[Suggestion] ~ Elemental Mods Overhaul ~

[TisEric]

Original:

elemental mods need to not do any damage at all.

i don't care what element does what to who, a flat 90% increase in damage is a 90% flat increase in damage. the double damage to specific enemies and extra effects are just a nice bonus.

so there is no choice to make ,every one will take the mods that give extra damage over everything else.

 

what needs to happen is make elemental mods conflict in nature and do noticeable effects .

by conflict i mean putting a fire mod will negate the cold mods effects and vise verse.

 

Updated: (ill keep the original post to have a sense of evolution of discussion)

 

Some proposed changes based on  feedback and some back and forth with Aizeol:

 

Elemental mods are agreed to be Overpowered in their current state.

our proposal is to have them be Focus primarily on the Utility and sub Utility.

 

Have elemental mods do 5% Increase in damage per level up to 25%,

or a lower value depending on how effective the mods utility will be.

 

Have 2 Effects:

1) Primary effect .

2) Secondary effect on a fixed % chance.

 

Primary:                                                            Secondary:

Fire - damage over time                                  Induce panic\spread the effect

Cold - slow enemies down                               make target slip and fall

electricity - some sort of stun                           arc lightning between targets

armor pierce - ignore armor                             penetrate targets that have no armor

 

and so on...

 

have elements react differently do different enemies.

I.E. electricity shutting off corpus shields , jamming weapons for grineer.

 

something along those lines.

 

Conflicts:

Elements must have restrictions to a degree to not have stacking of more than 1-3 elements per weapon.

 

 

 

 

some suggested effects for existing elements and a few suggested new ones:

 

electricity - do a mini stun on hit and have a chance to cause chain lightning damage when more than 1 enemy is shocked.

 

fire - actually freaking people out instead of them just running around like big &#! flares obscuring vision and have a chance to spread that fire.

 

cold - slowing down enemies  and having a chance to make that enemy slip.

 

armor pierce - ignore extra armor on targets and have a chance to puncture unarmored targets.

 

Toxic/ acid rounds - cause damage over time have chance to corrode armor.

 

Explosive rounds - do slash damage and have a chance to knockout a target.

 

magnetic rounds - seek out nearby targets have a chance to magnetize a target to pull other enemies closer to target.

 

Tracer rounds - tag enemies so they show up on mini map and have indicators on screen have chance to blind target.

 

Nanonite Rounds - no specials effects have chance to cause target to explode upon death causeing AOE.

 

Crystal Rounds - bullets get stuck in an enemy causing extra  explosive damage after 3 seconds no other special effects (useful for against grineer who love cover).

 

Infested rounds - have a chance to infest target  causing target to transform into infested NOT FRIENDLY .

 

Sludge rounds - have a chance to jam enemy weapons.

 

Amp Rounds (amplifier) - get stuck on enemy targets increase power damage to said target  to a cap.

 

Rubberized rounds - bullets bounce off walls  in a manner similar to glaive.

 

Spiked Casings - Shooting at the floor\walls\ceiling will leave small razor sharp spikes that will do continues damage as long as an enemy is standing on them.

 

Reaper Rounds - Shooting a target will place a small bulls eye like effect , each subsequent shot that lands in the bulls eye will do increased damage up to a cap.

 

EMP Rounds - You do double damage to shields but you lose 50% in overall damage.

 

Ballistic Rounds - Releases a shock wave behind the targeted enemy that knocks back the enemies behind him.

 

Flash Clip - Each time you do a full reload , from 0 bullets to full , your first shot becomes a flash bang.

doing no damage but dazing surrounding enemies for 1-2 seconds.

 

Energy casings - Ignore 25% of shields , if 100 shields you do 100 damage enemy takes 25 damage to health.

 

Maim - Bullets can cause dismemberment , purely cosmetic, maybe 2 - 4 mod points.

 

Shredder Rounds - Damage causes bleeding damage , has chance to shred muscles decreasing fire rate. 

 

Ball casings - Shot 30% faster , lose 30% accuracy.

 

Disco\Dubstep Rounds - Only usable in Dojo , makes your enemy dance to death.

 

 

and so on...

 

 

The goal is to give players choice , variety and specialization.

