Infested Spawns In Solo Are Completely Unreasonable

[Xtorma]

Why is this a discussion, they aren't op at all.

 

It's a discussion because your opinion isn't the only one in the universe.

[Dark_Zarke]

Pistol works fine in most instances, however if it gets hairy just do the following.

 

1.) Swap to Rifle. (Data unit will drop at your feet)

2.) Mow down room with your automatic/burst fire.

3.) Pick up Data unit (you will swap to pistol)

4.) Proceed on your way.

That would work if it wasn't an endless hoard of mobs every two seconds you can't keep dropping and picking it back up or you'll be in one spot for an hour..Or a day.

[matrixEXO]

Geeze people have you not read his post properly. He say he is doing Spy mission. He is stuck on secondary which is the pistol playing solo!

 

Secondaries can be swapped to primaries any time since you can easily drop and pick them back up without worrying anything is gonna happen. Geez, get the game mechanics right.

[Rakuall]

I'm a little confused why people are whining about solo difficulty in game that not only has co-op, but is designed specifically for it. Yes there is a solo mode, but Warframe is a game where, from the very outset, you were supposed to bring a friend or three along. now, don't get me wrong, I love me some solo, but you have to acknowledge and accept that you'll be doing 4 people's worth of work, by yourself. Yes it's going to much harder. Deal, or bring backup.

[Makemap]

Secondaries can be swapped to primaries any time since you can easily drop and pick them back up without worrying anything is gonna happen. Geez, get the game mechanics right.

 

He said Spy mission takes the longest. Then he has to drop it like every 1 min seeing how the spawn time of infested is very low. Spawn back, spawn front. I think every Spy mission should just give you the time limit to get out instead of that sabotage. Plus some part of the maps have height and climbing. Then he has to run back up or down to grab the kit again.

[ShimmerDoll]

I'm a little confused why people are whining about solo difficulty in game that not only has co-op, but is designed specifically for it. Yes there is a solo mode, but Warframe is a game where, from the very outset, you were supposed to bring a friend or three along. now, don't get me wrong, I love me some solo, but you have to acknowledge and accept that you'll be doing 4 people's worth of work, by yourself. Yes it's going to much harder. Deal, or bring backup.

 

It's not whining at all.

 

They always said it would be soloable in various places (forums, Twitter, other social media etc). That's WHY I contributed and became a founder. If I wanted to support a game that forced me to group with strangers, I'd go play some crappy mmorpg. Also Warframe doesn't have to be like ME3 where, yeah you could play 1 or 2 people but should play with 4. Some people don't want to. The game used to be soloable for me entirely until something changed recently where the spawns are acting odd. The way the spawns are working is obviously wrong for some people, and that's what I think you are missing. It's noting to do with a legitimate hard difficulty that's the problem. It's a cheap, fake hard, that I take issue with. And trust me, I'm a person who likes games like Dark Souls, and some of the challenges in Dark Souls like killing bosses with no armor and just your fists! 

 

Right now I'm seeing enemies spawn in big groups with an INSANE amount of Shield Ospreys  and getting stuck in doorways trying to charge into the room shooting. There's also what I suspect the normal spawn in other sections of a room, just standing there shooting/stripping shields at the same time. That room you just cleared 20 seconds ago and want to fall back to is suddenly filled with enemies again, and that's if you're lucky. Occasionally the room goes into lockdown immediately with 20 enemies attacking you, and no retreat at all. It's like a double spawn or more is attacking throughout the whole mission.  You can be in a corner with no doors, windows, anything behind you and an enemy will spawn behind your location and kill you. Not to mention the occasional nonstop lockdowns.  I go to hack the console in a room I just completely cleared (I've done this thousands of times now, so I know the game) and some boss occasionally comes out of no where, in a room I know I cleared and kills me at the console. I revive and kill the enemy and suddenly things go back into lockdown and some other previously closed room opens with all these enemies that strip your shields and health in seconds.

 

 I remember just a few weeks ago in 100s of hours of video I recorded, when I could actually play and never see this issue, and it wasn't crazy enemy spawns like it has been recently. I didn't use up all my revives ever, and I didn't stop playing after an hour because of it. I mean - come on! This is frustration.  Obvious larger spawns, or too many boss types mixed into these large spawns in comparison to maybe two weeks ago, and rooms you cleared respawning less than 30 seconds later, seeing enemies appearing out of thin air or right behind you. Walking into a situation where they strip your shields nonstop - this is happening even with two people playing together. Also other issues I hear people talking about.

