Replacing Exterminate

[Ghobe]

Except it's not done for rewards (if talking outside of void). I also happen to quite enjoy Void Exterminate

Obnoxiously long point not taken away

The point of Exterminate is not to reward you with exp or drops, Defence and Survival are there for that. The point is to give a straight forward "kill all the things" mission.

Kill all the handful of things. There's hardly even an enemy count. The only way an exterminate can be described is "safe" and people around here appear to like their safe mission.

 

P.S. You know what else is "obnoxiously long"? 90 minute survivals and 70+ wave defenses, but people still do them on a daily basis.

 

 

 

Iiii was not aware of this... Well now im sad :(

It wasn't what you think it was.

 

 

 

You keep countering everyone saying "but I enjoy exterms and use do them to level/explore/etc" with "You should run surv/(m)def instead." Not everyone wants to do things in the most effective way possible. DE shouldn't remove exterms for the same reasons they haven't deleted all the sub-par weapons from the game. People enjoy exterminate missions for a variety of missions, and while they may have a pretty simple premise, they still offer something no other mission type currently does. Removing them and replacing them with a mission that amounts to a campaigns worth of MD and other mission types would make the game less diverse. Your new mission type could be fun, but it should not replace exterminate. Removing exterminates adds nothing to the the game, and in fact takes away from it. You find them pointless, but as can be seen in this thread, a large number of people don't. Removing them makes the game less fun for us, while the act of removing them adds nothing for you or anyone else.

So it's perfectly ok for a mission to be incredibly inefficient? It's not like it's 10% behind, it's 50-70% behind. I would really love to see a chart from DE about how much each mission type gets run, especially with taking out starmap clears.

 

Also I'll say it again, I didn't suggest to remove it completely. I simply stated to switch it to alerts and tutorials while replacing it on the starmap with some other mission and a new mission type(most planets have 2 exterminates). We could increase the rate at which exterminate alerts appear if that makes you happy.

Edited May 11, 2014 by Ghobe

[Endrance]

To OP, your suggestion is epic, but it makes the mission too long/hard.

 

The only way i see DE adding this is either the following options:

 

Seasonal event - Once a year

Epic Event - Like all others, happened once, no date for again.

Alert only/special occasions - Best bet to have it.

 

 

I would increase Exterminate missions to 5x more mobs to kill. But this suggestion, is way bigger for just a new "tweak" to a mission.

 

Increase Exterminate mob number? yep.

 

Add "Annihilation" mission (the one you described)? Yep. Has massive bonus reward, and POSSIBLY, more "open map" than others. In other words. 4+ Tenno. Not only a 4 man squad. The mission has challenge for 8 or 12 members at the time

[Ghobe]

and POSSIBLY, more "open map" than others. In other words. 4+ Tenno. Not only a 4 man squad. The mission has challenge for 8 or 12 members at the time

This won't happen unless DE bites the bullet and moves to dedicated servers instead of P2P. Most people's ISP services cut out once you're hosting for 5 players.

[Warriorrogue]

No on so many levels.

 

#1 Vandals are supposed to be one offs that are never reintroduced. Exclusivity.

#2 Rewards are far, far too great.

Aside from the braton/lato vandals, they're talking about reintroducing them, along with the wraiths.

[Ghobe]

Because you get more challenge out of it, it's aimed at high waves and good drops. Exterminate is not, which you seem to not be able to comprehend. Exterminate is fun, not "safe". This is your opinion and not an argument.

I can't speak on "fun" you're right, but I can speak on safe. And exterminates are very, very safe.

 

Aside from the braton/lato vandals, they're talking about reintroducing them, along with the wraiths.

Well I'm sure that I'm not alone in being against that.

[D4rkAv3ng3r]

Does anyone here actually play Nightmare? Cause exterminate on nightmare is only one I play to get nightmare mods. Others are just to risky and not worth my time. I also use exterminate mission whenever I need to get smaller ammounts of xp really fast. I really dont think it should change to anything else.

Edited May 11, 2014 by D4rkAv3ng3r

[Ghobe]

Does anyone here actually play Nightmare? Cause exterminate on nightmare is only one I play to get nightmare mods. Others are just to risky and not worth my time.

Again...exterminates are safe. Thank you for proving my point.

[Mokkania]

Again...exterminates are safe. Thank you for proving my point.

what's the problem

[Ghobe]

what's the problem

Nightmare _____ is safe. That should not be a thing.

[00zau]

Okay, one more time.

 

I enjoy running exterminate missions. I, and presumably other people who run exterminate missions, don't care if they're 50% less efficient than MD. We've all still found one or more reasons to run them.

 

Exterminate missions are different from other missions. Every other mission type has respawning enemies, which means you'll have enemies coming up behind you even after you've cleared an area. Exterminate missions are not like that. Exterminate missions let you 'take it slow' and still finish in a reasonable amount of time (taking any other mission type slow will quickly bog down with enemies spawning nearly as fast as you kill them, and from all sides, slowing progress greatly if you try to kill them.

