How To "nerf" The Kunai, And Make Them Fun.

[Implodingbanana]

Nerf the ammo count as well, since there can't possibly be 200+ knives in those two pouches.

maybe there tiny? and i disagree with nerfing the ammo because iv'e run out before very quickly -_-'

[Magicfingers]

[sarcasm]NERF THE KUNAI AND THE DESPAIR!!!! make it so that you can only throw one every 5 seconds and when it hits the enemy it adds health instead of taking it away!!![/sarcasm]

 

leave muh blades alone man...they're the only bright spot i have playing the game...watching him sling them blades with a maxed out fire rate mod, you just know when he's not off killing bad guys, he's a chef in a sushi bar.....slicing and dicing

[Implodingbanana]

Nerf the reload. I cant grab 10 knifes in less then a second so can't a ninja.

correction we're not ninja.............. WE'RE SPACE NINJAS :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

[LasersGoPewPew]

or they should make it a burst throw weapon? one click two knives? would keep the knives lethal without making them a "spam into the group and kill 8/10 of them weapon"

[TisEric]

how about no.

 

 

i am tired of this game nerfing all the fun weapons into some  pile of mediocre pew pew S#&$.

 

 

 

the kunai , viper are like 2 of  4 maybe 5 side arms that are actually satisfying to use.

every pistol type weapon became worthless after they patched the fire rate to S#&$ not being able to shoot them as fast as you click.

 

same thing with rifles and melee there are like 2 of each group that are satisfying to use, everything else is just generic crap that goes pew pew .

 

 

 

 

instead of nefing, buff the S#&$ weapons. stop removing fun mechanics just because some dudes want to macro.

[Tlacatecatl]

Making all the weapons semi-auto isn't fun for everyone...

Just saying.

[Renegade_Master]

As much I I love them I have to admit they are braking the game for me, but reducing the attack power is not enough so I propose this:

 

Reduce rate of fire and change to semi auto.

 

Add a charge attack that throws all renaming knives in a wide arc. 

 

The idea of throwing all knives in an arc sounds cool, but that would essentially make Kunai the equivalent of a warframe's ultimate power ("press 4"), which would throw weapon & game balance more out of whack.

It would make a lot more sense to introduce "charge attacks" with a primary or rifle weapon that could fire a bunch of small rounds or fire a couple of large charged rounds per clip.

 

 

Kunai just need to be semi auto and have a portion of armor pen removed. It's a knife, not a spear.

 

I agree that it is not a spear, which is a good argument for removing part of armor penetration.

If DE is going to keep Kunai "real", then I would agree with reducing its armor pen.
If that's not DE's intention or they want to add to the lore that they're made of super special alloy or parts, then keep armor pen, but something should change regarding this weapon, other weapons, or enemies to even the scales.

 

 

Making all the weapons semi-auto isn't fun for everyone...

Just saying.

 

I too don't want to see every weapon have semi-auto, but it doesn't make sense that players can hold down a key to have them throw crazy fast when Tenno throw each Kunai individually.

Making the Kunai semi-auto would decrease the demand to see the Kunai's reload time increase or fire rate decrease.

DE doesn't let people hold down the trigger for semi-auto pistols where the trigger must be pulled with each shot, so it is beyond me why they are letting people hold down the trigger to throw multiple physical items as quick as possible.

Also, I didn't see anyone suggesting making all secondary weapons semi-auto.

Edited June 3, 2013 by Renegade_Master

[aTaVaX]

i think reducing the clip size to 8 from 10 would keep the feel of the weapon while marginally nerfing them. 

 

I also think a slight increase in reload time might be in order. Something that someone with a reload mod would be able to more then nullify but would require them to use a reload mod. 

[Naples]

How to 'nerf' the Kunai:

 

Make all other weapons just as viable.

[Lonestar96]

DON'T NERF "X", MAKE "Y" AS GOOD AS "X"

[aTaVaX]

How to 'nerf' the Kunai:

 

Make all other weapons just as viable.

 

make the game even easier

[Venarge]

Compare them to other strong secondary weapons though and you'll find that they really aren't particularly OP. Their DPS is lower than akimbo weapons, they're not as accurate or damaging as a lex or kraken, and they take considerably more skill to use than most of the other secondaries.

A gun being "strong" isn't a reason to nerf. It's only when something gets so strong that it trivializes content that it is OP. Example: Nyx's old Chaos ability, or the original sniper-Hek. Nobody's put forward a reason for why Kunai are as OP as sniperhek or chaos.

THIS SO MUCH ^

[ra9una]

Please don't change them?.....Oh what's the point, I don't even wanna try and defend this anymore.

[BlueCremeSoda]

How does turning the kunai into semi auto or stupid shotgun mode going to make it fun? The shotgun spread idea is worthless. They do no damage on their own, you're going to kill level 12 enemies with it and that's about it.  Turning them into a clickfest removes the fluidity of using them as they currently are. And once again, this isn't even addressing the possibility of them being intended for higher end content that we don't have now... the kunai aren't a god weapon or anything...

[AdamTheBean]

Don't nerf them, whats the fun in nerfing? - Also seeing as how enemies and certain levels are progressively becoming more difficult ( Orokin missions T2+ ) I think that the powerful Knives came in at a perfect time... all they really need to do is bump up some aspects of older weapons to keep them at par.

[LazyKnight]

If they only made it so Gunslinger didn't work with both knives that would be enough. Being able to get 5.6 fire rate is just too high. Just that one mod is the knives major issue, make it not function with knives and it would fix it.

