A Summarization Of Why The War Is Rigged.

[Dracosaber]

Taranis49 said it perfectly. Who wins doesn't really bother me, but an even playing field is essential to make these kind of events interesting and not just a slog.

 

This was my take. I wanted to support Corpus for lore, but I would have been fine losing the event had it been a balanced back-and-forth. Unfortunately, after the first day, it became a one-sided, steamroll win for the Grineer. Anyone who argues against the fact that the early battle pays won the war for the Grineer is either naive, stupid, or just doesn't want to realize the truth. DE could have made the war balanced, but once they gave the Grineer such strong momentum, the war was over. That took the fun right out of the event for me. I was so excited to have an all out war of competing sides, but this turned horrible.

 

Sadly, I've been forced to balance my missions and fight for the Grineer. There just isn't any point in staying Corpus.

[Jandor]

Uncle Ruk plays the game better than Salad V.

 

#teamgrineer

 

edit: Also, Lotus sucks at negotiating contracts.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Jandor

[Liminal]

Uncle Ruk plays the game better than Salad V.

Uncle Ruk ran a pretty impressive recruiting campaign, I'll give you that :P

[rksk16it]

I sided with the Corpus solely for lore reasons too. Im always beating Grineer soldiers at Phobos, since it was discovered in operation Arid Fear. I do this usually alone, most of the time without any help from other players, so its understandable that I should not care about captured Tenno. This is called reciprocity.

 

If DE dont put any Lore in place, I made my own.

 

F***kin exactly. There is probably more lore in Mario than in Warframe.

[rksk16it]

Uncle Ruk ran a pretty impressive recruiting campaign, I'll give you that :P

 

And those recruits will come and farm his a** off when they run out of Orky Cells.

 

Ruk : Hey buddies !! You kill me night and day just to get an Orky out of my A-Hole, NO PROBLEM !! Feel free to continue doing so, all my holes are yours, just fight these corpus in the event !

[awolin]

very well stated

[Liminal]

Ruk : Hey buddies !! You kill me night and day just to get an Orky out of my A-Hole, NO PROBLEM !! Feel free to continue doing so, all my holes are yours, just fight these corpus in the event !

Now I don't want to farm him :I

[Zapier]

All the hateful and spiteful comments in this thread really are pointless. General discussion is someplace else where these pissing matches and 'discussions' can take place. This is the feedback area where people can post their feelings on whatever it is they're posting. Right or wrong fact-wise, feedback from us is supposedly what they want to hear. People trying to drown out the comments or make posters feel invalid by being the forum trolls are really out of place here.

 

The OP has all valid points no matter how accurate they all are and they are something that many more people like myself can relate to when it comes to this event. If there's nothing constructive to add to the topic then people should either find someplace that is better suited to be filled with nonsense and people wanting to put others down for their own feedback or start a feedback post of their own where people can complain about other people submitting wrong feedback or whatever it is that compels them to post in feedback threads to try to undermine them.

 

For the first time there was an event and something going on that mattered enough for me to post about. There was a lot of good and a lot of bad. DE deserves to hear the experiences of those who felt the bad side without people telling us to just try harder or clan up and all sorts of other crap filling this thread.

 

Bottom line is that my time and effort into something is now directly affected by popular opinion and time sinks. I have no problem with something being grindy but I do have a problem when I can invest hours into something only to lose it anyways. To me the problem isn't that I could receive potato-less versions of something, but that I'm going to receive something I didn't put effort forth to get and lose that which I did. It's a terrible reward system and everyone who says just try harder or tough luck are usually the ones getting what they want or don't care either way. And then because of how the reward system is, the event is losing its appeal because people are then abandoning one side to join the winning side to maximize their reward, because if they're stuck with getting the winning side's rewards anyway, why not make sure you get the slot and potato to go with it? This is the very root of the problem for me and the OP has many good reasons why this event is flawed beyond that for many players.