 

Your proposal fails to replace exterminate missions with a mission type that provides the differences of exterminate missions. Your proposal is a combination of other mission types, which means it will behave much like those missions. It could be fun for a raid, or an additional new challenge mission type, but it does not provide what exterminate missions do. It does not provide the linearity or "safe backs" that exterminate does; it's just a gussied up mashup of existing mission types.

 

Thus, there is no reason to remove exterminate missions. Exterminate missions existence doesn't harm you. If you don't find them enjoyable, don't run them. There are 4-5 other mission types for you to play. Your proposal for a new mission type would add yet another. Removing exterminate missions will not directly enhance your enjoyment of the game, while it will detract from my enjoyment of the game. No gains, yes losses, not a good idea.

[Ghobe]

And allow me to say it again. I am not saying to remove exterminate all together. But whatever.

[Xylia]

And allow me to say it again. I am not saying to remove exterminate all together. But whatever.

 

Your suggestions in this thread to make each mission with 500 (or whatever crazy number of mobs) would turn what is a good fast mission into a slogfest that takes an hour+.

 

Eh... I'd rather not do that.

 

Nor do I want to stick mini-interceptions in it (I hate interception, which I already covered in this thread), nor do I want Survival-esque gameplay either (I like the killing, I hate the air mechanic and how RNG can screw you over if it so chooses).

[00zau]

And allow me to say it again. I am not saying to remove exterminate all together. But whatever.

You literally said to remove all set exterminate missions from the star map, with the exception of Terminus. Even if they remain for invasions, that still means there is only one on-demand exterminate mission on the star-map. If I want to run an exterm on ceres or saturn to relax and maybe get an orokin cell, or run an exterminate against a specific level and possibly type of enemy, I can't. Same issue we've had with infested being removed from the star-chart; we can't pick when and where to fight the infested, we're stuck with yet another RNG.

[Ghobe]

Your suggestions in this thread to make each mission with 500 (or whatever crazy number of mobs) would turn what is a good fast mission into a slogfest that takes an hour+.

 

Eh... I'd rather not do that.

What if...

Mercury: 60-120

Venus: 150-250

Earth: 350-500

Jupiter/Mars/Saturn: 450-650

Sedna/Europa/Phobos/Uranus/Early Eris/T1 Void: 600-750

Late Eris/Neptune/Early Ceres/Early Pluto/T2 Void: 700-850

Late Ceres/Late Pluto/T3 Void/Derelict: 800-1k

 

Sound better to you people complaining about the unit count?

 

You literally said to remove all set exterminate missions from the star map, with the exception of Terminus. Even if they remain for invasions, that still means there is only one on-demand exterminate mission on the star-map. If I want to run an exterm on ceres or saturn to relax and maybe get an orokin cell, or run an exterminate against a specific level and possibly type of enemy, I can't. Same issue we've had with infested being removed from the star-chart; we can't pick when and where to fight the infested, we're stuck with yet another RNG.

We could increase the rate at which exterminate alerts appear if that makes you happy.

[Sindrall]

         You are really missing the point, it is not all about "efficiency" It is about fun. People have fun with a game mode that is at a slower pace and where they do NOT have to constantly be running and jumping and ducking and rolling and sometimes spamming skills. Your back is safe, you can take your time. That is a very very nice change of pace in a game where it is ALL very action packed. That is not a bad thing but still there has to be some form of a change of pace or that one and only pace you have will drive you insane.

 

          I do still think that I personally would like your mission, but as and alert mission or event as previously stated  by others. It should in no way be a replacement and saying adding exterms to the alert cycle is not a very good solution. it should be the other way around. Again i like the idea though, maybe try to refine it and give it some uniqueness instead of it being a mash of different game modes.

[Ghobe]

Why are you perfectly ok with having easy/safe missions at high level? Shouldn't that stuff be hard?

[00zau]

We could increase the rate at which exterminate alerts appear if that makes you happy.

Did you even read my post? That doesn't help with the "on demand" issue. If I want to run a mission of a certain variety, I shouldn't be beholden to the RNG gods to do. Look at infested missions. If I just build a new gun or sword that would be good against infested and want to run it in some infested missions, but there aren't any infested incursions going on in a low level sector, I'm SOL. I don't want that happening to a mission type as well as a faction.

[00zau]

Why are you perfectly ok with having easy/safe missions at high level? Shouldn't that stuff be hard?

If people want hard missions, they'll run hard missions. What's wrong with having some easier than average missions?

[Ghobe]

Did you even read my post? That doesn't help with the "on demand" issue. If I want to run a mission of a certain variety, I shouldn't be beholden to the RNG gods to do. Look at infested missions. If I just build a new gun or sword that would be good against infested and want to run it in some infested missions, but there aren't any infested incursions going on in a low level sector, I'm SOL. I don't want that happening to a mission type as well as a faction.

Dark Sectors.

 

If people want hard missions, they'll run hard missions. What's wrong with having some easier than average missions?

Why should high level content be easy?

[00zau]

Dark Sectors.

 

 

 

Why should high level content be easy?

