Deciding on one last Prime frame...

[Khaine62]

 

Hello, fellow Tenno! I've come to you, needing a little outside input on this matter. I'm deciding on my last Prime Warframe to end my Prime addiction with. However, my last picks could be considered 'problem children'. By this I mean, that out of what I could find out about them, some people seem to either think they're incomplete, weird in terms of capabilities or I simply don't know enough about to make a proper call. 

Please remember, I'm not asking for you to tell me what I should do. Not really comparing them but seeing if they are any glaring facts that could possibly really turn me off or force me down a real narrow path in order to get the most use/fun out of them. I'm just gathering information to eventually come to an informed decision. 

Ember Prime- Barring her glorious design, I've heard that she's been called a glass-cannon. I'm guessing it's do to the fact that you'd be more concerned with her damage capabilities than focus on anything else. Also heard her polarities are not as good as they're supposed to be. Need a little more information on that one. She's not available via the Void, so that makes her a tad forbidden fruit in my eyes. Really not that much else I could find on her if... 

Nyx Prime- Another beautiful looking 'frame. However, I read a rather detailed thread where people seemed to be going back and forth about if Nyx was in a bad spot or not. Basically the discussion was about the fact the OP felt that Nyx's abilities were good on paper but did not mesh well together and made her feel clunky. There were arguments made that the OP simply didn't build Nyx right while the OP argued that Nyx's abilities needed to be altered to better flow together. No idea how relevant the information is now, but here's the OP's post to sum it up: 

Spoiler

  First, let me say, I've had nyx for a while, and am not remotely close to a new nyx user (if you could call me a nyx user, I tend to avoid her :/ )

 

     She just feels like she's in a bad spot to me. In her warframe profile, it's stated that she trades armor for increased power. Her absorb was nerfed, it used to just drain constant energy, and now it drains energy the more damage you take. Absorb is also an aoe damage ability, with a default radius of 10 meters (aka pitiful).

 

     Chaos was supposed to be one of her best abilities too, but I heard that was nerfed a while ago (I wasn't a nyx player at the time) so that it couldn't be recasted. Although it was op when recastable, I don't think that was the best option, as now you have to wait for chaos to end ('cause there's always that one enemy that decided to go hide in a corner) before you can use it on all the new enemies that are more than happy to fill you with lead and lasers. An option would be to wait in absorb when this happens, but since she can't cc anything with that beyond 10 meters, it's just a delay, cause when you let go you're gonna get rekt anyway. 

 

     Mind control is good where it is, but it's not enough to carry her into late game when your absorb is hitting nothing and your chaos is on a pseudo cooldown because you can't find the last enemy under its effect. I'm well aware that you can use overextended and stretch to make absorb the range it should already beviable, but this also increases chaos's range, so you have to hunt down even more enemies before you can recast it and start shooting at stuff again.

 

TL;DR: Nyx is in a bad spot right now, almost as bad as excal is atm. I think she should get a rework soon.

[BritishBob]

Honestly they're both good in there own ways. 

 

Ember Prime- SHe goes from a DPS frame to a CC frame as you move to higher content. Her WoF may not do a lot of damage, but with firequake it's consistant CC With little to no cost. She is Void viable, just her role changes. Polarities can be changed with forma to personal preferance.

 

Nyx Prime- That other one... She's one of the optional frames. Similar situation to Limbo, Banshee and Atlas (just examples). If the fame is played right she is excellent, if it's played poorly it's awful. Like you've quoted her ability set is a mixed bag, I focus on chaos and Absorb. Chaos for CC and absorb for the area damage reduction, use it when fellow team member is reviving, pod is low on head ect.

 

13 minutes ago, Khaine62 said:

get the most use/fun out of them. 

 

This all depeneds on your playstyle. Seriously. I'd consider them to have two different ethea and should be treated as shuch.

 

Not sure if that helped any... 

