[WC] Ushtar: The Marine Tactician | 6/14/2017 - Added fulcrvm's last sketch

[Autongnosis]

F***, my post got deleted by my *amazing* line. I'll give you the short version, sorry :(

I like your idea. Assuming the damage is a pure Slash flat value with a forced Bleed puroc, imho you can either go with that or you can make it so that normally Tourniquet targets one enemy only, during Blade and Gun instead it has a AoE cone effect sorta like Ice Wave.

It rather depends on whether you want to boost Ushtar's offensive or his support capabilities. As a side note Tourniquet, being not overly powerful, could use a pretty simple buff to make it more interesting, that also fit with the void strands visual: make it a one-handed cast :)

About the Karambit i had an idea about the stats, imho it could be nice to make it a deat by a thousand papercuts weapon: a pure Slash based middle of the pack damage dagger with bad crit chance but good attack speed and high status chance (30/35%).

That would imho represent somewhat well how i'd recon the Karambit would be used in Warframe combat, since the blade doesn't look like it can leverage strenght to puncture stuff very well.

EDIT: i also remembered somethin else. Ivara, the new archer frame, has a mechanic for her 1 that allows her to "switch mode" by tapping 1 and cast the current mode by holding 1. You could rewrite your proposal to fit that mechanic since imho it would work just as well on top of being something already actually implemented :) And that could work also for Tourniquet - you could, for ease of use, separate te support use of Tourniquet and the offensive one by using that mechanic.

EDIT 2: i also had an idea about a possible passive (mind i like yours a lot and this is just for discussion's sake). It coud be something like:

Tactical Movement - Whenever Ushtar is slidung or rolling on the ground or doing a wallrun he gets a marginal damage resistance (25%?) stacking multiplicatively with any other DR from other sources.

Edited December 2, 2015 by Autongnosis

[Rhekemi]

Autongnosis, I will reply to your points and suggestions soon. Thanks for your thoughts!

 

Update: All current splash pages added to the front page. I'll just show off two of the main ones here if you don't want to go look at page one:

 

[size=5]Overview Splash Page - Ushtar at a Glance:[/size]

 

 

[size=5]Gear Splash Page - Details:[/size]

 

[Rhekemi]

I love the smell of redditors' napalm in the evening...just posted splash pages. Now taking in all the tough feedback. 

 

Still room for change in Ushtar's concept, so I welcome it.

Edited December 8, 2015 by Rhekemi

[Andy1134]

So I did a quick sketch of my own version it differs a bit from what you envisioned, so here it is

[Rhekemi]

Hey, Andy.

 

It looks great!

 

A complete overhaul from your older sketch. I like it.

 

How did you feel you incorporated the military dress style elements? 

 

While I can't see them, I still like it.

[Andy1134]

Thanks for now its a light sketch I plan to add some more details a bit later im looking into a older military dress style at the moment

[Rhekemi]

Sounds good, Andy.

If you want to start a PM discussion (or I can) to work on the design, that would be fine. (That is how I tend to work with all artists.)

Edited December 13, 2015 by Rhekemi

[Akiryx]

So I did a quick sketch of my own version it differs a bit from what you envisioned, so here it is

That is definitely the style I imagined more for the Karambit, I quite like it in that picture.

[Andy1134]

I actually had a thought. What if you made it so that his ult changed his apperance? Kinda like Chromas effigy, But Yea PM me if you want I had some style Ideas I was thinking about

[Akiryx]

The only thing I have to say currently about this, which is something my friend pointed out, is that in most or all of the artwork, the Karambits blade is angled the wrong direction. If he holds it in his fist outwards from him, the tip should curve away from him, not towards him.

