Can We Talk About Chargers?

[Karosu]

no if you get swarmed you die, the issue is moment you get hit by infested, start being put into this stagger/stumble/stun/knock down chain that can be almost impossible to recover from.

Runner explodes stagger

charger claw stagger

charger 2 claw stagger

anceint charge knock down

ancient claw stagger/shield wipe

its VERY easy to get chain stunned by infested.

What i'm saying is this, damage is fine, health is fine, swarm is fine, spam stun on every single infested? not fine... i dont mind being swarmed, dieing do to damage incoming. I do mind that its super easy to just get chain locked from infested and have NO ability to get free... it doesnt happen often but it does happen and when it happens it feels so unfair you want to rage at someone or something.

stunlock in any game is never ok...

As i said, im a melee specialist and i really dont see what you're talking about so much, if ur gona fight infested ya gotta pay attention to where the enemies are. the only other way i really see it happening is if you're trying to run past them.

And yes i have been chain-locked once or twice, but only when i have about 12 infected on me at once, and even then i just spam spacebar til my dude jumps and use a downward melee trike to kill some and give myself breathing room, before doing it again or getting to high ground,

But if you really want no stun then they will probably have to amp their hp by 50-100% and double the damage or something to make them actually dangerous.

Edited April 8, 2013 by Karosu

[Sealgaire]

no if you get swarmed you die, the issue is moment you get hit by infested, start being put into this stagger/stumble/stun/knock down chain that can be almost impossible to recover from.

Runner explodes stagger

charger claw stagger

charger 2 claw stagger

anceint charge knock down

ancient claw stagger/shield wipe

its VERY easy to get chain stunned by infested.

What i'm saying is this, damage is fine, health is fine, swarm is fine, spam stun on every single infested? not fine... i dont mind being swarmed, dieing do to damage incoming. I do mind that its super easy to just get chain locked from infested and have NO ability to get free... it doesnt happen often but it does happen and when it happens it feels so unfair you want to rage at someone or something.

stunlock in any game is never ok...

Except that avoiding stunlock is incredibly easy if you're paying attention and use the tools available to you. When facing large groups of infested, dodge away after attacking and don't let yourself get backed into a corner. I don't think I've been stunlocked once in the last 50 or so hours of play, and it's not because I'm some awesome player.

Edited April 8, 2013 by Sealgaire

[Aggh]

There used to be a spam of threads about chargers when they were changed from a useless version of runners into what you see now, spouting how the changes were OP and how infested missions, which used to be boring w+melee spam missions, were now unplayable. Those threads died out within two weeks of the new charger's appearance when people figured out how to deal with them.

Why are they much less annoying to most people than rollers? Easier to hit, slowable, moving to the side evades their attack, and simply having your character run into one doesn't result in a stagger animation.

Chargers were around pre-U6 in the form of runners which did not detonate and basically did nothing to hinder the player. Hence:

I was responding to Renan.Ruvio. That would be why I quoted him :|

Regardless, it would have been impossible for him to encounter chargers pre u6 on Eris, Eris wasn't implemented yet.

Edited April 8, 2013 by Aggh

[Cakes]

I was responding to Renan.Ruvio. That would be why I quoted him :|

Regardless, it would have been impossible for him to encounter chargers pre u6 on Eris, Eris wasn't implemented yet.

This is true. :D

Anyways, on topic.... I let myself get surrounded by chargers on purpose to see how bad this permastun is. I've rarely been forced into such situations aside from sprinting into the middle of roller spams and ancient gangbangs (and for that I did deserve getting staggered often). Spamming spacebar worked a lot better against chargers than the previous listed staggerlocks, was easier to avoid when I tried to (damn you ancient autoaim hax), and when not surrounded on all sides dodgerolling worked easily as well.

Getting surrounded is probably the worst case scenario as dodgerolling does nothing but roll in place and jumping doesn't always work as you can get staggered midair before doing the melee smash.

[shavedllama]

Runner explodes stagger

charger claw stagger

charger 2 claw stagger

anceint charge knock down

ancient claw stagger/shield wipe

its VERY easy to get chain stunned by infested.

