About Pvp

[Mastikator2]

kill players in one shot or get killed in one shot, are you calling this fun?

Yes, it means skill is important. Most really good PvP shooters work basically like that.

[BrotherIcarus]

It's not hard for a PvE game to strike an appropriate balance with PvP aspects. When you introduce something, you take it seriously even if it's isn't huge by comparison. Lemme use PvP in Dark Souls for instance. Most of the game content is PvE, let that "little" addition of PvP spawned so much alone. Especially since it stems from the PvE content. PvP is nothing but a good thing for the game, and it doesn't have to drag away the devs attention from the PvE entirely like some people irrationally fear.

 

And I'm also sorry, since no, it isn't going to stay that way. DE said a million times that they will flesh out PvP later.

 

It needs to be understood that you don't have to stun people off to an entirely PvP focused game or an entirely PvE focused game when they feel it's lacking in a title. PvP doesn't have to rival PvE in content. Yet attention still needs to be paid to it at some point. A few fleshed out and balanced PvP options that, ideally, make use of PvE assets is something that would be incredibly healthy for a game like this. 

 

I feel like I'm not really communicating this as well as I could, but I'm hoping you get the picture.

Anyway, DE is going to put some more love into PvP at a later date. That was confirmed like a million times.

What I meant was that it stayed as an optional thing frankly I do not mind the devs spending some time making it better but I want it to stay optional.

Even in dark souls you can turn of PvP.

[SolidSp33d]

Yes, it requires lots of parkour skill, good aiming, stealth, and tactic. Its fast paced and very exciting. One of the best PvP modes i have every played. Can you respect my opinion? If you don't like just don't play there.

 

 

 

 

This is a PvP game too, there is PvP now, deal with it. I like Warframe, and i like PvP in Warframe, i won't play other games.

 

I can't agree with one shots from eeeverything being fun. But I basically see PvP in Warframe, at least after melee 2.0 and focus will be added, as a mix or Darksouls and CS.

 

Being able to maneuver, dodge (seriously DE give dodge rolls some invincibility frames with melee 2.0), parry, and spot opportunities if everything, but if you make too many mistakes you'll lose chunks of health or get one shot depending on the builds.

[DocHolliday13]

 

 

 

This is a PvP game too, there is PvP now, deal with it. I like Warframe, and i like PvP in Warframe, i won't play other games.

 

 

 

No it's not. It has a little PvP minigame thrown in as an afterthought, because DE figured why not. That doesn't make it a PvP game at all. If you're expecting more PvP, well, hate to break it to ya, but you're gonna be disappointed. Deal with it.

[.Talia.]

No it's not. It has a little PvP minigame thrown in as an afterthought, because DE figured why not. That doesn't make it a PvP game at all. If you're expecting more PvP, well, hate to break it to ya, but you're gonna be disappointed. Deal with it.

 

You didn't even read anything didn't you?

 

DE stated that they will eventually focus on improving the PvP aspect of Warframe, that's just on the bottom of their priorities right now. Deal with it.

Edited March 25, 2014 by RexSol

[Agent_of_Change]

Nope, DE stated that they will eventually focus on improving the PvP aspect of Warframe, that's just on the bottom of their priorities right now. Deal with it.

 

Then you have a solution to your problem.  Wait until they reach the bottom of their priority list to get around to it.

 

Everyone can be happy, we don't have to waste any more breath on this and a year or two from now after the game is complete (or as complete as F2P's get.) PvP worth playing might be tacked on.

[DocHolliday13]

You didn't even read anything didn't you?

 

DE stated that they will eventually focus on improving the PvP aspect of Warframe, that's just on the bottom of their priorities right now. Deal with it.

 

I'm sure they did state that. They've stated many things.

[SolidSp33d]

As I said before I'm more of a so long as I can ignore it I don't care if it exists or not.  But the moment that PvP development impacts PvE development even slightly it's at that point I do care and can no longer ignore it.

 

DE is handling it right so far, put PvP on the shelf until such time as they complete the game, I'm in full support of that policy.  People just have to understand that this is a PvE game first and foremost regardless of how they'd rather play it. 

 

Most people who advocate for PvP do understand that. What many people who play solely for PvE don't understand is that beating others down for just giving feedback on PvP or saying something about it is pretty scumbag.

