G3rman Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 It would be unfair if the weapon was OP, it has its own set of drawbacks and strengths. Developers have confirmed Vandals are exclusive, complaining will not make them give you a prize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzermeido Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 Personally, I've got two problems with the Braton Vandal (and the "Vandal" concept as a whole). 1st - the Braton Vandal per se has different stats than the Braton. It fills a different niche, a niche not filled by any other weapon. Not making the niche available cuts gameplay away from the game for a whopping amount of players. 2nd - the method of acquisition. I've beta-tested, so I got the Lato Vandal. Okay, I can understand, though I'd be more contempt with a new pistol with the same stats as Vandal available for everyone and Vandal being a unique skin for it. But the Braton Vandal is basically "Achievement Unlocked: Downloaded the Game Client". It's doesn't represent you did anything good, or helped the devs, or otherwise did anything significant. You simply downloaded the game client. Braton Vandal would make a great reward for participating in the open beta, but not for downloading the game client. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f3llyn Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 I undestand the point made, but the problem i have is that the braton vandal is not a skin, ist a different weapon altogether, with different stats altogether, And i didnt know the game exsisted until last week, so i was not able to buy that weapon until ist was to late, So that content is lost to me beacose i was not there when i should have, it is not fair, there is nothig i can do about it (or could have done, not knowing) Again this problem appear only beacose this is a difeerent weapon, with different ("better") stats, and not a skin How is it not fair? Would you join World of Warcraft or any other mmo and demand that you be given the exclusive rewards for every event they've ever held even though you only just started playing? That doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. Why not complain about the 2 free color pallets they've given away then? No one even mentions those, and you can't get equivalents (or better) just by playing the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfnico Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) make a gun with the same stats as the vandal call it the braton mk.2 remove the lotus flower symbol done i don't care about the fancy skin i just don't like the fact that there is an item that is cool from a game play perspective, because lets face it it looks the same as the braton/mk.1 who cares about a little lotus flower i just don't like that it has different stats when battlefield released preorder only guns people were in outrage. Edited April 26, 2013 by Wolfnico Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cy3160 Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 i think that braton is fine, braton vandal is just for stalker cosplay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inez Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 As a CB player myself, if new players had access to the Vandals, I don't understand how that would hurt me. At all. Even remotely. More guns for people to play with is always good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) I undestand the point made, but the problem i have is that the braton vandal is not a skin, ist a different weapon altogether, with different stats altogether, And i didnt know the game exsisted until last week, so i was not able to buy that weapon until ist was to late, So that content is lost to me beacose i was not there when i should have, it is not fair, there is nothig i can do about it (or could have done, not knowing) Again this problem appear only beacose this is a difeerent weapon, with different ("better") stats, and not a skin Personally, I've got two problems with the Braton Vandal (and the "Vandal" concept as a whole). 1st - the Braton Vandal per se has different stats than the Braton. It fills a different niche, a niche not filled by any other weapon. Not making the niche available cuts gameplay away from the game for a whopping amount of players. 2nd - the method of acquisition. I've beta-tested, so I got the Lato Vandal. Okay, I can understand, though I'd be more contempt with a new pistol with the same stats as Vandal available for everyone and Vandal being a unique skin for it. But the Braton Vandal is basically "Achievement Unlocked: Downloaded the Game Client". It's doesn't represent you did anything good, or helped the devs, or otherwise did anything significant. You simply downloaded the game client. Braton Vandal would make a great reward for participating in the open beta, but not for downloading the game client. And these "points" entitle you to get the Vandal... how? Again, the point of exclusive rewards is that they are exclusive. f3llyn's example hits this right on the head. You don't get to join and say "Hey, I failed to be here when the devs were rewarding people who participated in X, but I deserve the reward too!" @ Panzermeido's second point: Braton Vandal was a reward to players who participated in the open beta test weekend, which was also a stress-test on the servers. I would also point out that the devs can reward people with whatever the hell they want, for whatever the hell they want, but I don't know that that would come across well. Edited April 26, 2013 by Thor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzermeido Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 And these "points" entitle you to get the Vandal... how? Again, the point of exclusive rewards is that they are exclusive. f3llyn's example hits this right on the head. You don't get to join and say "Hey, I failed to be here when the devs were rewarding people who participated in X, but I deserve the reward too!" @ Panzermeido's second point: Braton Vandal was a reward to players who participated in the open beta test weekend, which was also a stress-test on the servers. I would also point out that the devs can reward people with whatever the hell they want, for whatever the hell they want, but I don't know that that would come across well. Exclusive doesn't mean "unique". As long as something is directly contributing to gameplay, one must provide all possible means to make this something available to the whole player base, especially since the weapon choice is rather scarce at the moment. Both Vandals, in my opinion, should be available to everybody, but the skin associated with the current look of the