We are too OP... OP is not fun.

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Maybe add a lot more armor? 

Yeah right add more armor. Like you don't have nuff pain fighting heavy gunners or bombards that are practically invincible past lvl 100 unless you're running with the full cp squad or use cheesy banshee and so on. Don't forget to make some enemies invincible that you can make damage to them only for few seconds or some crap like that in Razorback event. Cause we know how fun it was waiting for ... seconds, then beating him up, then waiting again and so on up to 8-10 times in a row. That surely will help a lot... not. 

Go play some Dark souls if you want to play difficult game. You won't see nearly as many enemies there per meter but they all can kill you easily and it's practically doesn't matter what gear you're using. Warframe as it is now is different, you're always swarming by the enemies and need to kill them fast to survive - that can't possibly go well with adding even more health/armor or increasing their stats even more. Like what the hell, how many more damage should they deal? Some new units like crazy cat lady and her cats are dealing so much damage they managed to kill me and another person in a matter of like 2 second when they fell down in the elevator on Draco. I mean, freaking cats lvl 35 or so killed frost with 1000 shields and Inaros with 2000 health in 2 seconds like what. 

Increasing enemies' stats is easy. Very easy. And very cheap. And it's called artificial difficulty when you can't kill something no matter how hard you try and have to run away from enemies with the tail between your legs every time you see a bombard or something. The only tactic in warframe is basically 'shoot until they die' anyway, there's no fun in shooting for 20-30 seconds in one target instead of 2 either.

[DxAdder]

Were Not OP, there is just so little content to challenge us.

But if you enjoy playing gimped have fun!

 

 

[Kettunen]

21 hours ago, TheBrsrkr said:

The system was and still is widely abused and exploited to the fullest extent it can be. Everything that has happened so far,,and will continue to happen, is a direct and ongoing result of this. If you want to keep your hard,  unnecessary, obscene amounts of power, expect hard, unnecessary and obscene amounts of cheese. The drop rate fell because you can kill thousands in half an hour. Nullifiers among other things  aren't affected by your powers because your powers are always on. Enemies are walking bullet sponges because walking bullet sponges are the only thing that can survive walking bullet dispensers. Timed resources are needed because all other resources are ALWAYS there.

[Emphasis mine] This, this and this. I don't really expect any meaningful changes to gameplay to happen before the core problems are resolved. It pains me that at the moment WF is a mishmash of ill-fitting components that have jack-all to do with the core gameplay and operate about two orders below any meaningfull content of challenge. Paradoxically empowering Tenno further every passing update breaks us more and more down the line. Adding more power to an already overheated system is not going to quarantee anything other than a meltdown.

[Fifield]

Sorties show how stupidly easy the rest of the game is.  Yeah there are a couple of tough enemies but now it's like tediously swatting flies for an hour then something relatively difficult comes along.  This is why I and everyone else quit.

The third sortie is generally challenging.  That's how hard the high end content in the rest of the game should be.

Stupid disables and guns should be heavily nerfed until all frames and high tier weapons are roughly viable. Anyone calling against nerfs -- you are killing the game!

Void missions should be bumped in difficulty a level. ie T3 should become T4, T4 should become T5.  Planets need to be a lot harder.  Sorties such that you do first 2 missions (made difficult after nerfs) for one roll on the table, do third for another roll.

Solo you'd fix by sending putting them up against easier enemies.

[TheBrsrkr]

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

Okay...this post...I can't even

So you are saying you don't care about how people feel about nerfs, okay, that's fine...but wait there's more:

Basically, when I read this part, it looked more like this "I don't care about anyone's opinions besides mine, the only thing that counts is things getting nerfed, F*** everyone elses fun, nerf everything!"

Um...... No. An opinion is only as useful as the information it stands on. If it's your opinion that ducks, for example, come from a different dimension that is superior to ours, you are,  of course, free to think that. I'm not the thought police. But don't expect me to care about what you say, because that's ridiculous. The same applies here. Refer to the example I gave you. Is the fact that the medicine tastes horrible a good reason to not take it? Obviously not. The medicine and it's effectiveness provides a net benefit to the child compared to crappie taste that lasts 5 minutes maximum. Will the child see it that way? Obviously not, because short term, you look like you just want him to suffer. The child has every right to that opinion, and you as the parent have every right to not care about it. In essence, this is what it boils down to.

