michaelwii Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Introducing the Latron Prime, ladies and gentlemen. The recent buff to this weapon makes it more powerful than the Soma in every aspect, per shot, DPS, aganist all factions. It does about 5x more damage per shot and about 700 more damage per second. This is, of course, assuming an equal mod-loadout for both weapons. This is based off of dpsframe (updated to 12.0.1) which is pretty cool and reliable. http://i.imgur.com/go8Zd6W.png That being said, SOMA is still best top-tier assault rifle for its automatic nature. EDIT: I'm not saying its role is replaced or that Latron Prime is suddenly best weapon. That's entirely subjective, as everyone is pointing out. What I'm saying, and what can't be argued, is that the soma no longer offers the best damage per second. That is all I meant by "king of DPS". Edited February 7, 2014 by michaelwii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSleep Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 I am a sad ninja. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PsychedelicSnake Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 I like Latron Prime, but I'll stick to my Grakata thank you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HillsAndTheSea Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 id still rather use a soma for infested Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zylin Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Who cares if it's not the king of dps. Other people like myself like the soma because it feels good. Has a nice clip and its pretty accurate and has good crits. It's not about using the best gun in the game, it's about using the gun YOU like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verryn Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Theoretically it does more damage. Whether or not it really has better usability is up for debate. Ah well, luckily I got all the parts from Orokin places. Those rewards are so messed up now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nintega Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Soma was already beaten by Synapse. Not to say I'm opposed to seeing Soma knocked down another peg. I wonder how Synapse and Latron Prime compete now, though. I like Latron Prime, but I'll stick to my Grakata thank you very much. #GrakataMasterRace Edited February 7, 2014 by nintega Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKhaun Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Another on-paper DPS thread from someone loading up nothing but damage mods. *yawn*. Never applicable outside a boss fight, and boss fights are being redone to include phases / weak points / etc so it won't matter there anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwii Posted February 7, 2014 Author Share Posted February 7, 2014 Soma was already beaten by Synapse. Not to say I'm opposed to seeing Soma knocked down another peg. I wonder how Synapse and Latron Prime compete now, though. #GrakataMasterRace Check out the screenshot i just linked. Same loadout on all 3, notice how soma is 2nd and synapse is 3rd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GottaGoFast Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Such damage. Much efficiency. So good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theasl Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 now if only i could get a latron prime without my internet logging me out of survivals... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwii Posted February 7, 2014 Author Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Another on-paper DPS thread from someone loading up nothing but damage mods. *yawn*. Never applicable outside a boss fight, and boss fights are being redone to include phases / weak points / etc so it won't matter there anyway. You're right. This is entirely based off of the numbers of the weapons and their mods. Arguably applicable when you have enemies that are bullet-sponges (in that case damage per shot might be more important), and your point about bossfights getting revamped may be true, but that doesn't mean these "on paper" calculations wouldn't be applicable. You would just need to take into consideration damage per shot, speed of projectile (irrelevant if hitscan), etc. Edited February 7, 2014 by michaelwii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKhaun Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) You're right. This is entirely based off of the numbers of the weapons and their mods. Arguably applicable when you have enemies that are bullet-sponges (in that case damage per shot might be more important), and your point about bossfights getting revamped may be true, but that doesn't mean these "on paper" calculations wouldn't be applicable. You would just need to take into consideration damage per shot, speed of projectile (irrelevant if hitscan), etc. Wrong. False. Nope. Multishot hits 3 guys. You now have +200% damage but the mod shows +0 DPS. It will kill three HP sponges faster than the DPS weapon kills two. Synapse/Brakk never had the range for this and no one caught on. Reload speed is included in DPS, so Soma reloads running down a hall after stuff is dead but Latron reloads five times in combat. DPS just fell off a cliff. I can do this all day with numbers, but I don't need to because playstyle does it for me. Some people will be better at using cover and so have fewer targets to shoot at a time, some people will be better at aiming and so get more DPS out of accurate headshots, some people will be using a warframe ability that helps one or the other more. DPS on paper is totally meaningless unless you're comparing two weapons used the same way vs the same target. If you're actually in a difficulty where DPS matters, a puncture battle rifle and a puncture/slash LMG are miles apart in how you'd use them, where you'd position, etc. Totally meaningless to say 'such and such is the most DPS'. Edited February 7, 2014 by VKhaun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKhaun Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Calculators and spreadsheets for DPS should be PART of a thought process, not a REPLACEMENT for a thought process. Edited February 7, 2014 by VKhaun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwii Posted February 7, 2014 Author Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Wrong. False. Nope. Multishot hits 3 guys. You now have +200% damage but the mod shows +0 DPS. It will kill three HP