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Experienced/Veteran Weapon Damage Guide


CosmicHermitCrab
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This build is updated to 18.6.1.1

 

I decided to make a combination of a weapon guide and a weapon tier list to assist players. The reason why I decided to make a “guide” is when I encountered newbs and veterans that seem to lack some knowledge to the game and instead of me explaining concepts 100 of times to each player; I rather just make a simple guide. I first became aware that even veterans lack knowledge in the game when a MR21 player said status chance is useless in this game. This is plain ignorance and is a false conclusion.  To let you know a little about myself I started playing this game around August 2015 and am now MR20, so I played the game quite a bit. I consider myself a veteran and I tested various weapons for endgame usage and for fun in this game. I haven’t posted much on the warframe forums because I rather test and research things or just play the game. Here’s a simple diagram of the status effects and elemental combinations of warframe:

 

Elements

The status effects of most elemental types and most physical types (impact and puncture) have either one of the two purposes. To CC (crowd control) the enemy or to debuff the enemy. Status procs are very essential to endgame content because not only do they help you survive by interrupting the enemies movement or actions, but they help you do more damage against enemies.

 

 Crit helps as well in terms of damage, but most crit weapons are balanced to have lower base damage than different non-crit weapons of the same weapon class. Thus, crit weapons are not always the best weapons since crit weapons’ base damage are balanced in compensation for their crit damage/chance. Also, one problem with crit weapons is that you usually have to use at least two mod slots, one for crit chance and one for crit damage, to make the weapon have optimal performance.  Thus, you have less room for utility mods or elemental mods since max mod capacity is eight. However, this problem doesn’t necessarily make crit weapons bad, it just enforces less different types of optimal builds for crit weapons. Crit weapons are generally good against weak enemies or when you hit a weak spot of the enemy; however, in terms of endgame enemies, you are going to need more than having red crits (a level higher than normal crits, requires over 100% chance of crit) or high amounts of raw damage to kill enemies at optimal speeds (having good dps).

 

So you are probably going to ask, what do I need in order to kill endgame enemies in decent amounts of time? The answer is kinda simple, status procs, generally corrosive procs. As I mentioned before, status effects; except for slash, toxin, and gas type; have one of two purposes, crowd control or debuff. Debuffing enemies helps a lot in regards to performing more damage against enemies, especially enemies with high amounts of hp and/or armor. Sometimes even high amounts of shielded enemies, for example corpus enemies with Augmented Enemy Shields sortie buff, can be difficult to kill. High level enemies are basically buffed versions of weaker enemies, meaning they have higher stats. So the method of killing endgame enemies is simple, debuff the buffed enemies. Now there are only a few status procs that debuff the enemies: corrosive, magnetic, and viral. Viral procs reduces the enemy’s health by a half for a certain duration of time. The debuff cannot stack, but multiple procs do refresh the duration of the viral proc. Magnectic procs reduces the shields (only affects enemies with shields like corpus) by 75%, but the debuff cannot stack. However, I quote damage 2.0 from warframe wiki regarding magnetic procs “Should multiple Magnetic status effects occur while one is already active, the duration will be extended, and the target's shields will be permanently reduced when the effect expires.”  Viral doesn’t permanently keep the same numeric remaining health when the duration expires, unlike magnetic in regards to shields, but keeps the same ratio of remaining life compared to total life, which is one-half.  Corrosive procs are my favorite procs in regards to debuffing armored enemies. I will quote damage 2.0 from warframe wiki regarding corrosive procs, “Corrosive damage's unique status effect is Corrosion, which permanently degrades the target's current armor by 25%. Corrosion can be applied multiple times to the same target, with each following proc reducing the remaining armor by another 25% of its current (not the initial) value, thereby causing the target's armor to decay logarithmically. Against Tenno, the status effect lasts for 8 seconds. In the case of shots with multiple pellets (both by default and through multishot mods), multiple stacks of Corrosion can be applied in the same shot. The enemy corroded by the proc will be covered in a green, electricity-like substance.” Since level 100-130 enemies generally have huge amounts of armor, which reduces how much damage they take, so you can see why I favor corrosive procs while I damage these enemies. If you want to know more about both physical and elemental procs, I suggest reading damage 2.0 in warframe wiki because that’s how I got my information and it’s true; I tested this stuff myself as well. There are puncture procs, which is a debuff, but it’s irrelevant in terms of DPS/damage since puncture procs reduces how much damage the enemy inflicts on players.

 

Also, certain enemies are weak against certain physical/elemental damage while are very resistant from certain physical/elemental damage. However, the warframe wiki did an excellent job in providing this information, so it would be redundant for me to reproduce it. Here’s the link: http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Damage_2.0 Also, generally status debuff procs outweigh or are more important than what damage type the specific enemy is weak against. However, some enemies such as bosses and mini bosses are immune to most status procs, but they usually aren’t a problem in comparison to a level 130 eximus heavy gunner; unless the boss/mini boss is over level 60, which is kind of rare.

 

Okay, now I’m going to walk through a mastery level 1 player in what weapons are the best in regards to mastery level while they level up to mastery 12. Also, even if you’re not that excellent at math, at least read the damage calculation of http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Damage_2.0 and try to understand the conceptual information.

 

Next I’m going to give a newb guide in what weapons a newb should get while they reach mastery 12. Read what weapons are accessible per mastery rank at the bottom of the page: http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Mastery_Rank .


At mastery 1,

Spoiler

 

I suggest getting Braton, Zhuge, Grakata, Burston, and/or strun for primaries. Strun (can’t get at mastery 0) might be the worst of the listed primaries, but it does 300 damage, which is pretty good for a mastery 1 weapon. Paris can also work, but requires very good aiming skills. Grakata can be a mid-tier weapon. I personally like Prisma Grakata as my most favorite assault rifle and it’s high tier. For secondaries get vasto, akvasto, magnus, akbolto, bolto, and spira (mastery 1). There’s a prime version of spira as well and it’s in the high tier of secondaries, but not technically an endgame weapon since it lacks status chance a little. For melee it doesn’t really matter, but I enjoyed using the heat sword a lot and used it for quite a while. Also, you can use the glaive/glaive prime which is a decent mid-tier weapon. I enjoyed using the glaive prime after I grew tired of traditional melee weapons. If you’re lucky you might get a dread from the stalker, which is one of the best bows in the game. Also, I consider Zhuge an endgame weapon, I will explain why later. Braton prime is probably the best prime assault rifle in my opinion, but it’s still high tier and not endgame. However, even I haven’t formaed the weapon yet due to listening to other people’s advice/guides/tier lists in the past.

