LeucienWeaver Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 To paraphrase a famous speaker and peaceful activist, 'I have a dream.' I have a dream that someone from DE will see this and will give it the nudge it needs so that the midday/late night(To me) players can see it and give their opinion, or to give it a poll... Such hopes might as well be pipedreams however. So far we've talked about how voting could be put behind a playtime or mastery wall, does anyone else have any suggestions for such a topic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skytt Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 No, having flexible spending money doesn't make one a game designer, but on a whole, the decisions that have come to light haven't been straight from the Dev Council. They've been tweaked, modified, and put under a proverbial electron microscope before being put through another filter... A vote. It's fine that you're a free to play gamer, I don't judge nor do I think myself superior to you, and that's actually what i'm trying to fight for. I want the Free to Play community to have a voice on the matter, where they can talk and possibly have votes of their own should the topic call for it. Yeah, my comments were more in the sense of "this is my stance, I happen to not have spent any money on the game yet, but I plan to, and my stance won't change because of that." I like what was said in the latest livestream, how they would rather kick a feature out the door to get feedback on how the first iteration was made to function, rather than build things in isolation until "perfection" only to realize the fans don't appreciate the final result. I don't know if extending to only the design council is a large enough bubble to gauge reactions for the player base as a whole, though it is definitely better than building things in total isolation. There are times when limiting your audience at first is beneficial, I just don't think when it comes to soliciting feedback or ideas that it is the best approach. Larger pool = better and more refined ideas through discussion; someone having paid money doesn't inherently make them more valuable in that situation. I think they'd do just fine, if not better, if they opened that kind of thing up to everyone, but kept a tight watch on things and removed people who were caustic to the "rational discussion" environment. As others have said, I'm not a fan of money buying "power." In this case, power to influence a game that not only they are playing. I don't know if I'd prefer to have the information more open to everyone while still restricting the voting, because that still prevents people with legitimate opinions from affecting the outcome because of "has not spent money" (and even then, some people have, just not through the founder option). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clessiah Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Filtering out spammers I'd say. There are better ways but having a $100 threshold is probably the option with the least hassle. It is also safe to assume those who spent huge amount of money in Warframe will stick with it for longer than average time. I do find myself as a "two weeks extreme activist" when I play some of the games so I do agree with having a threshold for voting. Even though DE is willing to listen to us, I'm also confident that they know how to create something good and liked by us. If they actually follow all the demands we make Warframe might ended up having the same fate as Dark Sector such as giving Excalibur bigger bulge. I'd rather see the voting to be more open, with other ways to earn the qualification to vote on the new content(while master+ founders are qualified automatically) but the result is only used as a convincing suggestion instead of final result. Problem is that in the Become a Founder page the access to Design Council seems to be included as part of the "value" of the founder pack, so I have no idea how DE is going to deal with such situation after beta... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatpig84 Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 You can tell them, but only we can vote and that's fine for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relkin Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 The design council shouldn't exist. Seriously, the ideas I see brought up when someone mentions what they say make me want to gag. Tell me how a worm hole for a team teleport power has anything to do with Anti-Matter. The suits powered by AM - look at the frame - those things on her back? The thing on her head from her alt helmet? Their is a tiny piece of suspended AM in each. They are reactors. The powers aren't exactly manifestations of AM itself and even if it were Gordan Freeman Jr. - its a game get over it. Frost? lulz wats thermo dynamics?! Ember? hahaha wats entropy? -__- The whole community got its butt hurt over Nova bc they're caught up on trying to out nerd each other on their minuscule knowledge of antimatter. Also, look into Non-orientable wormholes. Need a way to make AM for your gens yeah? Well what if a frame could do that....well the same frame could also likely make a regular worm hole via space magic. Because its a video game. Trying to say DC doesn't exist bc you think that if everybody got to vote you'd get better results is flawed - DC has literally thousands of members which vote on each poll now. I get tired of getting flack from people without decent reason to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rohver Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 I think it's not about the fear of leaks and such why free players are not allowed voting. It's probably because DE feels those who pay are serious and will provide honest feedback/voting. What I think anyway and I am a free player myself. At least let the free players get access to the previews if not vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dasmir Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 We can't, and still keep our ability to vote, Repaused. People would be able to artificially affect the voting system by creation of alts and such. over 500 post to acces council.. done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlayn Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 over 500 post to acces council.. done 500 can be done in a day and a half... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeucienWeaver Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 Dasmir, as explained in other posts, it would be easy to manipulate such a thing. While a 500 post count would be high enough to where the exploiters could get banned before reaching/voting at the minimum, we'd still have troll accounts and anonymous alts which would have people double dipping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowGhosting Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Maybe more players would buy founder's packs if they knew what exactly they were getting to vote on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clessiah Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 The suits powered by AM - look at the frame - those things on her back? The thing on her head from her alt helmet? Their is a tiny piece of suspended AM in each. They are reactors. The powers aren't exactly manifestations of AM itself and even if it were Gordan Freeman Jr. - its a game get over it. Frost? lulz wats thermo dynamics?! Ember? hahaha wats entropy? -__- The whole community got its butt hurt over Nova bc they're caught up on trying to out nerd each other on their minuscule knowledge of antimatter. Also, look into Non-orientable wormholes. Need a way to make AM for your gens yeah? Well what if a frame could do that....well the same frame could also likely make a regular worm hole via space magic. Because its a video game. Trying to say DC doesn't exist bc you think that if everybody got to vote you'd get better results is flawed - DC has literally thousands of members which vote on each poll now. I get tired of getting flack from people without decent reason to do so. They probably just need a name and effect that is more antimatter-ish for that Wormhole. Or DE just want to see if teleporting via portal even works at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeucienWeaver Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 I think it's not about the fear of leaks and such why free players are not allowed voting. It's probably because DE feels those who pay are serious and will provide honest feedback/voting. What I think anyway and I am a free player myself. At least let the free players get access to the previews if not vote. That is exactly the point of the thread; removing the secrecy so that you and other Free players don't have to hunt for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deaths.Reap3r Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Im a complete F2P Player, in every f2p game so far (but warframe has sometimes made me go almost off the edge in me wanting to buy some plat for cosmetics) I say, make the design council public, but all the voting and stuff happens to the masters + Actually, make the threads in the design council viewable to the public after like a month or half a month or so.