[Khaine62]

6 minutes ago, BritishBob said:

Honestly they're both good in there own ways. 

 

Ember Prime- SHe goes from a DPS frame to a CC frame as you move to higher content. Her WoF may not do a lot of damage, but with firequake it's consistant CC With little to no cost. She is Void viable, just her role changes. Polarities can be changed with forma to personal preferance.

 

Nyx Prime- That other one... She's one of the optional frames. Similar situation to Limbo, Banshee and Atlas (just examples). If the fame is played right she is excellent, if it's played poorly it's awful. Like you've quoted her ability set is a mixed bag, I focus on chaos and Absorb. Chaos for CC and absorb for the area damage reduction, use it when fellow team member is reviving, pod is low on head ect.

 

 

This all depeneds on your playstyle. Seriously. I'd consider them to have two different ethea and should be treated as shuch.

 

Not sure if that helped any... 

If actually helped a quite bit and thank you for that. 

My major point with this question was to see how much of a springboard I had to work with these frames and to see if I was evaluating them properly. By this I mean that I look at everything I can possibly do with a 'frame. If a frame's capabilities feel like they're giving me enough room/margin to work with to tailor it to my play-style without deviating too much from what the 'frame is good at, I investigate it.

Example: Loki- No damage, fragile but lots of tactical/utility value and high movement speed. Loki really lends himself to stealthy/subtle game play. However, his capabilities allow for hit-and-run style tactics in case I get caught out in the open. His movement speed also allows me to proceed through a level without getting caught simply due to being fast enough to run past an enemy before it's cone of vision makes it to me, while furthering the hit-and-run. Loki, overall, feels like I can really create my own approach towards things without too many headaches. 

In regards to Ember Prime and Nyx Prime:

Ember Prime- With what you said about her, I like the sound of it. DPS and CC. Simply switching between them as the situation calls for it? This tells me that I've got room to work with her and iron out my own details.

Nyx Prime- Like you said, Nyx will either work or she won't. That, to me, sounds like that it will be all about the optimization. The right build, the right situations or you've got nothing. That doesn't make a good case for her.     

Where Ember sounds like she has options for most situations, Nyx sounds like she's only good for certain situations. If things go a little sideways, Ember sounds like she can recover from that. Nyx, not so much.

[ThePredicament]

Whatever post you got that from, it's factually incorrect, outdated, and/or irrelevant. For one, Absorb shouldn't be used to sit there and used as a nuke, it's a defensive skill that has tactical uses, if she is properly built it will take a long time for normal enemy damage to drain full energy. Secondly, there wasn't a Chaos nerf, it's still recastable. Lastly, Mind Control is both the perfect pinpoint skill (mob style enemy infighting) and ultimate 1vs1 skill in the game with controlled enemies not engaged in battle will run to you and pretty much begged to be killed.

Ember Prime is the queen of mid tier games, especially quick games like Ext, Cap, Sab. Her constant DPS using WoF combined with actual player mobility skills will net her the most damage. Accelerant is actually her best move since it scales WoF by three fold easily, while adding 300% extra flame damage to weapons with fire damage on  (essentially putting an extra 2 90% fire mods, even more with 60/60 mod), on top of a nice quick CC. Unfortunately, since she specializes in damage and has only decent crowd control abilities, she will noticeably fall off fairly quickly in higher end game, with Accelerant relying on whatever weapon, built around heat, you have equipped. Also, since the introduction of Equinox, she doesn't fare as well as a permanent max range/efficiency Maim in lower levels.