 

 

 

 

At mastery 2

Spoiler

it’s still best to get weapons from the market because most of the ones in the clan dojo require forma in order to build. To get forma you need to get it by chance from a mission reward from void missions. Forma is also used to change/add polarities to slots of a weapon. Also, most clan weapons aren’t really endgame or even high tier, ironically. For primaries I would get Boar/Boar prime (Boar prime is endgame and out-dps against all prime rifles at close range) and Boltor/Boltor Prime. Boltor is worse than some of the mastery 1 weapons. However, Boltor prime was my first weapon I put an orokin catalyst on and I liked it for a long while, but later on I needed more damage. I even formaed Boltor Prime four times, but it’s a high-tier (not endgame) weapon along with soma prime. For secondaries get hikou (there’s a prime version too) and sonicor. Sonicor is a good cc weapon, but not the best for dps. I enjoyed using hikou a lot and I used it for a long time along with heat sword. For melee, I would buy atterax, it has good crit and status chance and for melee you usually want the crit builds of crit weapons. Also, orthos and tekko are good as well, but for the heavy weapons such as Gram and Scindo I would avoid them at low mastery level because they usually require the berserker mod in order to have ease of use. However, Scindo prime is a high tier weapon, along with orthos prime.

 

At mastery 3,

Spoiler

for primaries I would get convectrix, dragoon and Vectis. Vectis is a sniper rifle and sniper rifles are the opposite of the meta in the game due to there being so many crowds of enemies and usually long distance fire isn’t needed. However, Vectis/Vectis prime are one of the best sniper rifles in the game. Convectris is a clan weapon so you might not want to waste a forma on it. Dragoon is a pretty good weapon and I wish I played more with it since it’s a mix between a bow and a shotgun. For secondaries it isn’t that interesting. I would get Pyrana, but even I haven’t built this yet because it requires a forma to build it. For melee I would get broken war, ack and brunt, cerata, kronen, and tipedo (leads to lesion which is an endgame weapon). Broken war is an endgame weapon because you can easily perform finisher attacks with the Crimson Dervish stance, which is the most op damage in the game atm because it goes through armor and standard shields, and it’s atm the strongest sword weapon in the game so I highly suggest doing The Second Dream quest. However, you can only perform the melee combo that has the finisher attack in it if you wield the melee weapon by holding the ‘F’ key. Afterwards, hold the right-click mouse button while pressing the ‘E’ key to perform the Coiling Impale combo.


Rank 4

Spoiler

 

is when things start to get interesting. For primaries I would get hek, ignis, quanta, sobek, tigris, torid, tiberon and paris prime. The best out of the list are quanta, ignis, sobek, and torid. Quanta, ignis, and tiberon require forma and from here on out you have to research yourself whether or not a weapon requires forma or not. I know some may regard hek as a high tier weapon and maybe even an endgame weapon, but I prefer the vaykor hek for endgame content and the sobek for mid-tier content in comparison to the normal hek mostly due to its small magazine size and lower fire rate. Sobek was my favorite primary until I got a boltor prime. For secondaries I would get kulstar, tysis, and atomos.  Tysis is a good support weapon, atomos is a good support and aoe (area of effect) weapon, kulstar can kill the players themselves and has high base damage. Kulstar is also a decent aoe weapon. For melee I would nikana, which is used to get dragon nikana (can be endgame just like nikana prime), and Scindo Prime, which is high tier. Nikanas can be endgame because they too can perform finisher attacks with the right stance, similar to swords and fist weapons.

 

 

 

 

Rank 5,

Spoiler

yeah we did it, now you got the most powerful weapon of all, the tonkor. No point in going further, just kidding. For primaries I suggest getting amprex, sybaris, and especially the legendary tonkor. Tonkor is endgame and is one of the most ammo efficient weapons in the game. For secondaries the marelok is good and later on the vaykor marelok (MR6) is endgame. Also, staticor is an endgame secondary as well, with the right mods of course. For melee, both bo prime and Jat kittag are good high tier weapons.

 

Rank 6,

Spoiler

now you have access to syndicate secondaries. For primaries I suggest getting the Penta, Opticor, Phage, Soma/Soma Prime, and the synapse. Penta can kill the players themselves, similar to the kulstar. I personally was biased against the synapse and was for the Soma prime instead, but both are good, the synapse just has short range. Most players recommend players to get a soma and even put forma and a catalyst on it because it’s very easy to use and it’s a high tier weapon. All the syndicate secondaries are worth getting in my opinion, but obviously some are better than the other ones. The best ones in respectful order are vaykor marelok, telos akbolto, synoid gammacor, sancti castanas, rakta ballistica, and then the secura dual cestra. Also aksomati is a decent secondary, but I rather pick a syndicate secondary at this point. For melee I would get scoliac and dual ichor, the scoliac is good for pvp, even though I don’t have one yet.


Rank 7 and 8,

Spoiler

 

I decided to combine rank 7 and 8 since not many weapons require mastery 7 or 8. For primary I would get the Lanka which I think is one of the best sniper rifles in the game. Also, I would get the supra with the entropy burst mod on it because it should be better than the telos boltor. However, most players dislike supra mostly because it’s expensive to make and requires a lot of forma to make it viable against strong enemies. For secondaries I would get the acrid. The acrid, I formaed it because I was curious of trying a status build on it, and I think it’s a high tier weapon, but not endgame. I would get destreza, lesion, dragon nikana, and mios for melee. Dragon nikana and lesion are both endgame.

 

 

 

 


Rank 12,

Spoiler

 

I decided to skip rank 10 since only War requires rank 10. I will list the syndicate primaries that I think are the best in respectful order; vaykor hek, synoid simulor, sancti tigris, rakta cernos, telos boltor, and secura penta. Secura penta has high tier damage but requires a frame like bless trinity that won’t die from the blast of it. I personally was very upset that I couldn’t use it without risking my own life with it. Also, the lists for the syndicate weapons are very subjective, obviously.