sponges faster than the DPS weapon kills two. Synapse/Brakk never had the range for this and no one caught on. Reload speed is included in DPS, so Soma reloads running down a hall after stuff is dead but Latron reloads five times in combat. DPS just fell off a cliff. I can do this all day with numbers, but I don't need to because playstyle does it for me. Some people will be better at using cover and so have fewer targets to shoot at a time, some people will be better at aiming and so get more DPS out of accurate headshots, some people will be using a warframe ability that helps one or the other more. DPS on paper is totally meaningless unless you're comparing two weapons used the same way vs the same target. If you're actually in a difficulty where DPS matters, a puncture battle rifle and a puncture/slash LMG are miles apart in how you'd use them, where you'd position, etc. Totally meaningless to say 'such and such is the most DPS'. How does multi-shot hit 3 guys? Last I checked, split chamber maxes out at 90%. It also clearly says (+1092) beside Split Chamber. Reload is important to DPS, yes. But even then, the soma's reload of 3.0 is higher than the Latron's. After doing some quick math however, it's obvious that the clip on the soma ultimately makes it do over 120k damage before needing a reload, unlike the Latron doing 80k before a reload. So the soma can sustain its damage longer, and thus get more damage out of each clip. Latron wouldn't need to reload 5 times as often. Each bullet does 5 times as much damage, so it's like a soma with 75 bullets in the magazine. Would need to reload .33 times more often, and even then, it would do it .6 seconds faster than the soma. I didn't think I needed to explicitly state that I was assuming "all things equal" before stating that soma wasn't king of dps, I would hope that would be already the assumption made. The fact that one is mostly puncture and the other has slash doesn't change anything; the Latron still has higher values aganist all factions. I'm not trying to say DPS should be what you mod for. This obviously changes depending on several different things that math and calculations can't really take into consideration. What I am saying is that soma isn't the king of dps anymore, because the Latron Prime has a higher DPS value than it. Calculators and spreadsheets for DPS should be PART of a thought process, not a REPLACEMENT for a thought process. This is true. I think you misunderstood what I wanted to do with this thread. If I wanted to tell others how to mod their weapons or how DPS is most important thing, I would have put this in "Player helping Player" or "General Discussion". But that wasn't my intent. My intent was to show that soma doesn't have the highest DPS in the game anymore. Edited February 7, 2014 by michaelwii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKhaun Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Multishot = Punch-Through. Sorry, brain fart. If you're backpeddling from king of DPS to "well of course conditions and stuff" then we don't have an argument. My replies were in refference to this post: Introducing the Latron Prime, ladies and gentlemen. The recent buff to this weapon makes it more powerful than the Soma in every aspect, per shot, DPS, aganist all factions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwii Posted February 7, 2014 Author Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Multishot = Punch-Through. Sorry, brain fart. If you're backpeddling from king of DPS to "well of course conditions and stuff" then we don't have an argument. My replies were in refference to this post: Happens to everyone. I think I called it puncture even thought it's punch through now. No, I'm not backpedaling to "well of course conditions and stuff", I assumed people would understand that this can change depending on the conditions (like a bossfight with weakpoints like you mentioned). I made the claim of dps king under the assumption that you would read it understanding "all things equal". I also assumed you would understand the difference between theoretical and actual values; rarely does the real match theory because an endless number of conditions make an impact on the value. I think I'm justified to assuming the first, but the 2nd assumption I made was definitely not something people would think of. Lastly... it IS better than the soma in DPS, damage per shot, and damage to each faction. I do admit that it "in every aspect" wasn't really thought out, as the soma has better crit and damage per clip. So yes, I was wrong about the "in every aspect". What can I say, the prospect of my Latron Prime getting some action excited me and made me reveal my bias <.< Sorry for not making my initial statement both wrong and unclear. Lemme revise and put it here: Introducing the Latron Prime, ladies and gentlemen. The recent buff to this weapon means it can put out more damage per shot and second aganist all factions. Edited February 8, 2014 by michaelwii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKhaun Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 How about... Introducing the Latron Prime, ladies and gentlemen. The recent buff to this weapon means it can put out more damage per shot and second aganist all factions as long as there is an infinite number of targets so drastically different mag/reload schemes don't matter, you're not smart enough to use punch-through, and we assume a range for each where the bullet spread is equal for the same % damage loss from hitting or not hitting a weak point, and all targets die without DPS lost to overkill from the Latron Prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archistopheles Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) You can't really use Latron Prime as a full DPS weapon, though, and Heavy Calibur actually makes it worse DPS because you'll miss weakspots more often than not. Latron Prime's damage is fine because it's not about the DPS with a marksman weapon. (Plus Dread beats out Latron Prime when fighting Fleshy targets) Edited February 8, 2014 by Archistopheles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuifiee Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Except you don't use the full rate of fire and when you miss a shot, your DPS will drop much more that when you miss a shot with the Soma. I'd say the Soma is still one step ahead, but the Latron Prime gets awfully close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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