The question asked is "why nerf?" There are various answers in the post you quoted. The rebuttal to them is what? The most common is that I hate fun and I am selfish . Something you yourself said here. To which I say, I don't care what you think about me. It doesn't make what I say less true in any way, shape or form. If you're going to talk about it, talk about it, not me. I don't hate fun. In fact, I think you're the ones who hate fun, since you spend so much of your time advocating against everyone having it. But you don't see it that way, and of course it's not relevant to either person. 

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

Suck it up now, and it'll be better later." we could say the exact same to you, suck up the fact that we ARE powerful beings with powerful weapons, it'll be better later when we get things like sentient eximi and whatnot, looking at the direction this game is taking at the moment, which is not necessarily a bad thing even though it's ridiculous at times.

Sentient eximi that do what? Cheese harder? Nullify more of your power? Adapt faster than other sentients? Have a ton more health? You're not fixing anything, you're just making it more broken. More cheese for your cheesy weapons, cheesy abilities and excessive power. Is that what you want? Is that what you think this game needs? More fake difficulty? More enemies ignoring half of what you do? More need for more spam? Because I sure as hell don't think so. 

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

I feel no sympathy for the current situation,"

Then don't expect anyone to feel sympathy for you either.

"

I don't expect or want sympathy. I want understanding and directed action. Two things we will never have as long as the "nerfs are ebil u just hate fun"  mentality persists. 

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

 

"because we had our chance to fix it, and we spent it breaking it more."

Lolwat, "we had our chance to fix it", WE players were not supposed to fix anything, we were supposed to simply play and enjoy the game, you know...it's a thing players do, the devs are supposed to fix things, not us. Don't put a burden on us which is also absolute garbage in the first place.

 

We,  the players,  play this game, which is and was a beta back before all this mess. We use the forums, the thing we are currently on, to tell the devs what we want and don't want to see in the game. They take this data and use it to try to improve the game in various ways. "We want better guns" you said. DE provides. "We want more powerful mods" you said. DE provides. "We want more powerful frames and abilities" you said. DE provides. "T3 is too easy with the gun you made me! Make it harder!" DE adds T4. "I'm locked into builds with these mods you gave us! Make more!" DE makes abilities innate, adds corrupted and nightmare mods. "This frame does something better than this frame already! We need more frames with different abilities and concepts!" DE adds Mesa, buffs Nova, adds more effects to more abilities. "Now there's a farme that can use the mods I asked for with the abilities and guns I asked for to stop everyone else from playing! I want to play! But don't change the mods or weapons  I asked for or the frame I asked for, I like them!" DE adds nullifiers and the AFK system. "OMG DE why did you put in such a horribly designed cheese unit? No one asked for this!" "Why do I have to kill thousands of enemies to get loot, even though I can literally kill a thousand enemies in half an hour?" "Why does this new raid thing require me to use the cheesy tactics I use all the time everywhere else to win?" "Why are mods so rare when I can multiply the loot of the thousands of enemies I kill by 8?"

The developers are not the only ones held accountable here, because the developers had to cater to what YOU, the player base, wanted and asked for. Every thread to fix it was met with objection. Every nerf thread, every alternative suggested, every change made, met with nothing but whining that you weren't as powerful as you were before when you didn't need to be for any reason. You don't use a nuke when a pitbull barks at you. You don't go to an emergency room for a scrape on the knee. But anyone who said anything other than more power was labelled a hater of fun, just as you did.

Now we have this. People who want to be even more powerful, to no discernable end, still labelling anyone who thinks differently as a fun hater. DE still gets pushed back every time they try to keep you all in check with any changes. You think they're champing at the bit to nerf stuff when any change whatsoever is responded to with weeks, months or even years of backlash? You think they want to come to the forums and read hundreds of pages of everyone calling them failures for giving you what you wanted while you didn't care about the consequences? Then you still dare to tell me the players had nothing to do with it? Once again, you reap what you sow, whether you like it or not. 