[Paradoxbomb]

I could honestly care less about who wins the event, though on behalf of the Corpus supporters, I do hope DE pays attention to this thread and learns from it for future events. Personally I wonder if it would've worked much better if the battlepay rewards were either hidden or exactly the same for both factions. The idea of each faction having a seperate payment worked on paper I'm sure, but there's very few items that can be considered "equal" in value in this game.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Paradoxbomb

[Datareaper]

Corpus didn't draw enough awesome fanart to support their troops.

[litlit]

What do you expect? Do you want DE to show Grineer Eating corpus or something... maybe stealing their puppies and the sweets from small children?

 

The Grineer just invaded someone else sovereign territory of someone else over a trade dispute! 

 

It like saying you hire some builders to build you a house. They break the contract and build your house out jelly so you invade their homes... 

 

I feel that people expect to much from DE. 

 

Now I agree completely that we haven't seen any "colonists" or have much proof we will be saving these Mysterious discovered Tenno. But De is at least trying. Please remember (as I said above) This is all just a new mission mode Beta test with nice window dressing on it. They could have just tested this mode by just randomly having it occur all over the map to test stuff. Instead they took the time to make a story and tie in the release/re-release of two characters. 

 

Also we all really should wait till after the event is over. We still have several days f rewards and stuff yet. The Corpus might rally or the Grineer might run low on resources. Its not over. Also Who knows what DE plans as "after effects" from this event? 

 

Well, that analogy kind of falls apart. The Corpus aren't just some regular blokes whose homes are being invaded, they're plutocrat cultists driven to seek nothing but profit at the expense of all else.

 

The Corpus aren't going to rally. It's over already and it has been since day 1.

[-Kittens-]

All the hateful and spiteful comments in this thread really are pointless. General discussion is someplace else where these &!$$ing matches and 'discussions' can take place. This is the feedback area where people can post their feelings on whatever it is they're posting. Right or wrong fact-wise, feedback from us is supposedly what they want to hear. People trying to drown out the comments or make posters feel invalid by being the forum trolls are really out of place here.

 

The OP has all valid points no matter how accurate they all are and they are something that many more people like myself can relate to when it comes to this event. If there's nothing constructive to add to the topic then people should either find someplace that is better suited to be filled with nonsense and people wanting to put others down for their own feedback or start a feedback post of their own where people can complain about other people submitting wrong feedback or whatever it is that compels them to post in feedback threads to try to undermine them.

 

For the first time there was an event and something going on that mattered enough for me to post about. There was a lot of good and a lot of bad. DE deserves to hear the experiences of those who felt the bad side without people telling us to just try harder or clan up and all sorts of other crap filling this thread.

 

Bottom line is that my time and effort into something is now directly affected by popular opinion and time sinks. I have no problem with something being grindy but I do have a problem when I can invest hours into something only to lose it anyways. To me the problem isn't that I could receive potato-less versions of something, but that I'm going to receive something I didn't put effort forth to get and lose that which I did. It's a terrible reward system and everyone who says just try harder or tough luck are usually the ones getting what they want or don't care either way. And then because of how the reward system is, the event is losing its appeal because people are then abandoning one side to join the winning side to maximize their reward, because if they're stuck with getting the winning side's rewards anyway, why not make sure you get the slot and potato to go with it? This is the very root of the problem for me and the OP has many good reasons why this event is flawed beyond that for many players.

 

 

You're playing the event for the wrong reasons.

 

You certainly have a right to complain, but your complaints are in fact in no form of any type justified.

 

1. The Corpus are the "bad guys" in this, DE stated this when Alad V was being touted through video marketing before the event was even a thing on the radar. Having some kind of "moral high ground" with the either side is rather laughable, whether you wish to acknowledge it or not.

 

2. The initial offerings did not tip the war, as players immediately understood that you could run both missions, and this was clarified while those missions were still ongoing. You basically took three paragraphs to say the fanbase is both stupid and lazy, which ranks right up there with Xylia's comment of the people who bolted in to face roll the initial invasion as "no lifers" because they dedicated time to the game. I work a full time job and a part time job on the side and I had plenty of time play every mission easily, as they take about 6 minutes to complete with a leecher hogging up the extraction time.