It's stuff like that and it is ridiculous. Still, soloing should be fine. I don't understand why some people are so against it. If you like to group with others that's cool, that's your preference but not mine. People can have their preference but it shouldn't ruin the game for people who want to play solo or with another friend or boyfriend/girlfriend/wife/husband.. you get the idea. You shouldn't even be concerned with how I am playing the game. Scaling in so many games like this has worked for a range of playstyles, so it should be fine for this too. Look at Borderlands for example and even the raid boss is soloable.  Not to mention the game was represented as solo, and I played it that way and enjoyed it enough to drop $250 dollars on it for me, $250 for a friend and another $330 or so buying platinum. If they fix this I'd spend more... though I think the prices for alot of stuff in the market is priced too high and should be readjusted. And I don't mean the -25 or -50 platinum discount on a Warframe or weapon, which still results in you having to pay 10 dollars anyway to get enough platinum.  Gaming is turning into a hobby for rich people only, though thats an entirely different discussion.

From Official Warframe twitter -  WARFRAME ‏@PlayWarframe

@Mad_BD  We won't remove Solo! Hell no! Scaling difficulty is a continuous conscious effort.

@PlayWarframe  I (and I'm sure many others) play solo 75% of the time. Would kind of suck for it to be taken out.

   

    

WARFRAME WARFRAME ‏@PlayWarframe 12 Apr

@dutchirish56 Will never be taken out.

Here's the link https://twitter.com/...891036470947840

I also screenshot it and framed it on my wall, because it's about freaking time in these games!

 

I don't want this game to become a tiny MMO or ME3 (that game was total trash). Even if I wanted to group (I mean be forced to play with strangers, forced because there is no other option) I wouldn't and I couldn't because of my connection. I play with another friend who lives very close to me. I know lots of people on Steam, Raptr or other places that solo too. Quite a few people I know quit Planetside and became Founders here too because they really just were after a solo friendly shooter.

Edited April 18, 2013 by BloodDoll

[Damoklesz]

So if you're only soloing, why the hell are you using Trinity? What do you expect from a support in solo? Honestly besides this I tend to agree with most things said.

 

I also hate games where enemies are respawning in areas I just cleared. This makes any sort of tactical progression futile, and encourages to rush. Of course some people just don't understand this, so I often end up standing at the end of the map afking for several minutes.

 

Nowdays any missions where I have to carry the briefcase (and forced to solo), I just run through without barely killing anything. I actually have a viper, which is a perfectly capable main weapon in the sidearm slot, until the ammo runs out. I'd rather spend 1-2 free revives and 5 minutes on maps like that, then to spend several ammo boxes and half an hour. There is no way I'm willing to kill any high level ancients solo without actually gearing for it, because it's annoying and takes a lifetime.

 

Honestly I don't even understand how people can solo some of the higher level maps. For example it seemed completly impossible to do the Ceres - Kiste grineer mobile defense solo when I tried it. The problem is that I didn't see any change in difficulty between a solo game and a 4 player game. Same amount of enemies, same enemy strength. If this is really how it works, then we have a problem, because there is no way to balance any game content to be possible for 1 person and still be challenging for 4.

[Firetempest]

Ive killed well over 300 in a single mercury mission because of the broke spawn mechanics running between the last few tiles to farm. Spawn back concept is fine overall, yet they should really only allow so many "reserves" to spawn per room and afterward once reserves are depleted, no more should spawn. These reserve numbers could be increased on mission level.

 

Also I see box hiding as a exploit and will likely be fixed for infection to eventually get to you. So relying on that manuver and thinking the spawn isnt a issue will likely get a rude awakening when they tweak infected to climb and you just ran through 4 rooms and have a small army on your heels.

Edited April 18, 2013 by Firetempest

[xenapan]

he probably landed on a spawn point and kept going forward and back spawning more of em.

[TheTenthDoc]

Ive killed well over 300 in a single mercury mission because of the broke spawn mechanics running between the last few tiles to farm. Spawn back concept is fine overall, yet they should really only allow so many "reserves" to spawn per room and afterward once reserves are depleted, no more should spawn. These reserve numbers could be increased on mission level.

 

Also I see box hiding as a exploit and will likely be fixed for infection to eventually get to you. So relying on that manuver and thinking the spawn isnt a issue will likely get a rude awakening when they tweak infected to climb and you just ran through 4 rooms and have a small army on your heels.

 

If they make chargers able to climb boxes the high level infested content will be even more tedious, especially if you don't have a potato. It's already bad enough. I could see giving leapers better leap height though (they can already leap onto some of the lower boxes).