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

"The grind was built to suit. You reap what you sow."

And again, you make us players look like the badguys, it's not us who put these powerful tools of destruction in the game, it was DE, we simply used them. 

It's easy to say it wasn't you when you didn't make it. But who were the ones breaking the game? Was it DE? Who were the ones coptering from room to room with a Saryn hopped up on energy pizzas, killing everything with zero risk, zero skill and all the reward? Was it DE? Who sat on the pod for hours and hours with Mesa Trinity and whoever the hell else for the better part of an hour letting your drinking bird "play the game" while collecting all the rewards of a team that actually went in and played the game? Was it DE? Who used Nekros as nothing more than a lootbot and took pilfering swarm to a corner and spammed the hell out of it for as long as they possibly could? Was it DE? Who literally prevented anyone from playing while they "played" by spamming 4 and killing everyone so that there's nothing to do but pick up loot? Was it DE? Who mods their blind ability to blind everything so far as to still affect enemies you haven't even seen, and make them cardboard cutouts? Was it DE?

You honestly think that NONE of those things has ANY effect on the balancing and development process? Honestly? 

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

. And don't act too inocent either because I am pretty sure you also run around with weapons and frames which go against your "ideals" even now.

Tell me now, do I have the choice anymore? It's either you go with those weapons and frames that work, such as the Braton Prime and Rhino, or you don't play because someone else will. But somehow I'm the one who wants everyone to conform to how I want to play. You always say play alone or with like minded people, and somehow you don't see the hypocrisy of such a statement. Why should I not be able to play, not play my way, play, in a public game in a multiplayer game? Why should I nerf myself to be challenged in the first hour of the hardest game mode? Why should YOU have the ability to prevent others from playing? Why should YOU dictate the content everyone else has to play by yourself? Whether or not that's what you think you are doing, that is exactly what is happening right now. 

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

Basically, you played through the whole game until you reached the point of cheese, and instead of doing it like a lot of players have suggested, gimping yourself, you prefer to complain on the forums instead how the game should be completely nerfed to suit YOUR taste instead of actually finding a way to make the game fun for yourself. Games are made to be fun to those who play it, if you prefer to force your own wishes and tastes upon others, I believe that games simply aren't for you. Maybe politics or something suits you better.

Why should I have to? Why should I have to gimp myself to be challenged with the hardest content there is to offer? Why should you be able to take that away? Why should you be allowed to ruin everyone else's experience for your own gain?

You're not having fun grinding for months to get one mod. You're not having  fun having to farm for days to get enough of the resources to build something you want. You're not having fun playing against cheesy enemies that take away your power or simply suck bullets for hours. These are things that were and some still are caused by the stupid and unnecessary amounts of power you can access and use way too much. Yet somehow you find a way to twist it and morph it so that it's MY fault. That I'M somehow the cause of all the things you did to yourself. That I'M somehow forcing my tastes on you when you are forcing your taste for uncontrollable power on everyone else. 

 

7 hours ago, DJ_Vauban said:

You know what I think? I think that you are simply too bored and have nothing better to do.

 

Obviously we both don't have anything to do, since you're wasting your time attacking me, again, instead of addressing anything I say. It's almost like you're bored. 

Edited March 10, 2016 by TheBrsrkr
Paragraphs, do you use them?

[TheBrsrkr]

16 minutes ago, Fifield said:

 This is why I and everyone else quit.

I wondered why I wasn't seeing you around. 

[[DE]Danielle]

I'm seeing far too many personal attacks that will keep this discussion from being civil. I still find many parts of the game strategically difficult. I also think its hilarious to hack and slash my way through a mission. To each their own! It entirely depends on what you want to get out of your Warframe experience. We'll keep creating challenge for those of you that are interested in pushing the limits. 

Locking thread.