 

3. "The fanbase is greedy". So are people who whining about not getting their special FREE gun, because they get the other special FREE gun.. Warframe is Free-to-play. Free to play games are played by people who don't want to spend money. What an amazing concept. By all means petition DE to put the Detron up for platinum, I'm sure they'll consider it. I mean if you really want it that bad, right?

 

4. As stated and deliberately ignored, a gigantic and overwhelming portion of the fanbase had already sided with Grineer when the event was first announced, before any details or logistics were known.

 

5. Neither pistol compares to the despair or Acrid, and I'm pretty sure even the Xbow has better damage, so saying or implying you were "robbed" of something by a "conspiracy" is literally laughable, especially in light of the largest faction of clans already having access and excess of the materials offered as rewards.

Edited October 28, 2013 by -Kittens-

[Fire_Ashes]

Sadly I have to agree with most of this....

[Liminal]

4. As stated and deliberately ignored, a gigantic and overwhelming portion of the fanbase had already sided with Grineer when the event was first announced, before any details or logistics were known.

I've read that many times. If that is true DE should have swiftly balanced the event so as not to let it become one sided. Otherwise it's not much of a war... nor an event for that matter.

 

Still, all we know is that the big clans had sided with the Grineer very soon, we have no idea whatsoever about individual players or unorganized clans; and from what some (pro-Grineer) players have posted, the large clans don't weigh that much points-wise (although I think they caused many individual players to run to their side).

 

That's why the Grineer/Corpus choice should have been a one time thing, with no chance to swap. It's easier for DE to manage the event on the fly to make it challenging for both sides, no matter the difference in player numbers.

[LoveYourEnemy]

Fully agree with everything said, especially the Lore part. I'd rather save my fellow Tenno any day than attempt to save some colonies that we have no info on. 

[Jandor]

If the Event is rigged, why is it a massive problem?

I may be biased because my side is winning :)

 

 

Fully agree with everything said, especially the Lore part. I'd rather save my fellow Tenno any day than attempt to save some colonies that we have no info on. 

Colonies full of Corpus serfs, that will soon be colonies full of Grineer slaves. Not much of a difference between the two as far as I can tell.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Jandor

[Xylia]

If the Event is rigged, why is it a massive problem?

Eve Online, the poster child for sandbox games, has had rigged events. World didn't end.

 

I may be biased because my side is winning :)

 

 

 

 

Colonies full of Corpus serfs, that will soon be colonies full of Grineer slaves. Not much of a difference between the two as far as I can tell.

 

Maybe because you shouldn't advertise one thing, and then sell something else entirely?

 

They claimed that this is a Choice... a "Dilemma". They advertised a "War" in which there could be two different outcomes.

 

What we got instead, was a CurbStompBattle that due to several factors (like the ones I listed), was pre-determined from Day Stinking One. There has been absolutely nothing done in the Alad's favor, and everything has been in Ruk's favor right from the start, all the way down to the basic game mechanics where Corpus are much easier to kill than Grineer are (and you know it is Human Nature to take the path of least resistance).

 

Like I said in the thread title: It was stacked from the very beginning. Don't advertise a "war" or a "choice" to us when the thing was decided from the start. Or, perhaps they should have taken the steps to ensure that there really was some iota of a chance the Corpus could have won.

 

To the people saying I should have edited out #5: I've seen MANY messageboards where people crucify you for making major edits hours, days later. They say that is "cheating" or some BS like that.

[OblivionNecroninja]

 

Maybe because you shouldn't advertise one thing, and then sell something else entirely?

 

They claimed that this is a Choice... a "Dilemma". They advertised a "War" in which there could be two different outcomes.

 

What we got instead, was a CurbStompBattle that due to several factors (like the ones I listed), was pre-determined from Day Stinking One. There has been absolutely nothing done in the Alad's favor, and everything has been in Ruk's favor right from the start, all the way down to the basic game mechanics where Corpus are much easier to kill than Grineer are (and you know it is Human Nature to take the path of least resistance).

