The Reality Of "free-To-Play"

[hijinks_the_turtle]

But there is no content that requires multiplayer, I play this game solo and have done all the content in solo. sure is more challenging but it is by no means impossible. 

 

Wow.... o.O  Though, just because you and [insert other people can] doesn't mean a newbie can do it well.  Just sayian.  Ah well, depends on the person's skill.

 

 

^last i checked....people dont really complain about trading connection or networking issues....

 

It does happen though.  However, I must admit, connection and networking stuff has been getting better with DE's hotfixes.

 

The only thing that bothers me with DE's system is the limited weapon/warframe slots one has when they start out.  Other than that, I'm fine with the system.

Edited August 7, 2014 by hijinks_the_turtle

[MXultra]

I am sorry OP but you are just ignoring people who disagree with your opinion. As I previously stated calling someone a white knight is the same as admitting defeat because you cannot counter there argument so you just insult them instead. 

 

Actually, I am responding to people that are thoughtful.

 

People are tripping out over the white knight comment, but if you read the next sentence, you'd realize that I was only dismissing the people that would respond "If you don't like how it's priced, don't play". It's a common response and adds nothing to the discourse.

Edited August 7, 2014 by MXultra

[BrotherIcarus]

Wow.... o.O  Though, just because you and [insert other people can] doesn't mean a newbie can do it well.  Just sayian.  Ah well, depends on the person's skill.

I was a newbie once as well and I played solo then as I do now. I don't expect a new player to be good at the game but they can develop the skills needed to do all content solo, and if they cannot do that there are warframes and weapons which make the gameplay a lot easier. 

[LikeABawsh]

Thing is, that ISN'T the reality of free to play. Your perspective is skewed; there isn't some sort of

aggravatingly gimped version

that you're talking about. It is entirely possible to obtain 99.9% of the content in the game without paying. I know this because I've done it, and it isn't that difficult. It requires commitment; it isn't handed to you on a silver platter. You have to work for it. That isn't aggravating, that's good design. 

 

The 0.1% that I was speaking of is pertaining to the exclusive gear, and that stuff is totally fine to not have considering the mountain of other options you have to choose from, whether it be frames, colour schemes, or weapons.

[CBAROG]

Actually, I am responding to people that are thoughtful.

 

People are tripping out over the white knight comment, but if you read the next sentence, you'd realize that I was only dismissing the people that would respond "If you don't like how it's priced, don't play". It's a common response and adds nothing to the discourse.

You are responding to people who agree with you. And you don't provide any arguments except your opinion.

[BrotherIcarus]

Actually, I am responding to people that are thoughtful.

 

People are tripping out over the white knight comment, but if you read the next sentence, you'd realize that I was only dismissing the people that would respond "If you don't like how it's priced, don't play". It's a common response and adds nothing to the discourse.

Yes but you have not responded to a single person that has disagreed with you in the thread? I doubt you would of responded to me if I had not directly addressed you. 

 

Simply put warframe has a very fair free to play business model, one that allows you to experience all the content in the game for free (And any content you cannot access is exclusive stuff, which you cannot access even if you did pay) And the things that can be considered needed (Slots) Are cheap and thus are easily attainable with the in game trading system. Sure it could be better but not everyone can afford what valve can.

[MXultra]

Yes but you have not responded to a single person that has disagreed with you in the thread? I doubt you would of responded to me if I had not directly addressed you. 

 

You are responding to people who agree with you. And you don't provide any arguments except your opinion.

 

Uh... I responded to one person that was telling people to try to understand what I'm saying rather than nit-pick the semantics. The rest of my replies have been to people disagreeing with me.

[TheErebus.]

Uh... I responded to one person that was telling people to try to understand what I'm saying rather than nit-pick the semantics. The rest of my replies have been to people disagreeing with me.

Disagreeing with you because they don't agree with your view point.

You then reply to one person and said that they were the only thoughtful poster here.

 

Basically, you just see everyone here who is negative towards you as just a bunch of whiners.

[Soulden]

Why do always the seemingly logical and smart post get wasted on something as simple and clear as this topic?

 

You are a content junkie, not a gamer.

You are the kind of costumer all f2p item shops are designed for.

[BrotherIcarus]

Uh... I responded to one person that was telling people to try to understand what I'm saying rather than nit-pick the semantics. The rest of my replies have been to people disagreeing with me.

Your replies have been to people disagreeing with no arguments to back them up. 