[Q-Nel-974]

I hope to see this frame in 2016 .... ;)

[Q-Nel-974]

So I did a quick sketch of my own version it differs a bit from what you envisioned, so here it is

 

 

MMmmmmh... I prefer military skin

[Rhekemi]

I actually had a thought. What if you made it so that his ult changed his apperance? Kinda like Chromas effigy, But Yea PM me if you want I had some style Ideas I was thinking about

 

I think if he had an effect like Chroma's Effigy, everyone would say it was too much like Effigy, to be honest. I think we can keep exploring different looks for him and let the community decide what they like best. It's still only a concept, after all.

 

I will PM you. Just need time.

 

The only thing I have to say currently about this, which is something my friend pointed out, is that in most or all of the artwork, the Karambits blade is angled the wrong direction. If he holds it in his fist outwards from him, the tip should curve away from him, not towards him.

 

Indeed. It's on the list of tweaks to be made to the artwork (but unfortunately fulcrvm may not be able to change the critical detail).

 

Aside from updated art, there are concept changes I need time to implement (after the last Reddit session).

 

I hope to see this frame in 2016 .... ;)

 

Ha. Thanks for the support, but I'm sure Ushtar will have to get in line as it is. A lot of great concepts out there.

Edited December 24, 2015 by Rhekemi

[Andy1134]

I think if he had an effect like Chroma's Effigy, everyone would say it was too much like Effigy, to be honest. I think we can keep exploring different looks for him and let the community decide what they like best. It's still only a concept, after all.

 

I will PM you. Just need time.

 

 

Oh I dont mean he leaves it like a guard it would more like hitman where you change outfits. that way you appease the people who think the military dress doesnt look warframe enough. I actually like the military dress look makes him look more unique. Agreed ultimately it comes down to the community. Cool take your time with it, I will keep an eye on my inbox,

 

The only thing I have to say currently about this, which is something my friend pointed out, is that in most or all of the artwork, the Karambits blade is angled the wrong direction. If he holds it in his fist outwards from him, the tip should curve away from him, not towards him.

Wait is he holding it wrong in my art too? Cause I thought I drew it right way,

[VanguardViking]

I only have one issue with this

 

 

...

 

 

The point of the Karambit should face the other way...

 

 

+1

[Rhekemi]

Oh I dont mean he leaves it like a guard it would more like hitman where you change outfits. that way you appease the people who think the military dress doesnt look warframe enough. I actually like the military dress look makes him look more unique. Agreed ultimately it comes down to the community. Cool take your time with it, I will keep an eye on my inbox,

 

Wait is he holding it wrong in my art too? Cause I thought I drew it right way,

 

Ah, I see your point. However, without some kind of utility, or built-in mechanic, there's no way it would work. I'll think about it and get back to you.

 

No! You and Gamer_Jay both drew the karambit's blade in the right direction. By the time I'd noticed it in fulcrvm's work, he was on hiatus (as of November 8th) for personal reasons.

 

Aside from that, the only image we could do more edits on (after the main profiles were done) was the reference sheet, for technical reasons. I wish I'd noticed it when he sent the first draft, but I missed it. I should have caught it early on, but didn't.

 

I only have one issue with this

 

 

...

 

 

The point of the Karambit should face the other way...

 

 

+1

 

Thanks, and indeed. Artist is out of contact/cannot change the base image now, as I explain above in this same post. But I am decent with photo manipulation, so I'll give it a shot sooner or later. Minor manipulation seen here:

 

Original:

 

After manipulation:

 

I should be able to fool with it sometime in the near future. Expect imperfect results!

Edited December 24, 2015 by Rhekemi

[Andy1134]

I might be able to fix the blade direction in photoshop but not til monday if that is alright with you. Although its understandable if you prefer the actual artist to fix it.

[Rhekemi]

Fulcrvm is on hiatus, and even then, he can't change the blade direction on anything but the reference sheet for technical reasons. 

 

That said, nah, let me take a crack at it first. It's up my alley (my drawing skills are far inferior). Thanks for the offer, man.

