do is put unobtainable items in the Syndicate tables.

 

Things like the original boar, original strun, the wraith vipers, gorgon wraith, braton vandal, snipetron vandal etc etc.

 

On top of that add new mods that don't exist in the normal drop tables and can be used by all frames/guns.

 

- dual stat precombined mods  (like a mod that adds blast damage or a mod that adds corrosive)

- accuracy mods (a mod that is the opposite of heavy calibur) like EXTENDED BARREL - +150% accuracy -20% damage

- mods like THUNDERBOLT but for rifles and secondaries

- mods that cause an area-of-effect 'cleave' on melee weapons

- mods that change the base damage type of warframe powers (like making Vaubans abilities all do poison instead of magnetic/electric or Ember to ice)

- mods that decrease the amount of upkeep a Kubrow needs (DOGFOOD BOWL MOD)

- mods that make your warframes shields have more utility (like a chance to reflect incoming damage, or proc an effect when hit)

 

 

THAT is stuff I'd give up a potato for.

 

DE say they are actually making far more mods and rewards available.

But when ? We shall see.

 

But I can agree with putting in retired weapons as loot..

 

Imagine putting Boar, Snipetron, Ether daggers etc as part of the rewards is a nice change (for a puny 2.5k points will do since these aren't exactly super weapons)

 

Big boys like the Strun Wraith (Red Veil ?) Gorgon wraith (Steel meridian ?) will cost 25k points for example.

Edited November 3, 2014 by fatpig84

[PixalatedVortex]

Hmmmm whatever I got 856 in a ODD that I failed so

[kaz3n]

i think people are just getting impatient about the rewards... just like what everyone said its not to be completed in a day or so. The only mistake DE did here is not to give enough rewards in the pile. If they add more random rewards per tier, like weapons or crazy mods. Its easy enough that i think DE will follow through, they better act fast though since adding a weapon towards the end of the reward list could be tricky as picking the right syndicate is a huge deal.

[BurningDesire]

with the way RNG is some of the entry fees are just crap. some of us do work full time jobs and have families and some nights it can be impossible to get on. also a lot of the invasion rewards are geared toward the American time zone and those of us who dont live there tend to miss these quests. but the most important question we should be asking is where the hell is team infested i cant stand any of the syndicates.

[DaWolv]

Um... You aren't supposed to get them in a day. In fact, most people aren't supposed to get them at all, without trading of course.

 

We get points going to 2 factions at the same time. Then we can also join and level up to 4 syndicates out of 6, with only the other 2 getting negatives.

 

Why is the fact that the game suddenly has objectives that will take months to "max out" a big deal. This content is not "in the way" of other content, it is simply "extra content".

 

Both of your arguments are somewhat valid, but I happen to agree with OP in one critical point:

Its easy grinding!

If instead of 3 boring missions on Mercury-Earth for 1k combined, I could play a Multi-layer mission on Pluto - I'd do that!

 

The veterans have been asking for real endgame forever - not constant extendet powercreep (See Void T4)

I am sick of the same old boring Void tileset! I want a real challange incorporated into the existing mission types and tilesets and be rewarded acordingly.

The syndicates could've been that, but they decided to make it a boring grind-fest. I can equip my BoltorPrime and rund through each mission blind with my finger on the trigger and alternating with my Ultimate Ability, and I'd probably win.

That's neither interesting nor fun. It's dull.

[uppertiggy]

syndicate levels as far as i see them is somethign you have run in the background while you go off and do the stuff you wnat and every so often you get the option to rank up in it i never thought of it as a huge grind for a day cause i dont want content i can just finish in a day, i want something to look foward to down the line rather than either " yay did 3 story missiosn in an hour now i gotta wait till next major update for more" or "yay i got the new frame and all the new weapons after paying for it.... how come i dont get anything for my effort doing these new missions?" 

[Innocent_Flower]

syndicate levels as far as i see them is somethign you have run in the background while you go off and do the stuff you wnat and every so often you get the option to rank up in it i never thought of it as a huge grind for a day cause i dont want content i can just finish in a day, i want something to look foward to down the line rather than either " yay did 3 story missiosn in an hour now i gotta wait till next major update for more" or "yay i got the new frame and all the new weapons after paying for it.... how come i dont get anything for my effort doing these new missions?" 

"BACKROUND GAME MECHANICS> 

 

 

As opposed to the much needed foreground game mechanics?

 

Son, Are you forgetting that there's missions in which you actively play purely for syndicate points? 

Edited November 3, 2014 by Innocent_Flower

[DaWolv]

"BACKROUND GAME MECHANICS> 

 

 

As opposed to the much needed foreground game mechanics?

 

Son, Are you forgetting that there's missions in which you actively play purely for syndicate points? 

 

They are probably so far in his background that he either didn't notice them or hasn't reached rank 2 yet.

Regardless of which, the argument is non-sensical.

 

If the Syndicate system was meant to be just another background distraction for the game, then why lock gear behind it?

And again - In principle I don't care how long something takes, I want the risk/reward to be right.

and currently, anything but Ceres, Phobos, Pluto and Void T3+ are nothing but one-shot fests.

[ThePresident777]

My opinion of syndicates is that it's too much grind for nothing and if it were for something it would be too much grind for me anyway.  But, I'm not angry at DE, as long as they don't nerf my stuff.  I don't care how much they charge for it.  If it's too expensive for me, it's too expensive for me.  You'll hardly hear a peep from me for that.  But don't nerf my S#&$.  Don't destroy my game play.    Especially, if I spend money.  I don't care what they do as long as they don't lie, cheat, or steal, more or less.  I say more or less to avoid backing myself into a corner of unforseen circumstances and devil's details.  But common sense would inform one not to deprive people of what they enjoy and have or were led to expect.  When you lie, cheat, or steal, no one worth having as a friend (or customer), wants to be your friend.

Edited November 3, 2014 by ThePresident777

[Volume]

Yes, it's pretty much insane. Half the void missions I do I get like 14 per run. Apparently I have to remove all my weapons except one and sit in an interception for four rounds and pay for an affinity booster for any real syndicate reputation gain. It feels unintended.