Oh For The Love Of....

[Bionitech]

Foundry page cluttered with waframe blueprints and can you guess what is missing? Systems. Systems have not dropped a single time for any frame that I have attempted to build (that I then had to buy with the plat for restarting).

 

Other blueprints are missing very specific mats that I used to have access to that are basically nonexistent.

 

I have racked up hundreds of mods, and guess which of them are serration. Nada. 

 

I'm definitely not the first to complain about the loot system. It's been said over and over and it's been "It's just RNG stop hatin' broski." It's not RNG, it's complete and utter bollocks. I've browsed throughout the forums to find out how the world I haven't been able to find a single drop of much needed materials and blueprints. After seeing the insignificant percentiles I was not only discouraged from playing. The loot table is just SO cluttered it makes your worst hoarders seem almost organized!

 

Almost. 

 

The RNG loot system is lazy, dull and outright outdated. Some of us don't have the luxury to run the same boss run over and over and not have Hyena drop a single thing. Seriously, I've done dozens of runs and I've walked out with either a junk mod or nothing at all. 

 

What needs to be done is to branch out the loot table, per boss, per system. The current updates introduced a lot of mods and other junk that diluted the system to a point where some people are subjected to only getting nothing but junk or something like 90 latron prime handles.

 

The Void needs it's own loot table. It was supposed to have been made out to be like an alternate endgame but with so much spam flooding region chat that running it is yet another chore on top of running normal systems. 

 

Make Void Keys less accessible again, and increase the rate that uncommon and rare mods would drop, and equalize prime bluepprints. It's annoying when you have 2/3 required parts for Latron prime and never have gotten a single receiver. This way, you can get a receiver, a barrel and handle at different intervals. You'd be more likely to get either one of the three, but the last part regardless will still be a challenge to find but not impossible and requiring 200 Void Runs to get that ONE SINGLE part you've been shedding blood and other gross bodily fluids to get. 

 

Outside the Void? Separate the NEW and the OLD mats/mods. Each boss will have their own faction specific loot table and a boss can give you either a material, BP or a rare mod, so either way you'd be walking out with something. The loot table would not be shared with mobs, as trash mobs will be the ones dropping the junk and common mats. 

 

The HIGHER the level boss, the more likely you can walk out of a boss fight with some pretty sweet stuff. When was the last time  you went to an Ambulas fight and the bloody thing dropped a redirection mod...for your sentinel? No, you want the Ambulas fight to be riskier because the stakes are higher, because chances are you might be walking out with a HANDSPRING MOD. Or maybe you'd be fighting Lech Kril and he'd not only be dropping Frost Parts (which never happened for me, fyi. It'd just get junk mods as usual.) But a chance at a SERRATION MOD. It'd be less slim than before but you'd still have to work at it (it'd be maybe 12% more likely to drop, high lvl rare mods being even less so and scaled appropriately)

 

Of course there are people out there that rush in, kill the boss and then run out like they're Loki on speed, in one fell swoop. They're the people that are just farming now, all geared up the wazoo with all the mods your average person is not dreaming about because it's nearly impossible to find.

 

There needs to be a healthy sense of risk vs reward. If you fight in higher level content it will adjust to you, and continue to reward the stronger teams, the stronger one man army. The current system doesn't do that. There is no immersive and intelligent scaling, just bullet sponges and this god-awful "RNG"  

 

What needs to be done is this: Split the loot table. 

 

The Mods go into one spot, The Blueprints into another and the last slice of the pie would be the materials. And even the materials would be split accordingly based on relevance and logistics. 

 

Each of those loot tables would have their own ranking and would drop according between factions and systems and the bosses/alerts. Instead of everything being randomized like a slot machine, organize this buffoonery! 

 

Where are you? On Pluto. What level are the mobs? High level. Are you solo-ing? Yes. Are you fighting the boss? No.

