The Master Forma Solution

[(XBOX)LordPuck]

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

 

Also, if you don't want to use my full name then call me, "Mr. Flame".  I don't recall us being on a first name basis.

Glad you asked.

Remove weapons as MR fodder and you save a metric puck ton of time grinding your way to MR 30. 

This reduces overall grind time and stress from players. Less time = less stress on a player. " I dont have to powerlevel, 200 guns, 22 frames, 3 Archwing."

  

Im bad a math, but Im not blindly quoting a chart.... try to think for yourself Desecrated. 

 

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Glad you asked.

Remove weapons as MR fodder and you save a metric puck ton of time grinding your way to MR 30. 

This reduces overall grind time and stress from players. Less time = less stress on a player. " I dont have to powerlevel, 200 guns, 22 frames, 3 Archwing."

  

Im bad a math, but Im not blindly quoting a chart.... try to think for yourself Desecrated. 

 

I don't see how that helps the tea economy at all.

[motorfirebox]

Glad you asked.

Remove weapons as MR fodder and you save a metric puck ton of time grinding your way to MR 30. 

This reduces overall grind time and stress from players. Less time = less stress on a player. " I dont have to powerlevel, 200 guns, 22 frames, 3 Archwing."

  

Im bad a math, but Im not blindly quoting a chart.... try to think for yourself Desecrated. 

 

That really doesn't have anything to do with the topic, and at any rate it's not a significant grind reduction. People who pursue MR will still level all the weapons that they can get ahold of. MR is the ultimate useless bar to fill—past 8 or so, MR means nothing, it's just epeen (I say this as someone who is obsessively grinding his way towards MR19). If weapons don't contribute to MR, I'm still going to level them all, because there's no point having them sit in my inventory unranked when I can fill more epeen bars by maxing them.

[Sci_Ant]

That really doesn't have anything to do with the topic, and at any rate it's not a significant grind reduction. People who pursue MR will still level all the weapons that they can get ahold of. MR is the ultimate useless bar to fill—past 8 or so, MR means nothing, it's just epeen (I say this as someone who is obsessively grinding his way towards MR19). If weapons don't contribute to MR, I'm still going to level them all, because there's no point having them sit in my inventory unranked when I can fill more epeen bars by maxing them.

 

Lel, I admire your brutal honesty. I much prefer the term 'completionist' though. XD

[motorfirebox]

Compeentionist

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Compeentionist

I chuckled.

[AlphaHorseman]

That really doesn't have anything to do with the topic, and at any rate it's not a significant grind reduction. People who pursue MR will still level all the weapons that they can get ahold of. MR is the ultimate useless bar to fill—past 8 or so, MR means nothing, it's just epeen (I say this as someone who is obsessively grinding his way towards MR19). If weapons don't contribute to MR, I'm still going to level them all, because there's no point having them sit in my inventory unranked when I can fill more epeen bars by maxing them.

+1, haha.

 

In all honesty, I quoted you in the most recent hot topics, DesecratedFlame, as I feel this idea addresses the forma issues far more than having them be Ducat trade-ins. Feel free to look at the most recent Community Hot Topics and comment, see if we can get them to actually listen to us on this issue.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

+1, haha.

 

In all honesty, I quoted you in the most recent hot topics, DesecratedFlame, as I feel this idea addresses the forma issues far more than having them be Ducat trade-ins. Feel free to look at the most recent Community Hot Topics and comment, see if we can get them to actually listen to us on this issue.

Yeah, I saw and read that.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

So, I haven't seen DE mention this at all. What are our chances of actually getting this seen?

[AlphaHorseman]

So, I haven't seen DE mention this at all. What are our chances of actually getting this seen?

I hope good, I messaged Rebeccca with this thread, I hope she comments and gives us a response soon.

[(XBOX)LordPuck]

That really doesn't have anything to do with the topic, and at any rate it's not a significant grind reduction. People who pursue MR will still level all the weapons that they can get ahold of. MR is the ultimate useless bar to fill—past 8 or so, MR means nothing, it's just epeen (I say this as someone who is obsessively grinding his way towards MR19). If weapons don't contribute to MR, I'm still going to level them all, because there's no point having them sit in my inventory unranked when I can fill more epeen bars by maxing them.

This is why people should read a topic for themselves. The topic I mention earlier, removes weapons from the MR system. This eliminates a lot of grind overrall. So to keep it somewhat balanced, Im saying, its ok to restart your weapon at level 15. Not 25.

[XBlackLotusX]

+1 see no problem with it and would be fairly simple to implement it seems

[Mazen2013]

I'd rather have a permanent gameplay related solution instead of these shallow fixes. The root problem is that grinding is boring, not challenging, and the rewards suck.  

 

Solution:

 

Give every planet/mission a conclave rating. If you are higher nothing changes for you. But if you are lower you get extra experience, rewards and money. The lower you go the more you get. (Use single conclave rating for equipment parts, so you can't cheat the rating by taking one rank 30 weapon and the rest unranked)

So by having a challenge for yourself (which is part of the fun!) you can level up your gear much faster and you get a lot better rewards. There would also be an incentive to play lower missions again when you level up new gear since it would give more exp than doing high level missions. 

Edited July 25, 2015 by Mazen2013

[XBlackLotusX]

I'd rather have a permanent gameplay related solution instead of these shallow fixes. The root problem is that grinding is boring, not challenging, and the rewards suck.  

 

Solution:

 

Give every planet/mission a conclave rating. If you are higher nothing changes for you. But if you are lower you get extra experience, rewards and money. The lower you go the more you get. (Use single conclave rating for equipment parts, so you can't cheat the rating by taking one rank 30 weapon and the rest unranked)

So by having a challenge for yourself (which is part of the fun!) you can level up your gear much faster and you get a lot better rewards. There would also be an incentive to play lower missions again when you level up new gear since it would give more exp than doing high level missions. 

problem every event that has been added with a cc cap ive been able to cheese and so has the rest of the comunity making it scale off of bad gear only means people will min max and make a build that can easily rack up xp easily without risk and fast as everyone LOVES to find ways to get more out of what their doing than they are putting in that idea is like giving everyone a box full of bugs and exploits and saying go wild.