The real issue here isnt so much that chargers are high damage squishies, as much as the stun and cant be stunned problem. Infested as a whole are an issue why? because every single infested can stagger, stun, or knock you down. In a group infested can and will stun you untill you are dead. IS a reason that many players jump on boxes to avoid, and break infested pathing...

Thank you for following the thread, rather than spouting suggestions like everyone else. This is exactly what I'm saying, most infested have some sort of stun, but chargers have both stun and damage. So seeing as how the rest of them behave, I would say that the stun from them needs to go.

You're a player with little experience at solo? That's what i thought when i read your post... I went to Ceres...

Oh thank you enlightened one for your wise judgements and genius assumptions... /sarcasm

This is what I don't care to see here at all. How 'bout examining the issue rather than once again throwing suggestions for others' play-styles that nobody cares to see? If I wanted tips, I'd go to THAT thread. But no, I've been playing since early February, so if you REALLY need to know, I have a good deal of solo experience.

[Naqel]

The game should be more challenging, not less.

Infested are just about the only enemies that require actual effort and thought to defeat.

If anything, their immunity to the most abusive mechanic(stagger) and abusing it themselves, highlights EXACTLY why this game needs quite a few changes to truly shine(and I mean changes bigger than taking stagger away from any/everyone).

[Sealgaire]

Thank you for following the thread, rather than spouting suggestions like everyone else. This is exactly what I'm saying, most infested have some sort of stun, but chargers have both stun and damage. So seeing as how the rest of them behave, I would say that the stun from them needs to go.

Oh thank you enlightened one for your wise judgements and genius assumptions... /sarcasm

This is what I don't care to see here at all. How 'bout examining the issue rather than once again throwing suggestions for others' play-styles that nobody cares to see? If I wanted tips, I'd go to THAT thread. But no, I've been playing since early February, so if you REALLY need to know, I have a good deal of solo experience.

I see that you started playing in late February, so you kind of missed the "nerf chargers" bandwagon. Update 6 buffed chargers, then they nerfed them until people stopped complaining. When I hear you talk about getting stunlocked, then demand the stun be removed, I can't help but think you just don't know how to avoid it, because as I said above, it's quite simple. No offense intended, I'm honestly trying to help you out, because at this point it's (hopefully) unlikely that chargers will be nerfed much more than they already have been.

[shavedllama]

I see that you started playing in late February, so you kind of missed the "nerf chargers" bandwagon. Update 6 buffed chargers, then they nerfed them until people stopped complaining. When I hear you talk about getting stunlocked, then demand the stun be removed, I can't help but think you just don't know how to avoid it, because as I said above, it's quite simple. No offense intended, I'm honestly trying to help you out, because at this point it's (hopefully) unlikely that chargers will be nerfed much more than they already have been.

You're great at missing the point, aren't ya? Go to the help thread if you want to help people out. When I want it, I'll ask for help. This happens to be a different type of thread in a different section of the forum.

[Renan.Ruivo]

The chargers and eris were both implemented in u6 so you couldn't have played them pre u6 :|

True dat. Meant to say i played with chargers pre u6 boost.

[Renan.Ruivo]

Hmm, okay. You wrote your entire OP, i read it all. Then at the end of it, you asked a question. That i took as a legitimate one:

[...]Thoughts?

Then i said (and corrected a little mistake that was pointed out by the poster right under my own post):

You're a player with little experience at solo? That's what i thought when i read your post... I went to Ceres (Or Eris.. i always mix.. the one with Xini) pre and post U6 boost to chargers [thanks for the correction, Aggh] and pre U7-passives solo with my loki with a variety of guns and, while yes very dangerous, they aren't diffucult to manage once you learn how to play with them.

For instance, don't bother using any melee weapon against them that isn't a heavy weapon, otherwise they will keep staggering you. Heavy mellee weapons just carry the momentum of their own attacks so keep spamming E (don't try charges though). Also, grond slam from a heavily elemental modded Gram makes wonders, specially with ice mods.

