Implementing A Lot Based Trading System.

[xenapan]

I know DE has already announced its coming in. This is my take on how a trading system "could" work.

 

I'd say do a lot based trading system for resources:

e.g. A lot of morphics is 1000 morphics.

-Players wanting to sell morphics then add their morphics to the lot up to the 1000 point.

-At which point when it hits 1000 units it gets sold.

-Everyone that contributed morphics to that lot will get then X/1000 of the bids to that lot. So if you put in 200 morphics you get 20% of what people bid on that lot. if it was 10000 credits you get 2000.

 

Buyers wanting to buy morphics will look at a morphics lot - and add their bid to it. When the lot is sold, each of the contributors gets a % of the lot based on how much they contributed.

 

continuing with the example above, the lot of 1000 morphics sold for 1000000. each morphics was then 1000 credits. Everyone who contributed less than 1000 morphics dont get one. Everyone else gets a morphics per 1000 credits spent, then the remainder (if any) gets given one each to the people at the top of the list with the remainder closest to 1000. So say I contributed 5500 I would get 5 and have a remainder of 500. if there was 2 morphics left in the lot after the initial distribution, and there were 2 people ahead of me with a remainder of 900 and 800, i wouldn't get a morphics (but they would). But if the people had 900 and 400, me and the person with 900 remainder would get one each.

 

This way bots have no way to influence the market. If they farm alot, all they do is drive prices down as they fill up that pool faster, less people will have time to bid on it. Similarly, they cannot force a lot to not sell, if people see the price on a lot is good, they will contribute which will get the pool to sell faster. Also the higher the demand, the higher the supply will be because people will have incentive to put more into the pool if people are offering alot. It also helps smooth out price curves as all bids are /X units.

 

 

This would work the same way with blueprints, mods, platinum (replacing credits as the bidding currency) etc. You would just have to adjust the lot sizes so everything happens in a reasonable amount of time.

Edited July 31, 2013 by xenapan

[whitejackale]

I am sorry for not coming up with a solid argument, but this sounds terrible.

[Chronodroid]

Your math dude:

 

 

 

continuing with the example above, the lot of 1000 morphics sold for 10000. each morphics was then 2000 credits. Everyone who contributed less than 2000 morphics dont get one. Everyone else gets a morphics per 2000 credits spent, then 

 

 

^reread that, at least 10-5 times. The result is 5 times. I assume you changed some words around.

 

What about the not whole numbers? Why should I get "rounded down" when anyone else gets "rounded up" values of a lot?

 

Simply don't implement this, it's tedious, you have to wait for others, it's exploitable, and there's no real "trade" if you have to "share" bits from a pool put together..

Edited July 30, 2013 by Chronodroid

[xenapan]

Your math dude:

 

^reread that, at least 10-5 times. The result is 5 times. I assume you changed some words around.

 

What about the not whole numbers? Why should I get "rounded down" when anyone else gets "rounded up" values of a lot?

 

Simply don't implement this, it's tedious, you have to wait for others, it's exploitable, and there's no real "trade" if you have to "share" bits from a pool put together..

those numbers were just cause i originally had 2 examples and i decided to only use 1 but i didn't fix the math. the theory is sound.

the rounding is based on contributions. if you dont want to be rounded down then dont contribute less than the average price. it stops people from getting something for bidding 1 credit or something similarly stupid on something that costs 1000.

it is "trade" because as long as you bid enough, you get a share. once it gets implemented, prices will slowly settle, you can ask around for how much item X goes for, and people will be able to tell you its price Y per share. then you can bid n*Y+/-? and be practically assured that you will get N of item X. And it's design is so that no one can fill a whole pool itself (to avoid lots going for under market price) and that putting in alot of money early or late does not put you at a disadvantage because you know exactly how many items are in the pool. The only people losing out are those who totally under bid and its a totally fair system where everyone pays average market price for something. Its a communal trade. and at the single unit lot size its simply a buy order but as a whole the prices are much more stable and much less volatile

 

If you are going to say its exploitable, tell me HOW its exploitable? and the lot sizes can and will be adjusted so that common stuff closes in a max of a few hours while the rare stuff might take a day. you do realize THOUSANDS of people play this game right? A traditional auction system would never work well. it would encourage the general spam  of LTB LTB LTB on public channels, promote farm bots etc. not to mention the sheer volume of listings and transactions.

