Lore- Potential Farmability And Why It Should Be A Commodity

[slumpyvanguard]

Hi there, general feedback discussion.

Updates 14's strongest points were undoubtedly the feeling of immersion and world building that it gave to players, through the hard work of the Kubrow, player ship, questing, etc, but there is an easier way to immerse players into the game, a subject of much heated discussion and of much griping by us players.

I'm talking about lore, obviously. DE has released tidbits of lore over the game's life, through allusions made by characters, codex entries, and more, but why is this so uncommon?

 

In one of my many farming missions recently it occurred to me that it might be fun to get small bits of story on my 35+ minute long runs in various towers and missions.

Effectively, this would make lore a farmable resource. Rather than a small cache of credits, I would greatly prefer a small text entry. It would take little effort from DE to write several hundred of these (There are many, many talented writers out there) and scatter them into the mid-tier drop tables. Even a four line long poem would be worth half an hour's work. Or perhaps multiple parts that are incoherent until united?

 

Now, I know that the Quests are a thing, and that they give us large chunks of small stories within the Warframe universe, but that takes voice acting (probably primarily on DE_Rebecca's part) and additional work, some of which I'm sure many people will be disappointed with anyways.

However, if lore is made a common drop that could be paired with something else (A weapon part, or some resource) it would give players more of an incentive to play longer missions or do more mundane farming.

Of course, this idea is derived directly from the way older style RPGs run with finding information scattered as well as the cereal box style collection system of finding multiple parts that solve a simple riddle, but I think it might have a place here.

 

You might be asking how lore would have value to a single player, since it could be uploaded to the forums and shared, thus surpassing the need for farming it at all, but I think if the lore tidbits (I guess that's what I'm calling them now) were numerous enough, random enough, and small enough this might not be an issue.

 

What do you think? Would you want lore tidbits to be put into some of the droptables, or are they already diluted enough- or is lore worth it to you as well?

[Psychotoxin]

This is a good idea... I know that there was a discussion about the "Lore as reward" thing, but even so - it should be a thing. Lore would make this game come alive.

 

Of course the lore tidbits should disappear from the drop tables once you have it, so it`s not like you have 75 verses of a poem... and they all are the same verse.

[Arbiter_of_Soul]

I like the idea of farmable lore but they shouldn't put those in the void drop tables. Void farming is annoying as it is. Also new players shouldn't be ommited from the game's story. I say they put the lore in, lets say interception missions or regular def. This way it kind of ties with the gameplay, you are intercepting some information the corpus found out about the great war for example.

 

Also De should really, and I do mean really put some effort into the lore. First of all it will make a lot of people happy and that is never a bad thing. Second, warframe has huge potential for its lore. The world is simply fascinating, who were the sentients, who were the orokin and what happened to them, who is the stalker, what are we -the Tenno. Hell, if they make some sort of story driven missions a la mass effect, this will be oficially the best third person shooter ever. There is so much to explore and build upon and I really hope DE have been putting this off so they can first build the game on a technical level and then expand on that base with lore.

 

I really wouldn't mind at all if the next 5 or 10 updates have no or very little new content and instead focus on lore and world building. Put in some more of those awesome short trailers as in game clips and I am sure most people will be quite content with it.

[Evers]

Im guessing that they want to release as minimum lore as possible so they can change gameplay elements or frames or whatever without beeing afraid of going away from the lore. As soon as the game is in a place where it won't change much anymore im betting we will see more and more lore.

 

Just take PvP as an example. The original Lore in the very early CB was that Tenno never ever fight against each other. Well now we have PvP and the Lore had to be changed. Or take Nova, original Lore was that Nova was a frame which was designed by the Tenno Council which would have ment that a Prime Version of Nova was not possible. Lore was changed so they can do it if they want to.

 

Currently there is still the possibility that certain things might change or have to be changed and Lore would kind of force them to keep it.

I for example, absolutly dislike PvP because i started playing Warframe with that original Lore. Even if its changed now i still remember the old one and avoid PvP.

[Testostzzet]

I'm totally behind this idea. To expand on it, my favorite part of the Mirage questline was unlocking each piece and being given a riddle leading to the next one. I would love it if each acquired piece of a Frame or weapon provided a small snippet of lore that not only contributed to a complete piece about the completed item itself but also hinted or outright stated where to find the other pieces. Not only would it be world-building, but it would also provide a small puzzle to engage players as well as giving new players a way to find the components they're looking for without having to consult the forums or Wiki.

 

The challenge would be implementing all this lore while still keeping some of that feeling of mystery that the universe has. I think short stories, like the Mag Prime's codex entry, would be the best approach. A little peek into the universe instead of sweeping revelations and grand backstory.

[slumpyvanguard]

I like the idea of farmable lore but they shouldn't put those in the void drop tables. Void farming is annoying as it is. Also new players shouldn't be ommited from the game's story. I say they put the lore in, lets say interception missions or regular def. This way it kind of ties with the gameplay, you are intercepting some information the corpus found out about the great war for example.

 

Also De should really, and I do mean really put some effort into the lore. First of all it will make a lot of people happy and that is never a bad thing. Second, warframe has huge potential for its lore. The world is simply fascinating, who were the sentients, who were the orokin and what happened to them, who is the stalker, what are we -the Tenno. Hell, if they make some sort of story driven missions a la mass effect, this will be oficially the best third person shooter ever. There is so much to explore and build upon and I really hope DE have been putting this off so they can first build the game on a technical level and then expand on that base with lore.

 

I really wouldn't mind at all if the next 5 or 10 updates have no or very little new content and instead focus on lore and world building. Put in some more of those awesome short trailers as in game clips and I am sure most people will be quite content with it.