 

 

 

 

There are some damage mods that aren’t good period (in terms of the best damage build) and they are usually the bronze mods (brown). Three examples of these bronze mods are these three rifle mods called piercing hit, rupture, and sawtooth clip. They are bad because they only provide 30% additional damage of a single physical type. The reason mods like serration are a better rifle mod isn’t only because it gives more damage, but because it affects all sources of damage because it directly increases the base damage of the weapon. Serration increases damage, it doesn’t give you ‘additional’ damage. Thus, elemental mods benefit hugely from mods such as serration, hornet strike, and point blank. Mods like piercing hit, rupture, and sawtooth do not benefit elemental mods at all because they only give additional damage, not increase in base damage. When I was a newb I thought this was a big deal because the game didn’t really make it obvious that this was the case.

Now that the newb walkthrough of the mastery rank weapons is over, it’s time to teach you what makes a good weapon and what makes a good build for a weapon.

Also, for status builds, the best status mods are generally the dual stat rare mods such as high voltage, pistol pestilence, frostbite, jolt, voltaic strike, and thermite rounds. However, these mods are hard to get when you are new to the game. Here’s a link for the dual stat mods: http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Dual_Stat_Mods . Also, I suggest using warframe builder to help you build weapon/warframe builds of warframe or search for builds. Here’s the link for warframe builder: http://warframe-builder.com/ . However, Warframe builder doesn’t give you the actual dps of a weapon in regards to status procs, only in regards to raw power.

 

Okay the moment we have been waiting for, my own personal tier list of the warframe weapons. First things first, there are five tiers: high tier endgame, low tier endgame, high tier, mid tier, and then low tier. Also, what I mean by status builds are builds that use the dual stat mods (usually 3-4 mods) to increase the status chance of the weapon. Corrosive procs are only useless if you have four corrosive projection auras on your team or three corrosive projections if all are supported by coaction drift. Most random teams don’t have four or even three corrosive procs, so I have to compensate for this, especially in random sortie missions. Hell, even in premade sometimes a player doesn’t have corrosive projection for some reason. If the enemies have no armor and aren’t the infested nor corpus, the best elemental combo to use would then be viral and electricity or viral and radiation. For example fight against the corrupted or grineer with four corrosive projections, the corrosive procs wouldn’t do anything, but viral procs helps, especially against the heavy units. Most of the time I fight against the corrupted since I always need ducats. Also, grineer and corpus don’t reach endgame unless you do sortie missions or trials. I mostly tested my weapons against a level 90-130 corrupted heavy gunner and sometimes even a corrupted eximus heavy gunner or bombard in the simulacrum room.


High tier endgame weapons (please read the paragraph before this to continue):

 

Spoiler

 

High tier endgame weapons (please read the paragraph before this to continue):

 

Tonkor is probably the most ammo efficient weapon in the game. Even if you run out of ammo just switch to a secondary, kill a few things, and you should be good again. I used to be biased against the tonkor mostly because it had less base damage and less magazine size than the vaykor hek, but when I actually used it in regular gameplay I was amazed. It usually kills an entire group of enemies in one freaking shot. Until you reach to level 100+ eximus enemies you have to shoot multiple times, but it doesn’t take much time since it’s 2 second reload. This is probably the best crit weapon in the game atm as well because you don’t need to worry about status chance at all. As you can tell by know, I usually prefer status builds of weapons than crit builds of weapons in terms of actual dps. I will state again, warframe builder doesn’t give you the actual dps of a weapon in regards to status procs, only in regards to raw power. The tonkor doesn’t need to worry about status chance because it procs crits frequently with high base damage and is an aoe (area of effect) weapon. Also, unlike the penta and the ogris, the tonkor doesn’t inflict a lot of self-damage and lets you rocket jump when you shoot at your feet. Tonkor isn't good against nullifiers though since the shot bounces off the nullifier's shield.

 

Synoid simulor is both a good aoe (area of effect) and cc (crowd control) weapon. However, it also does good damage as well. The weapon performs best at groups of enemies. Some people use crit builds for simulor, but I use status build for mine and it performs well in sorties. It’s fun watching the enemies panic from getting burnt, reducing the shield of the enemies and reducing the enemies armor with corrosive procs. I’m guessing crit build simulor is better than status build simulor in regards to level 1-30 enemies, but in regards to lvl 100+ enemies, I want those enemies to have less shields and armor. Corrosive and fire combo isn’t the best against corpus, so magnetic and fire is probably better.

 

Quanta Vandal is a good status weapon and a very ammo efficient laser assault rifle. However, I don’t technically have one, but in theory it should be a good high tier endgame weapon. I have used the quanta, but sadly it doesn’t have the same status chance as Quanta Vandal. The quanta is an adaptable weapon in that it can focus on one enemy with its primary fire or a group of enemies with its secondary fire. The normal quanta I regard as high tier weapon, but not endgame.

 

Vaykor Hek is the best crit shotgun in the game at the moment and has decent status chance. I run a combination of crit and status for the vaykor hek for two reasons, I want a chance to perform a corrosive proc and I want to save forma. It performs well in sortie missions and up to the 60 minute/wave mark in void missions. Going beyond 60 minutes/waves, players usually start to die or have problems. I recommend not extending 80 minutes/waves in void missions unless the team composition is very good. I have used the vaykor hek a lot and I prefer it over the normal hek and the sancti tigris because it has more magazine size and I feel like it performs better against groups of enemies and huge groups of enemies are usually problematic. Some players say normal hek is better than vaykor hek because of the multishot augment, but they are overlooking the fact that vaykor hek is a crit weapon, has more fire rate, and has twice more magazine size. Also, the normal hek has to sacrifice a mod slot for the multishot augment. The main reason why vaykor hek is better than the hek isn’t because of its damage but because of its performance. If you want to use a normal hek, try a sancti tigris, it’s better.

 

Sancti Tigris is a monster at killing infested enemies and most planet bosses. Sancti Tigris performs best against small groups or individual enemies. It can have difficulty against huge groups of enemies, though. However, in combination with warframe abilities, for example nova’s ultimate, it should be good enough in terms of performance.