Ah, and yes, of course. Hek.

And then you:

[...]

You're a player with little experience at solo? That's what i thought when i read your post... I went to Ceres....

Oh thank you enlightened one for your wise judgements and genius assumptions... /sarcasm

This is what I don't care to see here at all. How 'bout examining the issue rather than once again throwing suggestions for others' play-styles that nobody cares to see? If I wanted tips, I'd go to THAT thread. But no, I've been playing since early February, so if you REALLY need to know, I have a good deal of solo experience.

Now, let's analyze the situation. Given your tone that you used in this reply to what i said to you, i'm assuming that you took offense.

When first replied you, I assumed - and feel free to correct me if i'm wrong - that you didn't have much experience with solo gameplay. Hence, i asked "You're a player with little experience at solo? That's what i thought when i read your post..."

Now, I'm being honest with you. I'm neither trying to troll or offend you, so i'll ask for a honest answer. Did you assumed that i inferred that you were a player with limited solo experience? Because - again given your tone - i believe you did.

However, i did not. I merely presumed that you were a player with little solo gameplay experience after reading your original post. And from that presumption, i wrote you a reply answering your original question on what i thought, and then offered tips. Again, without the intention to offend nor belittle you. I was trying to be helpfull.

And because of that, you "pounced" on me because of what - i hope - was a misunderstanding, so i'll say that i took no offense at your reply.

However, i'll leave with another tip (hoping you won't take offense at that): Language is a lot more than written words, and the internet cannot transmit any of those other things. So don't assume things based on what you might presume that the person behind your montior is feeling. Don't try to read between the lines and, most important of all, don't try to hide stuff between the lines.

But the matter of the fact is that a lot of internet users will indeed stab at you with stuff between the lines and just wait for you to fall into their traps. And the space between the lines allows for very powerfull traps.

TL;DR, the tip would be: Leave your emotions outside the log-in page once you go inside a text-based internet debate, or you might find yourself falling prey to people who would use their text-only language skills to affect you in ways you definatly do not want to be affected.

[LordLokai]

Except that avoiding stunlock is incredibly easy if you're paying attention and use the tools available to you. When facing large groups of infested, dodge away after attacking and don't let yourself get backed into a corner. I don't think I've been stunlocked once in the last 50 or so hours of play, and it's not because I'm some awesome player.

Like i said if you are super careful and neve take a hit, or avoid taking multibles at once you are fine... i mean not like infested charge you 20 or so guys at once... OH WAIT they do!

Here is my big problem with fighting the infested, and general reason i am pointing to the change in general and please do try and keep up with me here...instead of " i'm awsomesauce i never get owned by infested!" try for a little bit to read what we are typing and see the other side of the fence for a change.

First lets discuss how the infected actually fight and how the AI acts toward the player in and of itself. The infested are for the most part what i like to call " the zerg " method of combat. They charge down at the player and will use the shortest path needed to get to them, and ignore any and all danger in the process they are mindless zerg bots.

Next lets go over basic tactic when facing the infested, which in a nutshell involves 2 basic tactics.

Either A you charge forward meeting them head on and mow through them in a hope that you can kill enough of them that they do not build enough forces to overwhelm you(very doable on high damage frames like say an ember or ash), but this can be risky and end in taking a ton of damage, usually the player wants to try and find room to kite when needed and combine melee with ranged skills. Unless you are fighting low level infested, or have a completely maxed out melee weapon with best mods available, you cant one shot infested of any kind of your level(for me takes 2 swings of my fraggor to kill a charger, or runner).

Or B and is most common tactic for taking on the infested...you JUMP on a box... breaking the infested AI and preventing them from getting to you, and pick them off one at a time. I want to focus on this for a moment because its pretty important that this be our main focus of infested combat. Because if we want to admit it or not, at some point in fighting infested we do this, we all do, and its usually to reload or let our shields regen.

