Mastery Rank 19 attempt 2 and 3 will automatically fail often.

[Yasha-7HS]

If you are detected once in the MR 19 test, you will be sent back to the starting area and the first enemy spawns in a position that causes you to be detected instantly before you gain horizontal control of your character.
This can be mitigated for players struggling by holding the crouch button while respawning, causing you to be just low enough to avoid direct LoS. 
This causes the mastery rank test to only have one attempt for players who are doing this test for the first time, and makes it seem impossible to complete. 

 

This test has been the bane of most player's Warframe careers and at this point, represents no such reasonable 'Mastery' of the game. Even in the one section of the game closest to its gameplay, the New War where you play as Drifter for the first time, you have the ability to turn invisible and a gun. It's caused the most common response to tips on completing the test to be: "Use a gunblade." The test should be more reasonably appropriate to complete with an Excalibur, Volt or Mag with Skana or Bo.

 

To start, the first enemy that can spawn facing the platform and has a routed pattern under the platform should be removed. While the game is third person and you can see around walls, it shouldn't be expected to maneuver the camera in such ways to be able to complete the test. This seems to be why the scanner is disabled, since it's an invaluable tool for low or no ability use stealth missions that allows you to see enemy placements through walls. As such, it would be nice for the test to be designed with the idea that players will not see through or around walls.

Most missions in the game have you start very far away from enemies, behind a wall or in a room with plentiful cover, not on a platform in the middle of nowhere in immediate LoS of nearly all enemies in the tileset. The area should have more walls for reasonable cover and line of sight breaks. This would also mitigate simply using a gun in the melee slot to snipe enemies rather than a careful course. 

Instead of grineer humanoids, please use enemies such as Sensor Regulators which are an established, spy based enemy type that clearly marks the viewing FoV for detection. (This additionally opens the discussion for allowing drone type enemies of this specific variety to be attacked with finishers or disabled with the Parazon, as they currently are difficult to kill and instantly detect you through any non-fatal damage, where as humanoids need to be 'neutral.' Humanoids cannot alert other enemies if they are, say, knocked down or damage staggered.) 

 

[Zakkhar]

1 hour ago, Yasha-7HS said:

This test has been the bane of most player's Warframe careers and at this point, represents no such reasonable 'Mastery' of the game. Even in the one section of the game closest to its gameplay, the New War where you play as Drifter for the first time, you have the ability to turn invisible and a gun. It's caused the most common response to tips on completing the test to be: "Use a gunblade." The test should be more reasonably appropriate to complete with an Excalibur, Volt or Mag with Skana or Bo.

Take your time, learn enemy path routes (they are fairly simple and constant), abuse third person view and soft cover, use anything you like as long as it has sufficient range and speed. Have in mind the stealth executes are completely unrequired, you can just quick melee, heavy melee, slam or slide. The enemies are lvl 15 Grineer they do not have more than 600 EHP. If you managed to do Mastery 9 without cheesing it, I do not see any issues here. 

It is completed exactly with Excalibur and Skana in on the Wiki instructional video (without any enemy radars)

 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Zakkhar

[Zakkhar]

2 hours ago, Yasha-7HS said:

While the game is third person and you can see around walls, it shouldn't be expected to maneuver the camera in such ways to be able to complete the test.

Why not exactly? Have you ever played any third person PvP game? Like PuBG?

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

8 minutes ago, Zakkhar said:

Why not exactly? Have you ever played any third person PvP game? Like PuBG?

Terrible example, it’s pve for a start were as pubg you are competing against real players as well as bugs the mr19 is notorious for its buggyness a better example would be the division.

[Flannoit]

23 minutes ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

Terrible example, it’s pve for a start were as pubg you are competing against real players as well as bugs the mr19 is notorious for its buggyness a better example would be the division.

All MMOs I've played with third person allowed you to look over corners and stuff so you could prepare yourself against an ambush. Almost every single third person single player game has allowed you to at least some degree peer past corners, and that's ignoring the ones with specific "lean to peak" functions.

The camera is a tool of your arsenal, just like any other thing you bring to a mission. If you don't want to use it, then that is honestly your problem.

Does the MR19 test suck? Yes, it's absolutely miserable. It's not fun, it's a slog, and frankly I wish it were gone, but the camera is not the argument point to be made here.