[Akiryx]

Alrighty, just wanted to point it out if it hadn't been already. This is still one of my favorite concepts for frames. This, Flora, and Eidolon are the three that I desperately want in-game. 

 

One thing though. 75% Armor on top of 75% Damage Mitigation seems too OP, tbh. Like that would make him probably somewhere around 99% Blessing as long as he is channeling. I'd bump it down to like, 50% armor and 40% damage mitigation

(And even that is incredibly powerful. To be honest it would put Chroma's tanking to shame. I mean he'd have less damage but much easier time tanking)

Edited December 25, 2015 by Akiryx

[Autongnosis]

It's easy, if you just make the damage resistance not scale on mods. That way even a high Strenght (200%) would actually net you a total DR on health of 96% assuming Blade&Gun scales off total armour and not base armour. If it scales off base armour the DR on health would be 94%.

Considering we have multiple 95% DR abilities AND Trinity (99.8% or even more) and Chroma (98% assuming Ice and a 200% strenght and more) that reaches a lot more than that on both armour and damage boosting... I'm not sure that is so bad, this is actually decently powerful without being gamebreaking.

[VanguardViking]

Also, I like the nod to the Marine-corps being a Naval branch of the military in the Tricorn helm.

[Akiryx]

It's easy, if you just make the damage resistance not scale on mods. That way even a high Strenght (200%) would actually net you a total DR on health of 96% assuming Blade&Gun scales off total armour and not base armour. If it scales off base armour the DR on health would be 94%.

Considering we have multiple 95% DR abilities AND Trinity (99.8% or even more) and Chroma (98% assuming Ice and a 200% strenght and more) that reaches a lot more than that on both armour and damage boosting... I'm not sure that is so bad, this is actually decently powerful without being gamebreaking.

No, not really. 75% Mitigation on top of 75% additional armor is very ridiculous. With Steel Fiber he has a total armor of 630. 75% boost would make him have around 1100 armor. That's around 78% Mitigation on it's own. On top of the 75% pure mitigation you get already, assuming it worked the same way Blessing did, the armor would make you take 22% of the remaining 25% damage you would already take from having that base mitigation. Say you took 1000 damage, that would reduce it to 55 damage. That's a 94.5% Mitigation, for the entire duration of the ability (which happens to be a channel). And that doesn't take into account the extra mitigation you could get from Arcanes like Arcane Guardian, or with helpful effects like Arcane Grace, nor the mitigation you could gain from Melee Parrying or any other forms of defense, including those from other frames. Just a tad bit more powerful. And while Trinity and Chroma both have the ability to get ~98 Mitigation, they both have to try and it's not instantaneous. Ushtar's doesn't take any time to get to where it is, doesn't require you to be damaged, and can last as long as you like, as long as you can stay energized. Additionally, Chroma has to have massive power inefficiencies in order to score mitigation that high, whereas if Ushtar's (As you suggested) ability weren't affected by Strength, you could run NEGATIVE strength and still be fine, or just run an Intensify for your other abilities and build for other stats.

 

My suggestion to have 50% Extra Armor and 40% Pure Mitigation would be 85% effective mitigation, which is still quite reasonable. That also does not take into account the other defensive effects one could enact. I would have the pure mitigation unaffected, and have the armor boost be affected by your power strength halved. i.e. 50% armor with +100% power strength would result in +75% armor.

Edited December 25, 2015 by Akiryx

[Rhekemi]

Alrighty, just wanted to point it out if it hadn't been already. This is still one of my favorite concepts for frames. This, Flora, and Eidolon are the three that I desperately want in-game. 

 

One thing though. 75% Armor on top of 75% Damage Mitigation seems too OP, tbh. Like that would make him probably somewhere around 99% Blessing as long as he is channeling. I'd bump it down to like, 50% armor and 40% damage mitigation

(And even that is incredibly powerful. To be honest it would put Chroma's tanking to shame. I mean he'd have less damage but much easier time tanking)

 

Thanks for the support, Akiryx. Always great to hear others who like the idea (aside from me).

