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m0b1us1

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  1. Never claimed the OP said that Inaros should get buffed before others. What I did point out that with the example he gave, there are far more frames that struggle far more. So I was questioning his reasoning as it seems most people here have a flawed idea of Inaros and his capabilities. Pre-rework wukong was immortal, however his issue wasn't with his bulk. His issues were with the rest of his kit. They ended up making him less tanky. Chroma still is far less tanky and damaging than he once was. These are not his issues, his issues are that his 1, 4, and passive are incredibly underwhelming or simply completely ignored. That's my point though, its your opinion. What the OP is trying to argue, at least when talking to me, is that his "EHP" is low. In that regard, I do not find that a flaw. What you call uninteractive is not a product of Inaros, its a product of the meta. That is CC has no real place anymore. I do not find Inaros to be purely uninteractive for that reason. When the situation calls for CC, I find that Inaros's skills are quite potent. Even his 3, which I will admit it costs too much for this current meta, has interactions with his 4 that drastically increase he area of control. Half the kit not being used is something I agree with and that is a concrete example of a flaw, unlike just saying "his ehp is low compared to other tanks". However half his kit not being used is not a flaw of the ability itself, its a flaw of the meta and some QoL issues. The meta revolves around kills per second. So you hit a group of enemies with your 4, and they die in 2 seconds because that is what everyone else is doing. Is that because the skill is bad? Not at all, rather its because other players are more focused on kills than requiring healing. Most players don't even know the difference between a target affected by 2 or 4. Nor do they have any other indication what they can do to a target affected by 2. So if an Inaros uses 2 on an enemy behind a wall, how does a player on the other side know? That issue is a transparency issue that can easily be fixed. My suggestion is that what Inaros needs is not improvements and minor reworks. What he needs is some QoL changes to make his kit more transparent to his team and his abilities better explained. The kit itself simply does not fit in a kills/second rules all meta and should not be changed because of that. If the meta was more centered around CCing large groups of enemies, would Inaros still be considered flawed? I don't think so at all.
  2. That is untrue about Inaros. Just tested it myself. Well at least my Inaros tanked a lot more, technically he could have tanked infinite depending on arcane grace. Even without arcane grace, it took 7 hits from a level 165 nullifier (10 hits from a corrupted oddly) starting at 0% adaptation all without grace. 6 shots with 0 arcanes. Do note I use a rank 4 adaptation as Inaros and any other tank do not require a full one. Where do you get that Inaros can only tank 4 shots with 90%? Note, Trinity 4 only provides 75% DR max, where as Gara sits at 90% DR, so also curious how you are managing to get more EHP on trin than gara. Are you using an old online EHP calc? Are you sure you are not using the old bless values for that calculation? My tank trin can't even tank half the number of shots that my inaros can in the same situation. Though it is an old raiding Trin that has been collecting dust. You are missing my point, at some point EHP is quite literally worthless. I never said Inaros was the tankiest, that easily goes to Nidus and it has nothing to do with his EHP but everything about his easily renewed death gates. However what makes Inaros unique is that his bulk in not reliant on any abilities. All those other frames you mentioned, the moment they have 1 ability blocked whether by nullifier bubble, disruption, running out of energy, falling into a pit, or even just forgetting to recast, they are insanely squishy. Inaros? He has enough regen and naturally high EHP to be perfectly fine standing in a bubble. Your previous statement claimed that you wanted to make him better at all levels, but if the only example you can give is against level 800 enemies, then I don't think that holds true. I don't think you have played Inaros enough or have a strong understanding. Even more so if your Inaros can only tank 4 level 165 nullifier shots. I'm still trying to find a case where I get 4 shotted by a level 165 nullifier and the only way I can find is by removing arcane grace and guardian and other mods. My inaros doesn't even use quick thinking either. Here is what you haven't considered, and this is something a lot of people never consider in tons of games. At what point exactly does a difference become the deciding factor? Inaros's bulk and high regen alone, no skills absolutely necessary mind you, allow me to casually outlast everyone except a nidus clanmate that I play with all the time. If the EHP difference is only apparently at level 800, then I don't think that should be a focus of your changes. You are free to add me so we can compare builds. I want to know how I can tank twice as much as you claimed even starting from a worse position.