Nyx is the ultimate CC frame, which will let her survive even the hardest parts of endless. Mind Control is a great snipe CC, just cast on an enemy in a middle of a crowd and watch the rest of them devour the poor sod. Her 2 skill might not be that good on but it does have it's utility, for example, finding enemies behind cover or that are hidden by following the bolts trails and tick damage, great for use during reloads so you'll have an idea where to start aiming after. Does decent enough damage in low to mid ranges to be worth using as an offensive skill. Again, Chaos is one of the ultimate CCs in the game, it can shut down enemy advancements and "reset" aggro from heavier hitting enemies, which lets her and her team pick them off without too much worry. Absorb is a great quick emergency button to knock down enemies immediately around her, as a quick guard against slow but extremely dangerous attacks like Bombard missiles, and with a little savvy (castanas/pentas), can be used as a quick nuke. In terms of game mode/level dominance, Nyx is in the opposite spectrum of Ember, most of her skills are absolutely overkill in low to mid tier mission and can sometimes be a hindrance (like halting enemy advancement into a chokepoint) but she does scale gracefully, even to the point of being able to easily solo T4 endless to levels that would make most frames sweat.

[Khaine62]

2 minutes ago, TheLocalHentai said:

Whatever post you got that from, it's factually incorrect, outdated, and/or irrelevant. For one, Absorb shouldn't be used to sit there and used as a nuke, it's a defensive skill that has tactical uses, if she is properly built it will take a long time for normal enemy damage to drain full energy. Secondly, there wasn't a Chaos nerf, it's still recastable. Lastly, Mind Control is both the perfect pinpoint skill (mob style enemy infighting) and ultimate 1vs1 skill in the game with controlled enemies not engaged in battle will run to you and pretty much begged to be killed.

Ember Prime is the queen of mid tier games, especially quick games like Ext, Cap, Sab. Her constant DPS using WoF combined with actual player mobility skills will net her the most damage. Accelerant is actually her best move since it scales WoF by three fold easily, while adding 300% extra flame damage to weapons with fire damage on  (essentially putting an extra 2 90% fire mods, even more with 60/60 mod), on top of a nice quick CC. Unfortunately, since she specializes in damage and has only decent crowd control abilities, she will noticeably fall off fairly quickly in higher end game, with Accelerant relying on whatever weapon, built around heat, you have equipped. Also, since the introduction of Equinox, she doesn't fare as well as a permanent max range/efficiency Maim in lower levels.

Nyx is the ultimate CC frame, which will let her survive even the hardest parts of endless. Mind Control is a great snipe CC, just cast on an enemy in a middle of a crowd and watch the rest of them devour the poor sod. Her 2 skill might not be that good on but it does have it's utility, for example, finding enemies behind cover or that are hidden by following the bolts trails and tick damage, great for use during reloads so you'll have an idea where to start aiming after. Does decent enough damage in low to mid ranges to be worth using as an offensive skill. Again, Chaos is one of the ultimate CCs in the game, it can shut down enemy advancements and "reset" aggro from heavier hitting enemies, which lets her and her team pick them off without too much worry. Absorb is a great quick emergency button to knock down enemies immediately around her, as a quick guard against slow but extremely dangerous attacks like Bombard missiles, and with a little savvy (castanas/pentas), can be used as a quick nuke. In terms of game mode/level dominance, Nyx is in the opposite spectrum of Ember, most of her skills are absolutely overkill in low to mid tier mission and can sometimes be a hindrance (like halting enemy advancement into a chokepoint) but she does scale gracefully, even to the point of being able to easily solo T4 endless to levels that would make most frames sweat.

So Ember will work very well for a while but will fall off as you keep going up. Possible to work around that but that is still something that makes me pause.. Nyx's uses are not as obvious but work at all levels and she's even easier of the two to get... 

Thank you for taking the time to answer. That puts things into a new ballpark.  

[xiaodenden]

Have you played regular version of Ember and Nyx yet?  Playing these frames would be better way of determining which one you like better or you want to work with than reading what people tell you here.  Both Nyx and Ember bring different abilities to a squad, but you won't be able to tell how they suit your style until you play them yourself.  Unless you want to spend huge amount of plats for Ember Prime right now, I would go with Nyx Prime and then get Ember Prime later once she's out of the vault again.