Proposed Rebalance For Soma/supra

[6079Smith]

To be honest, though, the simple fact that the Supra is balanced based on comparison to the Gorgon - a weapon that performs so miserably itself that it was removed from the market, but is at least lower mastery and doesn't cost an arm and a leg to make - is ridiculous.

 

Y'know, in my opinion they should unretire the Gorgon and give it some buffs (I'm open to suggestions), so in a sense it serves as an Impact-oriented alternative to the Soma and Supra. Think about it;

 

Gorgon:

>Cheaper to produce and easiest mastery rank to reach

>Does better against shields

>Slowest wind-up time

 

Supra:

>Highest Raw DPS, balanced out by high mastery rank and resource requirements

>Does better against armor

>Slow Projectile Speed

 

Soma:

>Highest Crit Rate and Multiplier, at the cost of pathetic base damage and high mastery rank

>Does (somewhat) better against flesh

>Needs more care to really bring out its potential.

 

How about it? Any more ideas?

[(PSN)mkjt88]

I don't think any weapon needs nerfed. All weapons crap out at a certain lvl and the soma is also not the best weapon for real hgh lvl anyway. It's a powerful gun that everyone rank 6 can enjoy and take to higher wave content. I agree some things could use a buff but don't nerf things in the process. Anyone playing over lvl 50's will beg for more weapons like the soma and hate to see the few high wave weapons nerfed for no reason. Also why should all clan tech weapons be better than market weapons? They should both hold top contenders.

Edited February 24, 2014 by (PS4)mkjt88

[Starender]

OP is right, a weapon of the same type that is a lot harder to acquire MUST be better, period.

 

+1

[Davoodoo]

This is the thing though - Supra may "mow down crowds", but with its enormous accuracy issues it's ineffective against enemies spread out or in cover, and between the projectile time and once again the accuracy it's of basically no use at range.

 

Also, 7 forma will make even a MK-1 Braton worth using. Just saying.

 

"Soma outperforms it" - and Soma is a market weapon with a lower mastery rank, and any indication of the suggestion of a nerf to Soma has people crawling out of the woodwork to hate. To be honest, though, the simple fact that the Supra is balanced based on comparison to the Gorgon - a weapon that performs so miserably itself that it was removed from the market, but is at least lower mastery and doesn't cost an arm and a leg to make - is ridiculous.

Heavy machine gun shouldnt be effective against enemies in cover, you have extra dmg and rof to compensate for lack of accuracy, supra performs like intended imo. You want more precision choose assault rifle if you want even more precision semi auto is your choice, even more?? well then sniper rifles

 

Only proves a point that soma dps is unnecessarily high and should be toned down

 

Supra is balanced around side grades idea which was still in works during u8, u9 pretty messed it up with "tiered" weapon progression(its not tiered at all).

Gorgon was pretty useful(before supra was considered op) till we got soma that made all of machine guns obsolete and was taken down due to nearly 0% usage(i havent seen anyone with gorgon or supra once soma was released)

Edited February 24, 2014 by Davoodoo

[(PSN)mkjt88]

Kinda just gonna repeat what i said above is that we need these types of weapons. If you take most other weapons your not gonna last on high lvl def and survival. Most people don't play very high so they don't understand why the soma needs to one shot everything low lvl but instead they call it op. The truth is you take anything besides the big dogs like soma synapse etc to anything starting lvl 50+ your just wasting ammo your not gonna last. Nerfing the top weapons means taking away the ability to fight the hardest enemies in the game... Even with my soma try taking out a few napalms a heavy and few stragglers when their lvl 40-50 and up.. It gets tough even with the soma. No need to nerf at all. If anything boost the weapons that are lacking behind. As far as the soma being the only rifle used.. I disagree. I know personally i used mine to death when i got it but now it mainly just sits in inv. ill whip it out occasionally but for the most part im using a new weapon to lvl or something that fits my particular character at that time. And i see everyone using random weapons all the time.. I don't think i see the soma any more than i do a bow, ignis, synapse, or random low lvl weap.

Edited February 24, 2014 by (PS4)mkjt88

[Davoodoo]

Kinda just gonna repeat what i said above is that we need these types of weapons. If you take most other weapons your not gonna last on high lvl def and survival. Most people don't play very high so they don't understand why the soma needs to one shot everything low lvl but instead they call it op. The truth is you take anything besides the big dogs like soma synapse etc to anything starting lvl 50+ your just wasting ammo your not gonna last. Nerfing the top weapons means taking away the ability to fight the hardest enemies in the game... Even with my soma try taking out a few napalms a heavy and few stragglers when their lvl 40-50 and up.. It gets tough even with the soma. No need to nerf at all. If anything boost the weapons that are lacking behind. As far as the soma being the only rifle used.. I disagree. I know personally i used mine to death when i got it but now it mainly just sits in inv. ill whip it out occasionally but for the most part im using a new weapon to lvl or something that fits my particular character at that time. And i see everyone using random weapons all the time.. I don't think i see the soma any more than i do a bow, ignis, synapse, or random low lvl weap.