Exactly.

Warframe is designed to make the player feel powerful and important- as are all videogames. (which is another topic I may write on soon)

However, I feel the best, and the most badass when I play as Valkyr, because she is one of the only 'frames with a story behind her, the Zanuka Project. Warframe focuses too much on making shiny new additions with each update to a game that already has enough shiny things, (insert lens flare here) and making those shiny things hard to get, and at least in part worth it, but the game needs to give us REASONS behind what we are doing, which I think tidbits of lore would supply.

 

Giving us a purpose (as opposed to just a reason for farming) to do long defense or interception missions by making the information or being intercepted or defended valuable and impactful would immerse players even further, great idea.

 

Each element of the game has the potential to have a massive amount of story behind it, and as mentioned, we already know that some elements already do have large story chunks behind them- yet they are not being expanded or explained.

Not to ring my own bell too much, but I think this is why tiny lore capsules would be a good way for DE to begin to feed the obviously much, much larger plot into a game that has trouble otherwise carrying its own story effectively.

[slumpyvanguard]

Im guessing that they want to release as minimum lore as possible so they can change gameplay elements or frames or whatever without beeing afraid of going away from the lore. As soon as the game is in a place where it won't change much anymore im betting we will see more and more lore.

 

Just take PvP as an example. The original Lore in the very early CB was that Tenno never ever fight against each other. Well now we have PvP and the Lore had to be changed. Or take Nova, original Lore was that Nova was a frame which was designed by the Tenno Council which would have ment that a Prime Version of Nova was not possible. Lore was changed so they can do it if they want to.

 

Currently there is still the possibility that certain things might change or have to be changed and Lore would kind of force them to keep it.

I for example, absolutly dislike PvP because i started playing Warframe with that original Lore. Even if its changed now i still remember the old one and avoid PvP.

I agree, I think this is a very good reason for DE not to insert too much lore, but I think a year and a half in that some more solid groundwork can be laid, and really needs to be laid down, especially with older players feeling as if they have nothing to do and newer players being simply confused (though of course U14 helped that quite a lot.)

I think if lore needed to be changed then it wouldn't be a huge deal first, and second, DE has the complete right to do that, because as many of us forget, this game is in beta.

[Evers]

I agree, I think this is a very good reason for DE not to insert too much lore, but I think a year and a half in that some more solid groundwork can be laid, and really needs to be laid down, especially with older players feeling as if they have nothing to do and newer players being simply confused (though of course U14 helped that quite a lot.)

I think if lore needed to be changed then it wouldn't be a huge deal first, and second, DE has the complete right to do that, because as many of us forget, this game is in beta.

Lore has changed already (just look at the two examples in my post). Im not saying that DE has no right to change it, im just saying that it isn't good to do it. Sure we are in a Beta (no need to remind me) but still if people learn the lore and then it suddenly changes you just can't simply forget the old lore, espacially if you liked the old lore.

I personally was really happy that Warframe was "just" a Coop and PvE Game and didn't had any PvP and PvP was actually not possilbe with the old lore. So im sticking with the old lore i learned when i started Warframe and that was in the Gmae for quiet some time and avoid PvP as much as possible.

[slumpyvanguard]

Lore has changed already (just look at the two examples in my post). Im not saying that DE has no right to change it, im just saying that it isn't good to do it. Sure we are in a Beta (no need to remind me) but still if people learn the lore and then it suddenly changes you just can't simply forget the old lore, espacially if you liked the old lore.

I personally was really happy that Warframe was "just" a Coop and PvE Game and didn't had any PvP and PvP was actually not possilbe with the old lore. So im sticking with the old lore i learned when i started Warframe and that was in the Gmae for quiet some time and avoid PvP as much as possible.

Agreed, I understand that concern- for shifting the universe they have built once everyone gets used to it. It's a completely viable concern.

 

However I do not think it is reason enough not to release more lore for those of us already very invested in the game. I think the risk inherent to giving us more lore is one that DE needs to take. Not saying you were saying that, just building off of what you said.

[Arbiter_of_Soul]

We have some established facts already, which aren't nessesarily connected to the gameplay. The great war is one such part of the story.

 

I think DE can safely release info about it. Start connecting the dots in a way, give us a rudimentary understanding of the in-game universe, how it all started, why did the Tenno supposedly slaughter the orokin. This will give some food for though to the old players, keep them entertained, but without constraining DE about future gameplay. it will leave them some wiggle room.

 

Perhaps this is the best way to go about the lore - release an update with new shiny stuff and some history tidbits about old and well established facts.

[notlamprey]

This is a good idea, but I'm afraid of what DE might do with it. As long as the mechanic doesn't ultimately wind up taking advantage of players' enthusiasm (read: excessive/abusive grind/rng), I think I can get behind it.

 

Little bits of "recovered logs" would be awesome. Could it be worked in as some sort of mini-game that players can access when in the Liset?

[Testostzzet]

Additional thought, and I know this is out there, but I want to get it down in writing-

 

With all the veterans clamoring for "endgame content," how about a/a couple specific questline(s) about uncovering some of the secrets of Warframe's lore? What happened to the Sentients, the Orokin, what happened during the great war, etc. Quest-specific tilesets, or perhaps even linear levels (such as a battle-damaged Orokin vessel, maybe even a ship graveyard) unlocked through keys given as rewards for particularly grueling Void missions.

 

Maybe it should be its own topic, but now you have me thinking about the possibilities enough that I'm actually posting on the forums more than once in a blue moon. Great thread.