So effectively! if the infested AI wasnt broken, and allowed for them to " climb " boxes, and chase us down from high places what would happen in combat moment a swarm came at you? and dont sa it doesnt or cant happen because the infected never come at you one at a time...always in packs! well if they could climb after you THERE would be no cover, no safe haven and you would get stunlocked CONSTANTLY! basically people you are finding infested easy for one of two reasons!

1: the AI is broken and not working way they should

2: you are over geared, or max geared and you can effectively kill the infested in one hit

However most of people that feel that infested are to strong are people are not yet max geared, still finding mods, and still working on getting themselves to a level they can manage. This is important to note because chargers are earliest enemy of the infested you fight and they remain the most threatening enemy from start of the game to finish. They are harder to deal with then rollers, hit harder then any other enemy in game, attack you in larger groups then almost any other mob in game, they cant be stunned, at all, and can still take 2-3 hits before they die to the average players weapons.

Knowing all of this information i also have to consider the next fact...losing control of your player for any reason with the inability to stop it once it starts happening is the MOST frustraiting experience of any game. Is a reason that pvp trinkets made there way into WoW, is a reason that diminishing returns got added to numerous mmos, and is a reason that people hate chargers and it all amounts to the frustraition of not being able to stop it once it starts happening. Even as a rhino with 700 shields and life, and armor boost mod(think its almost 75% boost now) a 3-4 chargers can take my shields down, and reduce me to 10% hp inside of 1 knock down.

So basically it amounts to this... the amount of control in this game is used to try and cover the fact that the AI is dumb as balls, and try and superficially increase difficulty in some way. My thoughts are always on " how will this work once they fix it" and i keep thinking that infested missions will require a full group of people once there ai can climb boxes and get to you in high vantage points... and once that happens people will stop playing infested missions because they will end up stunned more often then they are actually fighting.

Not a fan of the amount of control the infested have in general... i'd prefer they walk on walls, use tactics, drop on you from above, hide in dark corners, and use some real intelligence in combat. Rather then " i can just punch you and you cant react while we eat your face off"

Do i have issues soloing infested missions? No... i dont, do i think the stun mechanics are bogus? yes... do i think the game needs to be harder? abo@#&*ely! but i think that giving enemies abilities that just stop you from doing jack all with out any ability to break free is also a load of bull as well. Are much better ways to make enemies interesting and involed with out making them bullet sponges, and without giving them the ability to force aplayer to afk while he dies.

[shavedllama]

TL;DR, the tip would be: Leave your emotions outside the log-in page once you go inside a text-based internet debate, or you might find yourself falling prey to people who would use their text-only language skills to affect you in ways you definatly do not want to be affected.

Here's one for you. Don't bring your presumptions, analyses, and condescending attitude into a thread that's here for discussion of a particular element. As I said, if help was asked for, you'd know. Help wasn't asked for. Writing out walls of text as a response to my telling you to give over is achieving nothing for the discussion, and rather promoting further antagonism. Your tips, if there unironically, are sweet and all, but have no place here.

[vats3]

i agree in the fact they have a tendesy to stagger you alot more then they should i find often that when i am hit by one and stargered 2 more come and from there its just them holding me down until reinforcement arrive and my problem is i use melee against them because i have the new mire and it pretty much insta gibs them but if i F*** up my timing and miss a swing it dose mean i have to be very fearful of a stun lock witch is one of the problems i have, i dont mind dieing because i have just been @(*()$ up but like when i fought the man for frost frame and he knocked me down he would come over and hit me again meaning im dead, i dont have a problem with dieing i have a problem with the fact that i do one thing wrong and the only punishment is death with no redemption

[MJ12]

Get rid of Charger stagger, make the other kinds of Infested actually threatening instead of laughable, and then we're probably getting somewhere.

The Infested are in desperate need of some way of killing guys more than twenty feet away from them, though. Say, something that throws... spore grenades?

I'd trade the Toxic Ancient's poison cloud to let it throw spores in a heartbeat.

[neKroMancer]

Infest's faction design is bad from the beginning. Melee 'ONLY' faction with nothing but stun/stagger mechanic doesn't sound good even on paper. It doesn't play well in the game is expected.