 

You have not responded to a single person who has backed up there disagreement with an actual argument (Most of the posts in the thread that is)

 

You have proven that you are not here for a discussion and you want nothing more than to say you are right and for others to say you are right, when ever someone says "your wrong" you just turn to them and say "No I am right" and anyone who says why you are wrong you do not acknowledge. 

[NoLife]

Real truth of games: Developers need money. Stop complaining.

[MXultra]

Disagreeing with you because they don't agree with your view point.

You then reply to one person and said that they were the only thoughtful poster here.

 

Basically, you just see everyone here who is negative towards you as just a bunch of whiners.

 

What are you even talking about? sorry if I can't keep up with the legion of people that think there is nothing wrong with DE's monetization schemes.

 

 

You are a content junkie, not a gamer.

 

So I'm not a gamer because 90% of the game poses no challenge and I don't like farming mindlessly low level missions for rare drops?

[TheErebus.]

What are you even talking about? sorry if I can't keep up with the legion of people that think there is nothing wrong with DE's monetization schemes.

Because there isn't.

In my post regarding the tin foil hat, it honestly sounds like you are one of the players who think DE is purposefully just trying to get all the money out of your wallets.

Which is downright false.

[fatpig84]

Initial warframes farming.

 

Bosses drop Warframe orbs.

BUTTTT, it's not guaranteed.

You can miss it sometime, or the orb doesn't spawn or physics sent it flying off somewhere.

 

Some frames like Banshee were definitely RnG frames.

You only get their parts off random missions.

Vauban is also RNG.

 

-----------------------

 

DE changed the system.

Bosses will drop a definite bp at mission rewards.

Just no control of it. But time is definitely saved.

 

Some frames became clan research.

No RnG ftw. Zephyr might seem hard to farm, but it isn't really as long you are smart about it.

VB remains as the only exclusive alert frame.

 

 

DE releases Hydroid, which frankly the largest grind wall.

People whine. Which is legit.

 

Not only do you need to form the triangulators, the drop parts are random.

So you will burn out a ton of time and DE realizes this is a bad idea.

 

Then DE releases Mirage, which has no RNG to it. Just purely a quest.

But people complain it is a time wall due to the 5 ciphers (took me an 1 hour with a team) and the construction of each part.

This is something i DO NOT agree with.

 

 

Look getting bosses drop BP rewards at mission endings does not necessary save time.

I have seen players kill phorid 30 times and still get helmets when they need systems.

 

Mirage is a guaranteed frame, this is by far the best DE has came out so far.

Surely they don't deserve hate on that ?

 

Also OP is mentioning DE is out for your money, what money ?

All frames can be built. I have built every single frame thus far. 

If you can't wait a little, then pay the cash.

Edited August 7, 2014 by fatpig84

[Kestral9999]

But with each update comes a new aggressive monetization scheme and it really gets to be insulting.

PWE is slowly creeping up on us... like a freight train on a deer.

[Sinistro6]

Warframe is expensive, yes, but at least it's not Pay-to-Win. You spend money if you want to either hoard stuff (like I do) or have any and all cosmetic options ingame.

 

I have friends who haven't dropped a single dime in this game, and have as much stuff as I do. Of course, they have to farm more, and then spend time trading, but still, they have everything there is to have except founder-exclusive items.

[Soulden]

So I'm not a gamer because 90% of the game poses no challenge and I don't like farming mindlessly low level missions for rare drops?

You kind of agreed with what I just said there.

 

You are not into the game, but the content, and DE forbids you have to play those boring low end missions in order to get what you want...

Content junkie.

[Zeitzbach]

Yes, and the game is rather annoying if you don't. None of my other games go into annoying mode if I don't feed them money.

 

Annoying mode is better than impossible to play mode.

 

I rather deal with RNG drop than stuffs like "Craft success rate" or "Stat reset via cash only".

 

What most people complaining about being forced to pay fails to realize is that you DO NOT need everything in the game. Latest content is not a must. All you need is a couple of frames you will play and a couple of weapon you will use. It's not like you're going to be beating T4 in the face with a Lato and an Alert Weapon.

 

We just buy slots because we just don't want past effort to go to waste although we will never use them again (so they are wasted anyway, just there to collect dust). Same goes to stuffs like mastery rank. Any person just playing this game for fun and not for hardcore collection purpose would probably leave their account at rank 6 at most unless they plan on challenging themselves with bad weapon for the "Meatshield" end-game. If you're going to be a collector, you're going to have to do what collectors do. Either pay, or trade. It's a choice here.