 

Also PvP players aren't in the wrong if they ask for a little intervention with some things in PvP. Tweaking a few damage numbers on impulse doesn't take much of any effort and is fine considering PvP is going to be in very rough testing stages for a while. And it isn't going to pull a drastic amount of attention from other aspects of the game if they give conclaves a few quality of life adjustments.

 

And on other note, why is it that we put such a rigid divide between the two? Much of what DE is working on right now effects PvP as much as it does PvE. That's because Things like Melee 2.0 and Focus effect gameplay across the board. Taking some time to check numbers on PvP and tweak a few things solely based on the feedback to observe what happens doesn't take much work. The PvP people would be happy to test that.

 

Also, don't expect there never to be a decent expansion on the PvP side. When you introduce something to a game, making it good and compelling is what you need to do. Giving PvP some level in the form of more tangible content is perfectly fine. If people whined and whined that a large part of a far off Update was centered on PvP I wouldn't know what to think. They are out to make a good and unique game and all the factors of it are included. If the PvE is doing solid enough and is just on the receiving end of a bolster to some lasting endgame content, then there is not reason to add to PvP, which inherently is endgame content for another side of the player base.

 

I could go on for hours discussing my thoughts on this. Though I feel like I'm just giving a taste on some things and then stopping sort of better explanation since it'll take an hour. 

[Anatolius]

I dont mine PvP it is something my clan and I participate in for S#&$s and giggles

That being said, like has has before, it is unbalanced but should not be removed.

 

I will have to disagree that this game is not a PvP game even though it has instances of PvP

It is a PvE game with some competitive aspects. Its like writing a paper about dogs and mentioning cats a few times and then saying the person who wrote it is a cat lover: there isn't enough justification for it. But PvP does exist and should be noticed as something that players do enjoy

 

also I dont think PvP needs rewards

rewards fuel aggression and instead of having fun, you all fight to get something out of it

I will repeat that PvP and conclaves should be something you do for fun to test your skills with others. There is nothing wrong with healthy competition.

 

One day it will be a fun balanced game mode that I will return to publicly

but not right now, not its in current state.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Anatolius

[SolidSp33d]

No it's not. It has a little PvP minigame thrown in as an afterthought, because DE figured why not. That doesn't make it a PvP game at all. If you're expecting more PvP, well, hate to break it to ya, but you're gonna be disappointed. Deal with it.

 

I hate to break it to you because DE said a million times they will expand more on pvp when the main systems of the game and pve is in a healthy spot.

[SolidSp33d]

Then you have a solution to your problem.  Wait until they reach the bottom of their priority list to get around to it.

 

Everyone can be happy, we don't have to waste any more breath on this and a year or two from now after the game is complete (or as complete as F2P's get.) PvP worth playing might be tacked on.

 

I kind of made it obvious with the last post I made to you, but seriously it's clear that isn't the solution to the problem considering he didn't raise a problem like that. What is his OP about? People being asshats the second some people talk about PvP and that being a problem. What isn't the problem? Knowing that any extensive work on PvP is later on the pipeline.

 

The problem is people ripping on the PvP community for little to no valid reason. It's like Salem in these forums sometimes.

 

I'm not even an avid PvP player. I've played conclaves like..three times?

I just happen to see the potential in it an look forward to it being worked on later. 

I also happen to dislike so many people being close minded and plain rude to anyone who utters the word PvP, or those who haven't really played enough games with expansive PvE as well as deep PvP with neither taking anything away from the other.

 

(Some people here would drop dead irl if they played DarkSouls with people invading or played Wildstar in a PvP server. I swear. )

Edited March 25, 2014 by SolidSp33d

[_Absolom_]

How is this not a PvP game? There is PvP so it is a PvP game.

Quite easily, sir. The game is focused, about 90%, on PvE. Having any kind of PvP content does not make a whole game PvP based. You need to understand that. PvP was added later, because the community was whining for it so much. And now they whine about OP content, they call for nerfs, and basically sicken the forums. I know that people like PvP out there, I for one dislike it as much as a man can do so. However, I don't think that DE's main concern at the moment should be balancing in the conclaives.

[Agent_of_Change]

Most people who advocate for PvP do understand that. What many people who play solely for PvE don't understand is that beating others down for just giving feedback on PvP or saying something about it is pretty scumbag.

