Move All 3 Starting Frame Bp To Saturn

[matrixEXO]

The reason for this is because they ARE starting frames. Additionally, it allows for the other planets to be used for other frames.

 

I'm not suggesting a full RNG gamble. Say you managed to get a Mag System BP, the game registers this and locks the BP obtainable to that frame until you get all 3. The more you get a BP type (ie: 15 systems in a row), the lesser the drop chance of it to be, moving the chances off to the other 2 BP types.

Example: Madda farmed up 15 systems and 10 helmets. If each of the drop chance was at 5% and the moveover rate was at a total of 0.1%, the chance for Madda to get a system is at 4.0% [5.0 - 1.5 (number of farmed parts) + 0.5 (half of moveover rate obtained from helmet)], helmet at 4.75% and chassis at 6.25%.

 

What happens if you are not the host? The host will register the possible BP drop instead. It will not override your BP lock unless you have already gotten the full set. 

Example: Madda joins Skadi's game. Madda has the BP locked to Mag while Skadi has his locked to Excalibur. Upon boss kill, they both get a chance to get an Excalibur part BP. When Madda goes back to hosting his own game, boss drop will try to drop a Mag part BP, since the lock is still there.

 

 

Also, this design does not need to be limited to the starting 3 frames. You (the devs) can choose where to put the frames in which planet. This can also mean moving off frames from Alert to a planet so people can just stop those damn QQs.

 

 

Other Suggestions:

Have multiple bosses in Saturn with each having individual BP sets. (Tsukinoki)

Edited May 19, 2013 by matrixEXO

[Tsukinoki]

@matrixEXO

What about having multiple bosses on Saturn to farm those BPs off of? That would allow them to consolidate the BPs for the starting frames to Saturn and keep it a bit more manageable to get the BP you want without relying on luck to get what you're after.

The reason I suggest this is what would happen if you want Mag and get Excalibur. You would have to finish grinding excalibur, which could take a *very* long time, and then hope that mag comes up instead of one of the others. And if you get another excalibur part then you're kinda screwed.

And that would also prevent people from screaming about RNG so much.

[Jumba255]

I like the multiple bosses idea better than the RNG lock. Not a bad idea except i already have all the starting frames and it would make me sad if they all became so easy to obtain after farming pluto and neptune

[lautalocos]

@matrixEXO

What about having multiple bosses on Saturn to farm those BPs off of? That would allow them to consolidate the BPs for the starting frames to Saturn and keep it a bit more manageable to get the BP you want without relying on luck to get what you're after.

The reason I suggest this is what would happen if you want Mag and get Excalibur. You would have to finish grinding excalibur, which could take a *very* long time, and then hope that mag comes up instead of one of the others. And if you get another excalibur part then you're kinda screwed.

And that would also prevent people from screaming about RNG so much.

well, saturn is a big system, i think it´s possible to move all starting warframes there

[Tsukinoki]

@lautalocos

That is part of the reason I was thinking having more bosses instead of RNG lock. Saturn is one of the bigger starter systems and this would also allow them to expand the boss variety as well. Such as adding another infested boss after telesto that drops a certain BP to have an earlier introduction to more infested units and even an early infested boss.

[liavalenth]

I am not sure if I agree that they put all the starter frames in the same system. I do like the idea of multiple bosses in a system.

 

The reason I do not know about the three 'starter' frames being put on Saturn is simply because, as far as I can tell, there is a decent chance that over time the starter frames could change. However, I do think that an additional boss with Excalibur there would be nice.

[matrixEXO]

@matrixEXO

What about having multiple bosses on Saturn to farm those BPs off of? That would allow them to consolidate the BPs for the starting frames to Saturn and keep it a bit more manageable to get the BP you want without relying on luck to get what you're after.

The reason I suggest this is what would happen if you want Mag and get Excalibur. You would have to finish grinding excalibur, which could take a *very* long time, and then hope that mag comes up instead of one of the others. And if you get another excalibur part then you're kinda screwed.

And that would also prevent people from screaming about RNG so much.

That is also an idea that can be applied. EXCEPT! They (DE) like to govern one planet with one leader. Until this is resolved (and maybe have a faction mix or intraplanetary faction border), I doubt we can see any possible solution to do it. Too many cooks spoil the broth, or so they say.

 

Gonna add your suggestion to the opening post.

Edited May 19, 2013 by matrixEXO

[Tsukinoki]

@matrixEXO

One thing is that they do have an infested mission there, just all on its own, and they could work it into the lore that there is a powerful infested ancient that the grineer are managing to keep back there and stop from spreading throughout the system.

At that point it wouldn't be a 'leader', just a unique unit that happens to be stuck there.

There are a lot of directions the lore could take.

[matrixEXO]

@matrixEXO

One thing is that they do have an infested mission there, just all on its own, and they could work it into the lore that there is a powerful infested ancient that the grineer are managing to keep back there and stop from spreading throughout the system.

At that point it wouldn't be a 'leader', just a unique unit that happens to be stuck there.

There are a lot of directions the lore could take.

Infested are everywhere. It's like a plague that exists to rip your anal out from it's socket. Other than that, you don't get Corpus AND Grineer on the same planet unless you do an Alert mission.

 

As for lore, I hate to say it but it's stupid when ingame itself has little lore. Most of the lore are from fanworks or outside the game that makes people feel... detached from the game. A game like this needs a story together with it, not separated from it.

Edited May 19, 2013 by matrixEXO

[Tsukinoki]

@matrixEXO

It would be interesting to have a system where the corpus and grineer are fighting it out.

I was just suggesting how they could do it and have it fit in lore-wise with infested.

[matrixEXO]

@matrixEXO

It would be interesting to have a system where the corpus and grineer are fighting it out.