[MXultra]

You kind of agreed with what I just said there.

 

You are not into the game, but the content, and DE forbids you have to play those boring low end missions in order to get what you want...

Content junkie.

 

So willingness to play boring low-level, unchallenging missions makes you a gamer?

 

Or maybe I like playing where the challenge is, but I also like new content.

Edited August 7, 2014 by MXultra

[MXultra]

Your replies have been to people disagreeing with no arguments to back them up. 

 

You have not responded to a single person who has backed up there disagreement with an actual argument (Most of the posts in the thread that is)

 

You have proven that you are not here for a discussion and you want nothing more than to say you are right and for others to say you are right, when ever someone says "your wrong" you just turn to them and say "No I am right" and anyone who says why you are wrong you do not acknowledge. 

 

 

Maybe I missed something. Can you quote me one actual argument that I ignored?

 

A few people pointed out that they haven't spent any money on the game, some have said that they have no problem with the system, and then a couple of you have just been hounding me about the white knight comment.

 

There isn't really anything to argue here other than opinions.

 

It is my opinion that DE's use of RNG and the excessive use of wait gates make this game exceedingly annoying. That's all I've been saying, where are these factual arguments that refute this?

[MXultra]

In my post regarding the tin foil hat, it honestly sounds like you are one of the players who think DE is purposefully just trying to get all the money out of your wallets.

Which is downright false.

 

That may be what I think. Where are your facts to claim that is downright false?

[TheErebus.]

 

It is my opinion that DE's use of RNG and the excessive use of wait gates make this game exceedingly annoying. That's all I've been saying, where are these factual arguments that refute this?

You can't refute an opinion. You can just say:

"I honestly don't mind all these wait gates".

 

See the thing is, you are saying that the wait gates and usage of RNG is making the game less of a F2P model.

Also, you have yet to provide a few of the games where it does not annoy you when it comes to feeding it with money.

[Spartan086]

So your question is to RNG or not to RNG? Well.... "0.01% drop chance per mission vs 100 missions to obtain the reward" is like choosing between "bad vs bad". What I like about the RNG system is that you actually find good stuff at times, that you do NOT need. Since we can trade... this encourages interacting with other people and trading and since we can even trade premium currency (which is rather rare for any game) we can actually sell those good things or trade them for what we actually need. If you remove the RNG I think you might see a drastic drop in trades and in turn less people would have access to earning platinum which probably means less platinum being spent, and that is a bad thing.

 

Item for item trades might even get extinct since people would get what they need solo and never go through the pain of running the same mission 100 times ever again, they might as well run another mission 100 times to get that other item they need. There would probably be a huge rush for the new content and those who obtain it first will sell it to other players for Plat but never trade them for any items. The value of the items would drop dramatically and after a couple of days everyone would stop farming that item because since there is no RNG they'd have to play the same mission another 100 times but this time they can't sell the stuff. 

 

So the main problem I see with completely removing RNG is that no one would have Spares of anything, everyone would get 1 of each item and then a few hardcore farmers would be selling stuff. Maybe... with predictable grinds... you might even attract botting... 

[MXultra]

You can't refute an opinion. You can just say:

"I honestly don't mind all these wait gates".

 

See the thing is, you are saying that the wait gates and usage of RNG is making the game less of a F2P model.

Also, you have yet to provide a few of the games where it does not annoy you when it comes to feeding it with money.

 

So you say I'm not replying to people with actual arguments, then you say that they can't actually make arguments against my opinion...?

 

And NO, I'm not saying that it's less of a F2P model, I'm pointing out that F2P is a business model that is actually getting more money out of people than a game you pay for once.

 

I shouldn't need to list specific games that don't annoy me with the constant need to feed it money, because that's most games. However I will provide you with a list when you quote the arguments that I've allegedly been ignoring.

[Soulden]

So willingness to play boring low-level, unchallenging missions makes you a gamer?

 

Or maybe I like playing where the challenge is, but I also like new content.

No it doesn't. And the challenge is an option you have at hand any given time you want it.

You want it forced into you and still have to grind mindlessly?...well thats a different point of view.

 

But your argument is about how we are gun pointed into buying the content, because otherwise the game is not worth playing.

Which in reality it isn't.