Is Warframe Heading Down The Wrong Direction?

[Nirb]

Hi guys,

 

I know that this post will no doubt spawn some flaming egos and fan-boyism but personally I believe that this game is heading down the wrong path in terms of gameplay and story.

 

Rather than making random levels with four tile sets and a infestation skin for them how about

 

- Introducing new factions or variants of/sub factions

- New tiles sets (such as Sentient ships or Orokin battleships)

- More outdoor areas (such as biospheres allowing possible forests to exist in war frames sci-fi world)

- Perhaps landing on worlds (such as visiting Africa or the Desolate ruins of the capitol of some city on Earth)

- New voice acting

- More Warframe characterization (how a specific Warframe came to be such as Nova and some side missions regarding that)

[- MORE BUG FIXES]

 

This would take the place of the typical updates of

- New weapon(s)

- New warframe(s)

- New dojo rooms

- Miscellaneous features

- More Animations

 

(Edit: Warframe balancing is too important apologies)

 

For maybe a year or a half

 

I understand that new weapons, warframes and dojo rooms are primary sources or influences of income however you are losing huge communities of players over lack of proper Lore (not 4 paragraphs), some degree of story telling, lack of different tile sets (so far we only have 2). In its place you are adding other features where variation is more important.

 

These changes would help prevent the feeling of grinding which is undermining Warframes playability.

 

Feel free to give some constructive criticism If you don't feel the same way I do or help get this noticed if you support the idea.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Nirb

[PsychedelicSnake]

DE has stated and shown that they are already working on all of the stuff you mentioned, especially models and mechanics.

[Gregio]

Things they've talked about, specially regarding weapon updates.

There's one team working on weapon and models. This team works on weapons. The team that makes maps is different. The team that makes sounds gets screwed by everyone else.

They are introducing a new big tile set, and they're always adding new things.

Nightmare mode IS a new mechanic. New dojo rooms have been mentioned, watch the livestreams, yea? We just got a new obstacle course room.

Skins and models aren't very important to me, but there's the clan emblems and the dangly bit helmets and more stuff to come they said.

Making brand new features takes time. And a lot of people. Adding a new sword takes much less time and people who WOULD NOT, either way, be working on the new features.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Gregio

[Nirb]

I hope so, I was really hoping that this would be in update 9 but.. that never really happened the way i expected it to.

 

Such as turning it into a tutorial

 

I wish they turned it into a new rescue mission and replaced Tolstoj with and made the revived Vor a nightmare boss or something.

[BIossome]

I'll be expecting everything but new voice acting.

[Nirb]

Things they've talked about, specially regarding weapon updates.

There's one team working on weapon and models. This team works on weapons. The team that makes maps is different. The team that makes sounds gets screwed by everyone else.

They are introducing a new big tile set, and they're always adding new things.

Nightmare mode IS a new mechanic. New dojo rooms have been mentioned, watch the livestreams, yea? We just got a new obstacle course room.

 

So far with a lack of turning off Nightmare mode it is a detrimental mechanic for people trying to farm or pass through planet systems

[Cpl_Facehugger]

I'll be expecting everything but new voice acting.

I'd expect that even. Witness how Lech Kril got his voice redone in U8 and Vor did in U9. Slowly but surely, DE's polishing the game.

So far with a lack of turning off Nightmare mode it is a detrimental mechanic for people trying to farm or pass through planet systems

Nightmare mode only turns on for people who've completed all nodes in a given system. As for farming, well, people complained about how the game was farmframe, yes? :p

Edited July 20, 2013 by Cpl_Facehugger

[Gregio]

Also, 2 tilesets? What the F doe.

We have 4 tile sets. Corpus Ships. Corpus outposts. Grineer asteroid bases. Grineer galeons. There are two faction structure-types plus infested "reskins". Plus the Orokin void. And the Dojo stuff.

In fact, just about the only thing I approve of in  your post is Warframe Characterization.

