Thoughts On Releasing The Aklato Prime And Dual Skana Prime [Please Be Civil And Constructive]

[Hardlined]

I always figured the build requirements would be like this:

 

duel skana prime blueprint

2x skana blades

2x skana handles

duel skana prime link

 

These blades have suffered much since the fall of the Orokin empire. Only by using them together can their ancient power be reawakened.

 

Single variant lore could be like this.

 

Miraculously, this blade survived the fall of the Orokin empire and still retains its power.

 

 Maybe something like this? Non-founders are unable to use single variants because the parts we find have lost their power. The same can be applied to the lato. Just an idea how this could work within the lore we have now. 

[Zaresin]

This is honestly only a problem when the maximum mastery you can get is within stone's throw of the next mastery rank... which is one or two weeks... and less and less often as the max mastery rank increases....

 

also since they leveled more weapons, they should have more mastery.... why not just let the guy who just started the game instantly be max mastery to solve the inequality? may as well give them all the maxed mods as well right?

 

Don't get me wrong... I think exclusives are terrible and I don't think they should have ever been added... but you shouldn't punish someone just because someone else can't have what they do...

 

I agree with you, but how is it punishing someone when they are giving other people the same ability for equal growth as someone that started a year ago and has done all the work compared to someone that is starting yesterday who has the same opportunity.  They have to do equal amount of work to attain same results, but they can still attain those same results regardless.  I don't think that is punishing anyone, I think that is called equal playing field.  

[Zaresin]

Oh then how about they remove all mastery XP from founder and event items, I like that idea too.

 

I think they should go that route until the items are brought back into the game either through a milestone system or similar to how the brakk and detron came back into the game..then add the mastery to the weapons.   

Edited June 11, 2014 by Zaresin

[OniDax]

Then why not make it so everyone is on the same playing field as everyone else.  In a game that will soon have a system in place where inequality in mastery will dictate a players effectiveness in game, removing that inequality allows players to all have that same effectiveness once they get the stuff they need ot reach that.  Currently there is no way for players to overcome that inequality.  I'm just curious on people's reasons behind keeping other players "at the back of the bus" so to speak.

 

Why is there no way to overcome that? Isn't there a mastery rank cap at level 16? So just make both weapons have the same mastery, and up the mastery. You assume that every Founder has every single weapon and is ahead of every other non-Founder when it's not a simple case of

 

Founder

-----------

non Founder

 

 

I'm at mastery rank 8. Been here for a year. You want to know why? Because I haven't cared that much about mastery, and there are weapons and frames I don't want to use. It's easy to say "give non-Founders more mastery to level the playing field" when the playing field isn't really that uneven. All you need is a weapon that can give non-Founders that boost. It doesn't matter if Founders get that boost as well, because everyone will cap out at 16 if everyone gets there. Again, mastery isn't the issue. Seriously, it's your issue, but it's not the reason for a suggestion that proposes an Aklato prime and Dual Skana Prime over an Aklex prime or Dual Dakra Prime. It's not about the mastery, or the stats. It's about having something that's similar to the Founders items since DE put their foot down and said no concerning the Founders items. That's what it really is about. People trying to find another means of getting what they can't have. So they've found a loophole - dual versions. But make no mistake, the core of this issue is that people can't have the Founders items and really want them, so this is how they're trying to get them. I really don't get how anyone can't see this. At the end of the day, though, they still don't have a definitive answer on why they need these weapons. There's no reason DE should release these weapons. Their answer should be the same because the reasoning behind this suggestion is the same as those who repeatedly asked for a Founders re-release.

Edited June 11, 2014 by AntoineFlemming

[Cerokhol]

again... that will feel like a punishment....

 

honestly they should't have had master XP in the first place and this whole fight could have been avoided...

 

they also could have just not had exclusives and this fight would have been avoided...

 

but it's not that simple anymore

 

 

now if you are rank 16 and you log on and suddenly you are rank 15 its gonna feel like a slap in the face....

 

 

and what about when the rank actually matters? what if the rank down locks you out of that shiny weapon you just bought?

[MerelyARumor]

Oh then how about they remove all mastery XP from founder and event items, I like that idea too.

this has been suggested on this 71 page thread over 10 times allready , i love the idea, but watch the arguements for it appear anyway

 

we even added to the idea and said they could give (mastery rank legendary cores) that max 1 weapon to 30 for every weapon removed from the mastery charts so people would feel they didnt waste there time leveling it

Edited June 11, 2014 by MerelyARumor

[Zaresin]

again... that will feel like a punishment....

 

honestly they should't have had master XP in the first place and this whole fight could have been avoided...