I was just suggesting how they could do it and have it fit in lore-wise with infested.

I can't wait for a 3-way faction rumble when the Tennos just drop in to hold out a Defense mission for as long as they can. Makes for epic battles since no one strategy is enough when playing against all 3 factions at the same time.

[Tsukinoki]

@matrixEXO

The only thing is they would have to re-code defense missions to allow for that.

I have been in defense missions where it showed the floor and wall decals for infested even though it was a corpus map but the infested never spawned in. I was disappointed because I thought it would have been great fun.

The only thing is that they would have to spawn in different groups for the different waves, otherwise it would be too easy to sit back and watch them all kill each other.

[matrixEXO]

@matrixEXO

The only thing is they would have to re-code defense missions to allow for that.

I have been in defense missions where it showed the floor and wall decals for infested even though it was a corpus map but the infested never spawned in. I was disappointed because I thought it would have been great fun.

The only thing is that they would have to spawn in different groups for the different waves, otherwise it would be too easy to sit back and watch them all kill each other.

And re-code the AI so that they don't just skirmish each other as well. There are a bajillion things to actually do like make a new map so the enemies pour from one side and so on. Not easy to just say recode defense mission.

[VKhaun]

No. I think we need to put this into the perspective of an ongoing cash shop game where they want their newest frames available and their newest areas to be shiny and desirable. 

 

Standard set of Warframes = Boss rewards.

Newest Warframes = ? Alerts and such.

 

New areas come out.

Old 'new' warframes = from the new bosses.

 

The new 'newest' warframes = ? Alerts and such.

 

 

 

To say all of them should drop from one boss is backwards. You need MORE BOSSES so only the newest frames are on ? rewards and the older ones can be rotated into the field. The starting three frame options taking up three bosses is completely trivial in the long run where we will presumably have many more locations. Besides, the starting line up has already changed once. The starting weapons and frames should all have their own sources specifically so that the tutorial rewards and options can be tweaked without needing to worry about retroactive changes or availability adjustments.

[matrixEXO]

No. I think we need to put this into the perspective of an ongoing cash shop game where they want their newest frames available and their newest areas to be shiny and desirable. 

 

Standard set of Warframes = Boss rewards.

Newest Warframes = ? Alerts and such.

 

New areas come out.

Old 'new' warframes = from the new bosses.

 

The new 'newest' warframes = ? Alerts and such.

 

 

 

To say all of them should drop from one boss is backwards. You need MORE BOSSES so only the newest frames are on ? rewards and the older ones can be rotated into the field. The starting three frame options taking up three bosses is completely trivial in the long run where we will presumably have many more locations. Besides, the starting line up has already changed once. The starting weapons and frames should all have their own sources specifically so that the tutorial rewards and options can be tweaked without needing to worry about retroactive changes or availability adjustments.

I think it's idiotic, undesirable and disses on people. Sure, you can say that they will add more planets and bosses BUT have you actually seen the disparity in updates for planets? If this game were to go 1 yr forward, I would believe that close to 50% of all the frames will be Alert only. If you think I'm over-exaggerating, try calculating it for yourself.

 

1 new planet = 1 new boss, current meta. Given that a frame comes out once every 2 months in average, you are seeing a total of 6 frames that are gonna be Alert-based, summing to a total 7 frames if 1 planet were to be created during this time span of 1 year.

 

If you don't see the issue at hand, I'm putting it forward. That and the fact that beginner Warframes are almost all so far away from getting makes people scratch their head a lot. What we, the players, do not want is playing a roulette that we cannot control to get anything. Alerts are already a roulette of uncontrollable magnitude as it is. It's like asking us to bet our life on a RNG effect where you are playing a guessing game to figure which one is gonna land to be your saviour, except 999/1000 of them are death callers. Farming for a random drop is something that is actually semi-controllable, thus tolerable.

 

 

 

Slight off-topic:

The reason why RNG games work so well is because RNG is actually managed by players. Diablo, Torchlight. These games are RNG in nature. Loot drops are RNG, item rarities are RNG. What makes them stand out is the fact that the RNG can be manipulated, increasing it to your favor (by a small bit). That and the fact that you get to decide if you want to even RNG by killing mass mobs or not makes it more enticing (obviously the prospect of seeing a good drop is a driving factor).

 

In this game, Alerts are RNG that has nothing to do with the player itself. They are rolled by machines and then only forced onto a player. The disparity between even getting an item from the RNG is low, whereas the other RNG games do give you loot (useless, but still). If this game needs a fix, it's where any Alert mission done GIVES you a roll onto the RNG. People playing Alerts more get to roll their dices more, that's all. This makes the game fairer and it actually would allow Alert-only warframes to be acceptable.

Edited May 19, 2013 by matrixEXO

[VKhaun]

---

 

Your only argument is still that you assume what they'll do well and poorly and in what proportion. 

 

 

None of that stands to reason anyway because the Warframe release cycle is limited to the dev time of making a Warframe, but the release schedule on new locations isn't linked to the dev time of making new environments. That's the whole purpose of the system that assembles separately made rooms and corridors. The devs don't have to make whole new levels. They just put the existing tiles together linking together at doorways that match up. They could make 100 new missions by lunch tomorrow if they wanted to.

 

The only limiting factor is the boss character itself, but I don't see any reason that the art of one boss is any more difficult to produce than the art of one Warframe model. It's probably even the same people doing both, so they could swap projects and the time difference would never matter. They just keep up 1:1 once they've got the proportion of ? alert rewards vs boss rewards that they want.

Edited May 19, 2013 by VKhaun

[Venarge]

Just because they are starting frames doesnt mean they are less powerfull than the rest. Making them all on saturn would simply devalue them. they are starters, yeah, but they are also as powerfull as the rest. No need to make them easy to get...