[Suggestion] Weapon Feature Augmentation

[Ruriko]

As someone who spends far too much time reading through the forum, listening to everyone's various quips about this weapon or that weapon, I believe I have thought of a solution to a number of issues. This idea will probably sound strange and I am expecting a lot of people to outright reject this because of things currently in the game, but I ask that they hear me out. I apologize in advance for the impending wall-o-text.

 

I believe it is time to actually talk about augmenting existing weapons. I'm not talking about mods. Mods enhance the existing qualities of a weapon by adding extra features, such as increased zoom or extra damage. I'm talking about creating a system that alters the base properties of the weapon itself.

 

Base Properties of a weapon are pretty much fixed and nothing (presently) can alter them. These qualities include Recoil, Accuracy, Weapon Spread, and Bullet Flight Speed. They also could include the following: Magazine Size, Zoom, Fire Rate, and Multishot (Not as per the mod).

 

This system would involve players physically changing out internal components for enhanced versions. These enhanced versions are not straight upgrades and come at a cost, which comes in the form of a trade off effect. In effect, it allows players to customize weapons for flavor and design as much as they can go for maximum effectiveness.

 

For simplicity (and balance), this should take the form of four category of parts: Barrels, Chambers, Stocks, and Sights. These may not apply to all weapons (Example: A shotgun might substitute a choke for a chamber, the Supra/Dera might substitute an energy coil in place of the chamber).

 

Ideally, Feature Augmentation would play a double role: 1. It would allow players to customize the look of their weapon beyond simply applying a paint job. And 2. It would allow a player to drastically alter their arsenal to allow each weapon to have situational effectiveness if they prefer. As an added bonus, this would allow DE to address the issue of Unused Mods that players often ignore, such as increased zoom, as players can now alter this without giving up something they value more.  

 

As to how each of these augmentations would work, the following is simply a list of concepts:

 

Rifle/Pistol:

Longer Barrel: Increases accuracy, but reduces fire rate.

Shorter Barrel: Increases fire rare, but reduces accuracy

Vented Chamber: Reduces recoil, but decreases flight speed

Reinforced Stock: Reduces recoil, but decreases reload speed

Magnified Scope: Increases zoom, but reduces response speed (I.E: Increases the time it takes to fully zoom in/zoom out)

Laser Scope: Creates a laser targetting line while zoomed, but can be seen by enemies.

 

Energy Weapons:

Magnetic Coil: Increases flight speed, but reduces fire rate.

 

Shotgun:

Tactical Choke: Reduces weapon spread, but reduces fire rate.

Double Barrel: Applies 100% Multishot, but each shot cost double ammo

Sawed-Off Barrel: Increases bullet spread, but reduces bullet flight speed.

 

 

I don't really have any ideas for Melee weapons/bows currently, but you see where this is going. Note that unlike Mods, which can be enhanced over time, these have a singular effect that cannot be altered. These augmentations, like mods, are not permanent and can be removed at any time without being consumed.

 

What do you all think?

 

[WindKard]

Looks like a good starting point, and there'll surely be more types of alterations that could be added to the list as well (i.e. more scopes for instances)

[GIMO]

This has been suggested before (although not so well thought out) and I've never been too sure if this would be good for the game. It's true there are certain stats that are currently unaffected by mods, maybe that will change in the future or maybe not. Regardless, I feel like the reason why mods were introduced instead of this in the first place is because it's different from others. Many games use gun part customization, whereas I can't think of too many games using a mod system like Warframe. Also, this may lead to a lot of weapons simply being gotten rid of and balancing would either get harder (from multiple weapons having multiple parts) or just make it a big waste of time. I know there is balancing issues and there are a lot of not so worth wile guns, but the DE's are working on that. I love having a massive arsenal to choose from, and if we can change certain parts of a weapon to match the stats we need, it will take away from that. We won't need to make a choice between two weapons if we can simply change the stock or barrel to act like the other option.

Your point about unused mods and customization is fair, and I like that you included a trade off effect. I'm just not totally convinced on this.

edit: spelling/grammar >.>

Edited August 25, 2013 by GIMO

[Tyranthius]

I can go along with this. New scopes? How about I add a suggestion:

 

Thermal Scope: Eliminates need of flashlights in the dark, while zoomed.

 

Pros: I'm not completely sure, but I think an Infested reacted to the beam of my flashlight once. This would prevent that. And if that mechanic with the flashlight isn't in yet, we should get that as well.