[Mazen2013]

problem every event that has been added with a cc cap ive been able to cheese and so has the rest of the comunity making it scale off of bad gear only means people will min max and make a build that can easily rack up xp easily without risk and fast as everyone LOVES to find ways to get more out of what their doing than they are putting in that idea is like giving everyone a box full of bugs and exploits and saying go wild.

 

You were able to cheese them because they had total conclave rating instead of single ones. If the cap would be "no higher than rank 5 equipment" I can't see exploiting.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Give every planet/mission a conclave rating. If you are higher nothing changes for you. But if you are lower you get extra experience, rewards and money. The lower you go the more you get. (Use single conclave rating for equipment parts, so you can't cheat the rating by taking one rank 30 weapon and the rest unranked)

So by having a challenge for yourself (which is part of the fun!) you can level up your gear much faster and you get a lot better rewards. There would also be an incentive to play lower missions again when you level up new gear since it would give more exp than doing high level missions. 

Your solution falls apart because everyone people have limited slots, so eventually all they will have is level 30 frames to chose from. If you restrict Frames from the rating then it is still boring because an unranked weapon will not hold up in high heir content, and taking a rank 30 frame into lower tier content is boring. 

 

My solution, takes away what makes grinding boring, and it has long term benefits to trying out multiple weapons and makes MR matter. As such, I think my solution is the better and "deeper" fix.

[Mazen2013]

Your solution falls apart because everyone people have limited slots, so eventually all they will have is level 30 frames to chose from. If you restrict Frames from the rating then it is still boring because an unranked weapon will not hold up in high heir content, and taking a rank 30 frame into lower tier content is boring. 

 

My solution, takes away what makes grinding boring, and it has long term benefits to trying out multiple weapons and makes MR matter. As such, I think my solution is the better and "deeper" fix.

 

There are enough planets for every rank. Also you don't lose anything by still going in with rank 30. You only get bonus if you go in lower. Which is the purpose anyway. We hit multiple problems at the same time: Going back to lower missions, getting better rewards in lower missions, getting back fun by having a challenge even when leveling up new equipment, faster leveling of new equipment. 

 

It solves so many problems. Your's only solves: "less grinding", when the underlying problem is: "grinding is boring because this and this and this.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Mazen2013

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

There are enough planets for every rank. Also you don't lose anything by still going in with rank 30. You only get bonus if you go in lower. Which is the purpose anyway. We hit multiple problems at the same time: Going back to lower missions, getting better rewards in lower missions, getting back fun by having a challenge even when leveling up new equipment, faster leveling of new equipment. 

 

It solves so many problems. 

I don't think it does.  I find fighting low level enemies with a r30 frame is boring. The enemies don't stand a chance.  In mid level content an unranked amprex is barely going to tickle enemies. It doesn't incentivise MR; and as such, it doesn't incentivise trying out a lot of new weapons.

[AlphaHorseman]

There are enough planets for every rank. Also you don't lose anything by still going in with rank 30. You only get bonus if you go in lower. Which is the purpose anyway. We hit multiple problems at the same time: Going back to lower missions, getting better rewards in lower missions, getting back fun by having a challenge even when leveling up new equipment, faster leveling of new equipment. 

 

It solves so many problems. Your's only solves: "less grinding", when the underlying problem is: "grinding is boring because this and this and this.

It doesn't make the grind more fun, in a sense, it just makes it more tedious. The time it takes to complete the task is lengthened or harder, due to the gimped gear equipped, but it does not inherently improve the grind, it expands it.

 

Actually making the grinding fun is a better solution, but in the meantime, the forma proposition given here does expand to different areas of the game that are lackluster. You don't have to grind as much to get weapons back to optimal performance, mastery now carries weight, and DE gets more plat sales as players continue to invest in forma due to the stigma behind it being taken away.

[Mazen2013]

I don't think it does.  I find fighting low level enemies with a r30 frame is boring. The enemies don't stand a chance.  In mid level content an unranked amprex is barely going to tickle enemies. It doesn't incentivise MR; and as such, it doesn't incentivise trying out a lot of new weapons.

 

 

Why would you go in with a 30 frame when you can take a rank 10 frame and weapons and get 4x the experience?! Because that's what the suggestion is about. 

 

 

It doesn't make the grind more fun, in a sense, it just makes it more tedious. The time it takes to complete the task is lengthened or harder, due to the gimped gear equipped, but it does not inherently improve the grind, it expands it.

 

Actually making the grinding fun is a better solution, but in the meantime, the forma proposition given here does expand to different areas of the game that are lackluster. You don't have to grind as much to get weapons back to optimal performance, mastery now carries weight, and DE gets more plat sales as players continue to invest in forma due to the stigma behind it being taken away.

 

So you would rather spend the same time in high level missions with low level gear than having a challenge in low level missions and with low level gear? That beyond my imagination. 

 

I can do 5 missions in 30mins in low level with low level gear that are challenging and get the even more exp than doing 15 missions in 30mins with low level gear in high level mission that are easy as F*** cause I took one rank 30 weapon with me.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Mazen2013

[AlphaHorseman]

So you would rather spend the same time in high level missions with low level gear than having a challenge in low level missions and with low level gear? That beyond my imagination. 

 

I can do 5 missions in 30mins in low level with low level gear that are challenging and get the even more exp than doing 15 missions in 30mins with low level gear in high level mission that are easy as F*** cause I took one rank 30 weapon with me.

With the solution proposed by the OP, I wouldn't be. I'd have enough mastery to cut that leveling time in half and get a good amount of re-leveling out of the way by having a higher mastery rank. Thus, the grind isn't inherently longer nor do I need to gimp myself to feel any sort of challenge, I can continue to grow my power without having to undercut my gear to get more experience, it is already there.

 

However, implementing both of these solutions would be good. I stated though that yours does not inherently make the game "challenging" by challenge itself. Your solution forces the player to be weaker in order to feel any sense of challenge, that isn't true challenge, it is artificial.

