Innodem Riven vs Sacrificial Steel

[(XBOX)Player244024418]

I've never build a calculator in excel or anything and was curious if blood rush and the extra damash types from puncture and slash will be better vs slotting SS. I lose 100% of base CC (25%) but BR should make up for it, I think...

[(PSN)Unstar]

That Riven seems like an overall downgrade from Sacrificial Steel.  The increase to Slash has no impact on Slash proc damage, only Slash proc frequency.  But you're also raising your Puncture proc frequency by almost the same amount, which basically removes any change to the frequency (since Impact is already so low).  On top of that, you're losing a chunk of your damage to Corpus.  So I see plenty of downsides to using that Riven and no real upside.

[(XBOX)Player244024418]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

I see plenty of downsides

Weeping wounds gives me ~80% added crit at max combo. I can slot organ shatter in that spot, put in the riven at 119% base cc in the open slot and only reduce gladiator rush to level 6 which gives me the 30% per combo cc. Not sure if there's something better than the three glad mods. CO isn't good on this because I have no elements right?

My base crit chance is 97%. I can also put WW back in for PPP if I was using innodem for melee. 

[(PSN)Unstar]

2 minutes ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

Weeping wounds gives me ~80% added crit at max combo. I can slot organ shatter in that spot, put in the riven at 119% base cc in the open slot and only reduce gladiator rush to level 6 which gives me the 30% per combo cc. Not sure if there's something better than the three glad mods. CO isn't good on this because I have no elements right?

My base crit chance is 97%. I can also put WW back in for PPP if I was using innodem for melee. 

I'll be honest, I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to get at?  So rather than get bogged down in the details, I'll start with a high-level question: what's your goal?  Is there a reason you want to use this Riven beyond the fact that you have it and want to use it?  Because unless simply having that Riven on your weapon makes you happy, I would advise against using it.

 

2 minutes ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

I can also put WW back in for PPP if I was using innodem for melee. 

Does this mean you are not using it for melee?  If so, what are you using it for?  A stat stick?  That would change things.  And to be transparent, I don't use stat sticks so I wouldn't be the best person to talk to about them ^^

 

2 minutes ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

CO isn't good on this because I have no elements right?

In my opinion, whether we put CO on a build is about your rate of applying 3+ statuses versus the amount of time you expect an enemy to be alive.  With your weapon being dominated by 2 of only 3 status effects while having a fairly low (when unmodded) status chance, I wouldn't use Condition Overload, because most of the time it probably isn't going to do you any good.

[Sephylon086918]

49 minutes ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

Weeping wounds gives me ~80% added crit at max combo

you mean blood rush? Why do you need that much crit on an innodem? to quote the guy above "what's your goal?"

 

 

50 minutes ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

CO isn't good on this because I have no elements right?

co includes ips, knockdown, lifted, etc

[L3512]

Replace Riven and Gladiator vice with Weeping wounds and primed faction mod if you want better damage.

Oh and use CO.

Edited yesterday at 01:34 AM by L3512

[(XBOX)Player244024418]

8 minutes ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

are not using it for melee

I use it mainly for the parkour boost. 

I just want to use it for the occasional melee hit and be able to deal more initial damage to higher level enemies. Figured more cc p and s would be beneficial.

[Sephylon086918]

you're better off with the praedos if you want the parkour boost imo. Innodem, even with the basic cobweb setup, just slaps as both grounded light attack spam or aerial attack spam. Doing some tests on it now with blast elec melee influence and the new elementalist mod and its been good so far. Could be better setups tho.

Edited yesterday at 03:55 AM by Sephylon086918

[(PSN)Unstar]

12 hours ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

I use it mainly for the parkour boost. 

I just want to use it for the occasional melee hit and be able to deal more initial damage to higher level enemies. Figured more cc p and s would be beneficial.

Hmmm, if you're only occasionally using melee, then any mod that requires building and sustaining combo probably isn't the way to go*.  So I'd avoid Blood Rush, Weeping Wounds, etc and instead use mods that provide flat bonuses like Sacrificial Steel.

In addition, your current build has two sources of increased critical chance and two sources of increased critical damage.  The second mods in each of these categories have diminishing returns on the value they give you, because they stack additively with the first mods.  But Warframe damage is all about multiplication, so you'll likely see better outcomes by instead adding Viral to your build, which will multiply your damage while also increasing your upfront damage.

My recommendations would be this (I'm assuming the mod we can't see in the picture is Organ Shatter):

• Remove the Riven, Blood Rush, and Gladiator Might.
• Add Sacrificial Steel for a large, constant increase to critical chance.
• Add the two 60/60 mods for Cold and Toxin so that you get Viral on your weapon and some more status chance.

I'd also recommend unlocking that Exilus slot and putting in a Tennokai mod.  That will meaningfully increase your damage output, and Innodem is a top-tier melee weapon and is definitely worth the investment.

Hope this helps!

