Some Unique Additions To Melee 2.0

[FoxFX]

My previous thread did not go as smoothly as I had hoped so I decided to try steer away from deterring the current Melee 2.0 system (other than a suggestion of channeling), and suggest something that should still preserve the challenge going melee only still delivers. I've already revised this on the megathread.

 

Observations

 

1> Parrying certain enemies (like trying to use the blocking function to stun Tenno Specters and Stalker) does not work.

 

2> Reflecting Bullets should be a bit more rewarding

 

3> Finishers should be more rewarding

 

4>Channeling is a bit costly since each hit you loose your Energy under Channeling Mode, and alot of players argue about having Channeling an on/off skill

 

[Suggestions]

 

 

Channeling

1>Channeling should be a duration ability (ex. Activating Channeling cost 20 Energy to remain in Channeling Mode for 10 seconds) this eliminates any inefficiency on using Channeling at the wrong time in risky situations

2> While in Channeling Mode, each melee attack will not cost you energy for each hit under Channeling Mode.

 

3> In this version of Channeling, Channeling will feel a bit like ho DMC's Devil Trigger mode where you have to pay an Energy Cost to be in that mode for a small duration. This not only gives players some more option to use Channeling Mods like Second Wind (which a lot of players find that mod a bit lacking now), but also gives players a chance to combine their abilities with melee mode for a more efficient energy cost.

 

 

Parrying

1> Parrying should also be a duration ability where after you press the block button (the right-click mouse button), there is a duration where the Parrying effect occurs.

(For instance, the Parrying effect works at the moment I push the block button, but only lasts 1 second after using the Block button. A Grineer is attacking me with an axe and I am holding the Block button for around 3 seconds after his axe connects. As a result, the Parrying effect is not there at the moment the axe connects, and the Grineer is not stunned. But if it connects its axe within 1/2 a second after I push the Block button, the Parrying effect occurs and the Grineer will be stunned.)

2> Every melee weapon should have an inert Reflection Stat which states how much damage is reflected form the enemy bullets.

 

3> To not cause confusion, blocking/parrying will still require Stamina cost to balance things out

 

4> Reflecting Bullets should have some means to stun enemies so that the player can move closer to the stunned enemy and launch a Finisher

 

5> Tenno Specters and Stalker should be vulnerable to parrying and stun, but not to stun by melee combos

 

6> These suggestions should make parrying about timing and keep the challenge melee 2.0 gives as well as making it more convenient to go close quarters with enemies.

 

Finisher Attacks (So far, I think there are three finishers: Stun Finishers, Stealth Finishers, and Ground Finishers)

 

1> Killing an enemy with a Finisher should grant more affinity, larger quantity of drops (like ammo), and an increased chance of dropping rarer drops. (This effect increases slightly further during Channeling Mode)

 

Order of Types of Finishers that grant more drops/affinity/increase in rare drops (left to right)

 

Stealth Finisher> Stun Finisher=Ground Finisher

 

2> Finisher Damage should be shown in the Melee Stats and maybe increase the damage

 

3> This could give players a reason to use Finishers more often and should diversify melee customization more if they want to mod their melees for Finisher Attacks instead of pure Damage builds

 

Mods

 

1> There should be a mod that gives reflected bullets form blocking an increase chance to stun a shooting enemy with a reflected bullet. (could possibly be done when under Channeling Mode only)

 

2> If Channeling Mode were to be a duration ability, there should be Warframe Mods that should Increase the duration of Channeling Mode

 

3> With the suggestion of the Parrying effect, there should be a Warframe Mod that increases the duration of the parrying effect as soon as the block button is hit (for a relatively small increase).

 

comments?

Edited April 20, 2014 by FoxFX

[Vargras]

Disagree with parry working on "certain enemies". Blocking/parrying is already quite strong, to be able to do so on some of the harder mobs in the game (and possibly execute them) just removes the challenge associated with them. I shouldn't be able to parry and execute Stalker.

 

Disagree with reflecting bullets not being rewarding. The major reward from that is that you are taking no damage at all. The fact that you'll sometimes bounce them right back at enemies (and injure or kill them) is icing on the cake.

 

Agree with some finishers needing to be more rewarding, but that depends wholly on the stance and the finisher.

 

Heavily disagree with channeling being a duration mode. First of all:

this eliminates any inefficiency on using Channeling at the wrong time in risky situations

It is 100% the player's fault for using channeling at a bad time. That differentiates good players from bad ones, and removing that just dumbs down the system. Not only that, but the current system allows more customization than what you propose -- players may either go for a light melee build and ignore many of the channeling mods, or they may do the opposite and try to compensate for the higher energy costs (as the channeling mods are also more powerful). Making things even more efficient would likely lead to people stacking channeling mods, for the simple reason that they're often better (and stronger) than non-channeling.