Cons: Very confusing to see through a thermal scope. Essentially, with you being in a starship most of the time, the only things would discernible temperature readings are some machinery and enemies. We could also have the Corpus, being completely insulated in their hostile-environment suits, barely show up at all in the Thermal scope.

 

P.S. GIMO posted before I could finish this. His points are actually valid in some respects. Still, I don't see any weapon with a thermal scope just yet.

Edited August 26, 2013 by Tyranthius

[jpvi1207]

This has been suggested before (although not so well thought out) and I've never been too sure if this would be good for the game.  It's true there are certain stats that are currently unaffected by mods, maybe that will change in the future or maybe not.  Regardless, I feel like the reason why mods were introduced instead of this in the first place is because it's different from others.  Many games use gun part customization, whereas I can't think of too many games using a mod system like Warframe.  Also, this may lead to a lot of weapons simply being gotten rid of and balancing would either get harder (from multiple weapons having multiple parts) or just make it a big waste of time.  I know there is balancing issues and there are a lot of not so worth wile guns, but the DE's are working on that.  I love having a massive arsenal to choose from, and if we can change certain parts of a weapon to match the stats we need, it will take away from that.  We won't need to make a choice between two weapons if we can simply change the stock or barrel to act like the other option.

 

You're point about unused mods and customization is fair, I like that you included a trade off effect.  I'm just not totally convinced on this.

not necesarily making it act like the other, more like an aproach

example

bigger ammo capacity per cartridge/ slower fire rate and a harder kick from the gun

[Tyranthius]

Missed the point, sir. If you change ammo capacity and recoil, you make it act like the gun. Increased fire-rate on the Braton= Grakata. Why would anyone make Grakatas if they could just shorten a Braton's barrel?

[Ruriko]

I probably should have clarified this before, but this system I'm suggesting is not about apply massive upgrades to a weapon. Each component would only provide a slight improvement to the base stats of the weapon with the only one that wouldn't be a massive one being the "Double Barrel" suggestion, since 100% Multishot for Double Ammo Consumption isn't really low-tier. Scopes, on the other hand, don't really have any majorness to them, though I suppose they could come in tiers.

 

Those things aside, I pictured something akin to a 5 to 2.5 ratio for the components. Example: Applying a shorter barrel to the Braton would increase its fire rate by 10% to 12.375, while reducing the weapon's accuracy by 5% to 27.15. These changes do NOT make it a copy/clone of the Grakata, who has a base fire rate of 20 with an accuracy of 28.6 (Which also happens to be the same base accuracy rating for the Braton).

 

Even if the bonus was much higher, say 20% and 10% respectively, The Braton's 11.25 Fire Rate becomes 13.5 with an Accuracy of 25.74 accuracy, still vastly lower than the Grakata.

 

The Grakata is a weapon with a different build in mind than the Braton, most telling due to the fact that (as of this post), the Grakata has 7.5% Crit Rate vs the Braton's 2.5%. They're not really a fair comparison for one another.

[Ruriko]

As an off note, I definitely see where you're coming from, GIMO. I guess I view mods differently. I look at mods and I see them changing how my weapon works by adding effects (Extra Damage, Puncture, Exploding Ammo in the case of Bows. Something that otherwise can't readily happen). I am only aiming as slightly modifying some of the base stats outside of these mods and give people a reason to consider things that they might otherwise not consider with their mods.

 

I'm just someone who likes having many different options at my fingertips. Besides, it would be a great excuse to allow people to customize more than just the color of their weapon.

[Arlayn]

This could be like the holo badges the Warframes equip. Similar in function to the basic camo pattern on Grineer weapons as well (its not desert camo its just basic camo pattern)

 

In this manner when you open up colors you see the parts you have taken the time to build from BPs earned through gameplay. These pieces similar to Warframe heads, and some skins for weapons will have stat bonuses, with physical appearance changes. Does this sound like the same idea, but actually making a place for the things you want?

[JamesMcJam]

all very good ideas, perfectly balanced

[Ruriko]

Arlayn,

 

That could very well be a working means to incorporate this idea through a medium we already have. It could have the same kind of defined limitations that changing the heads for the frames or skins of a weapon already does (Can't use more than 1 Holo-Badge, for example), but shouldn't be so limited that you're forced to decide between a different choke AND a different barrel for your shotgun.