 

If you want to make things challenging, then actually make those things better to go up against. Things like these to ensure that enemy units scale and are challenging throughout content, but do not hinder players:

 

Grineer:

Faction Ideology Overall:

As the Grineer represent the only actually militant force in our WarFrame universe, I hope to impress that upon the player by not only giving feedback on the individual units that we face, but also the tactics to which the player sees our enemy units moving. For the Grineer, the obvious tactical ideology that this faction would have would be a focus of Squad composition and strategy, similar to what we have in today's military. Specific units for specific tasks, while also providing a hierarchical ladder similar to their cultural reverence of The Queens. Status is reflected by rank, and those above are more mechanically diversified and potent than their underlings. These higher units (i.e. Grineer Commander, Grineer Bombard, Grineer Heavy Gunner) would reflect their rank by presence and mechanical variation, while also coordinating (in appearance) the rest of their squad through telegraphs like a hand signal, or verbal commands that their squad units respond to and act accordingly with.

 

The composition of Grineer Squads, as proposed, would consist of one or two heavy/elite units, with a handful of medium units, and a more substantial number of common/light units. In essence, this reflects the Queens dominance over all aspects of Grineer Society, with the unit composition reflecting the composition of the Grineer heirarchy as well.

Grineer Lancer:

The most common unit that we see on the battlefield, the changes proposed to the Grineer Lancer focus on making it known that they are the most common of the Grineer infantry, but that does not discount them from being an effective force on the battlefield.

 

Levels 1-10 Grineer Lancers hold on to the characteristics that they currently possess on the battlefield, with a reduction of the times they throw grenades, and the effectiveness of these grenades.

 

Levels 11-20 Lancers come equipped with a faster reload time and their Grakata's have an increased fire rate of 25% to ensure their offensive capabilities grow as players progress through the beginning missions of WarFrame.

 

Levels 21-30 now gives Lancers an increase to reload speed, along with an accuracy buff of 15%. In addition, the Lancers receive an increase of 15% of armor, along with a change to the plasma grenades that allows them to hurl the grenades to stick to locations, somewhat like C-4.

 

Levels 31-40 Lancers come equipped with a Karak, rather than the Grakata. The higher emphasis on impact damage focuses on how the Grineer weaponry focuses on quelling conflicts with the Corpus. Additionally, the Grineer Lancers now come equipped with a Sheev. An upgrade to the regular Baton, the Sheev should serve as a weapon for defense, should enemy units come into close quarters combat.

 

Levels 41-50+ Lancers exchange their Ferrite armor for Alloy armor, with a tint change to match, so as to ensure players identify when this change comes into affect. Additionally, Grineer Lancers can now deploy grenades that have elemental properties, such as Fire, Ice, Electricity, and Toxin. Grineer Lancers also now benefit with 10% increased HP and running speed when a Grineer Heavy unit is directing the squad.

 

With these changes to the Grineer Lancer, they remain the grunts of the Grineer army, numerous and vast, and not a massive threat to players or enemies on a field of battle, but present an interesting threat that grows organically as the player progresses through the first half of the game.

Grineer Scorpions:

Levels 1-15 Scorpions is what we have now.

 

Levels 16-30 Scorpions are able to block bullets/roll out of the way of incoming skillshot/ranged abilities and bullets. This gives the Scorpion some survive ability as it's one of the few units bringing a sword to a laser gun fight. Also allows the Scorpion some added defense in melee combat as well.

 

Levels 31-45 Scorpions now have a stance for their Machete to better utilize their weapon. Thus, the Scorpions can actually go into hand to hand combat with the power and technique befitting of one of the Grineer's few melee units, and one of the higher units at that.

 

Levels 46-60 Scorpions have the ability to shoot their grappling hooks into terrain, thus allowing them to use the environment vertically and fly around/across the battlefield. This could also allow them to resist knockback effects by shooting their grappling hooks into the ground to resist it. Or avoid such abilities completely by grapple hooking out of the way of the incoming ability.

 

Levels 61-80 Scorpions attain the ability to walk on walls through hooks on their prosthetic feet (or maybe just changing their feet with mechanical claws, sorry for making more work for the animations and model department!). Freeing up their hands to combat wall running Tenno, Infested Units, and also their hooks.

 

Levels 80+ Scorpions now have another sword, thus giving them dual wield capabilities, in addition to using their feet as grappling hooks, as they've been given more hooks to use. This change makes them a very mobile and powerful unit on the battlefield.

 

As a note, giving the Scorpions a telegraph such as a more audible and unique sound effect when firing hooks, or walking on wall/ceiling surfaces, would be a good idea. With these units moving in three dimensions and with more varied methods, tracking them on the battlefield would already be cumbersome visually.

 

Thus, we have challenge from content that is not just a rehash of the content that we have, but an expansion of this content by giving content better mechanics as their levels go up.

 

Veteran players actually face a challenge, rather than just more bullet sponges. We have a greater dynamic in end-game, and our enemies become far more interesting to fight

Grineer Heavy Gunners:

Levels 1-20 is how we see them now. To ensure that beginner players and lower planet content aren't too overwhelmed, their mechanics stay as they are for a longer duration of time.

 

Levels 21-35 gives them the ability to use their AoE ability to stop knock back abilities. Thus giving Heavy Gunners the ability to resist some CC, but also use current assets for an expanded function.

 

Levels 36-50 allows them to deploy a stationary shield (much like the Grineer Shield Lancer) to use as a defensive measure. With this defensive measure added, the Heavy Gunners can better pose a threat to us as a "heavy unit" on the field, outside of a health stat/armor increase.

 

Levels 51-65 provides them the use of a secondary weapon/melee weapon (stance added). Holstered, of course, but usable weapons should the AI decide to spice up the weapon variety and fight us with more than just a regular gun. Adding in a melee weapon also creates some interesting situations in close ranged combat, or when enemies are disarmed.

 

Levels 65-79 gives them the ability to dual wield a Melee and a primary/secondary. Essentially approaching the end-tier of Raids, this change makes heavy gunners a clear threat on the battlefield, and something that players should deal with quickly. They become a force to be reckoned with, but one that can still be overcome.

 

Levels 80+, in this case I'm pondering replacing the Heavy Gunners with a weaker variant of Lech Krill, minus the invulnerability and RNG phases. Essentially something of a second in command squad unit to Lech Krill. As their presence would primarily be in Raids, their presence in the highest levels of Grineer content would (I hope) justify their presence here.

