[INCURSION] Binding of Isaac-style End-Game Mission?

[Horse_Milk]

"End Game" is a constant and heated topic with many different opinions on how it should be handled. Here's mine:

Restart.

Okay not quite, but those of you who have played The Binding of Isaac will know where I'm going with this.

One of the main issues with end-game content in Warframe is that it just isn't challenging. Alot of the time you're fighting your own patience harder than the enemy itself.

But it's hard to make challenging content where Warframes are literally immortal up until the point all their health is drained in one hit, and where weapons like the Ignis Wraith allows players to switch their brain off entirely and waltz through any mission of any level with ease.

Sooo, take away the invincibility and overpowered weapons, what are you left with? Something we can work with.

Alright, to the point.

INCURSION ^{(noun: an invasion or attack)} is an endless mission for hardcore players looking for a real challenge, using what they're given effectively and approaching each situation with cautious flexibility.

• You can choose which Warframe to bring, but mind that it has some versatility because it will enter the mission completely unmodded.
• Companions and Items are disabled and you start carrying nothing but your Skana and Lato.
• Operators and their schools are also disabled, as to further prevent cheese strats.
• Energy orbs have reduced drop rates to encourage strategic use of abilities.
• Health orbs have reduced drop rates to encourage use of physical cover and stealth.
• Similar to (Elite) Sanctuary Onslaught, you complete objectives after which you can choose to extract or enter the next "stage".
• Enemy variety and levels progressively increase at an acceptable rate.
• Each stage has a randomized objective and tileset based on what planet the Incursion is occurring on.
• Every 3 stages contain an additional objective, an optional bossfight which you can kill for extra loot.
• Each stage contains X amount of weapons and mods ^{(along with whatever resources/drops our dear devs want to slip in)} to be found.
• Later stages may contain "conditions" as seen in Sorties and Nightmare missions.
• Looted weapons start at max capacity, but unmodded.
• Looted mods start at rank 0, but can be ranked up by finding duplicate mods or using some sort of special Incursion-exclusive resource.
• Players will be provided an Arsenal at the beginning and end of each stage to sort their loadout before heading out.
• Waypoint markers are disabled, with the exception of player-made ones. This way, players can't speedrun the objective in 10 seconds while ignoring everything else. The exception is made with the intention of marking loot, weapons, enemies, and objectives FOR eachother. Scour the map. Communicate. Teamwork.
• Death is semi-permanent. The only way to be revived is to wait until the next stage begins, or you can extract immediately if you don't have the patience.
• Nothing is lost from your rewards or loadout when you die, the punishment lies in not being alive to pick up new loot before the next stage.

 

That's basically it so far.

Not expecting a great reception to this idea, but I wholeheartedly believe a good step back is exactly what Warframe needs to address the difficulty problem.

Looking forward to reading your feedback.

[Jiminez_Burial]

What about Arcanes and Arcane Helmets?

1 hour ago, Horse_Milk said:

• Looted weapons start at max capacity, but unmodded.
• Looted mods start at rank 0, but can be ranked up by finding duplicate mods or using some sort of special Incursion-exclusive resource.

Would max capacity be 30 or 60 (or if you grab a paracesis 40/80)?

Honestly I'm just happy that you aren't suggesting any form of PvP as end-game, and although some might be salty about starting at the bottom of the power curve each time it's a reasonable way to avoid most of the issues concerning cheese/static gameplay.

[Horse_Milk]

25 minutes ago, Jiminez_Burial said:

What about Arcanes and Arcane Helmets?

If it were up to me, I'd want them disabled. Arcanes are a large part of why certain frames can become virtually invulnerable.

27 minutes ago, Jiminez_Burial said:

Would max capacity be 30 or 60 (or if you grab a paracesis 40/80)?

Good question. Since weapons are randomized, I would disregard Catalysts entirely and give the mission a unique Catalyst consumable that only works in the run you're in.

Either that or straight up give every weapon a Catalyst within the mission itself.

This way, nobody has to invest actual Catalysts in weapons they wouldn't normally choose to use, but might have to due to RNG.

[Sevek7]

On 2019-10-18 at 6:33 AM, Horse_Milk said:

INCURSION ^{(noun: an invasion or attack)} is an endless mission for hardcore players looking for a real challenge, using what they're given effectively and approaching each situation with cautious flexibility.

• You can choose which Warframe to bring, but mind that it has some versatility because it will enter the mission completely unmodded.
• Companions and Items are disabled and you start carrying nothing but your Skana and Lato.
• Operators and their schools are also disabled, as to further prevent cheese strats.
• Energy orbs have reduced drop rates to encourage strategic use of abilities.
• Health orbs have reduced drop rates to encourage use of physical cover and stealth.
• Similar to (Elite) Sanctuary Onslaught, you complete objectives after which you can choose to extract or enter the next "stage".
• Enemy variety and levels progressively increase at an acceptable rate.
• Each stage has a randomized objective and tileset based on what planet the Incursion is occurring on.
• Every 3 stages contain an additional objective, an optional bossfight which you can kill for extra loot.
• Each stage contains X amount of weapons and mods ^{(along with whatever resources/drops our dear devs want to slip in)} to be found.
• Later stages may contain "conditions" as seen in Sorties and Nightmare missions.
• Looted weapons start at max capacity, but unmodded.
• Looted mods start at rank 0, but can be ranked up by finding duplicate mods or using some sort of special Incursion-exclusive resource.
• Players will be provided an Arsenal at the beginning and end of each stage to sort their loadout before heading out.
• Waypoint markers are disabled, with the exception of player-made ones. This way, players can't speedrun the objective in 10 seconds while ignoring everything else. The exception is made with the intention of marking loot, weapons, enemies, and objectives FOR eachother. Scour the map. Communicate. Teamwork.
• Death is semi-permanent. The only way to be revived is to wait until the next stage begins, or you can extract immediately if you don't have the patience.
• Nothing is lost from your rewards or loadout when you die, the punishment lies in not being alive to pick up new loot before the next stage.

This is a good idea, or at least the start of a good idea 🙂 

I think you're right that currently the game is balanced in a way to get the perfect challenge for someone with half-maxed mods and 1-2 forma with no potato, no operator, and no arcanes. Anybody with maxed mods, operator focus schools unlocked, arcanes, etc... Will be able to cheese any content that requires surviving, or killing, or defending something. So, your idea of taking these things away is pretty good! I would like to suggest maybe also suspending warframe passives, since even an unmodded wisp has perma-invisibility for no energy cost if the player hops around!