I Wish To Express My Displeasure At The Need For Keys To Get Into The Orokin Derelects.

[YesIAmGod]

Not to mention the nekros bp is 100k, wtf...

[NoOneEverSaid]

Not hard at all.

[Tesseract_The_Pariah]

Thank you mod for moving this thread!

Also, after playing it for a bit, I can understand the value in this system in some ways, DE just needs to advertise it better.

[Madotsuki]

It's funny how easy you people compromise to these bad changes. Next thing you know, DE is going to think they did nothing wrong and all future content is going to be locked behind their own seperate key walls, or some other kind of grind-wall. Have fun doing more double-key grinds to play Alad V, while all of the old content never gets refreshed.

I don't even care about Nekros, slots told me he doesn't matter. All I want to do is face off against the new Golem one on one, for the challenge, for the FUN, and I'm not even allowed to do that without a double key grind, where the normal keys take an hour to craft each, and the boss key takes THREE SODDING HOURS OF DOING NOTHING to craft, so that I may fight the Golem ONCE. I don't know about the rest of you people, but I actually consider my time valuable, and this artificial double-key grind doesn't make me want to spend my time on it, not to mention DE practically LIED to everyone about it in the livestreams. "Oh we're re-working the Golem like we did with Kril and Vor." BOOM, two Golems, seems legit.

[Braken]

not to mention DE practically LIED to everyone about it in the livestreams. "Oh we're re-working the Golem like we did with Kril and Vor." BOOM, two Golems, seems legit.

I think this is the biggest issue right now.

 

Seriously, they led us to believe that it was a re-work of J3. They SAID it was a re-work of J3. But then they turn around and do this...

[EctoSage]

I agree with you completely.

 

I haven't been this offended with DE in a while.

 

I care not about Necro, but don't just rules lawyer me here. You said you were reworking Golem, not keeping the old one and hiding the new one past a grind wall.

That is one of the things that bothers me the most, is that they said so many times that they were re-doing the Golem boss, not making a new boss, that just happens to share the same name, & sticking it elsewhere. (An elsewhere that requires you to use Recruiting to find a group, & suck up mountains of your time just getting keys.)

[neKroMancer]

That is one of the things that bothers me the most, is that they said so many times that they were re-doing the Golem boss, not making a new boss, that just happens to share the same name, & sticking it elsewhere. (An elsewhere that requires you to use Recruiting to find a group, & suck up mountains of your time just getting keys.)

To be honest, it's pretty much clear that replacing J3 with J2000 wasn't possible unless they were going to push two bosses out at the same time. Where would Volt go?

Moreover, Jupiter is one of the starter system. Most of the players have access to it. All the way to the boss node. Golem will be killed for a millionth time within a few hours that way. And players will still complain about grinding and how short-lived the update is.

To be frank, the new key system takes roughly same amount of time to reach the golem and farm him for part. With equal 33% drop chance for each part, it's fair to say that he's one of the easier, less grindy frame to build. The only thing that make me cring a little is 3 hours crafting for assassination key.

[snark]

U10 is a befuddling design decision. Either maintain the existing Star Map or toss it.

More revealing, the pre-backlash gate costs were shockingly poorly thought out. One wonders how that could even happen in a professional development house. Mutagen can ONLY be obtained in the DERELICT tileset (drops were broken initially but are now fixed). The DERELICT tileset is resource gated. The Mutagen quantities needed for research are enormous. The initial gate fees were initially pretty much a monkey typing random numbers into a value field. I assume someone had to have thought up the double gated secondary track missions and tossed them in with an arbitrary grind tax at the last minute.

It barely even takes that much time to farm for the keys, i can't believe your complaining about such a small thing. I got all the Nekro parts in under 1 hour- so it proves that the farming is easy and De should've made it harder so you guys could rant more.

You are probably being silly. However, if you are being serious, hidden mutagen, double grind-gated boss content, fracturing more content off the star map system and lies to the community are reasons to question where Digital Extremes is going with this game.

Edited September 17, 2013 by BioSnark

[CosyPigeon]

It would be nice if I could be excited when a new update comes out, and be keen to go and play in the new areas, rather than disillusioned that I will have to grind through the same things I've already be grinding  my way through to get the barest licks of the sweet new maps. 

[HexCaliber]

It's funny how easy you people compromise to these bad changes. Next thing you know, DE is going to think they did nothing wrong and all future content is going to be locked behind their own seperate key walls, or some other kind of grind-wall. Have fun doing more double-key grinds to play Alad V, while all of the old content never gets refreshed.

 

THREE SODDING HOURS OF DOING NOTHING to craft, so that I may fight the Golem ONCE. I don't know about the rest of you people, but I actually consider my time valuable, and this artificial double-key grind doesn't make me want to spend my time on it, not to mention DE practically LIED to everyone about it in the livestreams. "Oh we're re-working the Golem like we did with Kril and Vor." BOOM, two Golems, seems legit.

DE are free to do with this game as they see fit, they can change their minds without warning as often as they like; you behave as if they owe you something, they do not. If DE slipped up anywhere with derelicts it was in not making more of them beyond a means to obtain keys.