  3. Usually for that I prefer 1 energize and trickery. Once you start hitting those levels then the 25% heal on finishers really has no value as the damage per shot is too high. While it is an OK passive, its worth nothing for endurance runs where tanking damage simply isn't an option. If you didn't rely on it, and you did go to that level, then you must realize that its worthless in your case right? Remember, at those points, you have to rely on either invisibility or death gates. The single best warframe for long term survival like that is Ivara. 1 ability, CL, and 2 sets of arcane energize and you are good to go for however long you wish. Or you just ran naramon focus school, threw on a crit melee and went to town before it was changed. Either way you had to avoid damage at a certain point if you were going solo. See thats the issue, his EHP before adaptation was amazing, and after it still is. Only Chroma back when vex armor and ice element could reach such high EHPs or Trin with 99% DR. I think using eternal prowl Ivara is incredibly lame, but I am not going to use my purely subjective opinion to try to argue for an Ivara buff. She is a strong frame, Inaros is a strong frame. The likes or dislikes of an individual do not provide sufficient reason to call for a change. So why Inaros if that is your goal? Out of all the frames there are, Inaros has at least 1 way to go that far. How many frames can truly and reliably go that far into solo mot? The longest Nidus run I have seen was about 7 hours. Did you know what good his EHP did? It was worthless. Every time he took damage from an enemy, it would instantly drain 15 stacks of his passive. At that point, enemy HP scaling is so absurd that the only reliable way he had to kill enemies was by using an octavia specter since they scale with enemy level. If you are saying that you are trying to balance Inaros because his method of survival in endurance runs in a damage boosted mot against level 800 enemies is boring to you, I find that incredibly short sighted. Why don't you try to balance Frost, Atlas, or Trin for that level? Sure, when trin could reach 99% DR she could reach extreme levels of EHP, but she can't now with 75% DR (about the same as having 900 armor) and she has no reliable way to quickly deal damage if you are running tank because HP scaling. Chroma ever since the vex armor nerf has a mere fraction of his old EHP and no way to prevent enemies from damaging him or stunning them. I don't buy your claim that you are trying to make him "better" at all levels. It seems to me you are trying to think of a scenario to justify your proposed changes. That is such an extreme that the vast majority of players will never even attempt to reach. If your goal is to fix frames for all level ranges, there are a ton of others who need far more help than Inaros. I will gladly admit there are many other frames who are stronger than Inaros at doing 8 hour runs, but a frame should be changed because of that alone! My point still stands, Inaros is one of the overall strongest frames in the game and needs no help. A simple straight up tank build can clear everything the star chart, sorties, and 3 hr arbitrations has to offer. If I understand you, you are wanting a change because there are frames that you find subjectively more fun than Inaros against level 800 mot enemies because you have to use a cheese build. Is that correct?
  4. It's not easy, but it can be good. It just requires a large amount of time invested before you can use it reliably. Any other frame, without the vazarin focus school, can't be revived instantly. And if you do go down, at a certain point some frames simply can't last that long without some form of defense. Also while the wiki might claim %HP, I think there might be more to it. Because I have managed a few times to revive despite not apparently hitting that %HP mark.For the most part you are right though. I think there just might be some weird spaghetti code there. I haven't done too much testing though as the only way I can reliable test it is by forcing myself in a down state with something like a rivend zarr against a bunch of level 165 corrupted gunners (not corpus techs because I try to test on armored targets). My guess is that it also has an EHP mark it looks to hit, though I haven't really been able to determine that or not. Also a frame that doesn't have a fear of going down until level 300+ is far more effective than a downed frame at 200. Also a frame that a team can insta-revive from as far as they want without taking time to manually revive them is far more effective than one frame stuck using a secondary and another standing there reviving. See that is an incredibly entry way to play him. Also its not %life steal on finishers. You heal for 25% of your max HP whenever you get a finisher kill. So you have to get the kill. I haven't needed to use a finisher to regain HP anything below 200. This is because Inaros, with arcane grace, has an absurdly high EHP regen. I think the last time I ever purposefully used the finisher kill regen was when I was in a sortie survival mission with the fire condition, thus lowering max HP and regen. Now it just might be me, but usually when someone talks like that it usually means that they haven't really given him enough time. What was your build with Inaros to feel the need to have to use finishers to regen? Most Inaros mains don't rely on that because it takes too long. Even without arcane grace its much faster just to expend some of your 4 cause it heals starting on the very first proc.
  5. Actually his passive is quite strong, it just does a horrid job fully explaining it. His passive, while giving you a laser, is more about "marking" enemies. When you go down, all enemies within a 14m radius are "marked" by sand. This looks like the same effect as your 2, but does not CC, unless you mark and pull an enemy with the laser. If any marked target takes ANY sort of damage, it will count towards your revive. This also works with your 4 cc. So if you somehow manage to go down, your ally can simply deal a bit of damage and instantly revive you. Or you can shoot off your 4 right before you go down and the damage from that will also revive you. 3 is just too costly for what it does. Paired with your 4, it acts as a way to mass spread your 4 cc. Hit a group with 4, use 3 to scatter them all over. Now you have vastly increased the area of your 4. However it costs a ton of energy, 25 for 4 blast and 75 just to start 3. Also the meta right now is all about kps. So with a team, you almost will never be able to benefit from that combo. However in the past with raids like NMLoR where CC was king, I used this very combo to lock down huge areas for a solid minute at a time. Which in warframe time is quite long. I think you just want him to be more like a nidus. And let's not kid ourselves, nidus is amazing all around and imo the best overall wf. But that isn't inaros. Inaros is great not because of his damage or synergies in his kit, he is amazing because what he gives you the freedom to do. Want to use a "non-meta" melee or any weapon? Inaros gives you the ability to use it and not worry about much else. Nidus has to worry about stacks, wukong has to worry about his new defy, chroma has to worry about vex armor, ash/Loki need stealth, saryn needs spores, etc etc. A fully built Inaros with arcane graces and negation swarm? Nothing. He can solo any content in the game easy and is one of the few frames you can so multihour long survival with, though if you want to go for crazy long you have to use an odd build. I'm just saying this from experience, but inaros is far stronger than an average player would expect. Veteran players don't doubt his position as a top tier frame overall.