Charger is fast, armored, tough, deal decent damage, stunlocking creature. Pretty impressive for cannonfodder to possess said traits. They feel like Ultralisk in stead of Zergling.

Runner should feel be redesigned to feel more like 'I'm gonna blow you to hell, Tenno'. If they spawn less and explode harder, it would be good.

Leaper still worshipping sungod Rah before jumping at you.

Ancients are the most uninteresting of the bunch. Apart from the doom tentacle of stagger, they possess almost nothing noteworthy. Healing ancient purpose is unknown when majority of the Infest already blow themselves to kill us or simply run faster than the Ancient and got themselves slaughtered. Disruptor ancient is probably one of the most powerful enemies in the game. These energy + shield sucking tentacle should placed on a boss, not an elite unit. However, with blade attack, player can stagger one of these to oblivion without worry.

Toxic ancient is dangerous upclose which is good. tentacle of doom serve fuction only to stagger you while applying poison damage DOT to your health. Still uninteresting.

This faction requires an overhaul to feel more lively with greater varities of mechanic.

1. Charger. Make them a true cannon fodder. Zergling-like speed, low armor, low damage but apppeared in group of 10-15 and swarm the player with superior numbers. One of them could act as an alpha an buff the rest with damage/movement speed.

2. Runner. They're Banling from SC2 for sure. Since they appear with Chargers most of the time, make Runner's kamikaze attack spread spore which reduce movement and melee attack speed but deal minor damage. Complimenting charger's speed and number.

3. Leaper. Get these guys off the floor. Put them on the ceiling and design them to be more insect-like. Jumping at player after a sound cue from above and pinned them on the floor (or pull them up to the ceiling). Player enter QTE and smash melee button for his/her life or have a friend blast it off with gun/melee weapon.

4. The Crawler, wonder of the Infest. In stead of vomiting at the player, vomiting at the floor and deal toxic damage to passerby and deal DOT to shield (something similar to leech osprey's effect). long range vomit attack (obviously with travel time) deal the same effect.

5. Healing ancient (slow moving ancient). Get rid of the healing part since it's no use any way. Make them a slow-moving spawner unit, creating new infest unit in a fixed interval and boost nearby Infest's armor/movement speed.

6. Disruptor ancient (melee ancient) Suck less shield/energy and push or pull player away depend on what kind of damage player deals to it. If it recieved range>melee then it pull. If melee>range then push. The only effect which i like is the one which messing with UI after the tentacle effect. After sucking enough energy, pound the ground and release stored energy to the floor, stunlock everything on it while deal extra damage to shield.

7. Toxic ancient (long range ancient). We need long range ancient to balance the design. Give these guy a mutated turret/gun similar to Grineer Napalm's attack but with poison instead of fire. When player enter the radius, release toxic cloud to defend itself.

My 10 platinum on the subject.

Edited April 9, 2013 by neKroMancer

[BoredWraith]

i dont have a problem with dieing i have a problem with the fact that i do one thing wrong and the only punishment is death with no redemption

My thoughts. But the first time i thought that wasnt vs infested but vs 3 of that grineer guys with shields. I was dead in notime (low lvl and my first hours in the game), i didnt see them coming while i was busy fighting other enemys. When that happened i alos instantly asked myself why the f... CAN the enemy push me around and i CANT do that? If the player would be able to push the enemy back (press attack key while blocking) maybe the problem with the stunlock from chargers would be also less of a problem. To prevent the player from "pushing" its way through the mission, the push would come at a price like stamina usage or something like that (maybe Left 4 Dead would be good inspiration in that regard).

Just my 2 cents... :)

[shavedllama]

Infest's faction design is bad from the beginning. Melee 'ONLY' faction with nothing but stun/stagger mechanic doesn't sound good even on paper. It doesn't play well in the game is expected.

Charger is fast, armored, tough, deal decent damage, stunlocking creature. Pretty impressive for cannonfodder to possess said traits. They feel like Ultralisk in stead of Zergling.

Runner should feel be redesigned to feel more like 'I'm gonna blow you to hell, Tenno'. If they spawn less and explode harder, it would be good.

