Loki...a Sad Frame?

[Ksenius]

So I've always loved playing as a loki; the manipulative gameplay makes it quite exciting.

But I never liked radial disarm...i mean, i can go invisible, deploy a decoy or switch teleport away! The last thing i need is to disarm my enemy...
Though it does prove useful in T3 defense, in combination with Bastille. 

 

However, right after update 9, there was perhaps a mix-up. Loki's radial disarm finally has damage. Me and my friends were excited to find this out while farming kappa; radial disarm kills certain enemies and selectively disarm some. While it doesn't kill all, it sure gets most of them. 

The damage may not be excellent, but having a bit of damage makes loki much more useful! Even if it's just 600 of damage. ( I didn't test the output, but with the focus mod it could kill grineers on kappa in one go)

But after a few hotfix, the damage is now gone:(
 

Anyone condone giving radial disarm damage back? Or does rendering damage along with disarming too OP? (dont think so..i mean look at nova) 

 

 

[PsychedelicSnake]

Loki is a trickster, not a damage dealer. So personally no. I think he shouldn't have damage dealing abilities.

[LalaLuck]

:|

No, I don't think Loki's radial disarm should deal damage. Loki is all about utility, he is not and never ever will be a room cleaner. If you want damage, I suggest your turn around and look elsewhere.

 

p.s. Please never ever ever ever compare Nova to Loki. They have different roles.

Edited July 31, 2013 by MiNDBREAKz

[Omegarick]

A trickster indeed, but damage added would satisfy a lot of people. Maybe having his decoy explode when killed or something like that. I actually didn't mind it when radial disarm was harming the infested a bit, I mean it did make sense.

Edited July 31, 2013 by Rickman108

[Ksenius]

Now we're all surrounding the conceptual idea.. that he is a trickster. But truth is most warframes have 'room cleaning' abilities, and in comparison, loki just seems a bit short. Im not asking for a complete AOE damage like that of a Rhino's, but i do second the way it was right after U9. that is, radial disarm doesn't kill all, but selectively. it doesn't completely empty out a room, but does deal a bit of a control towards the horde.

Did anyone else notice the damage addition after U9? 

[Ksenius]

A trickster indeed, but damage added would satisfy a lot of people. Maybe having his decoy explode when killed or something like that. I actually didn't mind it when radial disarm was harming the infested a bit, I mean it did make sense.

Agree, the blast of energy could be a bit more effective. 

[Agent_of_Change]

radial disarm already does damage to infested, it also strips any abilities from the mobs it hits (i.e. flying or the ability to shockwave)

[Kasamoto]

http://meta.filesmelt.com/downloader.php?file=lokiop.png

 

"I am not sad. They see me smiling"

[Feldgrep]

Maybe make it so the guns blow up, making it deal damage like before.

[Reithur]

+1 to Agent of Change.

 

I see people saying that Loki is not a room-cleaning damage dealer, but that's not quite accurate.  Loki deals more melee damage than any other frame.

 

Yes, most of his powers are "utility" powers and Radial Disarm doesn't pop a lot of instant damage per shot or deal damage over time like other frames.

Invisibility + Charged Melee attack w/ strong charge weapon with Reach, Killing Blow is room-cleaning ridiculous vs any faction.  Reflex Coil lets you attack more times per use of Invisibility, add the new combo mods (Focus Energy & Rending Strike) for even more damage that stacks with your existing mods.

This deals damage in the thousands.

 

Radial Disarm can be used to lure all those enemies into melee range.

Edited July 31, 2013 by Reithur

[xBrend]

Disarm should remove like 50% of everything it disarm's armor to make loki super useful in high wave defence when armor affects bullet type weapons like crazy.

[BigBadHunkyDaddy]

However, right after update 9, there was perhaps a mix-up. Loki's radial disarm finally has damage. Me and my friends were excited to find this out while farming kappa; radial disarm kills certain enemies and selectively disarm some. While it doesn't kill all, it sure gets most of them. 

The damage may not be excellent, but having a bit of damage makes loki much more useful! 

I didn't do "some" damage. It instantly killed Elite Lancers because they didn't have melee weapons. It was a bug.

 

And radial disarm does damage to infested, even instantly killing low level chargers

[Troublechutor]

This thread is in every forum now with a different name.

 

Radial disarm probably needs tweaking, but making into another nuke is boring/lazy design.  If you want nukes, go play literally any other frame.

 

Although...

Loki is a trickster, not a damage dealer. So personally no. I think he shouldn't have damage dealing abilities.

What could be a better trick. 

 

"SURPRISE!!! you're dead. "

[Desauron]

Loki IS damage, if used corectly. Go get some dual zorens (high crit rate, crit dmg and fast charge) heavyly moded + invisiblity (it gives a melee crit rate bonus and crit dmg bonus, you can do red crits with it) then you can clean rooms with loki. Get continuity + constitution, get invis and go melee, or reaper prime does the job well to with reach, you can stun lock and do constant crits and red crits.

But of course... only elite loki players know this, if you knowed this you would understand why we needed radial disarm, to disable that shield osprey, to disable heavy gunner (they wont stomp anymore, and go melee), to disable the napalm, scorch, bombard, fusion moa, shockwave moa, railgun moa. Disabling elite units SAVES ASSES, including yours.