 

This type of change wouldn't be a nerf to the weapon at all. Just like they can't do critical hits you shouldn't be able to throw them faster.  This would just make the 2 critical mods and gunslinger not work for knives anyone else think this is the simplest fix?

Edited June 4, 2013 by LazyKnight

[aTaVaX]

If they only made it so Gunslinger didn't work with both knives that would be enough. Being able to get 5.6 fire rate is just too high. Just that one mod is the knives major issue, make it not function with knives and it would fix it.

 

This type of change wouldn't be a nerf to the weapon at all. Just like they can't do critical hits you shouldn't be able to throw them faster.  This would just make the 2 critical mods and gunslinger not work for knives anyone else think this is the simplest fix?

 

seems like customization is already taking a very big hit with 2 mods not doing anything. I never use sights, so zoom is useless for me and i never run out of ammo either, so with fire speed not doing anything, that would be 5 of 15 mods being useless, so 10 left, and with forma you could almost certainly have 8 mods equipped and fully maxxed at the same time... so only 2 mods i wouldn't have equipped and maxxed out... 

[LazyKnight]

Well the thing is they do not need crit to do damage and they are already fast.  They could always add say exploding dagger, poison mods or something like that to make it interesting.  There are a ton of ninja type things they could do with knives.

 

 

My Despair is my favorite weapon I have got from playing this game. I like the space ninja vibe and these daggers are great for that effect.

 

I mainly keep posting because people keep saying make it a 2 shoot weapon. If DE did that I would vender my despair in 20sec flat and quit, so that's why I keep posting in this topic type so it doesn't get that type of nerf.

Edited June 3, 2013 by LazyKnight

[Tlacatecatl]

I too don't want to see every weapon have semi-auto, but it doesn't make sense that players can hold down a key to have them throw crazy fast when Tenno throw each Kunai individually.

Making the Kunai semi-auto would decrease the demand to see the Kunai's reload time increase or fire rate decrease.

DE doesn't let people hold down the trigger for semi-auto pistols where the trigger must be pulled with each shot, so it is beyond me why they are letting people hold down the trigger to throw multiple physical items as quick as possible.

Also, I didn't see anyone suggesting making all secondary weapons semi-auto.

 

Right now there is little choice in the automatic secondary weapon department. You have the Furis, Viper and there Dual Variants. Since U8 you also have the Kunai and the Despair. I am pretty happy to have more choice in the automatic department.

 

And the real life comparison is always dangerous ground. There is just so much abstraction going on. Who decides how far the abstraction should go?

[Caliocerion]

No, go away.

[Vorpalstryke]

Nobody likes nerfs but this one is hard to avoid. As much as I am also enjoying the Kunai right now, the fact that almost everyone is using it as a primary weapon really says to the developers that the Kunai and Despair are a little bit too powerful. Seriously, this weapon puts the Boltor to shame and that's one of the better assault rifles! 

 

However, we as a community need to suggest to the developers how to balance it so they don't do too much and gimp it completely. Let's give them some constructive comments instead of whining about the inevitable nerf-hammer to drop.

 

Making it semi-auto is a good place to start. It really creates a better feel for the weapon, you feel like you're throwing each knife individually rather than shooting an invisible automatic handgun that spits out knives that are almost 3 times more powerful than the Boltor's bolts. And half of us were happily clicking away until we realized it was an automatic weapon on higher levels anyway. Let's just try that for now and leave the damage/reload/fire rate alone. 

 

Locking out the Gunslinger mod may be an option also but it may be a technical problem that might screw up the mod on other guns. 

[LazyKnight]

The biggest problem DE now faces is a potential PR disaster if the even tweak the weapons. New players are getting on and buying the stalker pack for 800 plats. This isn't like the HEK that was op(no one spent plats on that) if they even lower its damage by 1dps it will be nasty. They are better off just buffing all the the other weapons and adding a challenge mode.

Edited June 4, 2013 by LazyKnight

[aTaVaX]

they can't just avoid nerfing weapons for the duration of the game's life because people spent plat on them. Beta is the best time to test the most appropriate ways to go about it : )

[LazyKnight]

they can't just avoid nerfing weapons for the duration of the game's life because people spent plat on them. Beta is the best time to test the most appropriate ways to go about it : )

If they nerf the knives people will be asking for a refund. If DE doesn't give them one a % will not buy weapons again. It is a money losing idea to mess with them. This isn't a closed beta, its an open beta with a cash shop. I wish people would think what will happen, If DE does x what will be the predicable outcome. The time to make them balanced was before they put them in the market place.

 

They already said they are buffing other weapons. People still haven't forgiven DE over the HEK nerf last time. With the void keys and everything else they do not need more bad PR with plat items.

Edited June 4, 2013 by LazyKnight

[Cursor]

I made a topic recently saying that they needed to be changed to semi-auto, so obviously I agree with you on that point, but originally I didn't think the fire rate was what needed nerfing.  I thought lowering the clip size and slightly increasing the reload was the way to go.

 

However, earlier today I saw a Vauban with Despair on a low level Assassination mission.  Now I think the fire rate needs a nerf.  Not because he was performing too well, he was doing fine and nothing ridiculous.  What was ridiculous was how he looked.  This guy was obviously using a high or maxed Gunslinger, and it looked absolutely stupid.  I realize that "it looks stupid" is a terrible reason to nerf something, but I've always hated the absurdly fast attack speed of modded Fang and similarly fast weapons because it's jerky and unreal, and this is no exception.  It is actually distractingly bad how firing a speed modded Kunai looks.