Dark sectors can be under conflict, and for several months before they were out, there was no permanent infested presence on the star map, which is more what I was talking about.

 

Who defines what high level content is? If you think it's easy, I guess it's not high level content, then, right?

Edited May 12, 2014 by 00zau

[Ghobe]

Dark sectors can be under conflict, and for several months before they were out, there was no permanent infested presence on the star map, which is more what I was talking about.

They aren't in conflict for long and there's an infested invasion pretty much every other day on low-mid level planets.

 

Who defines what high level content is? If you think it's easy, I guess it's not high level content, then, right?

...seriously? The high content would be the content that's at the upper end of the level spectrum of the game. Now go say something less troll-y.

[00zau]

...seriously? The high content would be the content that's at the upper end of the level spectrum of the game. Now go say something less troll-y.

But that's not the case, even not counting exterminate missions. Difficulty in Defense and Survival missions is almost entirely a function of time spent after a certain point. Staying for 3 hours on Appolodorus is going to be a helluva lot harder than running a capture or whatever non-endless mission on Pluto or Ceres. End game is determined by what the player base decides is endgame. In the current meta, 'endgame' is basically limited to long-run Survival and Defense, and maybe some of the harder non-endless t3 missions.

[Ghobe]

Did I say "endgame"? Pretty sure I said "high level". Two different entities.

[Sindrall]

          No where does it state in some RULE BOOK of gaming that high level content MUST be hard... This is not true in other games it certainly does not have to be true here. Like he 00zau said above the level is as hard as YOU make it. You can go run a T3 survival, and the first 10 minutes is a piece of cake.. therefore, easy. In this way all content is easy. If you want it hard, you make it hard by pushing it further. You also completely ignored the point i made in my earlier comment, and the points of everyone else, that it is the change of pace an the ability to progress at ones own pace that makes exterm desirable. It is not always about being hard..Some things are just for fun.

 

          It is also not always about getting the best gear and mods 24-7... It is ultimately about being fun.. if you enjoy just pushing levels to "hard" boundaries 24-7, then by all means do so. Other people however do not like that and want a mission that is inherently easy and safe, to relax and enjoy the game in. However, i expect you to miss this point as well because you cannot comprehend someone not thinking like you do, or not liking exactly what you do, so you simply come back with either insults or remarks about how stupid something is TO YOU.

 

 

[Ghobe]

Define "safe". You know whats happening start to finish? Stalker/G3/Harvester visits can make it "unsafe" if unaware. It's a straight-forward mission, start-end, kill everything.

Safe because you deal with an enemy count dramatically less than what you'd face in ANY other mission type. Safe because you don't deal with respawns. Safe because you always have a region(after the first room clear) to retreat to(as opposed to needing to clear a section of a room in the midst of a fire fight). It's pretty safe.

 

Nobody else views it like you do, I think that should be a big hint

Nobody? Or nobody vocalizing their opinion in this particular thread? 4 pages deep this conversation is going to pretty much remain between a few of us.

 

Exterminate has never been viewed as high-level content, Defence and Survival are, heading into the higher level stuff of those two = endgame currently.

See I don't mind it being on the lower end of a spectrum section for each level of content. My problem is that it's so far below that these exterminates on as high as Ceres are no harder(in fact easier) than a 15 wave defense on Venus or a Capture on Phobos. The spectrum section should NOT expand that far.

 

No where does it state in some RULE BOOK of gaming that high level content MUST be hard...

Pffft, casual. ;p But seriously, a game is about progressing to the end, in all your progression of a game, the high level/late game/whatever you wanna call it should not resemble the early game/tutorial area of the game. Even NES games had the game continue to get harder as you progressed through it, not remain the same easy from beginning to end.

 

You also completely ignored the point i made in my earlier comment, and the points of everyone else, that it is the change of pace an the ability to progress at ones own pace that makes exterm desirable.

There's a reason I ignored it. I can't counter an opinion, it's an opinion. I can disagree with it, but I can not counter it.

 

However, i expect you to miss this point as well because you cannot comprehend someone not thinking like you do, or not liking exactly what you do, so you simply come back with either insults or remarks about how stupid something is TO YOU.

Sigh...yet you insult me to try and drop a subtle hint that I should change my ways? Amusing.

 

In the world of game design, as I said before, the game should get progressively harder as you go. However, exterminates never move beyond their tutorial level difficulty(other than enemies just simply getting larger numbers of health and damage, which in the face of a lot of weapons these days, means nothing, especially when combined with our insane CCs).

 

In my perfect little world of Exterminate(if left in completely untouched starmap wise). It would be a mission for killing x enemies, but the x enemies would not be the cap on enemies, enemies would respawn, and yes they would appear behind you, forcing you out of your comfort zone. I'll gladly take this solution over simply increasing the enemy count too(as we'd still get out usual enemy count). And yes, I already know you're all going to be against this because it removes the safety net.

 

 

 

btw Sindrall on an off topic note, I find it quite amusing how quickly you adapted to your new format after that guy yelled at you in the other thread for your "wallotext" that was pretty small xD