 

Zhuge is a mastery 0 weapon atm and it’s freaking good. I haven’t leveled it to lvl 30 on the second/last forma yet, but at one forma it out dpsed the rakta cernos. You are probably asking how? The answer is simple, corrosive procs. I made it to where my Zhuge has 98% status chance along with 50% crit chance (in disregard of multishot). So every shot has 90% chance to shoot another arrow and both of these arrows have 98% chance to proc a status effect, either physical, corrosive, or fire. I like fire more than ice most of the time because it does DoT (damage over time) and it causes the enemy to panic, which is cc. However, in terms of being versatile in terms of raw damage and in ignore of status procs, corrosive and ice is better than corrosive and fire. Fire is basically more defensive than cold in terms of utility in my opinion. Cold does slow the enemy, but I rather the enemy panic and not shoot at me. Fire panics don’t work on MOAs though. The traditional bows may do more damage than the Zhuge, but the Zhuge has faster fire rate and higher status chance so the enemy will most likely have a few stacks of corrosive procs, which means the enemy has less armor than it originally had. I feel like the Zhuge is going to be my new favorite bow weapon, which might replace my assault rifles, especially since it has high base damage.

 

Vaykor marelok is a good pistol and is very easy to use. I run a hybrid of a crit and status build with my marelok. It’s not the best status secondary weapon, but it does proc some corrosive stacks from time to time.

 

Staticor is now my most favorite secondary weapon and it’s a status weapon! Staticor out dps sonicor and my build has 85% status chance in disregard to multishot. This thing has radiation base damage, which is really good with status builds. Basically all the time you reduce the corrupted/grineer enemies armor, knock them down, or confuse them with radiation. All three choices are awesome, so no matter what you are procing something that you want. Your enemies won’t have a chance to make a come back.

 

Broken War/Dakra Prime and Nikana prime/Dragon Nikana are the endgame melee weapons mainly because you can perform finisher damage through performing finisher attacks. Finisher damage is the best damage type in this game because it ignores standard shields and armor. You basically will kill a lvl 130 corrupted heavy gunner by performing 3-5 finisher attacks. Nikana prime is probably the best, but broken war is easier to use.

 

Any dagger can be endgame with the covert lethality mod, but you have to perform a stealth attack. This would be good when you make the enemies asleep with nightform equinox, blinded with Excalibur, or blinded with inaros, or stunning enemies with valkyr. The best daggers for covert lethality mod are the daggers with high attack speed, namely dark dagger and ceramic dagger. Dark dagger has an augment so I picked dark dagger, plus it’s cooler. Also, sheev might be good even though it has slower attack speed, but with normal attacks you can have 85% status chance.

Acrid, it out dpsed my vaykor marelok build.

Mios with a dual status and crit build it should reduce the enemy's armor heavily while doing quick critical attacks.

 

 

 

 

Low tier end game weapons:

 

Spoiler

 

Boar prime is my favorite shotgun, but I still use the vaykor hek more, generally. It can reach 100% status chance and I have at times completely taken away a lvl 100 corrupted heavy gunners armor entirely away due to having decent fire rate. I added no fire rate mods as well. Also, the individual pellets can each proc, which makes reducing the armor or procing even faster on enemies. This bad boy out damages boltor prime and soma prime in close range if you use a 100% status build.

 

Torid can control areas of the map pretty well, so it’s really useful for defense missions or even survival missions. Torid is more of a support weapon than a damage weapon, but for a support weapon it’s really good with the corrosive/blast combo, along with status dual stat mods. Especially good with Saryn Prime.

 

Snipetron Vandal looks like it has good stats and in theory should be a good weapon, but I don’t have it unfortunately. Sniper rifles aren’t meta in the game, but on the right hands can be deadly, which is why I put it in the second highest tier of the list.

 

Lesion is the best status polearm weapon. My build has 100% status chance and each status proc makes the weapons have additional attack speed, which is a unique weapon effect.

 

Synoid gammacor is an excellent secondary weapon, but it can run out of ammo fast. The best weapon against nullifiers, though.

 

Ankyros prime can perform finisher attacks pretty quickly with the right stance. The main problem is the reach of the weapon.

 

Brakk, I haven't used this weapon at all but it's raw dps seems pretty good in warframe builder. It can perform the same amount of damage as vaykor marelok, but vaykor marelok doesn't lose damage at long distances and it has much higher status chance.

Dual Toxocyst, requires headshots  in order to be sufficient for endgame use.

 

 

 

High tier weapons (non-endgame):


 

Spoiler

 

All prime weapons except boar prime

 

All syndicate weapons that were not mentioned

 

All wraith and vandal weapons not previously mentioned, except for wraith vipers, lato vandal, and wraith machete

 

Tigris and Hek

 

Prisma Grakata and Prisma Skana

 

Opticor

 

Phage

 

Drakgoon

 

Penta

 

Talons

 

Mara detron

 

Cerata

 

Glaive

 

Atterax

 

Sydon

 

Jat kittag

 

Kulstar

 

Tekko

 

Scindo and Galatine

 

Aksomati

 

Atomos

 

Ignis

 

Tysis

 

Sonicor

 

 

 

 

Mid tier weapons:

 

Spoiler

Any weapons that I haven’t mentioned yet

 

Low tier weapons:

 

Spoiler

Weapons that are downgrades for example the MK1-Braton and MK1-Paris

 

I got lazy near the end of my low tier endgame list. If a lot of people like this guide/tier list I might put in my personal weapon builds and might even update it. Hopefully people find this guide helpful and if you have any criticize please check the Warframe Wikipedia to make sure you are correct. If you have any questions and I'm not lazy enough, I might answer them, lol. Sorry, I just rather play and learn than post in a forum about stuff. I might have missed some weapons just because there are so many weapons in the game. I missed ignis, but I added it when I edited. Also, I recommend people watch Mogamu's weapon videos regarding weapons I talked about and haven't talked about. They helped me a lot to get a feel of the weapon.

I will just quote one of the replies since it gives good information regarding both status chance and crit damage.

On 3/21/2016 at 3:04 AM, PikeOrShield said:

...On another note: I realize you have a preference toward status weapons, but I think you should mention that critical headshots get a x2 multiplier in adition to the x2 headshot multiplier on most enemies.  You kind of mentioned it by saying crit weapons did well against enemy weak spots, but people might want the numbers to back that up.  It's on this page under "Critical Headshots".

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Critical_Hit

You should also consider talking about how the game decides which status your weapon procs most often.  (Ex: if a gun deals 50% slash, 25% impact, and 25% puncture and has a 20% status chance, the weapon will have a 10% chance of dealing a slash proc and a 5% chance for impact or puncture per bullet).  Also include that IPS damage gets a x4 multiplier to status proc chance over elemental damage types.