  6. Would it be possible to be able to sort relics/parts by if they are vaulted or not? I have been hoarding a lot of prime parts and it gets annoying looking back and trying to remember who was just recently vaulted.
  7. Says who? The last time I went down as inaros was in a 2 hr long arbitration where we outlasted a nidus and chroma. Even then I went down from somehow getting a slash proc through negation swarm and holding 4 revive orbs trying to save the nidus. Take it from someone who has played this game for years, inaros is easily in the top 3 frames overall. In the realm of tanking? Still top 2. Haven't really had the chance to put the reworked wukong through his paces yet though but initial thoughts have wukong trading bulk for power. Nidus can definitely be tankier than inaros. Who do you think is a better tank and tell us your builds. If this is your main account, at not even 2 months old, it would be interesting to see what you think.
  8. While Inaros is by far my most played and favorite frame, it is a horrible idea to buff one of the strongest frames in the game. He does not need any buffs, only QoL changes like making it easier for allies to know when a target is affected by 2 vs 4, and a timer for 4 CC instead of showing the armor buff in 2 locations.
  9. I don't see the issue here. The only difference between primes and not are small stats. Also, to do sorties I'm fairly certain you have to beat the war within. I have a hard time believing that it's common to go get that far and still not have a clue how to build a warframe. You could just solo everything. I do that all the time when it's spy missions.
  10. It would be nice for you guys to talk about the vast number of issues with melee 2.9999999 instead of sticking your heads in the sand hoping we forget about all the issues.
  11. Yeah no. He doesn't need a rework at all. He is one of the strongest overall warframes in the entire game. The only thing he needs is QoL changes such as... His 4 CC duration currently has no indicator of how much time is left, instead it shows the armor buff both in the top left of the screen and above the ability icon. Change one of them to show the CD duration. Maybe add some indicator to the healing aura as well so then players know when they are in range? His 2 and 4 cc are extremely similar in terms of looks. Make it more apparent that an ally can eat a target afflicted by his 2. His 3, it actually is useful, but not enough to justify the cost. You can hit a group of enemies with your 4, tap 3, and spread the enemies around leaving living mines that further spread your cc. However since cc in this game lost it's place to damage, it's incredibly rare you would ever want this. Doesn't help that just to cast it you need half your energy pool. His 2, ignore. His sand shadows suck and are not worth using at all. Make them scale with duration and make it so you don't have to kill them with 2 to turn them. Shouldn't be op as you rarely use 2 and even when you do it takes 25/150 energy. This is coming from an inaros main who has mained him for years. And I know the op might have multiple accounts, but this one at least has only been around since this month (july). So my advice to you op is to build a bit more experience before you suggest changes to frames. Inaros is obscenely strong when you get him fully built with arcanes. He is also one of the few frames that can go solo for crazy hours if you use a CL and arcane trickery build.
  12. You miss the point. I said it was a solution, but how can there be a solution if there is no problem? Hence my original point stands that at higher levels with large numbers of enemies the cast time and losing pre existing stacks is an issue. So thank you for providing supporting evidence for my point.
  13. Thralls, quite literally, do not taunt. When I say taunt, I quite literally mean taunt as in guardian derision or atlas 4 augment. Taking a small number of enemies and enthralling 7 of them proves nothing as now you have far less enemies and far more targets to pick from. They do not taunt, merely provide more targets for the enemy to pick from. Still don't believe me? Go take a look at the wiki and tell me where it says thralls taunt.
  14. You are still missing the point. If there is a flaw big enough to warrant a specific playstyle, then it is infact a flaw. If you are claiming that "cast in air" is a solution, then it has to be a solution to a problem. Like I said before, in general gameplay you can usually recast it whenever. However in far longer gameplay like 3hr survival and more, you have to start using stealth or death gate mechanics. Also you will still run into this issue if you are facing a constantly leveling growing number of enemies. I don't think you have been in that kind of scenario yet. I'm talking far more than 40m arb.
  15. 1 is a soft cc and enemies can still shoot you. Thralls do not taunt. Nidus's passive gives him complete invincibility if he has at least 15 stacks and drops to 0 hp. He becomes completely invincible for a couple of seconds and can quickly and easily regain stacks at higher levels. So yes he has that as well on top of DR, innate hp regen, and the ability to cc with maggots.
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