The problem is that endless content serves only 1 purpose, to determine what needs rebalance. Snow globe allows you to reach high wave easily?? Bastille stops whole waves?? iron skin makes you invincible?? These already got toned down. You shouldnt ever be able to reach high waves, if you do it means that you exploited the system

Highest enemies you should ever see are at t3 voids and alerts

Devs already said that endless content isnt endgame

[(PSN)mkjt88]

Well myself and many others enjoy doing high wave for fun.. It's more of a challenge and skill to make sure you don't get hit more than a few times or your dead.. If there is no point in high waves why don't they cap enemies at lvl 40 nerf all weapons and frames and once you reach 40 the waves just keep coming out at that lvl.. I wouldn't thnk this would be a good scenario for players or the devs.. Who wants to only play low lvls?? It gets to repetitive. I love the strong weapons and waves and honestly without them i probably would have quit playing warframe after 200-300 hours but knowng i can continue to challenge myself i keep playing. Right now even with a new frame or weapon the lowest lvl i play is xini.. Even then it is a cakewalk with a full group untill atleast lvl 20 But having the good weapons let us challenge ourselves to go further but it still starts low enough so anyone can play even the guys with low mastery and low lvl weapons.. Taking the good ones away just rids of anyone getting to progress past the new players..Many of the hardcore fans i would say would be pretty angry taking away high lvl content. Until a weapon one shots lvl 50-60+ i won't call it OP because when you on up it slows down as well.

Edited February 25, 2014 by (PS4)mkjt88

[Davoodoo]

Well myself and many others enjoy doing high wave for fun.. It's more of a challenge and skill to make sure you don't get hit more than a few times or your dead.. If there is no point in high waves why don't they cap enemies at lvl 40 nerf all weapons and frames and once you reach 40 the waves just keep coming out at that lvl.. I wouldn't thnk this would be a good scenario for players or the devs.. Who wants to only play low lvls?? It gets to repetitive. I love the strong weapons and waves and honestly without them i probably would have quit playing warframe after 200-300 hours but knowng i can continue to challenge myself i keep playing. Right now even with a new frame or weapon the lowest lvl i play is xini.. Even then it is a cakewalk with a full group untill atleast lvl 20 But having the good weapons let us challenge ourselves to go further but it still starts low enough so anyone can play even the guys with low mastery and low lvl weapons.. Taking the good ones away just rids of anyone getting to progress past the new players..Many of the hardcore fans i would say would be pretty angry taking away high lvl content. Until a weapon one shots lvl 50-60+ i won't call it OP because when you on up it slows down as well.

Thats why they dont take it out, if you want to do high waves you can, but game cant be balanced around it.

You say you do it for challenge but having excesive dmg makes it easier, if weapons are to be adjusted to barely deal with 40lvls then still you can high waves but it wont as easy as it is now, atm even weakest weapons make fighting lvls 40 too easy.

Edited February 25, 2014 by Davoodoo

[LazyKnight]

Heavy machine gun shouldnt be effective against enemies in cover, you have extra dmg and rof to compensate for lack of accuracy, supra performs like intended imo. You want more precision choose assault rifle if you want even more precision semi auto is your choice, even more?? well then sniper rifles

Have you used a 5 forma Karak? It is glaring how annoying Supra's wind-up time is, when comparing it to a weapon with the same fire-rate and no wind-up.

 

Supra has too many negative characteristic, and just looking at how it actual handles. Its TTK is always bad because of the wind-up coupled with the 40 initial/final speed. Most of the DPS charts are using '0' for range, and Supra is a horrid weapon when distance is factored in. I have played far too many games with FAR better heavy guns to cut supra any slack for being such a poor example of a weapon.

 

Edit typos

Edited February 25, 2014 by LazyKnight

[HolidayPi3]

Well myself and many others enjoy doing high wave for fun.. It's more of a challenge and skill to make sure you don't get hit more than a few times or your dead.. If there is no point in high waves why don't they cap enemies at lvl 40 nerf all weapons and frames and once you reach 40 the waves just keep coming out at that lvl.. I wouldn't thnk this would be a good scenario for players or the devs.. Who wants to only play low lvls?? It gets to repetitive. I love the strong weapons and waves and honestly without them i probably would have quit playing warframe after 200-300 hours but knowng i can continue to challenge myself i keep playing. Right now even with a new frame or weapon the lowest lvl i play is xini.. Even then it is a cakewalk with a full group untill atleast lvl 20 But having the good weapons let us challenge ourselves to go further but it still starts low enough so anyone can play even the guys with low mastery and low lvl weapons.. Taking the good ones away just rids of anyone getting to progress past the new players..Many of the hardcore fans i would say would be pretty angry taking away high lvl content. Until a weapon one shots lvl 50-60+ i won't call it OP because when you on up it slows down as well.