 

they also could have just not had exclusives and this fight would have been avoided...

 

but it's not that simple anymore

 

 

now if you are rank 16 and you log on and suddenly you are rank 15 its gonna feel like a slap in the face....

 

 

and what about when the rank actually matters? what if the rank down locks you out of that shiny weapon you just bought?

 

I think the sooner they fix this the better the game will be as once the focus system gets here and last time I checked it was still bound to mastery, it will feel even more like a punishment after that comes out and something changes that effects mastery rather than before.  If it is done before, I think it will be less noticed.   And if nothing is done about it....we will see even more griping about founders and since founders aren't getting any new blood to their ranks but new players are...I forsee it getting ugly (not to mention the old P2W arguments will have validity then).

Edited June 11, 2014 by Zaresin

[Kazzamo]

I think the best way to handle that slap in the face? Completely rework the mastery system just like they did the mod system. Anybody complains? Beta.

[Yezzik]

Probably safer technically to add rather than remove.

[Zaresin]

I think the best way to handle that slap in the face? Completely rework the mastery system just like they did the mod system. Anybody complains? Beta.

 

agree

[Cerokhol]

I agree with you, but how is it punishing someone when they are giving other people the same ability for equal growth as someone that started a year ago and has done all the work compared to someone that is starting yesterday who has the same opportunity.  They have to do equal amount of work to attain same results, but they can still attain those same results regardless.  I don't think that is punishing anyone, I think that is called equal playing field.  

 

 

thats not equal effort for equal reward though...

 

Grand Masters would level 4 weapons to 30 to get 12k mastery

non-founders would level 2 weapons to 30 to get 12k mastery

 

that is not equal effort... that's making Grand Masters work twice as hard for the same reward... especially since founder's weapons are pretty lackluster... so it isn't like it would be fun to level those weapons

[Cerokhol]

I think the best way to handle that slap in the face? Completely rework the mastery system just like they did the mod system. Anybody complains? Beta.

this is probably the only way to really solve it... just rework the whole system....

[Inferno_Hamster]

That makes zero sense within the Lore.

 

Tenno cannot construct Orokin technology. All Orokin weapons are constructed by finding the parts and combining them.

 

We are incapable of making Orokin weapons from scratch, thus this makes no sense within the game's established universe.

 

 

Well, that's 0/2. Anyone else want to have a go?

 

Construction of Aklato Prime and Dual Skana Prime could easily be addressed with lore.  In fact the lore would make it an exceedingly rare item to obtain.  

 

For example: As the first ever attempt by the Orokin to created twin weapons a physical link between the weapons were required along with an energy balancer.  The primitive nature of the balancer and link required that the weapons be constructed at the same time in the same conditions.  As such no Aklato Prime could ever have more than 1 compatible partner.

 

Now all of a sudden instead of needing Lato Prime + Lato Prime you need

 

Aklato Prime Reciever A

Aklato Prime Reciever B

Aklato Prime Barrel A

Aklato Prime Barrel B

Aklato Prime Grip A

Aklato Prime Grip B

Aklato Prime Chain

Aklato Prime Energy Balancer

Orokin Cell x 20

 

Uh, no. The entire reason people specifically want an Aklato Prime and Skana Prime instead of an Aklex Prime or Aksicarus Prime or Dual Dakra Prime is precisely because they like the look of those weapons and it's the closest they can get to having the Founders weapons since they're off limits to these people. I know that exclusivity doesn't extend to dual variants. I'm the one who asked, and I'm the one who got the official response. But that doesn't dismiss that people want the Founders weapons, and because they can't have them, they're settling for whatever they can get, hence the "sneaky" way of going around exclusivity by petitioning for dual variants (the sneaky part is DEDrew's words of how he said some players feel about it). If people weren't concerned about having weapons that LOOKED like the Founders weapons, then it could just as easily be the Aksicarus Prime or Dual Dakra Prime (since we know the stats on the founder weapons suck).

 

So yes, I stand by my assertion. People (some here) want dual variants because they are first and foremost concerned about having weapons that look just like the Founders weapons. It's why they couldn't accept a suggestion that including dual versions of another Prime weapon. It's why they refused suggestions where the proposed Aklato Prime and Dual Skana Prime looked different (different texture or model) from the single versions. That is why, despite what they may claim their reasons are. They absolutely MUST be the AkLATO Prime and the Dual SKANA Prime and they MUST look the same because the real goal is to get as close to the Founders weapons themselves as possible and to get weapons that look like the single versions. They are not concerned about compromising on this suggestion, because compromise would be to have these weapons, but that they look different from the single counterparts. Their idea of compromise is to simply accept their suggestion. If you don't accept it, then you're "derailing" the thread, or you're a "dumbass", or you're not being "civil", or you're being "selfish".