Leaper still worshipping sungod Rah before jumping at you.

Ancients are the most uninteresting of the bunch. Apart from the doom tentacle of stagger, they possess almost nothing noteworthy. Healing ancient purpose is unknown when majority of the Infest already blow themselves to kill us or simply run faster than the Ancient and got themselves slaughtered. Disruptor ancient is probably one of the most powerful enemies in the game. These energy + shield sucking tentacle should placed on a boss, not an elite unit. However, with blade attack, player can stagger one of these to oblivion without worry.

Toxic ancient is dangerous upclose which is good. tentacle of doom serve fuction only to stagger you while applying poison damage DOT to your health. Still uninteresting.

This faction requires an overhaul to feel more lively with greater varities of mechanic.

1. Charger. Make them a true cannon fodder. Zergling-like speed, low armor, low damage but apppeared in group of 10-15 and swarm the player with superior numbers. One of them could act as an alpha an buff the rest with damage/movement speed.

2. Runner. They're Banling from SC2 for sure. Since they appear with Chargers most of the time, make Runner's kamikaze attack spread spore which reduce movement and melee attack speed but deal minor damage. Complimenting charger's speed and number.

3. Leaper. Get these guys off the floor. Put them on the ceiling and design them to be more insect-like. Jumping at player after a sound cue from above and pinned them on the floor (or pull them up to the ceiling). Player enter QTE and smash melee button for his/her life or have a friend blast it off with gun/melee weapon.

4. The Crawler, wonder of the Infest. In stead of vomiting at the player, vomiting at the floor and deal toxic damage to passerby and deal DOT to shield (something similar to leech osprey's effect). long range vomit attack (obviously with travel time) deal the same effect.

5. Healing ancient (slow moving ancient). Get rid of the healing part since it's no use any way. Make them a slow-moving spawner unit, creating new infest unit in a fixed interval and boost nearby Infest's armor/movement speed.

6. Disruptor ancient (melee ancient) Suck less shield/energy and push or pull player away depend on what kind of damage player deals to it. If it recieved range>melee then it pull. If melee>range then push. The only effect which i like is the one which messing with UI after the tentacle effect. After sucking enough energy, pound the ground and release stored energy to the floor, stunlock everything on it while deal extra damage to shield.

7. Toxic ancient (long range ancient). We need long range ancient to balance the design. Give these guy a mutated turret/gun similar to Grineer Napalm's attack but with poison instead of fire. When player enter the radius, release toxic cloud to defend itself.

My 10 platinum on the subject.

+1

Love the scope of it, expanding the focus to the entire faction. I have to agree with you there, and those kind of individual improvements would be awesome.

[Cazakatari]

for those having trouble getting stunlocked by chargers, with me I found it was because I was trying to melee. Unless you have a heavy wep, they'll stunlock you to death if you're trying to even do standard attacks. Once I gave up using my heat swords on them they became cake

I agree they need to be reworked but that should help for the current pain

[nogaems]

Not sure it has been mentioned, but don't forget chargers cannot be gibbed by physical.

Sure, they can be ice gibbed, toxic gibbed (thanks sarin) and that's about it. So, coupled with the fact their model is HUGE, when they die they eat way, way too many damn attacks. [Decoy seems to eat melee attacks too for some raisin, but that's another story and probably wrong].

They eat bullets, they eat melee and they also camoflague other chargers while possesing the uncanny ability to run right through their brethren's corpses. Oftentimes even staying INSIDE it. This never used to be much more than an annoyance in the pre u7 endgame due to the large magazine capacities and piercing mods, but in u7+? Broken.

So here we are with our fancy r30 HEKs and boltors, our Grams and whatever you wants. Our potentcy far deminished (for good reason) yet we have this massive issue sitting here, ignored. Although it does seem a bit better lately as corpse clutter is easily remedied by a nice shot to the butt, making the corpse disappear where it used to persist.

That's not quite good enough, though.