They have mentioned the Warframes are the "characters" of the game, much like the Medic in TF2 or Zoey in L4D.
Yet with the way we can have all warframes, people think of them as mere armors. There needs to be mechanics and stories in place so people think of them as characters, you can still play them your way, but give the "canon" frames a personality, for example. They already sort of have one from their descriptions, make it more visual and more constructed.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Gregio

[Nirb]

Personally I'm hoping for a Sentinel ship tile set and more outdoor areas, maybe biospheres to integrate forests and the like

[Nirb]

I'd expect that even. Witness how Lech Kril got his voice redone in U8 and Vor did in U9. Slowly but surely, DE's polishing the game.

Nightmare mode only turns on for people who've completed all nodes in a given system. As for farming, well, people complained about how the game was farmframe, yes? :p

 

It makes it worse with an added degree of challenge, but yes its better to lessen the effect of farming you are right in that regard

 

Also I think its a bit too slow, however the game is still in its infancy so i'm prepared to wait.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Nirb

[Ganpot]

Rather than making random levels with two different tile sets and a infestation skin for both how about

 

- Introducing new factions or variants of/sub factions

- New tiles sets

- New voice acting

- More skins and models 

- New mechanics (e.g. The soon to be (possibly) added grappling hook)

[- MORE BUG FIXES]

 

This would take the place of the typical updates of

- New weapon(s)

- New warframe(s)

- New dojo rooms

- Miscellaneous features

- More Animations

- Warframe balancing

 

I'm not sure how to put this.... DE has been doing everything you've just listed.  There are way more than 2 tile sets (there's Corpus ships, Grineer ships, the Dojo, Corpus outposts, Orokin towers, and more).  DE has also stated they are working on a new faction (and have been for some time).  Voice acting is added every major patch (if not more).  And a new batch of skins (alternate helms) was just released with Update 9.  Last but not least, several key members of the dev team are currently working on the stamina and melee systems.  Quite frankly, I'm amazed at the amount of content this company is consistently putting out. 

 

The only thing DE is not doing well is polish.  Ironically, you are asking for more and less polish at the same time (more polish, but less balancing).  Unfortunately, the developers do not seem to have any intention of slowing down content updates for more quality assurance testing, which may very well lead to unhappy fans in the long run.  The game needs more balance testing, not less (2/3rds of all melee weapons are terrible, multiple warframes are underpowered or glitchy, etc.). 

Edited July 20, 2013 by Ganpot

[Nirb]

Also, 2 tilesets? What the F doe.

We have 4 tile sets. Corpus Ships. Corpus outposts. Grineer asteroid bases. Grineer galeons. There are two faction structure-types plus infested "reskins".

In fact, just about the only thing I approve of in  your post is Warframe Characterization.

They have mentioned the Warframes are the "characters" of the game, much like the Medic in TF2 or Zoey in L4D.

Yet with the way we can have all warframes, people think of them as mere armors. There needs to be mechanics and stories in place so people think of them as characters, you can still play them your way, but give the "canon" frames a personality, for example. They already sort of have one from their descriptions, make it more visual and more constructed.

 

I thought that was two tile sets, one Grineer and one Corpus, the other two you mentioned being extensions of that 

Sorry if I caused any confusion I mean a new faction such a Sentinel ships or Orokin warships (e.g. for Themisto) 

I'll edit that so it makes more sense

[Nirb]

I'm not sure how to put this.... DE has been doing everything you've just listed.  There are way more than 2 tile sets (there's Corpus ships, Grineer ships, the Dojo, Corpus outposts, Orokin towers, and more).  DE has also stated they are working on a new faction (and have been for some time).  Voice acting is added every major patch (if not more).  And a new batch of skins (alternate helms) was just released with Update 9.  Last but not least, several key members of the dev team are currently working on the stamina and melee systems.  Quite frankly, I'm amazed at the amount of content this company is consistently putting out. 

 

The only thing DE is not doing well is polish.  Ironically, you are asking for more and less polish at the same time (more polish, but less balancing).  Unfortunately, the developers do not seem to have any intention of slowing down content updates for more quality assurance testing, which may very well lead to unhappy fans in the long run.  The game needs more balance testing, not less (2/3rds of all melee weapons are terrible, multiple warframes are underpowered or glitchy, etc.). 