Grineer Commander:

For the Commander Unit, a change to his status would be adding in a mechanic similar to what we have with Rhino's Roar. Dubbed the Command Ability (or what have you), this emphasizes the Commander unit as the head of the squad and a top priority for enemy units to deal with. Having the ability be limited to one cast per twenty seconds might be a good idea, to ensure that this ability isn't overwhelming to newer players, nor veterans as the enemy unit scales later into content.

 

Levels 1-20 gives them the ability to use a Command ability to empower nearby allies. As a commanding unit on the battlefield, this helps to increase the effectiveness of the Commander, and fits his role aesthetically. Similar to Rhino's Roar, this ability could give a telegraph akin to Roar's effect, only now emanating off of the enemy units, rather than Tenno allies. The Commander himself could telegraph this by an entire body animation and audible cue.

 

Levels 21-35 allows the Grineer Commander to teleport a group of allied units with him upon utilizing his teleportation ability. Essentially becoming a squad leader, the commander can now better fit his role as the head unit. Repositioning Grineer troops and displacing enemy units can be a dangerous combination on the battlefield, and now the Commander is more of a unit to prioritize in battle as well.

 

Levels 36-50 The Command ability now has a chance (50%?) to remove procs placed on allied units. Adding in this change allows the Commander to assist the squad with removing debuffs. Similar to how field commanders in the military have to boost allied morale and empower their troops, this could be a useful trait for the Commander to have in later content.

 

Levels 51-65 gives the Grineer Commander heavier armor, and allows the Command ability to have a chance of increasing the level of allied units in the area. Grineer Commanders now also have a melee weapon on their person (complete with stance).

 

Levels 66-80 Commanders have an additional melee weapon and can deploy a Grineer Regulator. Used in synergy, they can create very difficult situations for Tenno to deal with. This changes allows the Commander to focus more on attacking enemy units and coordinating the squad, whereas the Regulator can perform the more auxiliary military functions.

 

Levels 80+ Commanders can now Teleport to another allied unit, rather than solely displacing an enemy unit. This allows the Grineer Commander to truly move squads wherever the Grineer need them most. Their repositioning could turn the tide of battle in favour of the Grineer, or directly to the enemy, if the Commander is not wary of crafty Tenno.

 

These changes help to make the Grineer Commander an actual Commander on the battlefield. Leading his troops and heading the charge against foes. Even in later content, if a Tenno can predict where the Commander would move his squad, they could essentially wipe out two whole squads or the majority of one in one fell swoop.

Grineer Regulator:

One of the very few support class units we see on the field for the Grineer, this rework is in the hopes of ensuring that this units presence is appreciated and felt by allied units, while becoming a more prioritized target for enemy units to dispatch before it becomes a noticeable threat.

 

Levels 1-15 Regulators are the units that we currently see on the battlefield.

 

Levels 16-30 Regulators emit a radial pulse every 10 seconds, which has a chance to knock down enemy units. Providing a bit of CC to the Grineer, the Regulators use now expands outside of just an enemy damage buff and UI jammer. This small addition allows players to identify the position of the Regulator in a more obvious way as well, as some issues occur with locating the Regulator in certain WarFrame maps. The radius of the pulse may be kept to 10 meters, for the sake of it not becoming too powerful in such an early stage.

 

Levels 31-45 Regulators increase the buffs given to allied units. Regulators are also equipped with shields similar to the Grineer Shield Lancer to provide extra defense on the battlefield. This helps to provide some survive ability to the Regulator while also emphasizing their support role.

 

Levels 46-60 Regulators have a chance to remove the procs applied to allied units upon its pulse. Pulse intervals are reduced to 8 seconds. Similar to what the reworked Nullifiers can do for allied units, this change helps to remedy the allied units around the Regulators, another added layer of defense and support.

 

Levels 61-80 Regulators can now move freely through the battlefield and can utilize a short ranged teleport to escape/reposition every 10 seconds. This change, in tandem with a Grineer Commander's reworked teleport ability, allows the Regulator to move from squad to squad on the battlefield and support groups in different positions.

 

Levels 80+ have Regulators with increased speed, and pulse intervals are reduced to 5 seconds, with increased radius. Covering a larger area with pulses and moving between squads, Regulators can now support more than just a squad in this instance, but also a larger platoon as well.

 

These changes help to make the Regulator a more useful unit on the battlefield, and helps them to become a very strong support to the allies around it. Rather than just a damage increase and enemy UI jammer, it now becomes something that Tenno can audibly hear and prioritize accordingly on the battlefield.

Grineer Eviscerator (Frontier and Arid):

The Grineer Eviscerator is a unit that presents an interesting encounter where, if hit by a saw disc, more often than not players find themselves hit with the slash proc, often stacking as the Eviscerator unleashes more volleys of saw discs at the player. The feedback proposed for the Grineer Eviscerator is in the hopes of making the slash procs less of an occurrence, while also making the Eviscerator a heavy hitter, should it land a shot.

 

Levels 1-15 Eviscerators now fire at 50% their current fire rate. This change is to ensure that newer players aren’t overwhelmed with a volley of saw discs.

 

Levels 16-30 Eviscerators now have an increase of 25% fire rate, along with a 25% increase of ricochets to help give the Eviserators more precedence on the battlefield.

 

Levels 31-45 Eviscerators now have the Brakk as a possible weapon to use in battle. As the Eviscerators were a unit with presence during the Gradivus Dilemma, having them carry a stock version Brakk weapon would be an interesting way to reintroduce the weapon to Grineer troops and introduce this weapons capabilities to newer players.

 

Levels 46-60 Eviscerators now can charge their shots to fire in concession. Essentially unloading their entire clip, this helps the Eviscerator become a massive threat, should it charge the shot completely. Consequentially, the charge time for this massive volley would be around 3 seconds, to ensure players have a time to react. (This would be given a telegraph of the Eviscerator standing in place to charge the shot. Additionally, an audio cue should be added to ensure players are notified of the incoming charged shot and the general direction, to allow them to respond accordingly.)