 

Tell me what can be exploited. There ARE no holes because its a group based trade.

Edited July 30, 2013 by xenapan

[xenapan]

I am sorry for not coming up with a solid argument, but this sounds terrible.

then come up with a better idea  that doesn't force DE servers to try and complete thousands of transactions, would avoid all the bot  spam of LTS LTS LTS, unstable economy from price spikes and drops, and cant be easily influenced by a single person.

 

my guess is you didn't understand the theory behind it therefore you think its a terrible idea.

[direcyphre]

then come up with a better idea  that doesn't force DE servers to try and complete thousands of transactions, would avoid all the bot  spam of LTS LTS LTS, unstable economy from price spikes and drops, and cant be easily influenced by a single person.

On the contrary, we currently aren't, therefore we need no alternative. Nothing is being forced and nothing is currently detailed how any future trading will work. The examples you've provided thus far also only relate to resources and not mods or other commodities, of which would not trade in quantity.

[xenapan]

On the contrary, we currently aren't, therefore we need no alternative. Nothing is being forced and nothing is currently detailed how any future trading will work. The examples you've provided thus far also only relate to resources and not mods or other commodities, of which would not trade in quantity.

why not? it would work exactly the same way with parts, blueprints, mods etc. the lots would be scaled accordingly to a rough market demand / timeframe by estimation initially, then adjusted each day. For instance hell chamber. Initially a lot size of 10.  supposed to be estimated at 240 a day (1 lot per hour) but the game only sells 3 lots. (30 units total). then instead the game adjusts at the end of the day for the next day's lots to be smaller. 30/24 = 2 units per lot. then some lots will sell in 1 hour, some will sell in 2. I came up with this idea because DE has been taking a while trying to iron out details of how trading will work. I designed this system so as to address most of the issues I can see without knowing how they are planning to do it at all. maybe they will "borrow" some of my ideas to make their system work. or maybe it would help them fix some problems with the implementation. im just throwing it out there as an idea to solve generalized problems with existing auction houses.

 

it works with everything.

 

the best part is abstraction... people dont even need to know/understand any of this. you could just use the current market interface, put in a public market mods/blueprints panel. you simply click the mod/bp you are buying like you are now. but instead of being given a price , you are asked for a bid. at the end of the time the item shows up in your stuff. DE can entirely abstract away everything because of how it works and it would decrease the volume of individual listings etc. so using the original example or morphics. you would put 5000 into morphics (it would suggest a base price for you based on previous days) and it would tell you, you would probably get 5 units of morphics. you dont SEE any of the lots etc. all you see is you putting in a bid. similarly for the sellers, they see nothing more than the current payout per morphics. "do you want to sell 5 morphics for roughly 5000" say yes and its put into the lot. all people would see is the current average price. people wont know when it is going to sell (because it sells when it accumulates enough units for there to be a good average)

 

IF DE wanted players to see lots they could implement an extra UI for it, but they could choose to keep it as simple as putting in a page in the market with a separate set of panels  for selecting stuff and buying/selling.  I'm simply posting the mechanics of it but as far as players are concerned, they dont need to learn anything new (compared to the old-> new mod  system change) and it would be very interface light (less work for DE) and it would be very fair (double blind group trading) which makes it pretty impossible for bots to abuse. if bots constantly farm, the worst they could do is cut prices for everyone else. Best of all, DE can make cuts  by absorbing credits/platinum as they see fit so as to balance out the market. All those over bids/under bids (because players dont SEE that stuff) DE absorbs (in the case of platinum, as profit/operating fees/whatever) and if bots get too aggressive with the farming, DE can artificially inflate demand or put a price minimum on lots before they are sold. either way they can run it entirely free market or control it as much/little as they like.

Edited July 31, 2013 by xenapan