New Kohm Is Fine.

[BluelitHalo]

New Kohm damage output statistics:

 

Damage: 30 (6 Impact, 6 Puncture, 18 Slash)
Pellet Count: 12 (yes, I counted this.  Here's proof so you can count for yourself: http://imgur.com/Ph5OyFs)
Fire Rate: 3.7

 

30 * 12 * 3.7 = 1332 DPS unmodded

An earlier iteration of the Kohm, which a lot of players liked, was like this just before the pellet count nerf: 

 

Damage: 37

Pellet Count: 10

Fire Rate: 3.7

 

37 * 10 * 3.7 = 1369 DPS unmodded, very close to what the new Kohm is.

Isn't this exactly the type of tweak that people asked for?  The previous iteration, which had a nerfed pellet count, got a lot of flak for trying to make the Kohm somewhere between a crowd shredder and a single-target murderer.  Now it gets flak for reverting to exactly the iteration before that, the crowd-shredder that everyone treasured, which actually has slightly more pellets now.  It also has a status chance buff from 10% to 25% to boot (which is actually slightly lower due to how that percentage is actually divided amongst the pellets, so that's like 2.0833% per pellet, which translates to 22.3% chance of at least one status proc after some probability calculations).

Sure, it changed from projectile pellets to hitscan, but a full multishot Kohm fried several GPUs back when it was projectile.  Damage falloff? Sure, I'm bummed about it, but in Kohm's case it's redundant because you need to be within 10 meters of the enemy in order to utilize the thing to its fullest, to get at least half the pellets landed.  Use it from any range longer and you'd be lucky to land a third of those pellets, that or you'll just tickle the enemy.  After all, it's a shotgun meant to be used within archetypal shotgun range, meant to reward you for getting in close.

 

Below-average ammo economy, and high spread resulting in short effective range, are all what balance this DPS monster.  Yet somehow some people managed to break even with ammo usage and pickups just fine with just a maxed Ammo Mutation and Shotgun Spazz (before the pellet count nerf).

The only thing wrong with this Kohm tweak is that it may not have the same character anymore to some, but despite that, the stats are still fine and it's still a perfectly good weapon.

Edited March 20, 2015 by Sonitorum

[Grom-84]

I liked long range kohm with particles, with punch through and a bit lower rate of fir at 2.7 unmoded. And those theoretical numbers mean nothing - the weapon feels like crap now. nuff said. 

[BluelitHalo]

 those theoretical numbers mean nothing 

Not necessarily "nothing" as they can provide you a decent estimate of how you will perform with it, but I'm fully aware that the theoretical DPS with Kohm is rarely ever achievable in practice unless you're suicidal.  Despite that, you can still land a third to half the pellets on individual enemies a majority of the time.  Spread the pellets out in the crowd and it's basically a Shotgun Amprex.

Edited March 20, 2015 by Sonitorum

[Grom-84]

I'm exaggerating a bit of cource) I like solid approach with numbers, but in game it feels just worse than it was before with the same skill and the same loadout)

[(PSN)Zeylon]

It took away the ONLY other non-hitscan shotgun we had!  

The Kohm already ate ammo like crazy, now it's not even tenable with a maxed ammo mutation.  It's utter crap now, a novelty.

 

Sure, it changed from projectile pellets to hitscan, but a full multishot Kohm fried several GPUs back when it was projectile.  Damage falloff? Sure, I'm bummed about it, but in Kohm's case it's redundant because you need to be within 10 meters of the enemy in order to utilize the thing to its fullest, to get at least half the pellets landed.  Use it from any range longer and you'd be lucky to land a third of those pellets, that or you'll just tickle the enemy.  After all, it's a shotgun meant to be used within archetypal shotgun range, meant to reward you for getting in close.

 

If you use the shotgun in single shots without spooling it up, the grouping remained tight and you could hit things at range for really decent damage.  It gave the Kohm a dual-mode.  This was especially true if you reduced the spread.  At any rate, it was a valid function of the gun.  That function was taken away.

It can reward you for getting close without removing it's long-range ability.  A LOT of people picked up the Kohm BECAUSE of it's lack of fall-off.  It's large part of why people avoid shotguns.  DE took a weapon with specific characteristics people liked, and gutted those characteristics.  If I'd wanted a another generic friggin hit-scan auto shotgun, I would've picked up the Sobek.  

[Rhiss]

I liked long range kohm with particles, with punch through and a bit lower rate of fir at 2.7 unmoded. And those theoretical numbers mean nothing - the weapon feels like crap now. nuff said. 

exactly, totally agree

[BlueSilkMetallic]

I like the new khom :)

was my favorite before change.

Now it rocks even a little bit more :)

[hoeskioeh]

well, it did change the mechanics... damage up or down, bah... but the mechanic change probably needs some getting used to.

*sigh*

 

well, i'll give it a try tonight. hitscan can't be that bad... after all, it works for the phage ^^

[Vaskadar]

There's only one shotgun now without falloff?

[(PSN)Zeylon]

There's only one shotgun now without falloff?

 

There's only one shotgun that isn't hit-scan now, unless you count the Phage (the freak-shotgun).

 

There's only one shotgun that can use the projectile speed mod for shotguns.