From testing various weapons I feel like I have more dps with status builds of certain weapons like the boar prime than I would with a crit build of the same weapon because the armors of endgame enemies are very high and lowering these armor values helps all sources of damage to do more damage in the end. Plus I can do headshots while inflicting stacks of armor reduction on the enemy. The normal crits really aren't as effective as reducing the enemy's armor if the enemy has high amounts of armor.

If you go to http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Armor, they provide an example of an endgame enemy. The example is in the spoiler below.

 

Spoiler

 

Enemy Armor

Enemy armor values are displayed under the codex and infobox, but scale to the enemy's level. Generally, onlyGrineer and boss enemies have armor, while the Corpus and Infested factions do not have any. When the enemy health bars is yellow, armor is in effect and damage will be reduced and cause it to flicker red.

Scaling of enemy armor values uses the following formula:

Armor = Base Armor × (1 + ((Current Level − Base Level)1.75 ÷ 200))

  • Base Armor: Base armor value for the enemy.
  • Current Level: The level of your target enemy.
  • Base Level: This is the initial level an enemy can spawn. This is important because certain enemy types, such as Heavy Grineer, will not spawn until certain levels (like level 8 for Heavy Gunners), so while they may be level 30, their armor has only scaled up 22 times.

Grineer Armor New

This graph shows the amount of armor for Grineer Heavy Gunner up to Level 120.

 

As mentioned before, this formula causes high level Grineer (lets say up from level 50) to be very hard to kill, as you can see in the example of a level 108 Heavy Gunner:

500 × (1 + (((108 − 8)1.75) / 200))
= 500 × (1 + (3162 / 200))
= 500 × 16.81
= 8405

Damage Received = Attack Damage ÷ (1 + (8405 / 300)) =
Damage Received = Attack Damage × 0.0345

The resulting damage received by the Heavy Gunner is dramatically reduced to ~3.45% of original damage.

 

 

So you see, a normal crit of a head shot isn't really enough to compensate for the enemy's high amount of damage reduction. Reducing the armor of the enemy is easier and usually more efficient at the very higher levels.

By WingGun

 

 

Edited by WingGun
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Good job!

It might be easier to read though if you spoiler tagged things into subsections like this:

Spoiler

Weapon Tiers:

Spoiler

High Tier Weapons:

Spoiler

Etc.ect.

Low Tier Weapons

Spoiler

Etc.etc.

 

 

On another note: I realize you have a preference toward status weapons, but I think you should mention that critical headshots get a x2 multiplier in adition to the x2 headshot multiplier on most enemies.  You kind of mentioned it by saying crit weapons did well against enemy weak spots, but people might want the numbers to back that up.  It's on this page under "Critical Headshots".

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Critical_Hit

 

You should also consider talking about how the game decides which status your weapon procs most often.  (Ex: if a gun deals 50% slash, 25% impact, and 25% puncture and has a 20% status chance, the weapon will have a 10% chance of dealing a slash proc and a 5% chance for impact or puncture per bullet).  Also include that IPS damage gets a x4 multiplier to status proc chance over elemental damage types.

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Great Job in General and rly Thumbs up for all the effort you but in it.

Now the Down-Side: your placement of Weapons is sometimes rly stange. For Example : Mios?! Non-Endgame?!? this weapon can rip appart lvl 150 heavy gunners in a few seconds and doesnt even need Finishers O.o explain pls. Acrid also sorted into Non-Engame, why?!? it removes the armor of a Heavy gunner completely in less then 5 seconds and most of the time he is allrdy dead even before that happens. Tysis totaly unmentioned allthou it easily kills Heavy Gunner but you dont even consider it High-Lvl-Weapon you Declass it as mid-tier or lower. Dual Toxocysts wasnt mentioned too even if it kills enemies at same speed or even more as some of the Lower Endgame-Weapons.

Again your effort is great it will surely help some new players to finaly get rid of their "War best Melee"-Attitude and make em think more but you should rly do more research on some Weapons before you declass em as "Not even High-Tier" since THIS can lead us to this "Boltor Prime"-Era we had long enough now because some ppl discarded every other Weapons because they "heard" about how bad the other weapons are.

Edited: Slash proccs are the best Damage you can get on every Melee and some but rly rare Firearms. Thats because the Slashproccs lead to Bleeding that Firstly is Fisher Damage so it ignores Armor and Shield alike and Secondly it can be Stacked. So lets asume you do Slash Procc with a melee for 500 every Second for 6 seconds allthough it doesnt sound much but its possible to stack it up lets say 4 times so you get about 2000 damage directly on the enemy health every Second. This is pretty solid and can often kill Enemies faster than Corrosive proccs can.

Edited by Cruelitas
Edit about your Comment to Slash-Proccs
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Can't believe I went through and read everything.  

In my opinion - you did a great job making this guide, it should be pretty helpful to everyone.

Thumbs up for you !

P.S. You should move Brakk from  High tier weapons (non-endgame) to High tier endgame weapons because Brakk is actually a really good choice for endgame missions. It's damage is high enough and it can literally one-shot everything (almost).

Edited by Valznar
Forgot to add something
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Crit weapons are pretty much the best weapons.

For melee, if the weapon csn't crit, it doesn't worth a damn.

For guns, the only top weapon that doesn't requires crit build is Tigris/Sancti Tigris and it was only because it has an absurb amount of base damage. Even Synoid Simulor is better with crit build. Boltor Prime is completely outclassed by Zhuge just because of crit also.

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29 minutes ago, ClinkzEastwood said:

Crit weapons are pretty much the best weapons.

For melee, if the weapon csn't crit, it doesn't worth a damn.

For guns, the only top weapon that doesn't requires crit build is Tigris/Sancti Tigris and it was only because it has an absurb amount of base damage. Even Synoid Simulor is better with crit build. Boltor Prime is completely outclassed by Zhuge just because of crit also.

I agree that crit builds are generally the best for melee weapons, but that's not necessarily true for primary guns. If you compare a build that only focuses on raw power (having four 90% damage elemental mods along with blaze, also vicious spread, primed point blank and hell's chamber) for the sancti tigris you will see that it has more average damage per shot than a crit build of sancti tigris. The crit chance of sancti tigris and synoid simulor is just too low to compete with pure raw damage builds. You don't always have to pick status or crit, you can just go for pure damage. I agree that Zhuge outclasses boltor prime, but the status chance helps a lot as well. Reducing the enemy's armor is kinda op in this game.

sanctipuredamagebuild.jpg

Edited by WingGun
trying to put in image
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13 minutes ago, PikeOrShield said:

Good job!