 

Also PvP players aren't in the wrong if they ask for a little intervention with some things in PvP. Tweaking a few damage numbers on impulse doesn't take much of any effort and is fine considering PvP is going to be in very rough testing stages for a while. And it isn't going to pull a drastic amount of attention from other aspects of the game if they give conclaves a few quality of life adjustments.

 

And on other note, why is it that we put such a rigid divide between the two? Much of what DE is working on right now effects PvP as much as it does PvE. That's because Things like Melee 2.0 and Focus effect gameplay across the board. Taking some time to check numbers on PvP and tweak a few things solely based on the feedback to observe what happens doesn't take much work. The PvP people would be happy to test that.

 

Also, don't expect there never to be a decent expansion on the PvP side. When you introduce something to a game, making it good and compelling is what you need to do. Giving PvP some level in the form of more tangible content is perfectly fine. If people whined and whined that a large part of a far off Update was centered on PvP I wouldn't know what to think. They are out to make a good and unique game and all the factors of it are included. If the PvE is doing solid enough and is just on the receiving end of a bolster to some lasting endgame content, then there is not reason to add to PvP, which inherently is endgame content for another side of the player base.

 

I could go on for hours discussing my thoughts on this. Though I feel like I'm just giving a taste on some things and then stopping sort of better explanation since it'll take an hour. 

 

My short answer:  Because Warframe is a PvE game.  (it was conceived as a PvE game, It was sold as a PvE game, the vast majority of the players are here for a PvE game, look at the posts in this thread alone mostly pro PvE).  PvP is in a lot of games, the push back is primarily from the justified worry that the screaming of the pro-PvP folks will end up having resources diverted to deal with PvP issues, which in turns affects PvE development which in turn slows down the part of the game that the vast majority of us here actually care about.

 

The hard divide comes because this is the internet.  Some people are very zero sum, my stance is that if it doesn't effect me i could care less.  What's more is that the PvP have their answer, re-iterated by the OP in this thread no less. "PvP is at the bottom of the priority list"  PvP, by DE's own reckoning is not as important as anything else they are currently doing or considering doing for the PvE side.  That is what makes this a PvE game if nothing else.

 

But then we come to these threads, if the answer, "DE will get to it when they are done with everything else" was taken with any kind of grace there would be no problem.  But these threads basically exist, not so innocently as a way to give feedback on the current PvP as there is literally nothing that hasn't already been said about duels/conclave already, No they are started to kick up controversy and try to drum up support to push DE to move PvP up the Priority ladder, and we all know that is the truth.  And that is why they are flooded with opposition, because the PvE crowd (read most of warframe players) needs to drown out the PvP players, which honestly isn't all that hard considering that, once again, Warframe is a PvE game above all else.

[SolidSp33d]

Quite easily, sir. The game is focused, about 90%, on PvE. Having any kind of PvP content does not make a whole game PvP based. You need to understand that. PvP was added later, because the community was whining for it so much. And now they whine about OP content, they call for nerfs, and basically sicken the forums. I know that people like PvP out there, I for one dislike it as much as a man can do so. However, I don't think that DE's main concern at the moment should be balancing in the conclaives.

 

Players who snap at players simply giving feedback on a mode in the game is far more sickening.

[.Talia.]

Quite easily, sir. The game is focused, about 90%, on PvE. Having any kind of PvP content does not make a whole game PvP based. You need to understand that. PvP was added later, because the community was whining for it so much. And now they whine about OP content, they call for nerfs, and basically sicken the forums. I know that people like PvP out there, I for one dislike it as much as a man can do so. However, I don't think that DE's main concern at the moment should be balancing in the conclaives.

 

I agree with you, DE's main concern at the moment should NOT be balancing the Conclaves or PVP mode. There are more important things. But that doesn't means they should remove this game mode, or just leave it abandoned forever. There are many players who like PvP in Warframe, and the Conclave do need some balancing.

 

 

 But these threads basically exist, not so innocently as a way to give feedback on the current PvP as there is literally nothing that hasn't already been said about duels/conclave already, No they are started to kick up controversy and try to drum up support to push DE to move PvP up the Priority ladder, and we all know that is the truth.  And that is why they are flooded with opposition, because the PvE crowd (read most of warframe players) needs to drown out the PvP players, which honestly isn't all that hard considering that, once again, Warframe is a PvE game above all else.