 

There's only one shotgun with projectiles.

 

There's only one shotgun without fall-off.

 

And the OP is fine with that I guess?  Because it can do high DPS on paper while it guzzles ammo.

[BattledOne]

I used to main it with my Turbulence Zephyr, making it almost hitscan and night removing spread. It's not even a tight corridor crowd shredder considering punchtrough is removed. 

[BluelitHalo]

considering punchtrough is removed.

This is completely false. I tested this claim yesterday by taking an unmodded Kohm to an Exterminate mission on Saturn. Got two Grineer aligned on my crosshair, fired a single, unspooled shot, and it hit both of them (even Slash proc'd the guy behind). Where are people even getting this claim from?

And considering the rest of the replies in this thread, I guess I can't help anyone that wants to use Shotguns in Rifle range and still expect to be effective (though I'm not saying this excuses damage falloff).

Edited March 22, 2015 by Sonitorum

[bl4ckhunter]

shotgun falloff needs to go, for the very single reason that shotguns are the weakest weapon category around

[Tekka_Croe]

To reiterate what I'd said in another thread:  The damage fall-off and total lack of visual impact are absolutely killing the experience for me.

 

(Especially the fall-off.  Spread already limits the effective range of shottys.  We don't need a double penalty when trying to use them at range.)

[Egg_Chen]

Can confirm the punchthrough is still there.

 

... but it felt like crap, performed like crap, and ran out of ammo a hell of a lot quicker than pre U16.

It got nerfed, and I'm more than a bit miffed that I dumped 5 forma and a catalyst into a projectile shredding machine, and now I got whatever this thing is.

 

DE could have adjusted the particle effects, but no.

^ and if anyone disputes they could have fixed the particles, look at the Drakgoon.

How may threads on its performance hit do you see?

[Siekier]

No, it's not fine.

 

It was fine before U16. Changes should be reverted.

[Dualstar]

Ok to the people who are claiming to run out of ammo, what biuld are you using?

 

Ive been running Primed Point Blank, Blaze, Ammo Mutation, (5/10) Tainted Shell, Hells Chamber, Shotgun Spazz and two elementals since before the changes and im still not running out of ammo.

Edited March 22, 2015 by Dualstar

[(PSN)madjonny]

Punch through is still there I was killing corpus through locked doors earlier...

It's still a decent gun but nothing to what it was before, it just dosent feel as good at all... Damage fall off also is a pain...

Edited March 22, 2015 by (PS4)madjonny

[Adhdaemon]

I like the new khom :)

was my favorite before change.

Now it rocks even a little bit more :)

Seriously? Not sure if troll or...

[BlutAdler]

Seriously? Not sure if troll or...

 

Why because you disagree with him? The new kohm is fine. If you don't want to use it don't . Honestly the people who aren't flipping out as if DE is messing with their lives on the forums will continue on and play. I like threads like this. Seems like there's less nerd rage suffocation. 

No, it's not fine.

 

It was fine before U16. Changes should be reverted.

 

It is fine. You don't like change. 

[Necr0Ra1se]

Punch through is still there I was killing corpus through locked doors earlier...

It's still a decent gun but nothing to what it was before, it just dosent feel as good at all... Damage fall off also is a pain...

I didn't see Any Dmg fall off...De never mentioned Falloff in Ps4 or Xb1 15.16....They only make it hitskan increased pellets and increased firerate...It oesn't have fall off.

[Blaze200]

Why because you disagree with him? The new kohm is fine. If you don't want to use it don't . Honestly the people who aren't flipping out as if DE is messing with their lives on the forums will continue on and play. I like threads like this. Seems like there's less nerd rage suffocation.

 

It is fine. You don't like change. 

Its fine for you but not the other people in this thread, its a bad change for them(and me) because we enjoyed the weapon as it was before, those traits made it unique instead of being another version of the boar prime. Also for people who dislike hitscan weapons and actually want to see where their shots are going.

[Siekier]

Why because you disagree with him? The new kohm is fine. If you don't want to use it don't . Honestly the people who aren't flipping out as if DE is messing with their lives on the forums will continue on and play. I like threads like this. Seems like there's less nerd rage suffocation. 

 

It is fine. You don't like change. 

 

Agreed. I don't like this change. Want to know why?

Because it's not Kohm anymore.

 

Kohm shoots projectiles that bounce and have innate punchthrough. They also have no damage falloff.

That is Kohm.

 

After the changes it's not the Kohm anymore. Projectiles are gone, punchthrough is gone. And we got damage falloff, wonderful.

They ruined what was really fun about this weapon. More importantly, they did it without a good reason and they did it in secret.

So I'll say that again, it is not fine.

[Suthurn]

Its not the same weapon I was investing in, period. I don't like this version of the weapon and would have never spent a potato or forma on if it was like this when I made it.

When I made the thing it shot ricochet projectiles, had no damage fall off, tight spread, and good ammo efficiency.

If the damage needed to be reduced, fine then, reduce the damage.

What they did was turn it into a completely different weapon.

I don't care if 'its fine' to you. I'd rather have my old kohm with just a flat reduction per pellet. At least it would be the same weapon.

[Necr0Ra1se]

Damage FallOf Comfirmed....Thnx DE for making trash from good solid gun.