 

DE did not take any money on the premise that the new golem would replace old, nor did they take money on the premise that the new tileset would replace Jupiter. Stop acting so butt hurt; in spite of all the drama this is not a major deal, it cost us nothing. Offer constructive criticism if you do not like something, but all this drama and S#&$e behaving as if DE owes you is childish nonsense.

 

Had the game launched like this, not one of you would have raised an eyebrow, you are getting uppity as it’s something a little different than you are used to, in another week you will be whining about something else. This game is under constant development, old mechanics will be changed or even removed while new mechanics are added, but it will happen on DE's timetable and by DE’s design, so you had better get used to it.

Edited September 17, 2013 by HexCaliber

[snark]

DE are free to do with this game as they see fit,[snip]

You're in the feedback section of the forums.

Edited September 17, 2013 by BioSnark

[Kyben]

Even with all these complaints, think of new players, or someone who just plays and doesn't look through patch notes and forums. If someone was to pick it up today, there is nothing that tells you what Nav Coordinates do, where you can buy keys, or even a hint that this derelict even exists. I had to look through the forums to figure out how to get there. DE created a nice solar system.. system, and for some reason they are trying to avoid using it.

 

Just some of the other things I don't like about the void and derelict:

* You can't host public games.

* You can't see what level the enemies are.

* Everyone is kicked from the group when the level is won.

* There are no alerts in these areas.

* Other things I forgot probably..

 

Why not just have these places have planets like everything else (or maybe a black hole for void, and a ship for derelict floating around the sun), and if your really set on using keys, blueprints and weirdness, have it so a message pops up that you can't start a level without a key.

[Creovex]

Oddly enough. I am perfectly fine with what they implemented.  You have really two simple options (hence remember F2P)....

 

A) Run the grind (which isn't really noticable as we have been conditioned for it)

 

or

B) Buy the Nekros with plat to eliminate this perceived annoyance.

[CloudPies]

Oddly enough. I am perfectly fine with what they implemented.  You have really two simple options (hence remember F2P)....

 

A) Run the grind (which isn't really noticable as we have been conditioned for it)

 

or

B) Buy the Nekros with plat to eliminate this perceived annoyance.

C) Watch the game die as you sip on whisky.

[NotBot]

-snip-

Significant Other: See you at lunch next Thursday!

-Thurday rolls around-

Significant Other: Sorry, executive design decision, seeing someone else now. Kthxbai.

 

Lying isn't cool, even if they aren't technically obligated to you.

[avinity8]

I read up to page 6. I think some people are over reacting a bit.

 

I understand the potential grindfest for the new hax frame, but give them time to adjust things.

 

I've done 3-4 runs of ODA and have 2 out the 3 BPs already. Who knows how long it will take me to get the last BP.But I don't see it as grindfest. Since the coords drop everywhere.

 

Most people are too lazy to break/open every container. I have to tell people to do it and/or go do myself and end up finding navs that people ran past.

 

There's a new mod for the sentinels that increases droprate, 40% when maxed out. This may help also with Nekro BP.

 

I agree the time for keys is ridiculous. I build one a day. They should have a queue system which allows us to build an item multiple times at the same time, as long as we have the materials for it.

 

This one item at a time is bs. I finally hit mastery 5 but have to wait 5 days to get the clan weapon i want because the injector fluid w/e and mutagen mass take like 12 hours to build. I work and have a life I can't play for hrs or come back in 12 hrs. So 1 a day. They should let us build as many as we can.

 

Getting the materials is easy. Building and waiting is lame. Grind is okay,maybe because my previous game i played was a grindfest, so i don't know how others feel exactly.

[r3dzer0]

They didnt make a mistake, they made a business choice. Its a fine one at that. They added longevity to the game. The only thing they need to do now is add the derelict levels to the plat purchases and they will be alot more set. This game gives players no reason to keep buying stuff from them once the end game has been reached. The derelicts could be something cheap, yet always in demand, thus always something to purchase. Other SUCCESSFUL f2p games have something people buy weekly if not daily to play the game happily. This game needs something like that.

 

I'll agree with you here, there is no mistake and it was an honest choice.  I will however disagree with you because longevity is not what they added.  they just added a large enough grind wall that new players have to go through in order to try out nekros. considering that after you've ran your 3+ runs on the golem, is there any reason besides your own desire to go back and fight him? in short the answer is no.  I think in order to make everyone happy, just release this as jupiters moon and call it good.  make unlocking it via nav points the first way to unlock it and then after you've unlocked all the missions you can fight golem to your hearts content, or run derelicts to your hearts content.

 

More than something for people to play the game happily through purchases we need something to keep us interested gameplay wise.  That would be something massive that would give great rewards at great risk.  Stuff that draws you in, consumes your thoughts on how you can overcome it.  at this moment in time, nothing but grinding is found to be rewarded.  its sad :(

[-Kittens-]

Sometimes I wonder if Steve just loves to make us all rage.

