(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 They removed coptering because it was unpolished, not balanced between weapons, and is potentially going to be rendered obsolete by Parlour 2.5. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 lolSuck feedback Much rational thought Many well thought out points Wow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 Suck feedback Much rational thought Many well thought out points Wow I could say the same to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 I could say the same to you.Uh, not really. I presented 3 rational points. You didn't really provide anything. You're just running up your post count right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract7777 Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 Suck feedback Much rational thought Many well thought out points Wow I've noticed that most people arguing against the removal of coptering are just arguing from an emotional place. There's very little actual discussion going on, just rageful/scared doomsaying about how removing coptering will take all their fun from the game. Honestly, if coptering is the only thing that makes the game fun for someone... I really don't know what to tell them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceryk Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 (edited) I like how these people always go to the doom and gloom and don't ever think that DE might just do something like... you know... add something more effective, easier to execute, and doesn't make you look ridiculous doing over and over that makes coptering obsolete and return the slide attack back to it's intended function as a melee attack. Always gives me a good chuckle. Edited June 20, 2015 by Ceryk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 Uh, not really. I presented 3 rational points. You didn't really provide anything. You're just running up your post count right now. You never addressed my point in the post that you quoted. I post it for you again: "If it was better then they would not have had to remove coptering." If new parkour was such a good system, as you claim, there would be no point in removing coperting altogether. People would have just natuarally used the new system. The only thing unbalanced about coptering was the staff weapons. Those needed a range reduction, that's it. That doesn't justify ripping coptering out entirely. That's why your post was laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 I've noticed that most people arguing against the removal of coptering are just arguing from an emotional place. There's very little actual discussion going on, just rageful/scared doomsaying about how removing coptering will take all their fun from the game. Honestly, if coptering is the only thing that makes the game fun for someone... I really don't know what to tell them... Coptering made the game fast and fun. Wall running is in every other game out there. Hell, even Call of Duty has wall running now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract7777 Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 (edited) Coptering made the game fast and fun. Wall running is in every other game out there. Hell, even Call of Duty has wall running now. You are missing everyone's point hardcore because you want to miss their point. Parkour 2.0 is way more than just wallrunning, it's an improvement of the old system. Instead of complaining about the removal/rework of a movement system based on a glitch, why not wait to see how well the new system actually works, before complaining? Maybe you will actually like it and find it to be a faster/more fluid and consistent movement system? If all you want to see is bad that's all you'll see. You aren't listening or giving this a chance, instead you're just doomsaying about changes that haven't yet been implemented, over something that, regardless of whether it was ever touched up, looks bad, is based on a bug, and was never meant to remain permanent. Remember this is beta, stuff is going to change a lot. That's part of the system. And no, I saw what you posted above and that's wrong. You don't just leave a old broken system in when you rework with a brand new one so "people have options" or "so they can see the new system is better than coptering". That's not how programming works. For the most part it's unlikely the old coptering system would even be compatible with a new movement system, because a new movement system means a lot of coding changes. But more to the point, coptering isn't just being removed for the reasons you are saying. It's being removed because a movement system based on a bug is not something devs want as part of their game, it looks awful. The new system will be better. Accept that. You aren't going to get them to stop at this point. It woudln't matter a hill of beans if it was not as good and they "left it in to show you", they wouldn't do that because it makes the game look bad, it's not professional looking at all. And before you say "then they should have improved coptering instead of removing it", well, that's the whole point. They made a WHOLE new system, to make things better. Edited June 20, 2015 by Tesseract7777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 You never addressed my point in the post that you quoted. I post it for you again: "If it was better then they would not have had to remove coptering." If new parkour was such a good system, as you claim, there would be no point in removing coperting altogether. People would have just natuarally used the new system. The only thing unbalanced about coptering was the staff weapons. Those needed a range reduction, that's it. That doesn't justify ripping coptering out entirely. That's why your post was laughable. Coptering was removed because it was a bug, which I believe is in the post. The other thing unbalanced about coptering is that Heavy Blades and Scythes would slow down instead of speed up when coptering. It's the same physics related fault. The ranges also differed too greatly between weapons for it to be balanced. Finally, what you're saying is that Parkour 2.5 should be good enough to make us cover up a bug, and not fix the bug itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 You are missing everyone's point hardcore because you want to miss their point. Right back at you. If they had left coptering in then this would not have been an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract7777 Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 Right back at you. If they had left coptering in then this would not have been an issue. No, that's not a right back at you. That's a you missing the point again. You are basically saying that this wouldn't be an issue if DE does nothing, but that's not an argument, or a reason not to, because that's something people do every time they change anything in a BETA GAME. Every time. Anything. Everyone screams. And it's beta. And they are beta testers. Think about that. Saying that they shouldn't have done it because people will complain is what you are saying, and makes no sense. It's not a reason, it's just you wanting your way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 Coptering was removed because it was a bug, which I believe is in the post. The other thing unbalanced about coptering is that Heavy Blades and Scythes would slow down instead of speed up when coptering. It's the same physics related fault. The ranges also differed too greatly between weapons for it to be balanced. Finally, what you're saying is that Parkour 2.5 should be good enough to make us cover up a bug, and not fix the bug