Edited June 9, 2013 by TisEric

[Athros]

elemental mods need to not do any damage at all.

i don't care what element does what to who a flat 90% increase in damage  is 90% flat increase of damage the double damage and extra effects are just a nice bonus.

so there is no choice every one will take the extra damage over the extra stuff.

 

what needs to happen is make elemental mods conflict in nature and do noticeable effects .

by conflict i mean putting a fire mod will negate the cold mods effects and vise verse.

 

Buddy, use punctuation. It's kinda hard to understand what you're saying...

If I understand it correctly, you suggest that elemental mods only give pure damage bonus (no reduction/increase), and the side effects were moved out from damage calculations?

[SniffYoBunnies]

Some of these are too fantasy and most also unneeded as of now...No hatin here but you might see this in like U12 or somethin.Although keep posting ideas like this to make ammo more special!LOVE IT!

[ArsVampyre]

I prefer the preset method.

[TisEric]

Buddy, use punctuation. It's kinda hard to understand what you're saying...

If I understand it correctly, you suggest that elemental mods only give pure damage bonus (no reduction/increase), and the side effects were moved out from damage calculations?

 

i did use punctuation, maybe you just didn't see it.

 

 

 

 

i suggest to remove damage from elemental mods all together.

have them focus on the actual effect of the element.

Edited June 3, 2013 by TisEric

[Athros]

i did use punctuation, maybe you just didn't see it.

 

Sorry, I read it before you edited the formatting... [Check the quote on my post]

How about the question? Well, if it does it'll be great (0% Electric against Ancients sucks...), but for the effects... If you used only one element at a time, that's no problem.

But with a multi-element build? It kinda will get chaotic...

[TisEric]

 

Sorry, I read it before you edited the formatting... [Check the quote on my post]

How about the question? Well, if it does it'll be great (0% Electric against Ancients sucks...), but for the effects... If you used only one element at a time, that's no problem.

But with a multi-element build? It kinda will get chaotic...

 

which is why they need to conflict with each other in some form .

fire and ice negate each other , fire  makes acid less effective , explosive blowing out fire.

sludge negating acid , bouncy  negating explosives and so on.

 

that way you can either  focus on 1 element you really like or have a multi elemental build but with reduced or non existent effects. 

so you have choice in play style.

 

on the other hand we can say make 2 similar elements have a stronger fused effect , for example , cold and electricity would result in a longer stun but  you give up the slow , slip and chain lightning chance.

[BadAimbot]

I don't mind the current system. I would prefer to see the non-damaging mods get buffed some so the decision between more damage and utility is more difficult.

[TisEric]

I don't mind the current system. I would prefer to see the non-damaging mods get buffed some so the decision between more damage and utility is more difficult.

 

 

problem is the current elemental mods are severely overpowered.

they offer a substantial damage boost  , good utility and a damage multiplier against Certain enemies. 

 

its functional but takes away options and specializations, you just dump all the good elemental mods on every weapon.

every one does this. its the only rational use of the mod slots.

 

now if they only offered utilities and had restrictions so you wouldn't just dump 8 elements into 1 weapon that would encourage specializing in a certain role for that weapon. open up many new build options instead of the current 1 build for every weapon. 

Edited June 3, 2013 by TisEric

[BiancaRoughfin]

Chance of casting Chain Lightning sounds too Diablo/Warcraftish for me...

 

The current elements on the game are more then fine. I dont see the need to have diferent Ammo types since there is already MODs to give your weapons special abilities.

 

Only changes i would do to the current elements:

 

Fire: Deals Over time damage. Chance to frighten the target. Chance to explode enemy on death and deal small splash damage.

Electrical: Deals additional damage. Chance to deal triple damage to shields only. Chance to Stun.

Ice: Deals additional damage. Slows target`s Attack/Movement speed. Chance to stack armor reduction.

[f3llyn]

elemental mods need to not do any damage at all.

i don't care what element does what to who, a flat 90% increase in damage is a 90% flat increase in damage. the double damage to specific enemies and extra effects are just a nice bonus.

so there is no choice to make ,every one will take the mods that give extra damage over everything else.

 

what needs to happen is make elemental mods conflict in nature and do noticeable effects .

by conflict i mean putting a fire mod will negate the cold mods effects and vise verse.