 

You are wrong, this was not the intention of this thread, read again the OP

Edited March 25, 2014 by RexSol

[Hyunsai]

There is Flappy Bird in Warframe, so Warframe is a Flappy Bird game.

 

Once it will be higher on their priorities, DE will focus on it.

[.Talia.]

There is Flappy Bird in Warframe, so Warframe is a Flappy Bird game.

 

Once it will be higher on their priorities, DE will focus on it.

 

PvP is not some mini-game. Its a complete game mode.

[SolidSp33d]

No they are started to kick up controversy and try to drum up support to push DE to move PvP up the Priority ladder, and we all know that is the truth. 

 

Dude are you serious? I can't even believe you read the OP's post and got an idea like that.

People get flamed everytime they make a feedback post on PvP or mention an idea they have for PvP, and a thread seeking to address that hostile attitude and vent a little about it must have some ulterior motive?

 

Dude. As someone who's not even part of the PvP community, I would have eventually made this thread. He's calling out people mindlessly shutting out everything PvP related or putting words into the mouths of those you like it or the idea of it. There's nothing wrong or suspicious about that.

Something like this is bound to start an argument, but he's speaking his mind because it's something that they shouldn't really have to deal with. Not trying to make a firestorm to get dev attention or something. If he is than he fooled me, but it looks painfully obvious from his post that he isn't out to do that. And just taking a quick look at the behavior of the community, it's very well supported.

Edited March 25, 2014 by SolidSp33d

[.Talia.]

Dude are you seriously? I can't even believe you read the OP's post and got an idea like that.

People get flamed everytime they make a feedback post on PvP or mention an idea they have for PvP, and a thread seeking to address that hostile attitude and vent a little about it must have some ulterior motive?

 

Dude. As someone who's not even part of the PvP community, I would have eventually made this thread. He's calling out people mindlessly shutting out everything PvP related or putting words into the mouths of those you like it or the idea of it. There's nothing wrong or suspicious about that.

Something like this is bound to start an argument, but he's speaking his mind because it's something that they shouldn't really have to deal with. Not trying to make a firestorm to get dev attention or something. If he is than he fooled me, but it looks painfully obvious from his post that he isn't out to do that. And just taking a quick look at the behavior of the community, it's very well supported.

 

I bet most of these guys didn't even read anything i said in the OP

[SolidSp33d]

PvP is not some mini-game. Its a complete game mode.

 

He meant that as support. If there is something as silly as flappy bird in the game, then they'll sure as hell get to something like PvP.

[MDRLOz]

Conclaves are there. Mostly people dont use them. 

 

Im happy to hear that there is a small community out there keeping pvp alive.

 

Some day we will probably see more pvp in warframe, once all the game systems are expanded and ironed out.

 

So keep the dream alive guys. 

[SolidSp33d]

Conclaves are there. Mostly people dont use them. 

 

Im happy to hear that there is a small community out there keeping pvp alive.

 

Some day we will probably see more pvp in warframe, once all the game systems are expanded and ironed out.

 

So keep the dream alive guys. 

 

My thoughts in a nutshell.

[neKroMancer]

Good to hear hat there are people who use conclave regularly. 

 

However, the game is mainly PvE and has been so for over a year. Conclave is unpolished, unbalanced, and badly executed feature in this game. I understand that there are players who find Warframe's aesthetic pleasing and want to play PvP with these skins and their need have been partially met. I just hope that, for the time being, DE don't waste time and resource with this minor feature when the main game is in need of fixing in many aspects.

[.Talia.]

Conclaves are there. Mostly people dont use them. 

 

Im happy to hear that there is a small community out there keeping pvp alive.

 

Some day we will probably see more pvp in warframe, once all the game systems are expanded and ironed out.

 

So keep the dream alive guys. 

 

[Incudem]

Direct PvP like conclave wont ever be the main focus of the game. And like DE has said before it  will be optional and wont interfere with PvE mechanics.

 

I see Badlands itself as an indirect PvP mechanic and that seems to have been met with positive feedback.

 

^The worth of PvP is all about the execution of it. Who knows, maybe if DE gets some good suggestions instead of negativity on how to change conclave it might turn into something a lot more people could end up liking.

 

Anyway as Agent_of_Change said before it is at the bottom of the list of things to do. Don't worry about it "getting in the way" of other planned features any time soon.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Incudem