 

Levels 61-80 Eviscerators now have the Atterax as a possible weapon to use in battle, complete with a Grineer Stance. Befitting an enemy using a saw disc launcher, the Atterax is a great complementary weapon choice to slash enemies apart while also keeping a distance.

 

Levels 80+ Eviscerators have the ability to split shot their saw discs. This lowers their accuracy, but increases the bounce chance of saw discs being able to hit targets through ricochets. (This cannot be used in tandem with a charged shot.)

 

With the changes to the Eviscerator, they go from an enemy unit that annoys players through extremely fast shots to being a threat on the battlefield to be feared, but able to be overcome. Their growth over time emphasizes their use of the miter and other weapons that have slashing as their mainstay, while also giving them secondary and melee weapons to help diversify their weapon usage.

 

*A reminder that miter shots can be deflected using melee blocking, even in their current iteration. A creative melee block could yield some interesting results on the battlefield, Tenno ;)

 

Corpus:

Faction Composition Overall:

The focus for the Corpus review is to emphasize the "endless automatons" that Darvo reveals the Corpus have in their arsenal. Comprising the bulk of the Corpus army will be the robotics, even going as far as changing some commoner units we have currently into robotics, and expanding the robotics in the Corpus faction. This increase in robotic enemies and decrease in more humanoid enemies helps to make the Corpus more distinct not only in appearance and weaponry from the Grineer, but also their tactical overview and army composition as well.

Faction Ideology Overall:

The Corpus Ideology will focus on AI tactics, rather than squad movements and composition like the Grineer rework proposes. This makes distinct the Corpus' AI network being sophisticated, while putting profit as the paramount paradigm. More deliberation on this topic will be added as the idea is fleshed out.

Corpus Crewmen:

Levels 1-10 is how we see them now.

 

Levels 11-20 gives them increased fire rate. Slight progression from before, to help them deal damage quicker as the difficulty increases.

 

Levels 21-30 allows for use of multi-elemental grenades* (that only detonate with one element). Thus, the Crewmen receive an interesting tool that can be useful for engagements and helps to make this grunt unit more useful. Having a UI displaying when and where a grenade is in the vicinity of the player would be key, in this case.

 

*Grenades explode with a base element (i.e. Fire, Ice, Electricity, Toxin), not elemental combos such as Radiation, Magnetic, or otherwise.

 

Levels 31-40 provides the use of more accurate weaponry, although it is now burst fire to conserve ammo. Higher accuracy, but lower ammo consumption effectively makes the Crewmen a better shot with more chances to land, as they don't expend their clips as quickly.

 

Levels 41-50+ gives them a melee weapon to use in close combat (stance added and allows them to block). Now they can fight players in close combat with more than just aiming up their guns at our faces, but actually present a duel or ninja-esque battle to players who decide to go into melee mode or sword alone. This also helps with weapon variety of enemies if these enemies are disarmed or choose to go into melee mode.

 

**It is important to note that a UI change such as an indicator would be key to have as well, to ensure players are notified when a Grenade is thrown into their area.

Corpus Nullifiers:

The idea behind the Nullifiers was a very interesting one, and one that could seriously alter the dynamic of the game, but as it stands, the Nullifiers act more so to limit player weapon choice, rather than hard-stop our powers solely. As such, my feedback for the Nullifiers is that they need a bit of a rework, to help them actually do their job equally of stopping our powers, but not limiting player play style, both with powers and with weapons.

 

Firstly, let's rename the Corpus Nullifiers Corpus Guardians. The mechanics of the Guardian unit is that it deploys a stationary 180 degree shield arc that protects all units behind it from CC/Utility effects and damage that is incoming from the direction it is facing. Think of it as a larger version of Alad V's thrown down shield during his Mutalist Boss Fight. Removing the limit on the amount of damage able to be done to the shield, but also upping its base HP, gives it a strong resistance to our powers, but does not limit our weapon variety. Additionally, any Corpus weaponry fired out of the shield receives a small damage bonus. (Tenno may also utilize this boost, should they be carrying Corpus weaponry).

 

Thus, the Guardian acts as protection for the Corpus against our powers, but does not hinder our weapon choice.

 

Players can now either tough it out in front of the shield against the enemy squads and fire upon it/use their powers until it falls. Or they can use their abilities and/or parkour skills to vault over/around the shield to kill the units taking cover behind it. The Guardian is now a unit that is useful and interesting to fight, but does not outright remove self-cast powers like Iron Skin or Hysteria, as the shield protects the occupants from outside interference/damage, but it does not remove them.

 

Scaling for the reworked Nullifier are as follows:

 

Levels 1-20 gives units behind it immunity to CC/Utility and damage incoming from the direction the shield is facing. It's somewhat like how we have them now, but with the bubble cut in half to ensure players still have to deal with a large enemy AoE ward, but it doesn't outright gimp multiple play styles.

 

Levels 21-35 gives a higher increase to damage for Corpus weaponry fired outwards from the shield. Beneficial and synergetic with the Corpus army, this change allows the Guardian to be a great asset on the battlefield for those who have Corpus weaponry equipped, Tenno included.

 

Levels 36-50 gives the Guardian the ability to remove procs from units entering into, or already within, its defensive radius. Bolstering its essence as a defensive ward, this change allows the Guardian to further support the units it protects.

 

Levels 51-65 allows the Guardian's shield to deflect incoming fire/powers in a random direction dictated by RNG. Somewhat of a buffer for the Guardian, it adds a bit more defense to the EHP of the shield, thus allowing for a short extension of defense for the units behind it. However, outside units beware, the ricochets might prove deadly.

 

Levels 66-80 allows the Guardian to absorb a portion of incoming damage and converts it into health (max 10% of incoming damage). The added defense could be telegraphed by the shield brightening or shimmering (for our color blind friends), thus visually showing an added protective measure present on the reworked Nullifier.

 

Levels 80+ Guardians can now be moved by a console at the center of the half circle shield. Essentially making the Nullifier a moving tank/castle, by this time the Guardian shields are Raid worthy, and this added mechanic adds a powerful way to make the Guardians a moving fortress, for anyone who can surmise to use them. (Essentially a Tenno Squad could use the Guardian as moving cover as well, should they be able to deal with the threats within the shield).