 

I will say that after the last two alerts I'm gonna retract anything about spawns being okay at the moment. I got 6 total ancients charging into a rescue room with assorted minions, 3/3 disruptor/toxic split. That seems a bit excessive, especially when every room is spawning 3-4 ancients anyway. At least on the Corpus tileset with the "hidden passage" down they all clog together at the entrance and can't fit, just like Grineer/Corpus.

[Anelyn]

I'm on the opposite spectrum with this, I ENJOY zergs (no matter faction) when am doing alerts. Just because an Alert is in a low level sector, DOES NOT EQUATE it's a low level alert. I had lvl 40+ mobs on Saturn Alert for example (which is one of the starter zones with Venus).

Always take a lvl 30 warframe with at least 1 good weapon on alert missions (at least if you plan to solo it). Make sure you have at least 1 elemental mod (even unranked) vs said faction it helps a huge deal.

Since you're playing trinity, I'd recommend dual viper / akbolto as sidearm for those Spy type of missions. Never stay in 1 spot vs infested trying to kill whatever comes at you. They come from different angles, and you can't shoot them all at same time or stop them from charging / hitting you.

Always move! Run ahead, do acrobatics, backtrack, etc. I can make a video with a high level infested spy mission only using pistols and melee, no warframe skills. You need to be mobile, aware of surrounding / map, know quick escape routes to let shields regen, how to side roll to avoid ancients ranged attack or chargers leaps etc.

[ShimmerDoll]

So if you're only soloing, why the hell are you using Trinity? What do you expect from a support in solo? Honestly besides this I tend to agree with most things said.

 

I also hate games where enemies are respawning in areas I just cleared. This makes any sort of tactical progression futile, and encourages to rush. Of course some people just don't understand this, so I often end up standing at the end of the map afking for several minutes.

 

Nowdays any missions where I have to carry the briefcase (and forced to solo), I just run through without barely killing anything. I actually have a viper, which is a perfectly capable main weapon in the sidearm slot, until the ammo runs out. I'd rather spend 1-2 free revives and 5 minutes on maps like that, then to spend several ammo boxes and half an hour. There is no way I'm willing to kill any high level ancients solo without actually gearing for it, because it's annoying and takes a lifetime.

 

Honestly I don't even understand how people can solo some of the higher level maps. For example it seemed completly impossible to do the Ceres - Kiste grineer mobile defense solo when I tried it. The problem is that I didn't see any change in difficulty between a solo game and a 4 player game. Same amount of enemies, same enemy strength. If this is really how it works, then we have a problem, because there is no way to balance any game content to be possible for 1 person and still be challenging for 4.

They definitely need to do more scaling so people can play the game alone at the end, on those higher level maps as you said. They have stated several times on twitter, not just in that link, that we can solo those higher missions and were working on scaling. I hope they are working on it. It seems important and I feel a bit cheated that they represented it soloable and stated so which prompted me to support it because that's a game I want to play, but things do get insanely hard eventually.  I understand some people like to play with others, but it should always be a choice, not forced upon an individual, where they either make themselves play with others, or quit the game.

 

There is still the problem with unnatural spawns, where there are so many pathfinding confuses them, and this chained lockdown issue.

[GeoffFromAccounting]

the only real spawn issues I've seen are on Io on Jupiter (wave 18, 3 other people and I was on a rank 30 Excalibur the entire time), LAAAAAAAG! anyway, that may be because I usually don't Solo, but when I do I usually get 10 chargers, a Healing Ancient and two Disruptors, and just quit from there since it's at the exact beggining (not joking, the second I begin the mission, it's like I'm infested food, or they're ill tempered mutated Mastiffs) and since all Infested have a stagger effect, I (don't) just extend my neck and go "Nope" (this part I do though) and just go "ABORT THRE- uh MISSION!!" so yeah it kinda needs a fix

[Naqel]

It is possible to complete solo infested missions with any frame. No adjustment is necessary.

If anything, they should fix the spawn rates on enemies when an infested mission has faction swaps.

 

It's fun to have as many Lancers and Heavies as there'd normally be Chargers and Ancients, but the onslaught of shooting enemies worthy of 4-man games is insurmountable for someone unprepared.