Yes, I altered it accordingly to comments

Edited July 20, 2013 by Nirb

[Gregio]

I'm not sure how to put this.... DE has been doing everything you've just listed.  There are way more than 2 tile sets (there's Corpus ships, Grineer ships, the Dojo, Corpus outposts, Orokin towers, and more).  DE has also stated they are working on a new faction (and have been for some time).  Voice acting is added every major patch (if not more).  And a new batch of skins (alternate helms) was just released with Update 9.  Last but not least, several key members of the dev team are currently working on the stamina and melee systems.  Quite frankly, I'm amazed at the amount of content this company is consistently putting out. 

 

The only thing DE is not doing well is polish.  Ironically, you are asking for more and less polish at the same time (more polish, but less balancing).  Unfortunately, the developers do not seem to have any intention of slowing down content updates for more quality assurance testing, which may very well lead to unhappy fans in the long run.  The game needs more balance testing, not less (2/3rds of all melee weapons are terrible, multiple warframes are underpowered or glitchy, etc.). 

You don't keep veteran players happy with only bugfixes though. If you don't flush out new content and balancing and fixes at the same time, you lose players. While I would like more, I think DE has been doing their best, and I'm not generally speaking unsatisfied. Quick fixes on Raptor and Vor, all the new prime stuff on the new modes, we're still researching stuff in our dojo.

[Itache]

perhaps you should watch their livestreams.....

[Shion963]

Things they've talked about, specially regarding weapon updates.

There's one team working on weapon and models. This team works on weapons. The team that makes maps is different. The team that makes sounds gets screwed by everyone else.

[...]

 

Making brand new features takes time. And a lot of people. Adding a new sword takes much less time and people who WOULD NOT, either way, be working on the new features.

 

Best answer about this I've seen.

 

Can I quote you the next time someone goes "DE y u maek new wepun n no work on stuuf" ;p

[Jovovich]

Streams.

[Ganpot]

You don't keep veteran players happy with only bugfixes though. If you don't flush out new content and balancing and fixes at the same time, you lose players. While I would like more, I think DE has been doing their best, and I'm not generally speaking unsatisfied. Quick fixes on Raptor and Vor, all the new prime stuff on the new modes, we're still researching stuff in our dojo.

 

That's true; players need a steady stream of new content.  But players also expect a stable, non-buggy, and balanced game.  Sure, sometimes their expectations are just too unrealistic.  But a lot of players won't put up with unpolished games.  Just look at Fallout New Vegas, Dead Island, or any other incredibly buggy game made recently.  There were a lot of public complaints (including lowered review scores), and that stopped a decent amount of people from trying them out. 

 

Even in beta, Warframe at least has the benefit of running smoothly (most of the time).  But there is still a lot of unbalanced content (mods, weapons, warframes, etc.), and each time DE adds new content without testing it first they have to spend the next several weeks fixing it.  It causes a lot of fan complaints and wasted work hours.  For example, DE had to re-work Rhino 3 times in the last couple of months because they kept going off of their gut reaction instead of gathering information and properly testing different approaches.  All it would probably take is to push back the release of major content for a week and set up a voluntary testing program among fans to gather feedback before patches go live. 

 

That being said, I think Warframe is still a very good game, and is more or less headed in the right direction.  I certainly favor it over some other F2P games in beta, such as Firefall (I don't want to get into this too much, but adding item degradation and a noticeable power curve in a game about "horizontal progression" is a terrible idea.  Plus, the game usually implodes from lag issues). 

[Weird_Stealth]

As many others have pointed out.

 

Watch the live stream

 

De has more than one team working on different things, Modelers are most likely split up into two or more teams, based on what they're best at. Some are on map/tiles, and others are on Warframes, AIs, and Weapons. Now just as a major heads up, and shocker you may not realize, MODELERS CAN'T WORK ON BUG FIXING. Yes they can help fix some model based bugs, but any coding based bugs like most of the bugs/glitches, all they can do is look at it, and say "Yes, that's a bug, also not my job to fix it, but let me point this out to someone who's job is to fix it." 