 

Could be a fun way to incorporate it, though. +1 for an awesome suggestion.

[Arlayn]

Arlayn,

 

That could very well be a working means to incorporate this idea through a medium we already have. It could have the same kind of defined limitations that changing the heads for the frames or skins of a weapon already does (Can't use more than 1 Holo-Badge, for example), but shouldn't be so limited that you're forced to decide between a different choke AND a different barrel for your shotgun.

 

Could be a fun way to incorporate it, though. +1 for an awesome suggestion.

I can use two holo badges actually... I have the clan badge, and event badge one on each shoulder.

[Ruriko]

Ah... Sadly, I do not have a clan badge, just the two from the last few events. The game won't let me use both at once. Sadness...

[Arlayn]

Ah... Sadly, I do not have a clan badge, just the two from the last few events. The game won't let me use both at once. Sadness...

at least you know theres no limits to how far we can customize a Tenno... First helmets, now badges on both shoulders plus the announcement of scarves... if we can do crazy amounts of customizations on a Tenno we can go crazy on a Weapon...

customizations similar to this?

 someday it would be awesome if they added different scopes to each weapon, someday a laser pointer... someday tools to increase accuracy, someday something to reduce recoil... all the while making your gun look awesome... (btw that's a glock...)

Edited August 27, 2013 by Arlayn

[Rengakun]

Magnified Scope: Increases zoom, but reduces response speed (I.E: Increases the time it takes to fully zoom in/zoom out)

Laser Scope: Creates a laser targetting line while zoomed, but can be seen by enemies.

My vision is augmented.

 

 

I had to make that joke simply because you typed augmentation.

 

 

 

On topic:

 

 

Double Barrel should be replaced with a burst shot system which will fire 2 shots with one pull of the trigger instead.

 

We need Explosive Bullets.

 

 

Hmm...If weapons have heat, we could use heat dissipation mods or something! https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/95098-heat-a-balancing-solution-for-some-weapons-or-maybe-a-solution-to-make-weapons-more-fun/

[Karma_Ghost]

 

Rifle/Pistol:

Laser Scope: Creates a laser targetting line while zoomed, but can be seen by enemies

Laser seems meaningless considering the reticle is always zeroed. Also, considering all enemies outside of duels are computer controlled, it doesn't make any difference whether or not they can see the laser.

 

Missed the point, sir. If you change ammo capacity and recoil, you make it act like the gun. Increased fire-rate on the Braton= Grakata. Why would anyone make Grakatas if they could just shorten a Braton's barrel?

Crit.

[Tyranthius]

Makes a great difference, if you're using a Stealth approach. I agree with you on the reticle, though. And thank you very much about the Grakatas, I was simply trying to illustrate GIMO's comment.

 

Edit: Realized that the laser sights would reveal what you would actually hit, as the reticle doesn't always hit center, even with 100 accuracy, especially if partially behind cover. It is also sometimes difficult to ascertain which target would be hit in a crowd, and this might curb this problem somewhat.

Edited August 27, 2013 by Tyranthius

[Ruriko]

A friend of mine raised a good point regarding this subject. He pointed out the concern with making these mods "All Inclusive", as in it will work on all different types of makes within the same category. He's right. That wouldn't make any sense.

 

Therefore, should this idea be considered, it would be in the best interest of DE to restrict these not just by weapon category, but by Faction-type.

 

Example:

 

Tenno - Rifle

Tenno - Shotgun

Tenno - Pistol

Corpus - Ridle

Corpus - Shotgun

Corpus - Pistol

Grineer - Rifle

Grineer - Shotgun

Grineer - Pistol

Infested - Rifle

Infested - Pistol

 

Thoughts?

[Karma_Ghost]

I think restriction by weapon origin is unnecessary. Logically, some parts are easily modified and could apply to many different models regardless of origin. Stocks and sights in particular only need their mounts to be switched. On the other hand, parts like barrels, magazines, and bolts would vary widely even within the same class and make. With the exception of shotguns, primaries and secondaries have many weapons that would, by design, negate the possibility of interchangeable parts.

 

Examples:

[Minor case] A barrel used on Braton is more likely does not share the same bore and chamber dimensions as Latron. 

[Mild case]  Twin gremlins most likely do not share the same dimensions or operation as Kraken.

[Major cases] Clan weapons, bows, and throwing weapons.

Edited August 28, 2013 by Karma_Ghost