It might be easier to read though if you spoiler tagged things into subsections like this:

  Reveal hidden contents

Weapon Tiers:

  Reveal hidden contents

High Tier Weapons:

  Reveal hidden contents

Etc.ect.

Low Tier Weapons

  Reveal hidden contents

Etc.etc.

 

 

On another note: I realize you have a preference toward status weapons, but I think you should mention that critical headshots get a x2 multiplier in adition to the x2 headshot multiplier on most enemies.  You kind of mentioned it by saying crit weapons did well against enemy weak spots, but people might want the numbers to back that up.  It's on this page under "Critical Headshots".

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Critical_Hit

 

You should also consider talking about how the game decides which status your weapon procs most often.  (Ex: if a gun deals 50% slash, 25% impact, and 25% puncture and has a 20% status chance, the weapon will have a 10% chance of dealing a slash proc and a 5% chance for impact or puncture per bullet).  Also include that IPS damage gets a x4 multiplier to status proc chance over elemental damage types.

Yeah I forgot to mention that stuff, but I didn't know IPS damage gets a x4 multiplier to status proc chance. I thought it was like x2. Impact proc is good for cc and Slash proc is kinda okay for damage, but puncture is the worst for focusing purely on dps. Yeah, I'll try to add spoilers if I can. I feel like reducing the enemy's armor in regards to the very high level enemies (levels 90+) is more effective than trying to crit on headshots of the enemy. Plus realistically, players don't do headshots 24/7. Because I tested the red veil bow with a crit build against a lvl 130 corrupted heavy gunner and I was doing headshots and it still took a bit too long of a while.

Edited by WingGun
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1 hour ago, Valznar said:

P.S. You should move Brakk from  High tier weapons (non-endgame) to High tier endgame weapons because Brakk is actually a really good choice for endgame missions. It's damage is high enough and it can literally one-shot everything (almost).

I rechecked the weapon since I haven't played with it much and haven't maxed my brakk yet, but it has the same dps as vaykor marelok, so I moved it to low tier endgame weapons.

 

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3 hours ago, Cruelitas said:

Great Job in General and rly Thumbs up for all the effort you but in it.

Now the Down-Side: your placement of Weapons is sometimes rly stange. For Example : Mios?! Non-Endgame?!? this weapon can rip appart lvl 150 heavy gunners in a few seconds and doesnt even need Finishers O.o explain pls. Acrid also sorted into Non-Engame, why?!? it removes the armor of a Heavy gunner completely in less then 5 seconds and most of the time he is allrdy dead even before that happens. Tysis totaly unmentioned allthou it easily kills Heavy Gunner but you dont even consider it High-Lvl-Weapon you Declass it as mid-tier or lower. Dual Toxocysts wasnt mentioned too even if it kills enemies at same speed or even more as some of the Lower Endgame-Weapons.

Again your effort is great it will surely help some new players to finaly get rid of their "War best Melee"-Attitude and make em think more but you should rly do more research on some Weapons before you declass em as "Not even High-Tier" since THIS can lead us to this "Boltor Prime"-Era we had long enough now because some ppl discarded every other Weapons because they "heard" about how bad the other weapons are.

Edited: Slash proccs are the best Damage you can get on every Melee and some but rly rare Firearms. Thats because the Slashproccs lead to Bleeding that Firstly is Fisher Damage so it ignores Armor and Shield alike and Secondly it can be Stacked. So lets asume you do Slash Procc with a melee for 500 every Second for 6 seconds allthough it doesnt sound much but its possible to stack it up lets say 4 times so you get about 2000 damage directly on the enemy health every Second. This is pretty solid and can often kill Enemies faster than Corrosive proccs can.

I forgot to mention tysis. Dual Toxocyst is a pretty new weapon. I think acrid is a better support weapon than tysis because tysis has low fire rate and acrid has longer status durations, but the acrid just doesn't have enough raw dps to kill heavy endgame units fast enough. The torid kills units faster, but it's a primary. Also, I had some ammo problems with the acrid, so sometimes I want an ammo mutation mod. The mios should be as good as the lesion with the right build. I'll make the following changes. I personally disliked the feel of the mios, but I'll give it another try, the stats do look good. Especially with the blood rush mod, which is new method of dps to me. The slash procs are probably best with weapons like sancti tigris, in a mix with corrosive procs, so why not have both slash procs and corrosive procs? In the past I didn't have the supreme slash mods such as buzzkill, but now I do. Thanks for your input. It's basically kinda hard to explore every weapon in the game and impossible to make a static tier weapon list.

Edited by WingGun
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I'm not sure if I missed it, but I didn't see the Sonicor on this list anywhere, did I miss it, or do you have reasoning behind that? It's easily one of the best best secondaries in the game, contested by Vaykor Marelok in my opinion, due to it's amazing CC. Ragdolls and knocks down capture targets and can easily keep enemies on the floor, allowing for clean and easy defense missions :P

+1 For a very in-depth guide though, thanks for the community contribution! :D

Edited by Spar_k
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2 hours ago, Spar_k said:

I'm not sure if I missed it, but I didn't see the Sonicor on this list anywhere, did I miss it, or do you have reasoning behind that? It's easily one of the best best secondaries in the game, contested by Vaykor Marelok in my opinion, due to it's amazing CC. Ragdolls and knocks down capture targets and can easily keep enemies on the floor, allowing for clean and easy defense missions :P

+1 For a very in-depth guide though, thanks for the community contribution! :D

I mention it in the mastery walkthrough, but I forgot about it when I was making the tier list. I put it in the high tier list because its CC is very good, but its reload time is too high for my taste and its fire rate is too low for my taste. The reload time would be fine if the base damage was higher, has higher magazine size, or has more fire rate. The sonicor shoots slower than a vectis or panthera.

Edited by WingGun
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14 hours ago, Rydian said:

Elemental damage always applies regardless of status chance, and should be like, #3.

What do you mean by #3? Also, "Elemental damage always applies regardless of status chance" is only relevant if the player doesn't know this fact, which I overlooked in mentioning in the guide. However, one of the guides that I linked probably mentions this.

1 hour ago, Rydian said:

That's more advanced things, and the guide is called damage guide...