 

 

 

 

Why do they need a change? I'll admit that I envisioned...more..for elemental mods but you don't supply a reason why they need a change, just your opinion.

 

And taking damage away from elemental mods means they would need to drastically buff other mods to compensate or the weapons themselves.

 

But then again, at the end of the day you could keep the current mods as they are and add entirely new weapons. Having more options can only be good.

Edited June 3, 2013 by f3llyn

[TisEric]

Chance of casting Chain Lightning sounds too Diablo/Warcraftish for me...

 

The current elements on the game are more then fine. I dont see the need to have diferent Ammo types since there is already MODs to give your weapons special abilities.

 

Only changes i would do to the current elements:

 

Fire: Deals Over time damage. Chance to frighten the target. Chance to explode enemy on death and deal small splash damage.

Electrical: Deals additional damage. Chance to deal triple damage to shields only. Chance to Stun.

Ice: Deals additional damage. Slows target`s Attack/Movement speed. Chance to stack armor reduction.

 

not casting chain lightning as a new ability i mean just have an arc of electricity jump between targets who are shocked.

like if you take 2 wires and see the current run through the air.

 

what i am suggesting isn't ammo types its mods.

 

there are no mods for weapons that do special abilities as you say.

all the mods do is just increase a stat i.e. multi shot  just adds damage , serration just adds damage , every thing just adds flat damage or makes your gun shoot faster or reload quicker nothing adds specialization or unique effects.

 

your suggestions sound incredibly overpowered btw.

 

 

Why do they need a change? I'll admit that I envisioned...more..for elemental mods but you don't supply a reason why they need a change, just your opinion.

 

And taking damage away from elemental mods means they would need to drastically buff other mods to compensate or the weapons themselves.

 

But then again, at the end of the day you could keep the current mods as they are and add entirely new weapons. Having more options can only be good.

 

i did state a reason : 

options , choice , specialization , Balance .

 

the current elemental mods are just overpowered.

there is no reason to use anything other than maxed elemental mods on every weapon and weapon type.

they give you an outstanding damage  boost , utility and damage multipliers, all in 1 mod.

 

that removes the need for anything else , removes the need to specialize , removes choice or rather options.

my suggestion makes them what they are , modifiers to your gun.

they don't magically make your gun do more damage. they just add  an effect to your ammo and give a small chance to induce a natural reaction of that effect.

 

i.e. cold damage makes enemies likely to slip up and fall , fire inducing panic and so on.

 

 

i want the element part of element mods to be the focus not the flat damage boost with perks.

 

 

 

also there would be no need to "drastically compensate " its a widely know fact that the weapons in this game when potatoed and decked out with all the damage mods , serration , 4 elemental mods , multi shot  they become so over powered you can 2 shot kill almost any enemy.

 

that is not balance the game has a very large lack of  challenge because the mods make you invincible when you get enough of them.

too many damage boosting mods , no variety  in them.

there is no other way to build your arsenal beyond throwing every damage mod into every thing.

 

 

if you remove the elemental mods  insane damage boosts you will find every thing more challenging , there will now be a need to use your abilities and acrobatic abilities to increase ones efficiency at surviving. the new elements will give you a way to build a weapon for specific occasions.

i.e. you go to a set of mission mostly involving infested? throw a fire mod for the crowd control or nanonite for the AOE chance or explosive for the splash damage , you gona fight grineer? use an armor pierce and magnetic rounds or use crystal rounds with acid.

 

specialize into the play style you want to be proficient at and not a jack of no trades. 

that's what i would like , depth and options not just more mods to throw at every weapon i own because its the best thing out there.

[TisEric]

le bump for great justice.

[TisEric]

bumpy ~

yeah i know bumping and such is frowned upon but i have a strict only bump after topic falls below 2nd page  and only after few hours policy.

spare me from the wrath of the mods please.

[f3llyn]

that removes the need for anything else , removes the need to specialize , removes choice or rather options.

.

 

You say that...but...the issue isn't that elemental mods are overpowered. The issue is that there are literally no alternatives. They can keep the current elemental mods and make entirely new ones to do some of the things you listed. More choices = more fun, right?