[FoxFX]

Disagree with parry working on "certain enemies". Blocking/parrying is already quite strong, to be able to do so on some of the harder mobs in the game (and possibly execute them) just removes the challenge associated with them. I shouldn't be able to parry and execute Stalker.

 

Disagree with reflecting bullets not being rewarding. The major reward from that is that you are taking no damage at all. The fact that you'll sometimes bounce them right back at enemies (and injure or kill them) is icing on the cake.

 

Agree with some finishers needing to be more rewarding, but that depends wholly on the stance and the finisher.

 

Heavily disagree with channeling being a duration mode. First of all:

 

 

It is 100% the player's fault for using channeling at a bad time. That differentiates good players from bad ones, and removing that just dumbs down the system. Not only that, but the current system allows more customization than what you propose -- players may either go for a light melee build and ignore many of the channeling mods, or they may do the opposite and try to compensate for the higher energy costs (as the channeling mods are also more powerful). Making things even more efficient would likely lead to people stacking channeling mods, for the simple reason that they're often better (and stronger) than non-channeling.

 So stunning Stalker is out of the question, ok.

 

I still feel that maybe blocking bullets should have some innate damage reflected, and that reflecting a bullet will have a small chance of stunning a "non-boss" enemy for a Finisher.

 

The channeling thing was to at least ease the popular suggestion of making Channeling an on/off skill. I have no qualms with the current Channeling system and heavily disagree on having Channeling as an on/off thing. I only made this suggestion as a more intermediary between holding and on/off.

 

About the rewarding Finisher attacks, I strongly feel that we need to see how much damage a Finisher does when viewing melee weapons on the game. Also, I have no idea the  correlation between Finisher damage and Stealth Finishers (If finisher Damage is something equal to a weapon's Finisher stat multiplied by some number).

[Vargras]

The channeling thing was to at least ease the popular suggestion of making Channeling an on/off skill. I have no qualms with the current Channeling system and heavily disagree on having Channeling as an on/off thing. I only made this suggestion as a more intermediary between holding and on/off.

I've messaged Rebecca in the past, and she said the devs are aware of people wanting a toggle for channeling.

[FoxFX]

I've messaged Rebecca in the past, and she said the devs are aware of people wanting a toggle for channeling.

Did they ever respond to whether of not its a wise decision to do so?

[Vargras]

Did they ever respond to whether of not its a wise decision to do so?

[FoxFX]

 

Did they ever respond to whether of not its a wise decision to do so?

 

 Well, like you Vargas, if I were to choose between an on/off system to the system I suggested. I'd rather prefer the duration version. But as of now, I don't mind holding it.

 

Other than that, what about my suggestion on changing the way parry works?

[FoxFX]

Or any suggestion about having reflected bullets having a small chance to stun non-boss enemies for a Finisher Attack?

[FoxFX]

bumping...

[FoxFX]

might do a Suggestion thread for Dark Sector

[Llyssa]

Ew. I dislike your channeling change entirely. I have my weapons built so that it costs 2 energy per strike, if I choose to use it, and I only choose to use it for a quick health boost(life strike). I don't want to waste a boatload of energy on a "mode" that could be running pointlessly while all enemies are dead and I have to find more.

 

Dislike your parrying idea. You can already move forward while blocking, so if you need to block while approaching the enemy, that's entirely feasible. There's already mods for damage reflection on block.

 

However, I DO like the idea of finishers giving a chance of bonus loot. Atm, they're mainly just an "I REALLY didn't mean to do that" interruption to comboes. If they had a chance of reward via bonus drop, it'd actually be worth trying to use them on purpose--the animation is still an unsightly lockout.

[FoxFX]

Ew. I dislike your channeling change entirely. I have my weapons built so that it costs 2 energy per strike, if I choose to use it, and I only choose to use it for a quick health boost(life strike). I don't want to waste a boatload of energy on a "mode" that could be running pointlessly while all enemies are dead and I have to find more.

 

Dislike your parrying idea. You can already move forward while blocking, so if you need to block while approaching the enemy, that's entirely feasible. There's already mods for damage reflection on block.

 

However, I DO like the idea of finishers giving a chance of bonus loot. Atm, they're mainly just an "I REALLY didn't mean to do that" interruption to comboes. If they had a chance of reward via bonus drop, it'd actually be worth trying to use them on purpose--the animation is still an unsightly lockout.

 Kinda getting alot of disagreements with my Parrying idea and the Channeling idea, but a lot of positives for the Finisher idea.

 

The only reason why I added that parrying idea was to at least favor my "extra loot for killing enemies with a Finisher" idea. But i guess I'll leave the current Parry mod to do that job instead.

[FoxFX]

bumping...

[FoxFX]

bumping...

[FoxFX]

bumping...

[FoxFX]

bumping

[FoxFX]

bumping

[FoxFX]

bumping

[FoxFX]

bumping

[FoxFX]

last bump