Status procs, such as corrosive procs, are 'advanced' but they can affect how much damage you inflict on the enemy or the time it takes to kill an enemy, does it not?

I'm sorry, but you're kind of vague or lack content in what you are trying to express.

Edited by WingGun
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3 hours ago, WingGun said:

What do you mean by #3?

In the list of what's important to mod for causing damage to the enemy.  Elementals are listed last for importance, when really they should be #3 or even #2.

3 hours ago, WingGun said:

Also, "Elemental damage always applies regardless of status chance" is only relevant if the player doesn't know this fact

I was more mentioning that for why it should be higher in the listing.  The only time non-event physical damage mods would even match 90% elementals would be in the case of something like Jagged Edge, and that'd be the only match, and only if the weapon is 100% slash with no impact or puncture damage on it at all.  The only physical mods that come close to being used with no elements are the 120% event mods, and newbies aren't expected to have those.

3 hours ago, WingGun said:

Status procs, such as corrosive procs, are 'advanced' but they can affect how much damage you inflict on the enemy or the time it takes to kill an enemy, does it not?

Not really, no.  Most status effects deal no extra damage.  Viral is the only one that directly helps kill enemies faster.  For the few status effects that do cause more damage (DoTs), continued fire will deal more damage than the DoT in much less time.

One of the newbie pitfalls for modding is that they underestimate elemental damage.  A lot of new players don't realize that elemental damage is always applied (not linked to status chance) and works off of the full base damage of the weapon (instead of just the one type like impact/puncture/slash), which I feel a guide for newbies on damage should point out.

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32 minutes ago, Rydian said:

Not really, no.  Most status effects deal no extra damage.  Viral is the only one that directly helps kill enemies faster.  For the few status effects that do cause more damage (DoTs), continued fire will deal more damage than the DoT in much less time.

One of the newbie pitfalls for modding is that they underestimate elemental damage.  A lot of new players don't realize that elemental damage is always applied (not linked to status chance) and works off of the full base damage of the weapon (instead of just the one type like impact/puncture/slash), which I feel a guide for newbies on damage should point out.

The power of corrosive procs against enemies such as corrupted/grineer enemies, enemies which have armor, is really strong in this game. I explained it heavily in the guide. If an enemy has less armor you do more damage against it. Viral isn't the only status chances that helps kill enemies faster. High level enemies have high amounts of armor, thus you do less damage against them. The level doesn't fundamentally mean anything, it's the amount of health and armor that matters. If an enemy takes about 90% reduced damage from your weapons, lowering the armor of the enemy would help a lot in performing more damage against this enemy. It's a pretty simplistic strategy.

Also, most newbs do underestimate elemental mods, but I provided another link to another guide which should explain what you are concerned about in regards to informing newbs. I was more focused on newbs in regards to what weapons they should pick at certain mastery ranks than in general. I was more focused on experienced players in general when I was providing guidance on specific weapons to 'max out' (put forma and a catalyst on) and how to perform more damage.

 

Edited by WingGun
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good info

one note... staticor is bugged as heck.  don't get too attached to it, because it will stop working in the middle of a mission, work the next mission, stop on the third, etc. 

staticor has a long standing bug that's well documented... no one should use it until it's fixed

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4 hours ago, WingGun said:

If an enemy takes about 90% reduced damage from your weapons, lowering the armor of the enemy would help a lot in performing more damage against this enemy. It's a pretty simplistic strategy.

But is less effective compared to elemental damage itself.  90% damage reduction requires ~2750 armor, so for example a level ~43 Bombard.  A 25% armor cut twice makes your 10% damage into 12.7% damage and then 16.2% damage for the following shots, but if you were doing Radiation you'd get a 75% damage increase from the start with no proccing required.

For example with Corrosive doing 5000 damage per shot, you go from 500 to 635 to 810 damage, needing two procs.
Versus if you were using Radiation, which would be doing 875 damage for all shots from the start with no procs needed.

Not all weapons can proc effectively, but all weapons can make use of elemental weaknesses.
 

4 hours ago, WingGun said:

Also, most newbs do underestimate elemental mods

Dude, I can't even tell you how many times I've typed "elemental damage is always applied" in the forums, in-game, and elsewhere.  It's like one of my catchphrases by now with how often i say it.  It's one of the biggest modding mistakes, and the info in your guide right now perpetuates the idea that elemental is situational over physical, and thus it should be fixed.

Edited by Rydian
Example added, clarification.
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13 hours ago, Rydian said:

But is less effective compared to elemental damage itself.  90% damage reduction requires ~2750 armor, so for example a level ~43 Bombard.  A 25% armor cut twice makes your 10% damage into 12.7% damage and then 16.2% damage for the following shots, but if you were doing Radiation you'd get a 75% damage increase from the start with no proccing required.

For example with Corrosive doing 5000 damage per shot, you go from 500 to 635 to 810 damage, needing two procs.
Versus if you were using Radiation, which would be doing 875 damage for all shots from the start with no procs needed.

Not all weapons can proc effectively, but all weapons can make use of elemental weaknesses.

You are overlooking something when you are comparing elemental damage that the enemy is weak against versus reducing the enemy's armor. When you are getting that 75% damage increase in damage due to being radiation in the following example, it too is being reduced by the armor of the enemy by a ratio of 90%. Also, your total damage most likely isn't all radiation (most weapon builds have more than one element type) so you have to consider that ratio as well, which gets even more complicated. Also, corrosive procs is only good against very high level enemies with lots of armor, so, in the future, don't use an example of a weak enemy with low amounts of armor. Your math isn't wrong in terms of calculation, but you didn't put in all the variables. Also, endgame heavy enemies don't usually take a few seconds to kill. Usually it takes like 10-30 seconds, so you can get much more than two corrosive procs, especially with multishot, unless you are using something like a tonkor. I think you should actually test out weapon builds on level 90+ heavy units in the simulacrum. It's like what moguma kind of said in one of his videos, I go by the numbers of damage in the game, not by the math. We are both suited to talk about theory, but I'm afraid we are both not suited to talk about the actual math that's going on in the game. I have a brother that has a computer science degree (four years) and got accepted for masters, but I think he has much more important things to do.

13 hours ago, Rydian said:

Dude, I can't even tell you how many times I've typed "elemental damage is always applied" in the forums, in-game, and elsewhere.  It's like one of my catchphrases by now with how often i say it.  It's one of the biggest modding mistakes, and the info in your guide right now perpetuates the idea that elemental is situational over physical, and thus it should be fixed.