[YummyBubbles]

Yeah they could just add more mods for.bullet specialization. But when they do that I'd suggest slight nerf to damage done

[Enot83]

You say that...but...the issue isn't that elemental mods are overpowered. The issue is that there are literally no alternatives. They can keep the current elemental mods and make entirely new ones to do some of the things you listed. More choices = more fun, right?

 

Hell some of the existing mods don't even see use... if they made those more appealing along with other additions like you say, we'd actually have some real diversity, instead of the same 6 mods always being present.

[TisEric]

You say that...but...the issue isn't that elemental mods are overpowered. The issue is that there are literally no alternatives. They can keep the current elemental mods and make entirely new ones to do some of the things you listed. More choices = more fun, right?

 

Hell some of the existing mods don't even see use... if they made those more appealing along with other additions like you say, we'd actually have some real diversity, instead of the same 6 mods always being present.

 

that's true , but they are overpowered. 

1 mod cant give you  great damage + utility + damage multiplier  , that's just an absurd benefit for 1 mod.

that's like if Redirection would give you % shield % health and % armor in 1 mod.

 

i am all for more mods but if they all give you so many benefits why even use anything else?

if they introduce more elemental mods that all have these same stats then what will happen is that people will load 8 elemental mods into each weapon instead of actually diversifying or specializing weapons into specific set ups.

 

 

my aim with the elements  not having damage is that then you weigh the actual benefits of the effect you get from the element itself instead of just adding it for extra damage just because.

have use of older weapons  for specific missions , i.e. vipers + fire\ explosive = massive AOE great for crowd control.

or load a Hek with Acid so that each shot shreds armor  until the rest of the team can reduce an enemy to ash.

 

make weapons have more of a point, right now you  look at the damage increase and think good 90% more damage and the slow or burn or mini stun is just a nice bonus.

[TisEric]

Yeah they could just add more mods for.bullet specialization. But when they do that I'd suggest slight nerf to damage done

big nerf , if you ask me.

[TisEric]

bumpy grumpy

[TisEric]

bump~~

[muccmaster]

Barely anyone likes your ideas so stop bumping a useless thread. If they take away damage bonuses from elemental mods then they have to pretty much rebalance the entire game or give us other ways to do more damage and most of your mod ideas are impractical. All DE needs to do is buff certain lousy mods and create more GOOD mods.

[MyXmaN]

Am i the only one supporting this idea?

No, really, id rather have some great extra effects than more damage. Percentage armor ignore and blowing enemies up on death particularly.

 

Damage, damage, damage... I have enough damage with my serration and split chamber. Id rather have mods that OP suggests.

 

 

Barely anyone likes your ideas so stop bumping a useless thread. If they take away damage bonuses from elemental mods then they have to pretty much rebalance the entire game or give us other ways to do more damage and most of your mod ideas are impractical. All DE needs to do is buff certain lousy mods and create more GOOD mods.

Can you please care to explain where exactly do you need such a ton of damage? Tier3 towers with lvl90 mobs? Or defense waves 35+? Thats the only things that come to mind.

Really, boltor/kunai/supra/hek do a ton of damage with multishot and straight damage mod (serration / point blank / hornet strike) already and installing extra elemental mods for the sake of extra damage is just pure overkill in most cases.

[muccmaster]

You answered your own question, yes high level defense/tier 3. Eventually they're going to have more endgame stuff with high level mobs so we will need the damage. Also, its not like elemental damage mods are gamebreaking since enemies have resistences (especially higher level ones). The point is taking away damage from these mods isn't going to make mod balance any better, especially in its current state.

[TisEric]

You answered your own question, yes high level defense/tier 3. Eventually they're going to have more endgame stuff with high level mobs so we will need the damage. Also, its not like elemental damage mods are gamebreaking since enemies have resistences (especially higher level ones). The point is taking away damage from these mods isn't going to make mod balance any better, especially in its current state.

they are in fact game breaking every one is complaining about how endgame is too easy or how enemies are to easy .

remove the absurd benefits of the current elemental mods and see how people stop saying how easy every thing really is.

 

it will balance early - end game.

the end game itself  is supposed to be difficult.

 

if you want more damage sure, make more specific mods in the future

i.e.

 

infested hunter - do more damage to infested.

Grineer slayer - do more damage to grineer.

Corpus breaker - do more damage to corpus.

 

more mods that  specialize your weapon for specific situations.

not gods of destruction of all beings,