itself. That's balance in an of itself. You get a high damage weapon, or you get a weaker weapon with better movement potential. I already pointed out a ton of things started out as glitches and because fun game play elements. Have you never seen wirefu martial arts movies. That's the exact type of feel coperting provided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract7777 Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 That's balance in an of itself. You get a high damage weapon, or you get a weaker weapon with better movement potential. I already pointed out a ton of things started out as glitches and because fun game play elements. Have you never seen wirefu martial arts movies. That's the exact type of feel coperting provided. No that's not balance. That's encouraging people to use melee weapons for something other than their intended purpose, and is clearly one of the reasons they are doing away with it. You are making our argument for us. And again, your missing the point. Devs can do whatever they want with their games, but DE doesn't want their main movement system to be based on a bug/exploit. If you design a video game and you want to base features on bugs, and exploits you can do that. They don't because it looks unprofessional and could easily be replaced with something much better, that doesn't look absurd. Too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 No that's not balance. That's encouraging people to use melee weapons for something other than their intended purpose, and is clearly one of the reasons they are doing away with it. You are making our argument for us. And again, your missing the point. Devs can do whatever they want with their games, but DE doesn't want their main movement system to be based on a bug/exploit. If you design a video game and you want to base features on bugs, and exploits you can do that. They don't because it looks unprofessional and could easily be replaced with something much better, that doesn't look absurd. Too bad. If you balance them around damage vs movement then both become their intended purpose. Devs can do whatever they want is no a valid argument for why something should be done. Street Fighter doesn't look professional to you? The way I see it Street Fighter is one of the most professional games around, especially considering the Pro tournaments like EVO and the sponsored player and such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 That's balance in an of itself. You get a high damage weapon, or you get a weaker weapon with better movement potential. I already pointed out a ton of things started out as glitches and because fun game play elements. Have you never seen wirefu martial arts movies. That's the exact type of feel coperting provided. It would be balanced if not for the massive discrepancies and the whole 'forcing a player to use a specific weapon to move around' thing. Scindo Prime should be slow, yes. Tipedo should be fast, yes. But the Tipedo should not be literally 15 times faster than the Scindo Prime. That is not balance.And yes, some things start out as bugs and become parts of gameplay, bit obviously coptering is not and should not be one of those things. Your load out should have no effect on you ability to move, because you need to move at all levels of play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract7777 Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 If you balance them around damage vs movement then both become their intended purpose. Devs can do whatever they want is no a valid argument for why something should be done. Street Fighter doesn't look professional to you? The way I see it Street Fighter is one of the most professional games around, especially considering the Pro tournaments like EVO and the sponsored player and such. But your only reason is that some devs from other games have turned exploits into features, you just argued against your own argument being valid lol. But the devs don't want movement to be melees purpose, simple as that. If you don't like that, you don't have to, but that's the way it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 And yes, some things start out as bugs and become parts of gameplay, bit obviously coptering is not and should not be one of those things. Your load out should have no effect on you ability to move, because you need to move at all levels of play. So all Warframes should have the same movement speed, and they should remove the mods that increase sprint speed? you just argued against your own argument being valid lol. Actually, I didn't, and talking to you is clearly a waste of my time so I will just ignore you from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 So all Warframes should have the same movement speed, and they should remove the mods that increase sprint speed?That has nothing to do with melee choices being related to movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 That has nothing to do with melee choices being related to movement. You said loadout should have no effect. Frames and Mods are also part of your loadout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract7777 Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 (edited) So all Warframes should have the same movement speed, and they should remove the mods that increase sprint speed? Actually, I didn't, and talking to you is clearly a waste of my time so I will just ignore you from now on. Yes that's what you said. You are saying that the reason DE should give you your way is because some devs from other games have chosen to turn bugs into exploits, but you cannot fathom that DE should have a different opinion on that matter, or have the right to do things their way. You make it about devs making choices, but you can't accept that they don't make the choice YOU want. It's like talking to wall with you. All you want to do is whine and be angry. Go ahead and ignore me, it's not like you are actually reading the posts of anyone you disagree with anyway. It's not like you are doing anything but seeing another post, writing that you want DE to accomodate you because that's what you want again, and ignore everything we say. You said loadout should have no effect. Frames and Mods are also part of your loadout. Like talking to a wall, you really are missing his point totally. Edited June 20, 2015 by Tesseract7777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 You said loadout should have no effect. Frames and Mods are also part of your loadout.You knew exactly what I meant, and purposefully misrepresenting what I said isn't making your argument any stronger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 You knew exactly what I meant, and purposefully misrepresenting what I said isn't making your argument any stronger. Actually, it weakens your argument. It shows you are cherry picking what you think should or shouldn't change movement speed, most likely because of your choice of melee weapon. Why is it okay to balance movement speed around one piece of equipment, but not another? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 Actually, it weakens your argument. It shows you are cherry picking what you think should or shouldn't change movement speed, most likely because of your choice of melee weapon. Why is it okay to balance movement speed around one piece of equipment, but not another?I'm sorry, I wasn't aware I could copter with my Latron Prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 I'm sorry, I wasn't aware I could copter with my Latron Prime. What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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