 

Between Reddit and this forum, the feedback has definitely helped shape and push Ushtar in the right direction.

 

The OP armor and damage reduction was raised on the last round of Reddit feedback, and I do plan to address it (reduce) it. Thanks for the suggestion in your other post.

 

It's easy, if you just make the damage resistance not scale on mods. That way even a high Strenght (200%) would actually net you a total DR on health of 96% assuming Blade&Gun scales off total armour and not base armour. If it scales off base armour the DR on health would be 94%.

Considering we have multiple 95% DR abilities AND Trinity (99.8% or even more) and Chroma (98% assuming Ice and a 200% strenght and more) that reaches a lot more than that on both armour and damage boosting... I'm not sure that is so bad, this is actually decently powerful without being gamebreaking.

 

Initially, I thought it was within the bounds of the game too, but the breakdown on Reddit (and Akiryx's here) is a strong argument for reducing the numbers. 

 

Thanks for the outlook on his armor, and support, but I do think I have to reduce it.

 

Also, I like the nod to the Marine-corps being a Naval branch of the military in the Tricorn helm.

 

The name of his karambit is also a nod (and a nod to the concept's original name).

 

When I get time, the next major update will revise numbers and abilities.

[Rhekemi]

Ushtar Update Notes: (I have a host of ideas written down, and am going through the process of whittling it down to the best ideas. This is an overview.)

 

Yes. I'm still working on the karambit blade direction issue when I have time, and I plan to address Ushtar's numbers as well (like the OP armor).

 

-Passives: (You guys are free to convince me not to drop any of these)

-Night Vision will be removed

-Frogman might be removed

-Rifleman remains the same/will not be removed

-Active Camo--New passive: When not seen/enemies are unalerted, Ushtar's armor will blend in on any tileset, rendering him invisible. Requires 8-15 (?) seconds to completely cloak. Ushtar will unsheath his Fidelis when fully cloaked, any enemy that passes by may be killed from stealth, but Active Camo is reset and Ushtar is visible.

 

-Silent Blade will be removed, and the first ability will become Takedown. Takedown will remain generally the same, but it could also be changed significantly. 

 

-Tourniquet will become Ushtar's second ability. Will remain the same, or see buffs.

 

-IED will be removed. 

 

-Zeal will become Ushtar's 3rd ability. A new threat priority increase (on Ushtar) ability where he will let out a battle cry (think male sounding Warcry). For all intents and purposes, it will behave like Blade and Gun used to, but grant a first kill buff to Ushtar and his team (if he kills the first enemy on the tile), draw aggro to Ushtar. Ushtar will also gain the ability to select allies (with an X armor rating/the tanky frames) and split aggro evenly between himself and those allies during Zeal.

 

-Command will become Ushtar's new fourth, and it's another experimental idea I want to play with. It will open up the more tactical side of this marine concept I've neglected. What I have in mind is a trade off system... Ushtar is immobile/less mobile and more vulnerable, but he can buff the team, direct and streamline attacks, via his energy strands:

-Ushtar will grant buffs based on ally power classification (created by DE when the modular Corpus were born):

---perception powers

---buff/debuff powers

---damage powers

---mobility powers

 

He can only grant one buff per cast of the ability, for the duration of the ability, not all buffs at all times to all power classes. (He'll be able to cycle and choose one.)

 

This is where my mind's been with the rework, without getting into too much detail.

 

I'd appreciate thoughts on this. Ushtar isn't perfect, no concept is, and I do want to make him better. But how attached are you guys to his current kit? (This rework tries to preserve most of it.) I can justify my reasoning for changes if you don't agree or want to know why I did change something.

 

Discuss.

Edited December 31, 2015 by Rhekemi

[(XBOX)Grimdark Dom]

This warframe puts Loki to shame. Love it!