[offtopic]Also: PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GRAVY MAKE RHINO CHARGE/SLASH DASH NOT STOP DEAD ON THE FACE OF A MOB OF INFESTED DUE TO CLIPPING (or lack thereof) ISSUES AND DO NOTHING. Well, I think it might have a minor stagger but that's about it. [/offtopic]

Now, it's all well and good to say "lol get gud scrub l2play I have no trabble ur a babby get rekt m8" and accuse other people of being S#&$ at the game with other ridiculous bullS#&$ appeals to authority and whatnot, but that's not going to help so I won't do it.

As it stands, infested stunlocking is still a huge, monstrous issue. Getting punished for having fisticuffs with a mutated nightmare is all well and good, but getting stunlocked by a chain of charger(+runner explosions and leaper leaps puncuated with the odd Ancient Shoryuken) is a glaring balance issue that needs to be addressed properly.

Wank on about realism all you want, this is a game. Games need to be fun and balanced.

[Renan.Ruivo]

Here's one for you. Don't bring your presumptions, analyses, and condescending attitude into a thread that's here for discussion of a particular element. As I said, if help was asked for, you'd know. Help wasn't asked for. Writing out walls of text as a response to my telling you to give over is achieving nothing for the discussion, and rather promoting further antagonism. Your tips, if there unironically, are sweet and all, but have no place here.

Well then, i can only wish you good luck with communicating with the rest of the community. I assumed you wouldn't mind some tips about gameplay, and you shoved in my face that you didn't wanted any.

I'll take your suggestion for what it's worth, in regards to you. Hope you can find what you are looking for =)

[Karosu]

Ok so i still didnt see what you were talking about by being chain-stun-locked, so i decided to go out and let myself get swarmed under by chargers in varying circumstances in order to see if i could provoke this mechanic.

Stood still as one charger hit me 20 times, no stagger

stood still as 2 hit me about 20 times, no stagger

stood still as 3 hit me about 20 times, no stagger

let myself get swarmed under by 7 til dead, one stagger took me about 7-10 seconds to die.

Wondered if my rhino frame had some kind of anti stagger so i swapped to my xcal

same results one stagger in all of testing,and that one was getting swarmed under til dead..

I was testing on lares (mercury),oro (earth) and proteus (Uranus), and i killed all non-chargers before testing.

figured there had to be something so i went back and let myself get swarmed under by about 15 til death, repeat, no stagger at all.

I'm not sure whats going on maybe my client is weird, or i'm lucky, or your client is weird or unlucky. maybe there is a bug somewhere causing this, because i still don't see what you're talking about, and you wouldn't be &!$$ed about it if there wasn't something to be &!$$ed about.

Perhaps other infested nearby increase the chance of stalker stagger? i don't know.

Edited April 9, 2013 by Karosu

[shavedllama]

Well then, i can only wish you good luck with communicating with the rest of the community. I assumed you wouldn't mind some tips about gameplay, and you shoved in my face that you didn't wanted any.

I'll take your suggestion for what it's worth, in regards to you. Hope you can find what you are looking for =)

You seem honest and were apparently trying to help, so I'm sorry for blowing things out of proportion. I overreacted and I apologize. Its just that I'm tired of seeing this on these forums:

"lol get gud scrub l2play I have no trabble ur a babby get rekt m8" and accuse other people of being S#&$ at the game...

...which is what I interpreted it as. (Nogaems, I realize that was ironic use, I'm merely using it as an illustration of what so many do on here.)

Let's leave it at that.

Peace.

[Renan.Ruivo]

Yeah don't even bother with that. Like i said, communicating with people with internet text can affect you in ways you don't want to be affected. Just don't take anything personally and you'll be fine =)

Also no need to apologize, i could see that you were just &!$$ed off at that sort of people and threw me in the same bag by mistake. It happens :)

[nogaems]

Hrm, seem I was kidna wrong about charger corpse clutter. It's not too bad these days.

Maybe that's because everyone has mutliple elements on their weapon. though. I guess? Who knows.

[Xtorma]

I really like this game, it is very fun.

That being said, I would like to find a game that does not include stun/stagger lock as a game mechanic.