 

Like I said in the thread title: It was stacked from the very beginning. Don't advertise a "war" or a "choice" to us when the thing was decided from the start. Or, perhaps they should have taken the steps to ensure that there really was some iota of a chance the Corpus could have won.

 

To the people saying I should have edited out #5: I've seen MANY messageboards where people crucify you for making major edits hours, days later. They say that is "cheating" or some BS like that.

Rigged implies that it was deliberate, though. This was more like DE accidentally stacked the event by not thinking about the consequences of their design. As usual.

[Zapier]

You're playing the event for the wrong reasons.

 

You certainly have a right to complain, but your complaints are in fact in no form of any type justified.

 

1. The Corpus are the "bad guys" in this, DE stated this when Alad V was being touted through video marketing before the event was even a thing on the radar. Having some kind of "moral high ground" with the either side is rather laughable, whether you wish to acknowledge it or not.

 

2. The initial offerings did not tip the war, as players immediately understood that you could run both missions, and this was clarified while those missions were still ongoing. You basically took three paragraphs to say the fanbase is both stupid and lazy, which ranks right up there with Xylia's comment of the people who bolted in to face roll the initial invasion as "no lifers" because they dedicated time to the game. I work a full time job and a part time job on the side and I had plenty of time play every mission easily, as they take about 6 minutes to complete with a leecher hogging up the extraction time.

 

3. "The fanbase is greedy". So are people who whining about not getting their special FREE gun, because they get the other special FREE gun.. Warframe is Free-to-play. Free to play games are played by people who don't want to spend money. What an amazing concept. By all means petition DE to put the Detron up for platinum, I'm sure they'll consider it. I mean if you really want it that bad, right?

 

4. As stated and deliberately ignored, a gigantic and overwhelming portion of the fanbase had already sided with Grineer when the event was first announced, before any details or logistics were known.

 

5. Neither pistol compares to the despair or Acrid, and I'm pretty sure even the Xbow has better damage, so saying or implying you were "robbed" of something by a "conspiracy" is literally laughable, especially in light of the largest faction of clans already having access and excess of the materials offered as rewards.

 

So, wanting to play an event for a competitive struggle is the wrong reason? Playing an event to try and earn a reward being touted if I choose a side and help them win as was advertised is the wrong reason? What exactly are the right reasons then, to just sink more time into something meaningless and just accept whatever is given despite the advertised opportunity for a chance to earn what I fought for? There was no opportunity in earning anything aside from the Grineer winnings after the first couple of days and everyone knows it. It doesn't matter why at this point, but it does matter that once an event that is supposed to go on for days appears to be decided after a couple of days means that more people are influenced to just pick up the best rewards rather than play the event and choose a side as promoted... but I guess doing as DE advertised is playing the wrong way. I guess I shouldn't play online with friends either to have fun, because that must be playing Warframe for the wrong reasons even though that option is promoted.

 

Now, to focus on your points...

 

1. I never mentioned any side being good or bad in terms of any moral positioning so this whole point means nothing to me.

 

2. Awesome, you spend a lot of time in Warframe as well as working, etc. Great for you, but your experience isn't the same as everyone else's so let's not pretend that just because you do something a certain way everyone else is expected to. A lot of people also play Warframe running solo missions. I'd rather play Warframe with the 4-5 other guys I tend to play online games with than do it alone. Neither is the right or wrong way. I even acknowledged the fact that Grineer could have been the favorite and won anyways, but you failed to acknowledge that I also suggested that once the war was tipped early, no matter the reason, that the war stopped being interesting because people started giving up or grinding Grineer missions, etc. This is a failure for the event because the struggle stopped being interesting... no matter if you won or lost.