Boom, the system molds the chances of getting you the appropriate chance to get materials and mods and it would be different every now and again. If you're on a planet that doesn't drop a lot of materials it can drop a few fairly good mods. If you're toying with Vor on Tolstoj you're not really going to be getting any morphics or the cronus, but more of the far more common materials like Ferrite. But if you're starting out you have far better odds for the former than the latter. 

 

I am still aware that this is a game still in BETA, but I love this game to bits and have come to a point where playing the game is the last thing on my mind because the experience has become far less enjoyable in the last two big updates. The game is cluttered with rushers because match-making is still bricked, and the loot system is piled under ONE BIG LIST making finding anything but infrequent junk rather appalling if not discouraging and adding content is not fixing it. 

 

TL;DR - Read. The Bloody. Page. I might not be a programmer, or on the Design Council. But I am a designer by trade and I want to help shape this game into something great, even if I'm just one small voice in a sea of complaints and toxic attitude. 

 

Feedback greatly appreciated. Auf Wiedersehen

 

 

[DeathByTeaCup]

You are saying how hard it is to get warframe bps and mats.. to give you an example of how ez this is.. i have leveled 3 warframes max way and i only need vauban and sayrn.. the rest i have... if you just put the damn time in and stop complaining you would have them by now.. and no you cant just get the chest helm and systems in 3 turns.. and this game does not have a bias towards you.. just farm like the rest of us, its not that hard.. actually its quite ez and i wish it was harder so i could still farm stuff while i level because its makes it more fun that way!..

 

it took me 10 times to get 1 control mod moduel but that was the highest i have seen.. i have had to farm the S#&$ out of the frost guy just for the helm about 20 times!! so please just farm and have fun.. or buy plat.. either 1 i dont care but this should not be an issue

[Seanjuju]

I disagree

[Lakais]

With support to the OP I can say that the system is... odd. Not everyone has the time to grind a boss for ages. We got other responsibilities and maybe want to see other systems. But doing the same boss 30 odd times not only gets old, it gets frustrating. When the game starts to annoy and frustrate you, you are just that much more likely to leave. 

 

I'm not saying that the boss has to drop EVERY time. but I would like it if there was a sort of checklist thing going on. If you have part A, then that part gets a LOWER chance of dropping the following times and parts B and C get a slightly higher chance of dropping. This should only apply to BP's and the like. Mods are more fishy and the best way to deal with them is... grind. 

[Countess_Hapmuhr]

And for me it was helmets, always those damned helmets. But it's just RNG at the bottom of everything after all. What you're seeing is the RNG working as intended. Think about it, if you want four out of four drops, your "wooohoo, drop!" happiness is 100% guaranteed. Then you go down to 2 drops and suddenly your happiness is cut down to 50% and so on.

 

Our clans most extreme run was with Jackal where one of our teammates ran the thing 60-70 times before he got his prized Rhino Helmet.

Compare that to when I ran Phorid and managed to score all parts with 10 runs. It's completely random and depending on the side the coin toss lands on, it both sucks and doesn't suck. At this point, I think there should be a token system in place (and the devs have mentioned that too) which puts an upper cap on how many runs you're supposed to do before you go nuts. Perhaps one could trade in one blueprint for a token, that way we'd also have a use for spare blueprints for other things than credit farming.

 

Edit: with that said, the token system should only guarantee you one part per 100 runs. Otherwise it would just be faceroll academy all over again.

Edited June 10, 2013 by Hap-muhr

[Spirokeat]

I agree with OP. System is rubbish at the moment.

[Ganpot]

Yes, RNG can be annoying.  But the OP sounds like he/she needs to calm down a bit, as fury is rarely condusive towards productive discussion.  Now then....

 

How can you be missing Serration?  It's not even rare.  I've probably gotten over 50 of the things (I've currently got a level 6 Serration, and I don't remember fusing anything other than duplicates).  Now if you were talking about Handspring or something, then I could understand.  How many hours have you been playing? 

 

About the systems blueprints, I can state with absolute certainty that you are just having terrible luck.  How can I know that?  Because in the last week, I've farmed enough to get almost every warframe (I don't yet have Frost or Excalibur, but I am still working on those).  Sometimes I would get all the parts in just 3 runs, and sometimes I needed to run a single boss more than 50 times.  But eventually, I always got everything. 