If you already knowed this, this thread wouldnt exist anymore.... loki is for people with brain only, enough said.

[Aure7]

A trickster indeed, but damage added would satisfy a lot of people. Maybe having his decoy explode when killed or something like that. I actually didn't mind it when radial disarm was harming the infested a bit, I mean it did make sense.

exploding decoy actually is superb idea if they ever want to buff Loki. Personally I've picked excalibur as my first, but when I saw loki's abilities and even after having ash already, I decided to go for him ignoring many other powerful frames that i had blueprints for, such as frost prime or vauban.

[Keiiken]

I used to think I had no use for radial disarm. Then I started using it in combination with other abilities. Using radial disarm with maxed stretch it forces ranged enemies into melee range where Loki can shine with invisibility and a melee weapon that hits multiple enemies per swing. It even better when used with decoy since you don't even have to use movement speed or stamina mods to chase after enemies they come to you, just babysit the decoy and they are lambs to the slaughter. The only thing I fear now when I pay like this is the Toxic Ancients which I will simply move away from and shoot to me hearts content with the bullets I didn't use on any other enemy.

[Relkin]

I'd rather they improve his utility ability's more than just making another DPS frame; I want variety in playstyle beyond blow them up with antimatter, or burn them up with fire.  

[Kielix7]

So I've always loved playing as a loki; the manipulative gameplay makes it quite exciting.

But I never liked radial disarm...i mean, i can go invisible, deploy a decoy or switch teleport away! The last thing i need is to disarm my enemy...

 

Stopped reading there.

You have zero idea what you are talking about.

[Agent_of_Change]

I used to think I had no use for radial disarm. Then I started using it in combination with other abilities. Using radial disarm with maxed stretch it forces ranged enemies into melee range where Loki can shine with invisibility and a melee weapon that hits multiple enemies per swing. It even better when used with decoy since you don't even have to use movement speed or stamina mods to chase after enemies they come to you, just babysit the decoy and they are lambs to the slaughter. The only thing I fear now when I pay like this is the Toxic Ancients which I will simply move away from and shoot to me hearts content with the bullets I didn't use on any other enemy.

 

Loki + good use of powers + Gram or Hate modded for charge attacks = one of the best frames in the game.

 

Loki + poor understanding of powers = unnecessary requests for buffs 

[ASH_PRIME]

What about his woeful shields/health/armour?

He has some of if not THE best Melee potential in the game but he's so flimsy that he cant go toe to toe with a crawler let alone an ancient

Loki needs to borrow Ash's armoured arm guards for a weekend and deal some damage!

 

[W4RM4CHIN3]

Vauban has more utility then the "trickster" and deals S#&$ ton of damage...

[Chaosyn]

In my opinion Radial Disarm SHOULD do minor damage.

If you're holding a weapon and have it forcefully torn from your hands,it hurts....

Maybe not melee weapons but think of HOW you hold a firearm....having it ripped from your grasp would break fingers at the very least....

[Lumireaver]

If Radial Disarm needs a buff, it should inflict a slow, and maybe a defense/armor debuff. Like Mol.Prime.

[Reithur]

What about his woeful shields/health/armour?

He has some of if not THE best Melee potential in the game but he's so flimsy that he cant go toe to toe with a crawler let alone an ancient

Loki needs to borrow Ash's armoured arm guards for a weekend and deal some damage!

 

This is why you've got 3 abilities that distract/evade enemy attacks.

 

Also, his armour (50) is pretty decent compared to the majority of frames (10).

Edited July 31, 2013 by Reithur

[NeverNever]

Loki does not need direct damage. His skills just need a little bit more trickster.

Decoy should be invulnerable, but should only distract each individual enemy for a certain amount of time they spend attacking. (Aka, after 6 seconds they notice it's a hologram and stop attack it.)
 

Switch teleport should stun the target swapped, and apply a very short (2-4 seconds) "Chaos" like effect where he is targeted by other enemies as a enemy for a few seconds, to represent the confusion such a ability causes. Higher "class" enemies should probably shrug off the stun/taunt quicker.

Invisibility is fine.

Radial disarm just needs a longer range and that's about it. In both solo, and high level defenses it's a very valuable tool. Perhaps have it remove ancient healers/disrupters special abilities. (I didn't say toxic because I'm not sure that would make sense in my head, and because them already being easier to kill would probably trivialize the infested faction even more than they already are.)

I feel as a whole these would be far more effective. Decoy might even be a little op, as it would essentially function, with the right mods, as a 25 energy 9 second un-breakable stun, almost on par with bastille.

 

Perhaps even have a special interaction between switch teleport and decoy, where switch teleport makes decoy act like it's just been cast for the purpose of the taunt per individual enemy?

 

I just know some-ones going to say loki is useless in high level defense/tier 3 stuff. Go ahead and run Frost Vauban Nova/saryn and loki, and laugh as you stun lock, disable, and group up everything for the incoming nukes of doom.

 

Edited July 31, 2013 by NeverNever