 

The reworked Nullifier now becomes a potent tool to stopping our powers, but not so limiting as to how to deal with the threat. In addition, it functions as a useful tool for any who can surmise how to use it once it is deployed.

Sniper Crewmen:

As the primary long range Corpus unit that is not a Moa, I would hope to increase the efficacy of the Corpus Sniper as a ranged unit, but also provide it with some interesting mechanics. To assist with the scaling and identification of a Sniper Crewmen on the field, adding in a laser sight to signal where the Crewmen is aiming would help make their unit known on the field, but not overly powered against newer players.

 

Levels 1-15 remain as we see them now, with the added laser to help newer players identify where the Sniper Crewmen is perched.

 

Levels 16-30 gives the sniper unit a deployable Shockwave Moa to help with defense, should an enemy unit come into close range. An added measure to ensure that the Sniper can hold their ground should enemy units be able to push past the bulk of the Corpus squad.

 

Levels 31-45 gives the Sniper Crewmen a melee and secondary weapon to utilize, as the need arises. Although this change may come at a lower level than other units, their general squishiness and ranged nature makes this change less felt, but also more unique should encounters in close combat arise.

 

Levels 46-60 increases the fire rate of the Sniper Crewmen's Lanka by 25% to help with eliminating enemy threats more quickly, in addition to increasing accuracy by 15%. Emphasizing the role of a Sniper, a specialization of such a sort can help to individualize this unit in higher levels.

 

Levels 61-80 allows the Sniper Crewmen to deploy a weaker version of Alad V's Mutalist shield. This shield also functions similarly to how the Corpus Guardian (Reworked Corpus Nullifier) Shield functions. Having this be used can help the Sniper Crewmen to set up a fortified sniping position away and back from the main Corpus force, and pose a threat to units as they proceed to advance through the battlefield, while also providing cover for Corpus squads on the offensive or retreating.

 

Levels 80+ Sniper Crewmen come equipped with a supply of Grenades as well, to help with encounters should players overcome their MOA. Or, if the AI see fit to place the Crewmen in an area where a short ranged AoE device would prove more effective than a long range sniper rifle, a grenade could be utilized.

 

These changes would hopefully allow the Sniper Crewmen to become a special unit on the battle field and be more individualized when it comes to encounters. Their added nature as offensively strong enemy units with slight defenses emphasizes ranged play, while not discounting that they can make a quick escape with the deployment of a Shockwave MOA or hold their ground with their shield.

 

*A laser sight would be required for Sniper units like the Corpus Sniper and the Grineer Ballistica, to ensure that players can identify the position of the Snipers when they are deployed on the field.

 

Infested:

Faction Ideology Overall:

With an emphasis of a "horde" mentality, the following has been suggested by Deus_X_Machina to help and outline the Faction style to which the overall Infested group would permeate. These points will be expanded and implemented into the Infested Units as they are looked at for expansions within this thread:

 

- Walls start to get used

- The ceiling is used

- Spawning / travelling in ceiling vents could exist for smaller infested

- more spreadout pattern for headon attacking infested

- more durable units running in front of the squishier ones that deal more damage

- cutting off routes

- targeted surrounding of one Tenno

- targeted cornering of Tennos

- seperating Tennos (driving a wedge between them and trying to lead them apart for example)

- Infested could crawl over each other to reach a target (get surrounded in 3d)

Infested Crawler

Levels 1-10 standard Crawler Unit.

 

Levels 11-20 Crawlers now move 10% faster while in a toxin cloud. This promotes synergy with the Mutalist Osprey unit, as now the Osprey can drop the Crawler, and the Crawler may now use the Toxin Cloud as a type of steroid or accelerant.

 

Levels 21-30 Crawlers now have the ability to change elemental status' if inflicted with certain base elemental damage. This makes them an interesting threat, as they can now be infused with different elemental damage types against enemy units.

 

Levels 31-40 Crawlers may now latch onto players and hold them in position. Thus, this allows other Infested units to swarm players, as any good mindless horde would.

 

Levels 41-50+ Crawlers are now able to become Bloated Crawlers. In other words, they are able to be lifted and hurled by large Infested Units, such as the Healers, at a location. Upon landing on an area, they explode after three seconds, releasing a small radial blast of whatever element they were before detonation. During this charge up, players can attack the crawler with guns or powers to destroy them and ensure that no AoE damage occurs, or hit the Crawler with melee to push them away from the area. Aiming a Bloated Crawler is simple, just face your crosshairs to an area and hit it to launch it.

 

The final change to higher leveled Crawlers turns them into a very useful tool on the battlefield for both the Infested and their enemies. They become a dregs level unit with some interesting mechanics, but ultimately aren't too crazy to merit immediate attention unless they become Bloated.

Infested Charger:

Levels 1-10 retain the current unit characteristics.

 

Levels 11-20 Chargers gain the ability to dodge incoming attacks by rolling sideways or hopping backwards. This gives Chargers a few more tactical options in fights, without making them far too agile to still be counted among the most common of the Infested units.

 

Levels 21-30 Chargers can mutate for a short time and experience an adrenaline rush, allowing them to charge at enemy units faster and strike at an increased attack speed (1.5 normal attack speed). This mechanic allows the Chargers to actually charge at enemy units, giving their namesake some weight.

 

Levels 31-40 Chargers can now burrow into the environment. As enemy units approach, Chargers can spring from their holes and attack enemy units. Adds a bit of a scare factor to the unit and allows them to be tactical in their approach.

 

Levels 41-50+ Chargers now are able to climb and run along walls and ceilings. Adding verticality and versatility into their arsenal further, this helps to expand the ways Chargers can spawn in and reach players while also giving an interesting tactic to help accentuate the horde mentality that the Infested permeate.

 

Orokin:

Corrupted Bombard:

The bane of many a player's Void expeditions, the hopes of this rework is to make the Corrupted Bombards still a force to be reckoned with on the battlefield, but not so detesting as they are now. The following changes are to continue the feeling of the Bombards being a priority target, while also giving the surrounding units around them the cadence of presence that the Corrupted Bombards are on the field. In that spirit, allowing the Bombard Missiles to also harm allied units, along with enemy units, is a change I would propose from the outset. As self explosives like the Penta can damage a player if they use it, I hope this mechanic also creates some interesting situations for both the Tenno and allies of the Corrupted Bombard.