 

*unless you use Naramon as your focus school, since Naramon's passive technically multiplies your combo duration by such a large amount.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 13 Stunden schrieb (XBOX)Player244024418:

I use it mainly for the parkour boost. 

I just want to use it for the occasional melee hit and be able to deal more initial damage to higher level enemies. Figured more cc p and s would be beneficial.

there are actually enough alternatives for speed. Praedos would be better for movement stuff?

but if you're looking for an all-rounder for kick-ass damage, then "weeping wounds" + fast combo and duration + viral and rest in damage. because you're probably using arcane 4x corr stacks, then the weapon will really hit hard. and then you have to adjust the attack speed.

and riven is unfortunately very bad. slash only gives a higher proc chance. and then you'll also be chewing on those shield things for longer.

Edited yesterday at 04:37 PM by Venus-Venera

[(XBOX)Player244024418]

On 2024-07-01 at 6:40 PM, Sephylon086918 said:

you mean blood rush

Yes, sorry.

On 2024-07-01 at 6:40 PM, Sephylon086918 said:

co includes ips, knockdown, lifted, etc

Good to know.

On 2024-07-01 at 10:54 PM, Sephylon086918 said:

Doing some tests on it now with blast elec melee influence and the new elementalist mod and its been good so far.

Interesting 

23 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

your current build has two sources of increased critical chance and two sources of increased critical damage.  The second mods in each of these categories have diminishing returns on the value they give you, because they stack additively with the first mods

Yes but going dor a melee that doesn't depend on combo, wouldn't getting CC closer to 100% be better?

23 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

outcomes by instead adding Viral to your build,

I have teated viral on my secondary and also on my sentinel weapon (helstrum) and I honestly never see a difference in the numbers. I tried it again with my prisma skana using viral on my helstrum and I just don't see it. I do occassionally reach about 4.5M in damage on a heavy attack using tennokai but in a 40min SP grineer session I only noticed a +4M twice, maybe three times. 95% of the hits are 10k-999k. I don't have a helstrum riven. Maybe I have too many status? I believe I have five including viral. So maybe viral just doesn't proc often?

23 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

recommend unlocking that Exilus slot and putting in a Tennokai mod.  That will meaningfully increase your damage output, and Innodem is a top-tier melee weapon and is definitely worth the investment

Yeah. I just don't have any forma and would like to use them on other weapons first, I guess. 

23 hours ago, Venus-Venera said:

Praedos would be better for movement stuff?

I ran both and it's hardly noticeable.

23 hours ago, Venus-Venera said:

because you're probably using arcane 4x corr stacks,

Yeah the corr arcane R5. I bever see corrosive proc visually though 

So...a different question on slash. If slash was on a Nukor riven or Cycron riven (neither have slash) would that riven cause the cycron to proc bleed? Woukd slash be a good stat if the weapon doesn't have it?

[Sephylon086918]

12 minutes ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

Yeah. I just don't have any forma and would like to use them on other weapons first, I guess. 

Iirc acrithis has a built adapter in her shop this week. I think she's selling both a weapon and warframe adapter for 20 pathos each

Edited 7 hours ago by Sephylon086918

[(XBOX)Player244024418]

4 hours ago, Sephylon086918 said:

acrithis has a built adapter

Thanks. Got them both. I thought they were BPs. Why would DE sell a forma BP and also offer an exilus adapter that requires a pre built forma to build? Regardless thanks

[(PSN)Unstar]

4 hours ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

On 2024-07-02 at 8:56 AM, (PSN)Unstar said:

your current build has two sources of increased critical chance and two sources of increased critical damage.  The second mods in each of these categories have diminishing returns on the value they give you, because they stack additively with the first mods

Yes but going dor a melee that doesn't depend on combo, wouldn't getting CC closer to 100% be better?

I think the important thing to realize here is that generally speaking, 100% critical chance isn't any kind of significant threshold.  Like, if you were to plot the average damage-per-hit of your weapon on a graph, with damage on the y-axis and critical chance on the x-axis, you wouldn't see any interesting behavior happening at 100% crit chance.  The entire graph would just be a straight line with a constant slope.

If this were the slowest weapon imaginable (something like a sniper rifle) then I can imagine possibly putting more effort into reaching 100% crit chance so that every shot would reliably crit and thus allow you to consistently 1-shot enemies with your headshots.

But not only do you not need 1-shot kills like a sniper does, you're using the Innodem, a fast dagger weapon.  You'll hit them a lot in a very short period of time, and statistically some of those hits will be crits.  You will kill enemies long before you have a significant combo multiplier.

All of which is to say, nope, 100% crit chance isn't something worth overextending your build for.

[Sephylon086918]

42 minutes ago, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

Thanks. Got them both. I thought they were BPs. Why would DE sell a forma BP and also offer an exilus adapter that requires a pre built forma to build? Regardless thanks

Whats funnier is you have access to this shop, and by extention the arcane adapters in it, before you finish the quest that unlocks arcanes for you

Edited 2 hours ago by Sephylon086918