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

2 minutes ago, Flannoit said:

All MMOs I've played with third person allowed you to look over corners and stuff so you could prepare yourself against an ambush. Almost every single third person single player game has allowed you to at least some degree peer past corners, and that's ignoring the ones with specific "lean to peak" functions.

The camera is a tool of your arsenal, just like any other thing you bring to a mission. If you don't want to use it, then that is honestly your problem.

Does the MR19 test suck? Yes, it's absolutely miserable. It's not fun, it's a slog, and frankly I wish it were gone, but the camera is not the argument point to be made here.

I never said the camera was the point

[Yasha-7HS]

On 2023-12-12 at 9:40 PM, Yasha-7HS said:

While the game is third person and you can see around walls, it shouldn't be expected to maneuver the camera in such ways to be able to complete the test.

On 2023-12-12 at 11:42 PM, Zakkhar said:

Why not exactly? Have you ever played any third person PvP game? Like PuBG?

Please read the post and then reply instead of reading part of what was said, and replying with something that was answered or addressed later. 

On 2023-12-12 at 9:40 PM, Yasha-7HS said:

This seems to be why the scanner is disabled, since it's an invaluable tool for low or no ability use stealth missions that allows you to see enemy placements through walls. As such, it would be nice for the test to be designed with the idea that players will not see through or around walls.

 

On 2023-12-12 at 11:36 PM, Zakkhar said:

Take your time, learn enemy path routes (they are fairly simple and constant), abuse third person view and soft cover, use anything you like as long as it has sufficient range and speed.

I did learn the paths, but the paths aren't the issue. 

On 2023-12-12 at 9:40 PM, Yasha-7HS said:

To start, the first enemy that can spawn facing the platform and has a routed pattern under the platform should be removed.

On 2023-12-12 at 9:40 PM, Yasha-7HS said:

Most missions in the game have you start very far away from enemies, behind a wall or in a room with plentiful cover, not on a platform in the middle of nowhere in immediate LoS of nearly all enemies in the tileset. The area should have more walls for reasonable cover and line of sight breaks. This would also mitigate simply using a gun in the melee slot to snipe enemies rather than a careful course.

The objective of the post is that, to start with, there is currently a glitch that causes newer players to fail multiple times, back to back, instantly.

The second focus is that this represents no such scenario in the game. Spy vaults and rescue missions have good line of sight breaks and multiple different routes, and failure isn't immediate upon being seen.

The video you references is multiple years old, and several things have changed with enemy AI. Not all directly or purposefully, but similar to situations with Eclipse. Something else was changed, and that had an effect on these scenarios. For example, the most upvoted comment on the video you referenced: 

Quote

Since the TWW stealth changes any enemy anywhere near a dead body instantly gets alerted, and starts moving about quickly with a much greater detection range. It's greater than the maximum range of a Glaive with Whirlwind, so you have to get too close. All it takes is for one of the enemies running around on an upper platform to see you from the edge, or one off the edge of your minimap to run round a corner, and it's all over (enemy detection doesn't have enough vertically range, even when maxed out, so you can't track movement of enemies on the highest platfom when you're on the lowest). Mod a redeemer to the point it can get a one-hit kill from a single pellet, even with the damage falloff (you don't want to be clipping targets and only wounding them, as that's an instant fail), and snipe all the lancers from the starting platform, starting with the closest. I counted 12 enemies. The ones that are hard to spot are the stationary one just behind the pillar to the left of the prisoner's room (not always there), and one passing behind that big central block, who only briefly shows up between all the pillars on the bottom level to its rear left. The others are pretty easy to see though.

They also, as I mentioned in the original topic, recommend just using a gunblade and sniping the enemies. That's a problem for the design of the test as well. And if the tests are meant to challenge and train players, there are better enemies that can be used for this test:

On 2023-12-12 at 9:40 PM, Yasha-7HS said:

Instead of grineer humanoids, please use enemies such as Sensor Regulators which are an established, spy based enemy type that clearly marks the viewing FoV for detection. (This additionally opens the discussion for allowing drone type enemies of this specific variety to be attacked with finishers or disabled with the Parazon, as they currently are difficult to kill and instantly detect you through any non-fatal damage, where as humanoids need to be 'neutral.' Humanoids cannot alert other enemies if they are, say, knocked down or damage staggered.)