 

I do agree that the RNG system should be changed.  However, the devs are very aware that the game cannot just give players everything they want in short order.  There needs to be some kind of grind, or else no one is going to keep playing for long periods of time.  I do think that loot tables should be for individual systems (and from their latest updates, it sounds like the devs might have already started down that path).  However, there still needs to be an element of RNG, and it still needs to be time-consuming to get stuff. 

[ShardsSuperior]

I get one Hellfire mod, then I get another about 5 minutes afterwards... after farming for days to get one.

[Skeloton]

How can you be missing Serration?  It's not even rare.  I've probably gotten over 50 of the things (I've currently got a level 6 Serration, and I don't remember fusing anything other than duplicates).  Now if you were talking about Handspring or something, then I could understand.  How many hours have you been playing? 

134hrs not even seen a multishot mod.

[Bionitech]

160 hrs (since reset, worst mistake ever) and only have multishot for rifle and pistol, anything else worthwhile avoids me like the plague. I am also not much of a forum user so I make a post when I feel I need an issue addressed. 

 

And the frustration comes from trying to blast the same spongy face over and over again to get a component I have even less likely chances to get with each new run. Some people have serration mods drop for them like flies where I have gotten nothing at all. How can that happen and still be called "working as intended." The system needs tweaking so it doesn't feel like you're drinking overly distilled water. 98% Distilled water is gross. 

[Trylobyte]

I'm too new to have suffered through the huge grinds that people here are talking about, but I'd like to chip in a thought from a design standpoint:  Randomness is inherently a negative thing and a lot of people don't understand how percentage chances work across multiple trials.

Here's an example.  Suppose you get a gun for your Warframe.  It has 10 shots and a 10% chance to kill anything in the game in one shot.  Most people would look at that gun as great!  A 10% chance to kill any boss in one pull of the trigger, and 10 shots to boot!  What are the odds it won't work before running out of ammo?  One in three, actually.  Now let's take another example, Borderlands 2.  Legendary weapons have random drop chances from bosses.  Certain legendary weapons are keyed to certain bosses and have a greater chance of dropping, up to 5%.  How many times do you need to kill that boss to get a 50% chance you'll get its gun, assuming a 5% drop chance?  A lot of people will say 10.  The real answer is about 14.  To get a 90% chance, then?  26?  Try 45.  There are some bosses whose drop chances are sufficiently low that you have to kill them over 1300 times to have a near-certain (~95%) chance of getting their legendary weapon drop.

 

What does this mean?  It means that for every person rolling in good mods, there's probably another person not getting any at all.  With no way to trade items even among friends or clanmates, this can become an issue when you're That One Guy that never sees the one blueprint he needs despite running a boss 50 times.  It becomes grating, hinders advancement, and saps the will to play.

Edited June 10, 2013 by Trylobyte

[CatPhoenix]

You need to stop playing for wanting, needing X, and instead, do the boss you want the item a few times, if you don't get it move on to something else, get some resources, try a new weapon and try again another day.  You're going to drive yourself crazy if all you do is grind the boss over and over and over again and not do anything else.  Have some fun with the game and do something other than that.  Do a defense, get a raid get, find some rare cards, play some lower levels with some friends.

 

Some things that I have noticed though, is that the items that seem more likely to drop appears to differ between month to month (or maybe it is update to update).  Like during April, finding a helmet was very difficult for any frames, for May, apparently it is systems.  But, all the frames that I already had the previous parts for, but the helmet were far easier to create in May.  In contrast, any frames that I started to try to get in May are missing systems, so the next month could be easier to get next month.

 

You're not going to be able to get everything you want when you want it (unless you buy it with platinum).  Enjoy what comes by, do missions to get what may be rare common at the moment (like tier I raid keys currently) and move on.  The game is still in a very fluid state, things becoming weak or strong or too strong, don't go nuts about this and that, enjoy the game for what it is and not what you are trying to force it to be.