You say that you need weapons like the Soma to get to high level content, but that content really doesn't feel much different from doing much lower level content... with crappier weapons and crappier frames. If all of the super powered outliers are brought down, then it'll still feel like you're playing "high level content," but the level will be lower. Lower level stuff would actually give you the challenge you're looking for in endless def / survival, and it won't take hours to get to. Of course, this doesn't just mean weapons, but frames as well-- and it just goes to show that the balance in this game... seems very confused as to what it wants to be.

Edited February 25, 2014 by HolidayPi3

[Black-Nasty]

Please stop asking to nerf weapons the community loves.

The community loves it because its the best rifle that you can get. Nerfing its damage slightly and buffing others slightly to make it an even playing field would be a very strong move, as not everyone likes huge clip fast firing guns. I'm more of a fan of Grinlok style weapons, that have a unique firing mechanism. It sucks that because the soma is so strong and the Grinlok is not, that I have to take the soma (or any other extremely powerful weapon) to "end game" level 40+.

[(PSN)mkjt88]

Thats why they dont take it out, if you want to do high waves you can, but game cant be balanced around it.

You say you do it for challenge but having excesive dmg makes it easier, if weapons are to be adjusted to barely deal with 40lvls then still you can high waves but it wont as easy as it is now, atm even weakest weapons make fighting lvls 40 too easy.

But have you tried lvl 50+ with weapons that's not top of the line.. Top weapons make it easier but are necessary.. Low lvl weapons won't kill anything lvl 50 it's not a challenge with them its suicide. Even top weapons are tough to take out the high lvl big boys.

[LastSeraph]

But have you tried lvl 50+ with weapons that's not top of the line.. Top weapons make it easier but are necessary.. Low lvl weapons won't kill anything lvl 50 it's not a challenge with them its suicide. Even top weapons are tough to take out the high lvl big boys.

Sorry man, but you haven't understood the argument the entire time you've been arguing. Soma needs a nerf because it is much stronger than nearly every other top-tier option at the moment. It's true that we can solve it by buffing a bunch of other guns until they're just as strong or stronger than Soma, but it's easier to nerf one than buff five. You've been arguing that Soma's not overpowered because you need it to do high-level content, but somehow you're not seeing that that fact weakens your argument and proves our point instead - if a single gun is so much stronger than the others that it becomes the only option to do high-level content, then it is overpowered and unbalanced.

[(PSN)mkjt88]

I don't even use my soma very often anymore.. When I'm doing the toughest stuff i grab my synapse. What I've posted in earlier posts was that the soma even craps out on really high wave stuff.. There fore there are more powerful weapons out there.. And also many lower weapons out there.. Its a top gun but not the best.. So why pick on it is all I'm saying. And with the new U12 weapons coming out it looks like they are going to outdo everything in their class aswell. Pistols are awesome maybe not the best.. phage is a beast and jat has the highest base charge damage under the galatine.

Edited February 26, 2014 by (PS4)mkjt88

[(NSW)Omgwtfl9lbbl]

Sorry man, but you haven't understood the argument the entire time you've been arguing. Soma needs a nerf because it is much stronger than nearly every other top-tier option at the moment. It's true that we can solve it by buffing a bunch of other guns until they're just as strong or stronger than Soma, but it's easier to nerf one than buff five. You've been arguing that Soma's not overpowered because you need it to do high-level content, but somehow you're not seeing that that fact weakens your argument and proves our point instead - if a single gun is so much stronger than the others that it becomes the only option to do high-level content, then it is overpowered and unbalanced.

 

The Soma is really not as amazing as you make it out to be. There are plenty of weapons at very high level that can match or outperform the Soma. The Soma just happens to be among the easiest to acquire and use. And for whatever reason, it really has no downsides other than ammo efficiency at high level. It just simply happens to be really strong in most categories, but again, it's not like it is the only valid option or even the best option for very high level.

 

The real issue is that it should not be strictly superior to other weapons which should be viable sidegrades. The Supra should be a viable sidegrade that shares similarities with the Soma, not be strictly overshadowed by it.

Edited February 26, 2014 by omgwtflolbbl