 

I kinda agree with this as well.

[Zaresin]

thats not equal effort for equal reward though...

 

Grand Masters would level 4 weapons to 30 to get 12k mastery

non-founders would level 2 weapons to 30 to get 12k mastery

 

that is not equal effort... that's making Grand Masters work twice as hard for the same reward... especially since founder's weapons are pretty lackluster... so it isn't like it would be fun to level those weapons

 

They can either do it that way or remove the mastery for those weapons and all event/beta weapons cause to be honest I can't think of any other solution that fixes this.  This problem is only going to get worse overtime and teh sooner it is fixed teh better. Especially if the focus system is coming in the next couple of updates.  

Edited June 11, 2014 by Zaresin

[Yezzik]

It'll take either Mastery 2.0 or Weapons 2.0.

I'm in favour of the latter because DE could take the chance to fix other weapon-related problems.

A cleanup of the whole weapon list, perhaps, making all variants into alternate models for their base weapons.

Skana Prime would be a Skana model unique to Founders, etc, but would provide no Mastery.

[Cerokhol]

They can either do it that way or remove the mastery for those weapons and all event/beta weapons cause to be honest I can't think of any other solution that fixes this.  This problem is only going to get worse overtime and teh sooner it is fixed teh better. 

This is why I don't like exclusives... like I said there is no real easy fix where someone doesn't feel like they are being slapped in the face...

 

well except saying "too bad its not ever going to be fixed... you missed it your loss"

 

cause honestly that's what it is... they weren't here they missed it...

 

eventually we will have enough weapons to hit the absolute max mastery and all the event items wont make a difference anyways...

[MerelyARumor]

thats not equal effort for equal reward though...

 

Grand Masters would level 4 weapons to 30 to get 12k mastery

non-founders would level 2 weapons to 30 to get 12k mastery

 

that is not equal effort... that's making Grand Masters work twice as hard for the same reward... especially since founder's weapons are pretty lackluster... so it isn't like it would be fun to level those weapons

Sooo... the free legendary mastery cores for every exclusive item removed from mastery can address this....by making the next released weapons require no effort for anyone who has allready put in extra effort...so it will even out

[Kazzamo]

I'd be for either of those, honestly of the mind that event/exclusives should be cosmetic only anyway. Unless they are an "early access" thing like Brakk was.

 

Oh and the idea that someday everybody will hit max master, I think someone did the math on that and with the 1 weapon a week and frame however often they normally release them and so on it came out to almost 10 years before enough is added for everybody to hit rank 30 mastery.

Edited June 11, 2014 by Kazzamo

[NightBeats]

Skana Prime would be a Skana model unique to Founders, etc, but would provide no Mastery.

 

So DE would be changing the terms of the transaction after we gave them the money? And we're supposed to be OK with this?

[Zaresin]

So DE would be changing the terms of the transaction after we gave them the money? And we're supposed to be OK with this?

 

Some won't but tech if it is still exclusive to founders they didn't break their word.  Just to be devils advocate here.

[OniDax]

I'd be for either of those, honestly of the mind that event/exclusives should be cosmetic only anyway. Unless they are an "early access" thing like Brakk was.

 

Oh and the idea that someday everybody will hit max master, I think someone did the math on that and with the 1 weapon a week and frame however often they normally release them and so on it came out to almost 10 years before enough is added for everybody to hit rank 30 mastery.

 

Why rank 30? I thought the cap was 16?

[Kazzamo]

It's only 16 right now since that's all there is enough for in the game. If you check the wiki there is a full list of titles of ranks nobody can hit yet with rank 30 being grand master.

Edited June 11, 2014 by Kazzamo

[Cerokhol]

Sooo... the free legendary mastery cores for every exclusive item removed from mastery can address this....by making the next released weapons require no effort for anyone who has allready put in extra effort...so it will even out

I think that the cores are probably the best solution. Doesn't mean it won't feel like a slap to the face, but it is still better than just strait up giving double mastery to non-founders...

 

Why rank 30? I thought the cap was 16?

the current cap is 16 cause we don't have enough mastery sources to get past it yet

[Yezzik]

So DE would be changing the terms of the transaction after we gave them the money? And we're supposed to be OK with this?

You'd still have exclusive access to SKANA PRIME, regardless of its form. Or does it being a weapon as opposed to a model for a weapon matter so much?

Hell, DE could refund players a forma for each lost forma star in this change.

[Inferno_Hamster]

The current cap is 16 due to the number of weapons we have out right now.  But I think it set up to have 30 max.