 

 

This is the interesting thing; making players actively rage does increase draw... for a time. Controversy does sell. The hidden caveat is players that become fatigued never come back, and most won't even bother with another product from the same company ever again, in addition to actively suggesting others should do the same.

 

DE is playing literal dice with their company's future, and not very smoothly.

[Zakalwe]

The new key set up is 100% fine.

A new player shouldn't be at the void yet. And when they've completed the main game they will have PLENTY of credits and nav points and mats to farm the keys they need.

Then they can just jump to the recruit channel or find a clan and share their keys to make the grind less.

This is a GOOD change. 

[Revel72]

The new key set up is 100% fine.

A new player shouldn't be at the void yet. And when they've completed the main game they will have PLENTY of credits and nav points and mats to farm the keys they need.

Then they can just jump to the recruit channel or find a clan and share their keys to make the grind less.

This is a GOOD change. 

 

Hmm.... Nope.

 

Btw. Does anybody else lose a giant amount of frames per second some times on the Derelict because I do a lot of it. Just seriously what's going on it?

 

I think the warframe designers and developers has already stepped too far on the big hole of greedyness and can't come back. So what do you guys think should we leave? Or should we give them one more chance to change everything so they would work. This grinding is bloody BORING. Just look at those @(*()$ clan weapons too.

[Lumireaver]

Please remove the second and third sentences from the original post. They damage credibility. 

 

Feedback on content behind keys: The concept is great. Each planet could have it's own hidden system. (IE: Mercury Navs could lead Tenno to "The last Formorian, and Neptune Navs could take us to "Alad V's Gas Planet Retreat." However, Inventing some new golem instead of giving us our upgraded J3 for some reason was cool.

[Zakalwe]

Hmm.... Nope.

 

Btw. Does anybody else lose a giant amount of frames per second some times on the Derelict because I do a lot of it. Just seriously what's going on it?

 

I think the warframe designers and developers has already stepped too far on the big hole of greedyness and can't come back. So what do you guys think should we leave? Or should we give them one more chance to change everything so they would work. This grinding is bloody BORING. Just look at those @(*()$ clan weapons too.

Sorry, but it is fine. 100% fine. Nekros is the easiest frame to farm in the game due to the abundance of derelict keys now floating around and the guaranteed drop rate.

Of course, a few people will have to do more than the average amount of runs due to rng, but the average I've seen so far is around 3-8 runs. And that's not bad, especially considering the content is more fun than most boss runs.

This is a step in the right direction. 

Edited September 17, 2013 by Zakalwe

[Madotsuki]

Sorry, but it is fine. 100% fine. Nekros is the easiest frame to farm in the game due to the abundance of derelict keys now floating around and the guaranteed drop rate.

Of course, a few people will have to do more than the average amount of runs due to rng, but the average I've seen so far is around 3-8 runs. And that's not bad, especially considering the content is more fun than most boss runs.

This is a step in the right direction.

Oh so adding more unnecessary grind to the game is the "right" direction. I suppose that means all future content should be locked behind double key grinds too. No wait, how about TRIPLE key grinds? Seriously, Alad V should require you to farm Corpus Void navs, which you use to craft keys that take one hour to craft each, and then you have to farm those for Gas Planet navs, which use even MORE mats/navs and take 3 hours to craft each, and then you have to farm the gas planet for Alad V's navs which take 6 hours to craft, so that you can fight him ONCE. And of course they should hide ALL the fieldron samples in the gas planet tileset and nowhere else, and release a bunch of corpus research weapons at the same time :D And of course Nef Anyo or the Hyena or any of the other Corpus bosses should never get changed! Instead we should have TWO COMPLETELY SEPERATE Hyena/Anyo/Raptor fights, with the new better one locked behind a seperate grind-wall! FRIGGIN' GENIUS!

[PeripheralVisionary]

I got over my initial mad.

Other than the fact that they lied to us.

[Zakalwe]

Oh so adding more unnecessary grind to the game is the "right" direction. I suppose that means all future content should be locked behind double key grinds too. No wait, how about TRIPLE key grinds? Seriously, Alad V should require you to farm Corpus Void navs, which you use to craft keys that take one hour to craft each, and then you have to farm those for Gas Planet navs, which use even MORE mats/navs and take 3 hours to craft each, and then you have to farm the gas planet for Alad V's navs which take 6 hours to craft, so that you can fight him ONCE. And of course they should hide ALL the fieldron samples in the gas planet tileset and nowhere else, and release a bunch of corpus research weapons at the same time :D And of course Nef Anyo or the Hyena or any of the other Corpus bosses should never get changed! Instead we should have TWO COMPLETELY SEPERATE Hyena/Anyo/Raptor fights, with the new better one locked behind a seperate grind-wall! FRIGGIN' GENIUS!

There is no more "unnecessary grind"

have you tried it yet? It's faster than acquiring any other frame in the game.

You need to look at the TIME it takes, not the amount of steps. 

All the amount of steps do is add variety to the grind, instead of running a single mission+boss over and over for days to weeks, you get to do the entire Golem set up in days.