 

3. Fanbase is greedy? I don't recall saying that. Maybe you're now making points based on what others have posted in this thread and if so, I apologize but all your points have a feeling that you're responding to what I posted since you quoted my post only so I'm going to respond in kind. Yes, Warframe is Free-to-Play. Yes, I have spent some money so I have a little more interest than some. Also, I may not spend money everyday, but I spend my time which for Free-to-Play games is just as valuable, because if you aren't playing you'll never spend a dime. If the events are going to change to where my time invested can no longer net me what I was hoping for in any way, then why am I even playing? That's the question that some will ask. It's not whining but it's just a simple concept of being rewarded in a way that makes your time worthwhile. If my rewards are now dictated by popular sides rather than my own gameplay, then yes I'll find something new. It's not a threat. It's not being butthurt or anything. It's a simple fact and something DE deserves to know. Maybe they'll care... most likely they won't care... but that's not for you or me to decide.

 

4. I already agreed that this could be the case and it really isn't my main gripe anyways, though it does contribute to my issue of what kinds of rewards I get for my time.

 

5. I claim no conspiracy about anything and the stats of the weapon mean nothing to me. I like the feeling and look of some weapons better than others. I used the Gorgon before the Soma was released. I hated the look of the Gorgon and the stats weren't always the best for most situations but I liked the machine gun style weapon over others. The Soma had a style I preferred and I went to it before I even knew what kind of stats it had. I wanted the Detron over the Brakk and I actually wanted the Prova rather than the Machete. I'm in a clan and built my ghost clan's dojo with my time and money as well so I can still build the Prova and many of the rewards I also didn't need, but I can still want them more than others. I may not be robbed of a weapon since I will get the winning side's weapon but I have indeed been robbed of both a choice in my time investment and robbed of a good struggle in an event that was decided early by the clans that lead the way and helped influence regular people who might want to maximize their reward potential.

 

You can try to put down people as much as you want here, but you're showing exactly what the problem of this event has become. Something that was meant to be fun with a nice reward at the end has turned into something that was over after a couple of days and now has one side of the community bashing the other side who are putting up complaints about the way it was handled. There's been whiners and complainers on both sides, but it's been very apparent that the 'winning' side is trying to claim that it's only the losing players' fault for their complaints. Anyone who feels this way is missing the larger issue of this whole thing... the problem is the way the event has been handled and how it has influenced everything from the way the players have sided to what players get for their time. The event was fun for a couple days... now it's just pulling teeth and sucks if you know you're on the losing end and are not going to be rewarded in a fair shake as those who win.

 

Have I played 1000 games for Corpus? No. If I did and still lost, I still wouldn't be rewarded as much as the Grineer player who only played 100. That's a problem. The salt in the wound is that not only would I not be rewarded as much, but I won't even get the pieces of what I tried to win. And this is the problem that has lead to the boring event now because why continue this event's struggle if even if I put in every minute of the next couple of days only to have my time less rewarded than the others. I'm not the only one who sees this. Some have stuck to Corpus, but some have also jumped ship to Grineer. It's a flaw that I hope is addressed and fixed for this type of event in the future. Some of us players want the next events to be better.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Zapier

[Alkirin]

 

 

 

The imbalance of the rewards (particularly at the start) was definitely the cause - the "heart of the war" obviously wasn't with the Grineer, or Quirnus and Martialis would be Grineer-controlled nodes too.

 

I covered it in my post, as did the OP; it's called "momentum" (there's also the fact that, as the OP pointed out, pro-Corpus missions are significantly more difficult than their counterpart) - the uneven slant during the first day set the tone for the entire war - people were pegging it as a Grineer victory even before the Corpus started offering decent rewards (and they certainly didn't offer Mutagen as frequently as the Grineer did, shortly after they both introduced new bio lab weapons and made mutagen harder to come by).

 

Hell, DE even tried addressing the early call of Grineer victory at that point by claiming "oh, you're being premature, knee-jerking, etc." - by the time they tried making the Corpus more appealing, it was basically rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. Perception was reality.

 

 

How long did it take for Martialis to flip?  How well did the Corpus hold onto ANY point at ANY time during the war?

 

Oh, right.