 

Levels 1-20 Bombards now have their fire rates reduced to 50%, with missiles travel speed and armor reduced to 75% their current rate. As their presence and armor values already make them a formidable force on the battlefield, slight reduction to armor is to help them become less bullet sponges as they are now. This change is to allow first timers who visit the Void to realize the strength of the Bombard's weaponry, but not overwhelmed by the constant knock downs and AoE attacks that the missiles are notorious for.

 

Levels 21-35 Bombards can now deploy an Orokin drone for defensive measure of allied units. The Orokin Drones now hover slightly higher than they had before. This added safety precaution is to ensure that drones are not directly damaged by the Bombards' AoE blasts from missiles, and the next upcoming changes.

 

Levels 36-50 Bombards now have a unique grenade mechanic added to them. These grenades are similar to the Bombard Missiles in that they have a slight AoE. However, instead of knocking down players, these grenades knocks them up into the air. Similar to the newly released Tonkor weapon, this gives the Bombard the ability to displace enemy units. However, similar to the Tonkor, players still have agency while airborne. These grenades also affect enemy units as well. Think of it like a poor mans Bounce in this case, as now units could be launched airborne.

 

Levels 51-65 Bombards now have the Ankyros Prime as a Melee weapon for them to use. As they're the main tanks of the Orokin Corrupted, having them equipped with the Ankyros Prime makes them an interesting to foe to fight in close quarters. Giving them the Ankyros Prime also allows them Knock Back. (not that it is not knockdown, just knock back, to ensure players have agency) (Hats of to those who are Melee enthusiasts, I hope this change is something you'll find challenging!)

 

Levels 66-80 Bombards now also have the Bronco Prime as a secondary that they can utilize on the battlefield. A close range hand cannon essentially, this can be used if enemy units come closer into range to the Bombard. In conjunction with the Ankyros Prime, Bombards can Knock Back enemies, should the get too close, and switch to the Bronco Prime for close quarters gun combat.

 

Levels 80+ Bombards receive a change in mechanics through an ability called Bombard's Volley. This locks the Bombard in place, however, they have their fire rate doubled (essentially returned to their normal fire rate as we have them now) and gain an increase of armor (125% of their current iteration). (A telegraph such as the Bombard preparing to lock down (an animation of maybe three seconds?) should be implemented to ensure players have time to react before the Bombard let's loose his volley.)

 

Overall these changes are to help newer players not be gobsmacked and knocked down repeatedly by the Bombards, but also make them a felt force on the battlefield as the heavy unit of the Corrupted Arsenal. Each change emphasizes impactful gameplay and weaponry, while also creating some interesting situations for players to try and understand and work with on the battlefield.

 

For instance, allowing the Bombard to fire his volley may seem like a bad idea, but if a player can utilize the missiles and redirect it towards enemy units, they could essentially create instances where friendly fire would benefit their team by eliminating threats for them. Other instances like the Knock Up mechanic could be used to knock up enemy units that are incoming for melee combat, essentially displacing them instead of agile Tenno adept at the game's parkour.

Corrupted Ancient Healers:

This unit has come under fire as of late, and with the recent mechanical additions DE has implemented to the Healer, its complementary units within the Void have more so become an issue that is extremely difficult to deal with. The General feedback given for the Corrupted Healers (that I have seen) focuses on the immense range of the heals, the mechanic of Healers intaking very little damage, and the mitigation of abilities, especially discriminating against certain abilities as well. The hopes of the following feedback is to ensure that the Healer is still a primary support unit for the Corrupted to rely on, but not so game breaking as they are now.

Base Mechanical Changes:

Ancient Healers have a few tweaks to their mechanics. A paramount concern is the multiplicative or stacking mechanics occuring with the Corrupted Ancient Healers. In tandem with these changes to follow, rather than allowing the stacking to continue, the damage mitigation should be removed from their lower levels, and the instances of damage mitigation cannot stack as well. This is to ensure that enemy units do not obtain absurd amounts of EHP simply by the presence of more than one Corrupted Ancient Healer.

 

Instead of an unclear range as to the Ancient Healers at the moment, a set distance of 10 meters would be a good way to gauge their Healing capabilities. Additionally, have the Healers act as an actual healing unit, rather than a straight forward damage reduction tool. Healing surrounding units for 10% of their max health per second might be a good way to go about it. Alternatively, healing units for a percentage of health lost might prove to be a more substantial healing formula. Regardless, either route seems to be a far better alternative than what we have now. 

 

Healers also now intake damage from the units they are healing, maybe 25% of that damage, to ensure that the surrounding units survive. Also with this change, ensuring that the Healers do have a substantial amount of Health may be required, as now instead of damage mitigation, it's an actual healing mechanic.

 

Also, changing the Healer's grappling hook into the Infested Healers arm would be a visual improvement, as it is somewhat game breaking to see a Healer launching a Grineer Scorpion's hook to pull us towards them. The recent Lore placed on the Corrupted Ancient Healer may work to disprove that these are Scorpions, after all, as no Grineer unit has the capability to heal in such a manner.

Visual Tweaks:

Ultimately, as more Ancient units become Corrupted, the hope is that their visual variations become more prominent to ensure players can discern their differences on the battlefield more clearly. As the models for the Ancient Healer and the Ancient Disruptor are similar, and only visually different in color variation, their model changes when they become Corrupted would better give players visual cues as to which is the Healer, and which is the Disruptor.

Levels 1-20 Corrupted Ancient Healers hold the mechanics given above, rather than the iteration that they currently possess. These changes ensure that the Healer actually fills the role as a Healer, but does not overwhelm newer players to their mechanical uniqueness.

 

Levels 21-35 Healers now have an increased rate of damage linking, whereas instead of taking 25% of the damage of surrounding allies, they now take 50% of that damage. Consequentially, 5% of total damage taken is counted as health restored to the Corrupted Ancient Healer, to help give them a scaling HP value in tandem with making them a bit of a beefier unit. The field radius of their healing aura could be expanded to maybe 15 meters as well, to ensure that they can cover a larger radius.