 

There are a lot of things that you and many others have pointed out, and yes they know about them, and they're working on them, and believe it or not, but the updates aren't always what you stated. Yes, they try to add new warframes, new weapons, new dojo rooms, and other features, but they also add more, they added tiers to clans, they fixed the dojo pricing based off of tiers. I understand that not everyone cares let alone gives a rat's donkey, about anything clan related, but a very large number of those of us who are in clans, mostly those who are in small clans, cared.

 

they're working on a lot of things, they're trying to add story to the game, but some of this takes time, and/or they have planned for later updates.

[DAWGUNITALPHA]

You don't keep veteran players happy with only bugfixes though. If you don't flush out new content and balancing and fixes at the same time, you lose players. While I would like more, I think DE has been doing their best, and I'm not generally speaking unsatisfied. Quick fixes on Raptor and Vor, all the new prime stuff on the new modes, we're still researching stuff in our dojo.

Veteran players generally are less likely to pay more than an influx of new players. Its word of mouth that can make or break a new game, especially something that markets its self as a f2p game. Catering more to veteran players who aren't as likely to pay large amounts a second time will hurt the game as it drives new players and new wallets away. Just look at the recent changes in U8 and 9. The market changes drove many, many new players away and the upped difficulty has made the starting areas abysmal for any new players unable to get a group. Those who do go online most likely just get rushed through by over levelled players farming, which can kill interest in a game just as fast as anything else.

DE ignoring new players to cater to the older ones is probably going to come back to bite them in the &#!, especially with the up and coming PS4 launch.

[Gregio]

Veteran players generally are less likely to pay more than an influx of new players. Its word of mouth that can make or break a new game, especially something that markets its self as a f2p game. Catering more to veteran players who aren't as likely to pay large amounts a second time will hurt the game as it drives new players and new wallets away. Just look at the recent changes in U8 and 9. The market changes drove many, many new players away and the upped difficulty has made the starting areas abysmal for any new players unable to get a group. Those who do go online most likely just get rushed through by over levelled players farming, which can kill interest in a game just as fast as anything else.

DE ignoring new players to cater to the older ones is probably going to come back to bite them in the &#!, especially with the up and coming PS4 launch.

The new players haven't really seen much change though.

Nightmare mode won't affect any new players until they finish their first planet. Mercury's difficulty hasn't been upped otherwise, except for the Vor buff. And that their first boss encounter is a difficult one is a good thing. It'll require DE to improve the other bosses to match up to Vor. A boss should be a team effort as it is for new players in all levels. Not someone you go kill to get drops X, Y and Z.

I haven't really seen many new players driven off or anything. Once or twice, a new players stops by and says "DISRUPTORS ARE TOO OP, PLEASE NERF", or "I GOT SLASHED BY SOME GRINEER WARFRAME WHO FLICKERED LIGHTS", but mostly the community is helpful and if the player "lived" enough to come to the forums address their concerns, he'll probably make some friends, get a squad and keep playing.

[Oizen]

I want spaceship battles. An entire different playing style.

 

 

Would break up the monotony of this game.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Oizen

[Shion963]

I want spaceship battles. An entire different playing style.

 

 

Would break up the monotony of this game.

 

woo yeah vehicle sections in run-n-gun shooter games.

.

,

.

 

I hate those with a passion. >:I

(I'm looking at you, Binary Domain's jetski mission)

[Oizen]

woo yeah vehicle sections in run-n-gun shooter games.

.

,

.

 

I hate those with a passion. >:I

(I'm looking at you, Binary Domain's jetski mission)

Im talking more like star fox like missions.

 

:v It be neat customizing a ship and what not

[TunaMayo]

It's almost like you watched the livestream, listened to what they said they are currently working on, and then made this post suggesting that they should work on that.