 

Momentum didn't take off until Martialis because that is the point where people heavily sank one way or another into that major battle.  Before then, investment wasn't heavy enough to weigh one way or another.

 

The complaints set on the first day kept consistent, even in the face of things that demonstrated them wrong time and again.  Even rewards?  Grineer.  Consistently better rewards for the Corpus?  Barely noticable change, they were still losing.  Yet these were supposed to be the things that single-handedly determined why people supported the Grineer.

 

Simply put, you're wrong.  People supported the Grineer before battle pay came into the picture and major fluctuations in battle pay haven't affected the end outcome.  More convoluted excuses for why your favorite faction isn't winning aren't any more convincing.

[Zapier]

How long did it take for Martialis to flip?  How well did the Corpus hold onto ANY point at ANY time during the war?

 

Oh, right.

 

Momentum didn't take off until Martialis because that is the point where people heavily sank one way or another into that major battle.  Before then, investment wasn't heavy enough to weigh one way or another.

 

The complaints set on the first day kept consistent, even in the face of things that demonstrated them wrong time and again.  Even rewards?  Grineer.  Consistently better rewards for the Corpus?  Barely noticable change, they were still losing.  Yet these were supposed to be the things that single-handedly determined why people supported the Grineer.

 

Simply put, you're wrong.  People supported the Grineer before battle pay came into the picture and major fluctuations in battle pay haven't affected the end outcome.  More convoluted excuses for why your favorite faction isn't winning aren't any more convincing.

 

Didn't Corpus win Martialis as well? If momentum didn't take off until then, then technically there should still be some good battles going on, right? If people really didn't invest themselves into sides before then, by did Grineer suddenly take off after that? Oh, you mean because even Grineer supporters who wanted a Cata instead of a Reactor couldn't keep grinding for Grineer there. It was only a war because of that fact.

 

Either way, let's go with what you're saying it right. Grineer was heavily favored before and after the event started. Corpus is losing. So, an event that was supposed to be a struggle turned into something that wasn't even a struggle except in one location where it was a struggle because the heavily picked and favored Grineer couldn't grind it out if they wanted the Cata instead. This means the event really wasn't that great because there wasn't much a struggle or fun back and forth. It was over before it was even half way finished. This is a problem with the event. Not one side winning or losing, but with the event being over so quickly. This has been a reoccuring problem in events it seems, even the cooperative events. DE says you have all this time to earn rewards, but it's quickly seen you don't really... in the case of this event, you never had a shot for Corpus supporters.

 

The funniest part about all of this is... no one has even suggested that Grineer supporters not get what they invested their time into and won. I think few have said that the losing side should get equal rewards. Many have said that we would like our consolation prizes to at least be the BPs for the side we chose instead of the side we fought against. Barring that change, then yes future events like this really need their system worked out to keep it more balanced so people putting time into either side have a shot. And before anyone tries to say, 'Well life isn't fair', last I checked this is a game and not life, so it can indeed be fair. No one is trying to take anyone's toy away from them, but we're definitely hoping for a chance to earn the toys we wanted as advertised, even if they come with no slot, no potato, etc. Is that really such a terrible thing to want? Fix the system or fix the rewards...

[Jandor]

If you did 100 missions and your side lost you should get BPs for everything. If you did 100 missions and your side won you should get pre-potatoed and slotted weapons for your side, and BPs for the other sides stuff.

 

If you did 50 missions for one and 50 missions for the other it should count as no missions. Pick a side you damn mercs j/k.

[Namacyst]

Over 130 Corpus and 0 Grineer Missions here.. won't get any Corpus weapons. *thumbs up*

[Cakes]

So the final victor is determined by the number of conflicts won by each faction?

 

Can someone please find the quote of that for me, because I still can't find it.

[Namacyst]

So the final victor is determined by the number of conflicts won by each faction?

 

Can someone please find the quote of that for me, because I still can't find it.

The final victor was decided by DE_Steve some time ago.. proof is somewhere on twitter ^^