Jump to content

VermilionBoulder

PC Member
 View Profile  See their activity

  • Posts

    405

  • Joined

  • Last visited

 Content Type 

Posts posted by VermilionBoulder

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted · Edited by Redstoneman

    Now let's not discuss numbers yet, this is just an idea so far. The biggest problem with this is the fact that nothing prevents tank frames that get both high HP and shields to just stack this for even more tankiness. This indeed would pose a problem I'm not sure how to solve, apart from universal stat tweak.

     

    EDIT: Now I realize that this would make shields superior as dodge would scale infinitely while armor+HP gets worse results as enemies scale in levels. Thoguh this is mostly the same problem the rest of the game suffers from... yet again... scaling. Well, at least remove the RNG bleed proc for now... please?

    Regarding the first point, I think that the shield recharge delay OR rate could scale with base shield value for some warframes. For example, Loki would have to wait longer than Excalibur to get his shields back up, but Excalibur would have to wait longer than Mag to do that.

     

    Loki already has the ability to stay invisible almost all the time. Zephyr... That's kind of another thing. She has both high HP and Shields, meaning that she would have to get a personal nerf to shield recharge rate and/or delay. She can already mitigate a good portion of all ranged damage.

     

     

    Now for the second point... I don't really see the problem. I doubt that evasion, if implemented, would make us able to evade 100% damage. On a normal 35-40 wave run of T4 Defence, it may give warframes that rely on their shields an edge, but that kinda is the point. They would still have to seek cover from time to time, while most armor/HP-reliant warframes already have viable means of damage reduction.

     

    EDIT: We've never had proper scaling. Adding more and more damage and health to enemies was never a good solution. It's just numbers, to win you just need a team with the right combination of CC spam, restoration and spewing damage all over the place (I'm looking at you, Escalation TA).

    A good scaling would be increasingly difficult AI, able to evade attacks, flank, move in formations, cover each other, weaponry becoming more varied, utility units, etc.

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted

    I would like to see the change and then see HOW it affects frames across the board. right now only speculation can be done. having said that I can imagine that some frames would become VERY tanky as a result

    IMO, If bleeding procs were to be nerfed (by preventing them from going through shields), shields should also receive some kind of nerf. After all, warframes like Rhino, Valkyr, Oberon and so on were specifically designed to be able to take a hit and still stand their ground. But doing so would at least allow shield-reliant warframes to take a hit, provided that they seeked cover just for a few seconds, to get their shields back up.

     

    Mag can restore her shields non-stop, but simply adding a 5-10 second cooldown to Shield Polarize would probably fix it. She would just be able to sit a top of an energy restore and spam Polarize non-stop to survive.

     

    I see no issues with Volt, as he relies on agility to avoid being hit, and is actually in need of a buff in general. No bleeding procs while shielded = dodging becomes more effective. However, I feel that he should suffer from a trait whenever sprinting or using Speed:

    1. Reduced shield recharge rate

    2. Reduced shield recharge delay

     

    All of the above would be calculated based on what speed he is moving at. Mobility is his weapon, so letting him recharge his shields faster even while under fire would be an OK way to buff him.

    However, rushing face-first into a mob of enemies would not be possible without full shields, as even with reduced restoration delay, being under constant fire would effectively prevent them from recharging.

    On the other hand, rushing through a level with enemies scattered here and there would mean he regenerates as much shield as he loses, enforcing his role as a speed buffer.

     

    Whatcha think? Is that overthinking or a more-or-less good idea?

     

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted

    Armor+HP should be about damage reduction and HP recovery.

     

    Sheilds+agility should be about damage prevention. But shields are pretty bad at preventing damage and agility does nothing. Maybe we should get a dodge chance stat?

    Armor for Health, Evasion for Shields?

     

    I like this idea. It already exists in many games, and does its job pretty well...

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted · Edited by Redstoneman

    So, spam CC or die? Great fricken solution. I love it when my playstyle revolves around pressing one butto- wait, isn't that exactly what DE says they have a problem with?

    ...It's hard to admit, but... this statement is true.

     

    We can categorise warframes like this:

     

    - Relying on armor: Rhino, Valkyr, Oberon, Chroma, (possibly) Frost

     

    - Relying on ability-based damage mitigation: Zephyr, Rhino, Valkyr, Trinity, Ash, Limbo, Mirage, Loki, Mesa, Saryn, Nyx, Hydroid, Frost

    - Relying on CC: Rhino, Mag, Mirage, Nova, Loki, Vauban, Excalibur, Hydroid, Banshee, (kinda) Ember, Nyx

     

     

    Make of that whatever you will.

    Also Volt belongs to none of these.

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted

    The issue at hand is that it makes absolutely no sense to be damaged by a cut (toxin I can understand, our shields are most likely permeable), whilst our shields are up, only to be killed because something managed to cut us without touching us through a force field. I'm also not sure what you are talking about with rejuvenation, as the bleed proc scales off weapon damage, while the aura at most can restore 12 health per second if the entire team is using it. This means a bleed proc from a weapon of about 36 damage (as the proc is 35% according to the wiki) will completely negate the aura, and from there you take more damage as enemies get higher in the levels. 

     

    The shields act as a way of risk and reward, if you run out of shields, then you should be able to be punished with slash procs, but being unable to avoid these procs at all is what is wrong with them.

    This guy gets it.