 

Levels 36-50 Healers now have a pulsating aura, rather than a constant healing aura. With this change, Healers now can heal targets at a faster rate, with 20% of total enemy health restored per pulse, having it be one pulse every three seconds as well. Depending on the number of allied units healed, the Healer receives a percentage of its health back. (i.e. if 10 units are healed, the Healer receives 5% of health back) This turns the Healer into a more formidable support unit, but it also doesn't overwhelm the player with units recovering their health at an absurd amount and pace.

 

Levels 51-65 Healers can now scale the environment, as most other Infested do in other reworks. A more retroactive change, this helps to make the Corrupted's approach more three dimensional. It also acts as a retroactive change as well, should the Corrupted be expanded with more units that can scale the environment (i.e. the majority of the Infested, and the reworked Grineer Scorpions, should DE decide to Corrupt this unit). Healer Pulses now shorten the duration of procs on allied units by 50%. 

 

Levels 66-80 Healers now emit one final pulse upon death that expands to 20 meters, and removes procs applied to allied units within the area. Somewhat of a last stand mechanic, this change emphasizes that the healer is a unit to be dealt with quickly, and hopefully away from other enemy units. The proc removal allows other units to be strengthened by the last stand mechanic this entails, therein fulfilling the role of a healer unit.

 

Levels 80+ Healers receive a mechanic where, when units are affected by the healing pulse, they now heal 15% of their health over time when outside of the Healer's effective radius, only immediately after being hit with a healing pulse. This change helps to make allied units of the Healer more mobile, rather than dependent on the Healers and sticking around them. Also, Healers can now intake 10% of incoming damage to themselves and translate that into 5% of health increase to units affected by their pulses. Also, this change ensures that the returns to Healer's by units surrounding them aren't so drastic, as they are now.

 

Overall, these changes ensure that the Healer is a powerful support unit that should be dealt with quickly on the battlefield, but it does not cheapen their encounters with damage mitigation or the stacking of their mitigation affects. They complete their tasks as healers through multiple means, and overall become a stronger unit in higher levels, without having the need for mitigation.

 

 

As Original Orokin units are added into the game (hopefully), this section may be expanded upon.

 

Source:

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/425117-rework-all-the-enemies-grineer-lancer/

 

Now that would actually make the grind challenging and fun, rather than just the same old content we have now, but with your solution annoyingly harder because we have to go in with weaker gear to get more experience. Along with these changes to enemy scaling, if experience scaled concurrently with their level, we'd see better results. Also, if we implement your solution, going in with lower level gear into higher content could still yield better results for the players' overall.

 

The forma solution also makes the grind that much less, while the solution you propose also accentuates that, while the enemy changes actually do make the grind more of a challenge and interesting, by mechanical difference, rather than by being artificial.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

 

Why would you go in with a 30 frame when you can take a rank 10 frame and weapons and get 4x the experience?! Because that's what the suggestion is about. 

 

 

 

So you would rather spend the same time in high level missions with low level gear than having a challenge in low level missions and with low level gear? That beyond my imagination. 

 

I don't have infinite frame slots. I only have two frames that are not maxed out. They too will hit 30 eventually.

 

My proposition means that you could start with up to a level 25 weapon after every forma. If you have a tater in it, then that is 50 energy to play with immediately, instantly making them viable in end game.

 

Low level areas are not a challenge for vets.

[AlphaHorseman]

I don't have infinite frame slots. I only have two frames that are not maxed out. They too will hit 30 eventually.

 

My proposition means that you could start with up to a level 25 weapon after every forma. If you have a tater in it, then that is 50 energy to play with immediately, instantly making them viable in end game.

 

Low level areas are not a challenge for vets.

Exactly.

[SiiNN321]

There is no forma issue. No one is making you forma all your weapons. With one weapon spec'd out in each category of weapons, you have yourself all the power you'll ever need. This isn't a solution of any sorts. It is players crying for less grind in a game that (in reality) doesn't have that much grind.

This does not combat player burnout either since that is the players fault not the games. To avoid burnout stop running draco with the mindset of "I gotta do this to level my dang weapon" and do it for the fun of playing a new weapon. Don't bring other OP weapons and just use that one weapon and you'll see how much more fun and exciting it is.

Now to a REAL forma solution.... Once you forma a weapon, allow the player to place their mods on the spot with the maximum energy they would have at rank 30. When the weapon is played and leveled up, allow mods in the order of left to right, Top then bottom, be unlocked in real time. That way your weapon that was rank 0 and is now rank 6 has 12 energy worth of mods without leaving the game. This way it is viable the longer you go and the more exp you get. Grind doesn't feel like grind since you scale with the enemies (albeit not as fast)

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

1.) There is no forma issue. No one is making you forma all your weapons. With one weapon spec'd out in each category of weapons, you have yourself all the power you'll ever need. This isn't a solution of any sorts. It is players crying for less grind in a game that (in reality) doesn't have that much grind.

2.) This does not combat player burnout either since that is the players fault not the games. To avoid burnout stop running draco with the mindset of "I gotta do this to level my dang weapon" and do it for the fun of playing a new weapon. Don't bring other OP weapons and just use that one weapon and you'll see how much more fun and exciting it is.

3.) Now to a REAL forma solution.... Once you forma a weapon, allow the player to place their mods on the spot with the maximum energy they would have at rank 30. When the weapon is played and leveled up, allow mods in the order of left to right, Top then bottom, be unlocked in real time. That way your weapon that was rank 0 and is now rank 6 has 12 energy worth of mods without leaving the game. This way it is viable the longer you go and the more exp you get. Grind doesn't feel like grind since you scale with the enemies (albeit not as fast)

1.) There is actually quite a lot of grind depending on how many weapons you want to use, if you want them to be viable, and if you want to power level them.

 

2.) It does combat player burnout because there is less reason to for players to feel forced into draco. A weapon only starts being fun for me once it has 2 forma most of the time, especially if I am not planning to tater it. Just bringing an unranked weapon into end game will get you destroyed, but playing more than a few rounds in low level content is also completely boring.

 

3.) This is a nice WoL idea, but it doesn't address any of the core issues that mine does. There is also nothing stopping both from being implimented.