I don't see how my guide perpetuates the idea that elemental is situational over physical versus what you have said. I would like a reference of how it does. Both physical and elemental damage CAN be situational if you only consider the elemental/physical weaknesses of the enemies. You even admit to this in your example regarding radiation damage vs corrosive procs; however, you missed one of the variables that the armor is still there and the total damage most likely isn't all radiation. Also, you shouldn't assume I know all your 'catchphrases' just because you spent a lot of time on a forum. Also, just because I haven't talked much about IPS in comparison to elemental damage doesn't necessarily mean my guide views negatively about it.

Edited by WingGun
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3 hours ago, WingGun said:

You are overlooking something when you are comparing elemental damage that the enemy is weak against versus reducing the enemy's armor. When you are getting that 75% damage increase in damage due to being radiation in the following example, it too is being reduced by the armor of the enemy by a ratio of 90%.

That is accounted for.  (5000 * 0.1) = 500, and (5000 * 0.1 * 1.75) = 875.

Also, your total damage most likely isn't all radiation (most weapon builds have more than one element type) so you have to consider that ratio as well, which gets even more complicated.

I was concerned with just the elemental part of the damage to show how they compare in cases of extreme armor.  If you wanted to actually do the most damage, you'd do finisher attacks which bypass armor (but those aren't always available).  There's also the case of running 4 Corrosive Projections or 3 Corrosive Projections and some Coaction Drifts to remove enemy armor in most missions, but that's not always available either.

Also, corrosive procs is only good against very high level enemies with lots of armor, so, in the future, don't use an example of a weak enemy with low amounts of armor.

I used the Bombard, which has double the base armor of most other Grineer units (500 versus 200/250), and a level 43 one at that in order to match your stated damage resistance from armor (yes, I checked the charts).  That's around the highest level star chart and non-endless void missions will reasonably reach, so I consider it about the end of what new players may encounter.

Also, endgame heavy enemies don't usually take a few seconds to kill. Usually it takes like 10-30 seconds, so you can get much more than two corrosive procs, especially with multishot, unless you are using something like a tonkor.

25 seconds if you're relying on Corrosive procs to slowly boost your damage over time.
15.3 seconds if you go for a 75% damage boost from the start.

I think you should actually test out weapon builds on level 90+ heavy units in the simulacrum.

My concern is incorrect info in this guide being given to newbies.  If they don't know how to mod or pick weapons then they're not concerned with level 90 enemies for a while.

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Your weapon isn't technically maxed out, it only has corrosive damage. Plus quanta isn't a good status weapon because it procs status too slowly due to low status chance and low fire rate, but the vandal quanta is a good status weapon, which I don't have either. I suggest using the staticor with status build, boar prime with status build, or prisma grakata / zhuge with a crit/status build. Also, hammer shot is generally the worst status mod for status builds. Replace it with an ice/fire dual stat status mod, you have enough mod capacity room for another maxed out status dual stat mod. Good status builds aren't cheap to make. Also, newbs don't usually get quanta off the bat.

1 hour ago, Rydian said:

I was concerned with just the elemental part of the damage to show how they compare in cases of extreme armor.  If you wanted to actually do the most damage, you'd do finisher attacks which bypass armor (but those aren't always available).  There's also the case of running 4 Corrosive Projections or 3 Corrosive Projections and some Coaction Drifts to remove enemy armor in most missions, but that's not always available either.

It's possible to run corrosive and fire or corrosive and blast, especially for weapons that have a catalyst and some forma on it. The same goes for combinations involving radiation. That's what I was pointing out. Also, most weapons have physical damage, not a base of elemental damage; for example the boar prime and lesion. The best endgame builds have all mod slots filled up. You did not do this and thus you easily only had one type of damage.

Your video is only true with weapons that don't proc status effects often and for weaker enemies. A lvl 45-50 bombardier is still mid tier. I suggest not committing the straw man fallacy, but you are correct that the corrosive procs strategy isn't the best method in killing weak-mid tier enemies. However, mid-tier enemies are already easy to kill, are they not?

Most good weapons with a catalyst installed and some polarites, assuming all mod slots are filled up and the damage mods are maxed out, will always have ease at killing mid-tier enemies.

1 hour ago, Rydian said:

My concern is incorrect info in this guide being given to newbies.  If they don't know how to mod or pick weapons then they're not concerned with level 90 enemies for a while.

Eventually the newbs will have to been concerned with level 90 enemies, if they wish to continue playing the game and do a few sorties, long void runs, or even trials. That's why it's regarded as a newb/veteran guide. Newbs with mastery rank 4 and a warframe at level 30 can do a sortie.

1 hour ago, Rydian said:

I used the Bombard, which has double the base armor of most other Grineer units (500 versus 200/250), and a level 43 one at that in order to match your stated damage resistance from armor (yes, I checked the charts).  That's around the highest level star chart and non-endless void missions will reasonably reach, so I consider it about the end of what new players may encounter.

My guide focuses more on endgame enemies than mid-tier enemies, especially the tier list. Now the part when I explain what weapons a newb should get for each mastery rank, that's 'mostly' the only part in the entire guide that the targeted audience is newbs. Also, I said, "Newbs with mastery rank 4 and a warframe at level 30 can do a sortie."

Basically you are correct that elemental damage (focused on the weaknesses of the enemy) along with crit is the best method in dealing with low level and mid-tier enemies. However, the biggest issue with endgame enemies are their armor values and that was what I was trying to focus on in my guide. I feel like many players overlook this and this guide's targeted audience is more for experienced players than newbs that have absolutely no idea what to do in this game. There are enough newb guides. Maybe my title is misleading, I'll change the title.

Edited by WingGun
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On 3/21/2016 at 8:23 AM, Cruelitas said:

Acrid also sorted into Non-Engame, why?!? it removes the armor of a Heavy gunner completely in less then 5 seconds and most of the time he is allrdy dead even before that happens.

You are correct, I tested my 3 forma acrid and it out dps my vaykor marelok crit/status build with primed crit mods on. I'm going to put it in high tier end game. My acrid build even has an ammo mutation mod and the syndicate augment in it, so it beat my vaykor marelok build with only 6 mods relating to multishot/damage.

Edited by WingGun
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