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted · Edited by Redstoneman

    The logic is play Oberon... or get friends who will c: *haii*

    Of course I do. "Erhmahgerd, remove procs! I can't go out and tank with squishy Warframes ;-;" I can say I also run into this problem. I counter it with Rejuvenation... And yes. I change the Auras to Ds sometimes just for that. Just ask my Ash. Works effectively, actually.

    Ultimately though, I am totally against this Thread. It removes God Mode from Frames like Nova and Loki, for example.

    Sooo... You're saying I should play Oberon and cast any other warframe aside, because it is poor at survival in present circumstances.

     

    D polarity on Warframes is loved, D polarity on weapons is hated. There's nothing unusual in giving warframes D polarities.

    Your post qualifies for the "Git gud scrub" category.

     

    Ash does not rely on shields. The problem this thread is about does not address Ash.

     

    "It removes God Mode from Frames like nova and Loki, for example."   ...Are you for real right now? Can you cast personal preferences aside and, for once, think about how the warframes you probably consider trash the ones that suffer the most in this game? Or are you entirely against balance and just want to see this game burn at the hands of Power Creep? I certainly do not want to see that happen.

     

     

    Actually enlighten me: How does removing procs that bypass shields remove what you described as "God mode" from Nova and Loki? I don't see your point.

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted · Edited by Redstoneman

    Ahh, BUT studies ALSO show that 23 out of 23 Warframes are affected by this ability, whereas your Iron Skin thing is only personal. I could have mentioned Nyx's Absorb, but thought it would be better to name a Frame that ANYONE can benefit from.

    Where is the logic in that? You do not always play with an oberon beside you to keep clearing procs off of you.

    Also, do you even get the point of this thread? I'm addressing the viability of shields. Means of removing procs are only possessed by certain warframes, further worsening the situation of a good part of all warframes: Having no way to stop those procs on their own.

    New Pvp Is So Broken

    in General

    Posted

    You do not have to charge face-first into someone spamming their kogake. Also by doing that, they are pretty vulnerable to ranged attacks.

     

    Rhino's charge is pretty easy to jump over or just dodge. Do a sommersault as soon as you hear them preparing the charge, there is a reason for that 0.25s delay between a Rhino pressing 1 and actually starting to move.

     

    No opinion on the new frame yet. It's a caster. How can there be no use of using his skills?

    Stop The Shield Bypass! - Shield Viability Vs. Bleeding

    in General

    Posted · Edited by Redstoneman

    Addressing the Year of Quality: Why is there so much shield bypassing damage in warframe?

    Warframes that rely on their shields are often rendered useless when facing threats such as the recently added Manic grineer. A bleed proc is the bane of existance for every warframe that has low armor and/or health. This game has gone so far it practically punishes you for relying on shields.

     

    Go face a level 30 Seeker. Got armor? No problem. (Sorry for the confusion, I realised armor has nothing to do with bleeding procs. The problem still stands, though.) Got literally any damage migitation ability? No problem.

     

    Oops, your armor is 65 or less and you're bleeding? Welp, better wrap your things up and say goodbye to endgame with this frame.

    ________________________

     

    Out of all 13 damage types we currently have, three or four of them have the ability to directly damage one's health. Why is it that way? If this is not intended to change, why is there no way to stop damage over time? (Don't even start on Iron Skin)

     

    When Damage 2.0 was introduced, blocking would stop bleed procs from damaging your health, instead just draining stamina. While this was unrealistic and possibly even a bug, this was a fairly good mechanic that made it possible to survive bleeding procs. It was later on removed, and if you're not quick enough to drop a health restore down, bleeding is often a death sequence, as there is no way around it.

    ________________________

     

    Another problem is the viability of shields.
    Fixing it would be very simple - some of the ways this could be fixed are:

    - Preventing any procs that directly damage health over time from occuring when the target (or Tenno) has even 1 point of shields on them. If this was applied to both Warframes and enemies, basically only the Corpus would benefit from it, as they suffer the same problem we do: shields just do not matter.

     

    - Disabling shield bypass entirely, like it was done in Conclave (Which was a very good idea, IMO, as it gave warframes like Volt and Mag a chance at not dying from one lucky proc).

     

    - Bringing back the ability to block bleeding damage by blocking with melee, which sadly would not be much of a solution for non-melee oriented builds.

     

    - [As LocoWithGun suggested] While the warframe is shielded, its shields grant damage evasion, presumably coupled with preventing bleeding from going through them. This would no longer apply after shields were depleted.

    _______________________

     

    Please consider what I described, Digital Extremes. Anyone interested: voice your opinion below.

    Damage 2.0 prevents a good portion of warframes from entering end-game, and this was going on for long enough.

     

    Edit reason: +2 possible shield viability solutions, ironing out minor mistakes. Made the text slightly easier to look through.

    March 13Th: Community Hot Topics!

    in Blog

    Posted

    Sniper rifles need to be made more reliable - Either by making them able to reach high above 100% crit chance, or buffing their damage severely at the cost of crits. You expect a sniper rifle to 1-shot targets, even the heavily-armored ones. Rifles unable to do so are simply not good enough, desperatedly needing a buff.

     

    Some sniper rifles also need their Zoom lowered - Vectis's zoom is perfect as it is, complimenting quick mid-range shots, but still manages to give you an edge at a distance. Other sniper rifles suffer from forcing their users to shoot from the hip at close range.

     

    Both of these points generally make sniper rifles inferior to bows - We very rarely need any long-range weapons. That being said, bows, while unable to scope in and having projectiles with travel time, simply outdamage sniper rifles.

     

    Ammo is fine as it is, though.

×
×
  • Create New...