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlayn Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Dasmir, as explained in other posts, it would be easy to manipulate such a thing. While a 500 post count would be high enough to where the exploiters could get banned before reaching/voting at the minimum, we'd still have troll accounts and anonymous alts which would have people double dipping. OR crazy people making tons of alt accounts and spamming the hell out of forums... Even making 10 accounts and having the 10 accounts have a conversation with each other in one thread... which you could do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deaths.Reap3r Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 500 can be done in a day and a half... Oh oh how about making it 300 posts instead? BUT. They all need to have atleast 10 rep? Eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeucienWeaver Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 Im a complete F2P Player, in every f2p game so far (but warframe has sometimes made me go almost off the edge in me wanting to buy some plat for cosmetics) I say, make the design council public, but all the voting and stuff happens to the masters + Actually, make the threads in the design council viewable to the public after like a month or half a month or so.... That's too much of a gap between reveal and release. There's rarely been more than a month and a half between dev council early info and the game getting the content. Which is why i'd like it to be instant, but still, as you and I agree, behind a wall of some sort, be it pay, playtime, post count, Mastery rank, etc... I just want everyone to have equal Information. If they opened up voting to those with exemplary accomplishments, awesome, if not, that's cool too, but i'd prefer that the 'early access' info be shared with everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relkin Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) They probably just need a name and effect that is more antimatter-ish for that Wormhole. Or DE just want to see if teleporting via portal even works at all. Maybe? idk I tend to not get overly caught up with the science of science FICTION because its just that. Fiction. Honestly I feel like people have a little bit of science education and feel they're qualified to speak about what is and isn't possible (even when they're not) and its so absurdly close minded. AM is mostly still theory for us in many ways, as are other things. Hell Star Trek? Dude, they're writers just made S#&$ up. Literally. They didn't have excessive backrounds in science or anything. Transparent aluminum? Yeah, that's a thing now. Cellphones-->communicators? S#&$ lets go back to 30,000 leagues under the sea, yeah a submarine. Better yet, to the moon and back by jules vernes! Dude concieved rocket propelled space travel in 1865! My point is bordering childhoods end, our technology is what is no more and no less. Technology 1000 years from now (if we continue advancing at the same rate as today) may seem like friggen magic or impossible. It may also seem completely unrelated to the things behind it as we know them now. Lasers! A great example! When lasers were invented they considered friggen useless. Now we use lasers everyday for all kinds of crap. Don't be so narrow minded people! Edited July 19, 2013 by Relkin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeucienWeaver Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 Oh oh how about making it 300 posts instead? BUT. They all need to have atleast 10 rep? Eh? And then approval by a Community Moderator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deaths.Reap3r Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) And then approval by a Community Moderator. Yah. That would work, because then you know that the person has good ideas. And the person can NOT have any warning posts or anything. AND, should have played warframe for atleast 3 months? idk. Any amounts of months . Edited July 19, 2013 by Deaths.Reap3r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RePaused Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Dasmir, as explained in other posts, it would be easy to manipulate such a thing. While a 500 post count would be high enough to where the exploiters could get banned before reaching/voting at the minimum, we'd still have troll accounts and anonymous alts which would have people double dipping. There will always be trolls, but I don't think a troll will make 10 accounts and post 5,000 times just so he can vote on what he wants.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeucienWeaver Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 What's funny is that by those standards, I shouldn't be a Dev Council voter, but i'd be cool with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlayn Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Oh oh how about making it 300 posts instead? BUT. They all need to have atleast 10 rep? Eh? And then approval by a Community Moderator. Yah. That would work, because then you know that the person has good ideas. And the person can NOT have any warning posts or anything. AND, should have played warframe for atleast 3 months? idk. Any amounts of months . No... and No... and defintily No.... 300 plus rep no.... If anything it should be 1000-1500 post Must have started 5 topics that had at least 5 post from 5 other players minimum. Have approval of community Moderator Must have their account IP address compared to other accounts and only one with the same IP may be allowed to vote. Must have an ingame Mastery rank of 6 That is what they should have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deaths.Reap3r Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 There will always be trolls, but I don't think a troll will make 10 accounts and post 5,000 times just so he can vote on what he wants.. Yup. No one would do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deaths.Reap3r Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) No... and No... and defintily No.... 300 plus rep no.... If anything it should be 1000-1500 post Must have started 5 topics that had at least 5 post from 5 other players minimum. Have approval of community Moderator Must have their account IP address compared to other accounts and only one with the same IP may be allowed to vote. Must have an ingame Mastery rank of 6 That is what they should have. No not 300 plus rep. It should be 10 rep for EACH post. So ok. 1000 posts is fine too. And mastery of 6 is fine too. Also 5 posts from 5 other players min is too little imo, cause that like the average amount of posts you get if its a random thing before it dies out. Should be like 20-30... Edited July 19, 2013 by Deaths.Reap3r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeucienWeaver Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share Posted July 19, 2013 There will always be trolls, but I don't think a troll will make 10 accounts and post 5,000 times just so he can vote on what he wants.. I agree wholeheartedly on the insanity of such an action, but I was referring more to double or triple accounts, like that person who was trying to get a rise out of me earlier by being overly troublesome. 3k posts of nothing but teen rage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts