Forma: Suggestions & Feedback

[TheSphynx]

Over the last few months, many Tenno have come to realize Forma are of paramount importance. From Polarizing weapons and warframes, to constructing dojo rooms and clan weapons. Some would argue that Forma are the most desired and long-sought items in the Star System. I myself have spent what feels like weeks in the depths of the corrupted void. Endlessly searching for that little golden puzzle piece.

Before update 10, obtaining forma felt like what a daily quest would be in any other MMORPG. I would go to the void, run about 3-10 Tier 2 Raids and walk away with a forma blueprint. From there, I would be all set for the day and ready to enjoy re-leveling my newly polarized weapon or helping friends with missions.

After update 10, obtaining forma felt like... well, it just felt impossible. A clan mate and I have burned through 100+ different types of void keys trying to pick up a forma blueprint. Never, in my warframe experience, have I ever felt so "required" to get an item. All of my time spent in game is dedicated to farming void keys and running void missions. All for a Forma. I have no time to help other (unless they really need it) and I have no time to actually enjoy the new different missions types. It's just running the same missions over and over again. /end whine

Update 10 came, bearing some cool new toys and an awesome warframe. To most of our surprise the new clan weapons were increased quite a bit in development time and resources. Most importantly, the amount of forma it took to craft a single weapon. Two forma for the secondary weapon and three forma for the primary weapon. Significantly increasing the importance and demand of Forma.

I had started a post with a few ideas and some of the results from the "Forma Journey". Unfortunately, I didn't get any response from DE. I figured I would just wait until the livestream and see if we would get some answers there. Luckily, there were a lot of posts on the livestream thread regarding the Void Rewards and Forma. Here was the conversation during the livestream:

Void Reward Table Issues
Rebecca: With update 10.0.4 we did some fixes for the Void Reward table issues. Forma was considered to be stealth nerfed out of there. Want to talk about dilution or what happened there?
Scott: I don't believe it stealth nerfed out there. We added more stuff so some of it did get diluted. The loot tables got a little scrambled up in order to balance out what was available in each mission type.

Forma were discussed again:
Rebecca: Someone saying "Discuss the Forma issue not dropping in the void".

Sheldon: It should be now
Rebecca: It was, it was just dilution.

According to Scott, there was no intentional nerf to the forma reward rate. It was all a matter of "dilution". Regardless, after watching the live stream, the same clanmate and I instantly dove right back into the void. Hoping and praying that said changes were in effect. Unfortunately, after running the void over 30 times, we have still come up empty handed. At this point, I really have no idea what to do. The Orokin Void Wiki claims the stats have been datamined and are "Pending Upload". I think the only option is to wait for locations and rates.

EDIT: The datamined tables have been released. They are still a little mixed up but seem to be accurate when compared to my 100+ Void runs. It appears there has indeed been some removals and lowered rates of forma in the reward tables. Forma Blueprints (according to this table) have been removed from Void Exterminates. It also appears the Forma Blueprint rates in ALL the void missions have been reduced to 1% or less. I believe the "Orokin General" tab in this spreadsheet is displaying the old pre-10 reward tables. These new findings further backup my post in regards to Forma NEEDING to have a more stable and consistent way of obtaining.

EDIT 2: DEMegan has claimed they "Messed Up" regarding the Forma reward rate. See her post here. There are a couple things about this that I find a bit ridiculous. For one, I have been posting for almost a week discussing there has been an issue with the Forma reward rate. Scott said straight to us during the livestream the rewards were not "ninja-nerfed". Not once, until the datamined tables were released, did anybody from DE acknowledge posts regarding the Forma issue. The other things that bothers me? The 100+ void keys I have spent since U10 trying to get a Forma Blueprint for the new Clan tech with 0 results.

EDIT 3: Sheldon has posted an apology thread. This thread discussed the "unintended" changes to the Void Reward tables and what DE plans on doing to change it. He also stated that the cost of the Clan Weapons will be reduced and the time spent to make them. Also, they will be giving each player 50 platinum.

From my last post, I have received a lot of feedback and great ideas on what DE can do to improve the current forma reward system. Here are a few different types of input I received. Give me your ideas and I will add it to the list! Take the poll, vote for your favorite.

   1. Forma Blueprints purchasable though the market for credits. Forma blueprints purchased with credit reset item rank. Forma purchased with platinum will not reset item rank.
   2. Forma Blueprints available through clan research. Almost 90% of the Clan items require a forma to build. Include research in the Oracle (currently an empty building). Replications costing 150k-250k credits.
   3. Survival time limit. Reach 60m in a Void or Derelict Survival mission and be rewarded with a forma.
   4. Remove Forma from all Clan construction (weapons and buildings). Replace with a new item "Augment" that can be researched from the Oracle.

   5. Stabilize rate in the Orokin Void. Add Forma to Derelict Rewards.

   6. Token System. Run X amount of Void/Derelict runs to get X amount of tokens. Tokens can then be spent on rewards.

I know a lot of people are going to say, "DE is a business, they need to make money!". I completely understand that. That is why we list other alternatives (Option 1). Also, they really need to retire all of the helmets. I would be completely fine with the removal of helmets from alerts and made them platinum only, if they came out with a stable forma system. Helmets are cosmetic. Forma are a huge necessity. If you make the only stable way to obtain them through platinum purchases, you are (I hate to say it) making the game pay to play.

You see, forma keeps players playing. Building your Clan Dojo, crafting new clan weapons, re-ranking those weapons after polarizing, testing new warframe builds. That all adds to game life. When you have to spend a week running the same missions to try to obtain a Forma, it slows the whole process down. People will get frustrated and leave because they are stuck doing the same thing over and over again with no results.

I sincerely ask you, DE. Please look over your Forma system. Help us move past this issue. Let us enjoy the levels, weapons, warframes, and content you create without having to worry about when we will obtain our next forma. If this thread could be pinned, it would be greatly appreciated. The more it's seen, the more we can discuss this issue.

TL;DR: The search for forma has been incredibly stressful. It takes away time from actually enjoying the game and spending time with friends. Since forma are so demanded in the game, we need a more stable and consistent system of obtaining them. Post suggestions and feedback to help make the current system better or a completely new system.

 

Edited September 20, 2013 by TheSphynx

[Caramelaion]

+1, yes sir, what a big true

[ScopeWraith]

+1

 

We need DE to check on this issue ASAP!

Edited September 20, 2013 by ScopeWraith

[Demons3ye]

Agreed. I don't spend most of my time doing Voids, but Formas don't drop often.

[Smitty12212]

+1

[Reddeq]

Well, we've earned forma yesterday from Void Extermination 3. I think nothing changed. Just bad luck. Also we had a lot of fun in 5 secret rooms. Just don't go Void as a job

[cary2010haha]

DE wants more money this time, you didn't see how MAG P. 's drop rate is so great?

Forma? maybe 1.5-3% in T3

 

 

And i don't like the way they silence those data miner, i don't care how they did it or not.
Just release the data and let us know the rate, it won't change anything but we want to know. Just like those crit chance

[Reddeq]

But I like the idea of Tokens and Forma as derelict reward, 'cause there is nothing interesting there currently. And tokens are good &#!-kick to RNG. 

[ScopeWraith]

There are many different ways to approach "repopulating" the forma. The importance is getting the reoccurring issue back into the hands of DE.

 

We need to know just a few things. Did they ninja nerf the drop rates? If not... Where are they? If they aren't there... Can we introduce a new system of obtaining forma.

 

PLEASE DE!!!!

[litlit]

I've run over a hundred void missions since U10, and I haven't received even a single forma blueprint. I'm not exaggerating.

 

I did receive 2 formas as a login reward. Maybe they upped the rate there?

[Crunchyblack]

Totally agree, done 40+ runs and not a single blueprint

[Holy_Storm]

I also agree on your ideas on getting Forma.

Another idea would be to add Void Endless Defence keys and make Forma BP's obtainable as a possible reward when completing 5 rounds.
I think a drop chance of 2-3% would be fair for a hard endless defence mission. DE could also add Orokin Catalysts BP's to the drop table and exclude any parts for weapons. I would guess many people would agree with the idea to farm/grind for Forma and/or Catalysts only, if there is a fair chance to get one without paying.

[avenger5]

I like alternative 1. Forma and Super Forma.

Also, what is the best key for finding void race/parkour rooms? Like the laser drop challenge. I used to use Raid II keys for that, but they no longer exist.

[TheSphynx]

I also agree on your ideas on getting Forma.

Another idea would be to add Void Endless Defence keys and make Forma BP's obtainable as a possible reward when completing 5 rounds.

I think a drop chance of 2-3% would be fair for a hard endless defence mission. DE could also add Orokin Catalysts BP's to the drop table and exclude any parts for weapons. I would guess many people would agree with the idea to farm/grind for Forma and/or Catalysts only, if there is a fair chance to get one without paying.

Nah, that sounds a little too easy. Also, catalyst and reactors should never be farmable. The alerts alone give you more than enough to sustain yourself.

 

I like alternative 1. Forma and Super Forma.

Also, what is the best key for finding void race/parkour rooms? Like the laser drop challenge. I used to use Raid II keys for that, but they no longer exist.

Not sure which key is the best for parkour rooms. It seems they all have a random chance (except for Defense).

[TheSphynx]

Edit: Added a summary regarding the newly release datamined tables. Please post your feedback.

[ScopeWraith]

Wow! My results ended up pretty much dead on for T2 Exterm.

 

Here are my results after 25 runs. If you guys like this PLEASE let me know!

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20611113/T2Exterm.png

Edited September 20, 2013 by ScopeWraith

[TheSphynx]

Update and Edit: Regarding DEMegan's Post.

[drentz]

+1

 

Another awesome compliation of ideas/concerns Sphynx.  This game has too much potential for DE to let this go to the point where it begins ruining the game, at least in my opinion.

 

I also think having 2 types of formas, and/or a token reward system are the two best suggestions for forma gathering.

[TheSphynx]

+1

 

Another awesome compliation of ideas/concerns Sphynx.  This game has too much potential for DE to let this go to the point where it begins ruining the game, at least in my opinion.

 

I also think having 2 types of formas, and/or a token reward system are the two best suggestions for forma gathering.

Thank you for coming to this thread and leaving your kind feedback. I hope this thread can help DE with suggestions and ideas to help the current system.

[Andoryuu]

Current system of getting Forma is good. There is just problem with set rarities.

 

There is 76% chance for common drop, 22% for uncommon and 2% for rare. Chance is evenly divided between items with the same rarity.

 

Before, Forma blueprint was set as common in T2/3 Ext/Raid and pure Forma as rare. Blueprints and Forma were set as rare everywhere else.

If those new datamined tables are at least a little accurate, all pure Formas were removed and blueprints were set as rare which reduced their drop rates.

 

To fix this, all is needed is to set blueprints rarity back to common on some void missions or uncommon on all.

[jaybayblay]

1. Forma Blueprints purchasable though the market for credits. Forma blueprints purchased with credit reset item rank. Forma purchased with platinum will not reset item rank.

 

 

LOL? I'm only pointing out the OPs first suggestion, buy forma with plat and you don't have to reset? Although I agree, forma is hard to come by nowadays. I don't mind any changes, just don't allow noob low level players to forma a weapon without resetting the rank so we dont see 5 forma soma's on level 3 tenno..

 

On another note, there should be SPECIAL EFFECTS for FORMA'D weapons, depending on how many forma, etc. :3

Edited September 20, 2013 by DEMegan
rude

[TheSphynx]

1. Forma Blueprints purchasable though the market for credits. Forma blueprints purchased with credit reset item rank. Forma purchased with platinum will not reset item rank.

 

 

LOL? I'm only pointing out the OPs first suggestion, buy forma with plat and you don't have to reset? LOOOOOOOOOOOL goes to show how lazy and pathetic of an idea that is. Although I agree, forma is hard to come by nowadays. I don't mind any changes, just don't allow noob low level players to forma a weapon without resetting the rank so we dont see 5 forma soma's on level 3 tenno.. HAHAHAHAHA so ridiculous I wish you can slap yourself for coming up with such a pathetic/LAZY idea.

 

On another note, there should be SPECIAL EFFECTS for FORMA'D weapons, depending on how many forma, etc. :3

This thread is for mature players that can speak their mind without acting like a child. I didn't say "DO THIS DE" it's a suggestion an option an opinion. Coming into this thread, calling people lazy and pathetic for making a SUGGESTION makes you look idiotic. We are looking for positive feedback. Not troll children that want to spam the thread with "LOOOL" and "HAHAHA". Thank you for your input and I hope next time you can use some manners.

[jaybayblay]

Zz anyway, I can't help but find it hilarious how you want an easy way out to forma a weapon, to make your weapon OP you should have to earn it through effort making it that much more satisfying to wield. Again, they should DEFINITELY look in to implementing FORMA EFFECTS on weapons and warframes depending on the Forma rank (How many stars) leaving players with more satisfaction through our EFFORTS.

 

Buying plat won't allow you to have everything you want, to be OP sorry!

[Andoryuu]

After last update it looks like Forma blueprints is rare in T1, uncommon in T2 and common in T3 with Forma being rare in T3.

So every 10th T2 and every 3rd T3 at average should give you a blueprint.