[xStonedRaveNx]

doesn't rolling (tapping shift) evade disruptor's poking tentacle? And as you're a grand master/master founders package fit out your sentinel with slows (lightning, ice). Swarms of infested are the most intense fights in warframe at the moment, until they rework the bland boss fights (and I mean bland. THERE IS SO MUCH YOU CAN DO WITH BOSSES IN WARFRAME WHY YOU NO DO IT)  

[ShimmerDoll]

It's still a problem. Alot of content I just can't get past so I'm stuck with nothing to do. I don't want to group with people and my connection isn't going to allow it anyway but even if it did. I don't do forced - especially in a game of all places! I haven't in 10 years of playing other games where I had to find work-arounds to do group content, and I'm not starting now, but also just because of my connection. Besides I already went over this.

 

I also wish I could hide the chat too in solo mode, I don't want to read that occasionally racist talk people type. It's upsetting stuff some nights.

Edited April 19, 2013 by BloodDoll

[Zekushiido]

honestly i enjoy the spawns........ Whats the fun in only 10-20 enemies in a room

[ShimmerDoll]

honestly i enjoy the spawns........ Whats the fun in only 10-20 enemies in a room

That's fine but it depends. I just came out of a game with a couple ancients at once, tons of other staggering annoying enemies and at the same time the enemies I killed in the previous room about 5 seconds ago, came back. It's not fun at all. I used all my revives today on various maps with the characters I care about. So the game's dead for 24 hours. Awesome design there!

 

I think paying for revives is silly. They should allow us 4 per mission not 4 a day (for each character).  It's like they are purposely making it unfun. It might be fun to some but they need some difficulty setting. I still can't beat some lower content bosses despite having alot of good stuff.  Some people can, some can't since I tried to duo it with a friend.

 

I do like the numbers you said if it's balanced right. I don't like 10-20 enemies mostly being harder enemies and bosses and staggering and no ammo around, draining shields and just plain over the top frustrating stuff. <---In that case it is CHEAP, poorly designed encounters. I remember the days games didn't do this and people still talked about them as great games. It's like they do this to force us to give in to buying stuff with platinum or grouping. If they aren't intentionally trying to do that, then please balance, scale or fix this issue.

 

On Twitter or here it seems if you bring it up you get no response, but someone can tweet 10 seconds after you to whatever person is monitoring Twitter about something totally worthless to improving the game, sometimes not even related directly to gameplay and they will respond to it. Please, listen devs! Give us a difficulty setting so some of us can enjoy the game and people who want it harder can make it harder. That's the CHOICE I want! Games over a decade older gave us these options and were also shooters/fps,  and games throughout the years have too.  Playing for 8 hours no rare drops, can't get past some areas on the map (I am sticking to solo/duo forever, never going to change), crazy like almost fan-made griefer spawns coming at me that need fixing and no more revives.

 

It would be great to get an official response about this scaling thing they brought up in that twitter post. Community response isn't helping solve anything. The game is one of the best I've played in awhile, but the difficulty is the problem.

Edited April 19, 2013 by BloodDoll

[Hollow_Knight]

Sounds like a bug, but I would have relished the chance to test myself against that many enemies on solo :)

 

Try a Boltor, with full armour pierce, a multishot mod and a few other typical mods you can wipe out an ancient in seconds.

[HvcTerr]

 I used all my revives today on various maps with the characters I care about. So the game's dead for 24 hours. Awesome design there!

 

The game's not dead, it's just that your next death will either be mission-failure or you'll have to wait for your teammates to finish.

[Hans-The-Dragon]

A new player to this game with only a few hours gameplay in.

When I recently played the first mission over again hoping to get something to fusion my mods with I got over 90 kills.

I have noticed the fact that a room I have cleared trough is suddenly spawning enemies when I leave it and sometimes a room I am in is spawning enemies behind me.

It makes me want to play the game less and I end up playing maybe 2 missions before quitting for a while and doing something else before coming back to play an hour later.

[zagibu]

Enemies spawning in cleared rooms is the biggest gripe I have with this game. It makes any kind of tactical approach futile.

[Fluffanutter]

When Playing Solo set yourself up for it as Others have said. Use a Shade for Example, or do not bring a Support Frame in to fight Solo, or Better yet even, use Link on Trinity when Fighting Ancients and stand in the Toxic Goo. Let them do the work for you.

 

Fluffanutter

[Mikawo]

When soloing, I play most missions as an extermination killing everything in sight. In my experience, the spawns die down after you've killed enough enemies. If you want to comfortably complete objectives like spying without being shanked in the process, I recommend playing those missions as if it were an extermination. Yes, you will have to kill MANY enemies. My advice is to melee as often as you can to conserve your bullets for tougher enemies like poison ancients.