Vandals should stay exclusive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 Exclusive doesn't mean "unique". As long as something is directly contributing to gameplay, one must provide all possible means to make this something available to the whole player base, especially since the weapon choice is rather scarce at the moment. Both Vandals, in my opinion, should be available to everybody, but the skin associated with the current look of the Vandals should stay exclusive. By "directly contributing to gameplay", do you mean "a nonmandatory gameplay option"? Because that's what it is. And in that case, I fail to see how they're obligated to do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsubasakuroi Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 Figure I'll just try to do a compromise. How about a skin for the Braton that gives it the same performance of the Braton Vandal? Of course, it probably still won't have a polarity slot, and probably not the same awesome firing sound the Vandal has... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzermeido Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 By "directly contributing to gameplay", do you mean "a nonmandatory gameplay option"? Because that's what it is. And in that case, I fail to see how they're obligated to do anything. Yes, I mean exactly that. The gameplay doesn't consist of "Obligatory Braton, Skana and Lato and all the other S#&$ that's just an option". The gameplay is the options, the versatility, the choice. The wider the choice, the better the gameplay, as a rule of thumb. And why do you try to strawman me with "they're not obligated to do anything"? I'm voicing my concerns and opinion, which isn't really about obligating anybody to do anything. Try some new fallacies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) And why do you try to strawman me with "they're not obligated to do anything"? I'm voicing my concerns and opinion, which isn't really about obligating anybody to do anything. Try some new fallacies. As long as something is directly contributing to gameplay, one must provide all possible means to make this something available to the whole player base I'll just leave this here. Re: The part where you were actually making a point instead of waving "omg fallacies" around, last I checked the gameplay is the part where we're chopping things in half, not fussing around about "oh no these people got a slightly different version of this gun that I have that's not fair". Once again, the point of an exclusive item is that it is exclusive. More variety is in weapons is guaranteed to be added in the future, and the fact that you cannot get a single item, which is neither gamebreakingly overpowered nor even incredibly unique (If we were talking about beta testers getting, I don't know, a gun that shot smaller guns, then I'd probably agree with your argument, but this is a reskin and slight stat-modification of a gun that everyone can buy for credits), which was intended to be an exclusive reward, doesn't mean much of anything. That was probably a run-on sentence. I don't care. Edited April 26, 2013 by Thor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
__Kanade__ Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 How on earth would me getting a Vandal screw you? Because Braton/Lato Vandals were a gift to us as a thank you for being a Closed Beta participant, giving it away to everyone would take away the Vandal's rarity, which is why I also agree with keeping it just for those of us who were in CB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venarge Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 Because Braton/Lato Vandals were a gift to us as a thank you for being a Closed Beta participant, giving it away to everyone would take away the Vandal's rarity, which is why I also agree with keeping it just for those of us who were in CB. Yep. And they already said that it was one time offer...... So this request for another braton vandal give away wont do anything.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K0bra Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) I think they will return. :) Because i asked DE_Steve about that and this was his answer : Hey - thanks for playing! We do those vandals on a limited time basis and then put them back in the 'vault' so to speak. I think we'll run events and stuff to give them out, I know what you mean by collector mentality! Edited April 26, 2013 by K0bra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) I think they will return. :) Because i asked DE_Steve about that and this was his answer : Hey - thanks for playing! We do those vandals on a limited time basis and then put them back in the 'vault' so to speak. I think we'll run events and stuff to give them out, I know what you mean by collector mentality! Personally I'm interpreting that more as "We'll have events in the future to give away new exclusive items", not "We'll have events in the future to give away past exclusive items". Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I'm not wrong. Edited April 26, 2013 by Thor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K0bra Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) He said "We give THEM out." We talked about Vandals.Easy to understand. Why you "hope" they will not give them out again?Are you guys really so greedy ,so epen lovely?Cmon.Be happy about when another people can be happy too.Think about it. Greetings Edited April 26, 2013 by K0bra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
__Kanade__ Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) If they do that, it really will be a cold slap in the face to us CB testers. It's like saying BLR should give out their "Rotten To The Core" and "Beta Tester" tiltes out to all players regardless if they were in CB or not, but they won't, and for other Veteran players like myself, we also got "Egg Hunter" "Loyalist" and "Battle Hardened". Those titles were released before BLR went to Steam and are still exclusive titles since they were specifically for pre steam release players ( the original BLR community ). Giving out the Braton Vandal again to the entire WF community means we as beta testers no longer have something unique that signified us that we were beta testers. DE needs to appreciate the players who participated in CB as the Vandal weapons are the only unique CB items they released, they even said it was an exclusive one time offer, key word Exclusive. We are the original Warframe community, therefore the Vandal items are and should be off limits to those who weren't a CB player. Edited April 26, 2013 by __Kanade__ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaperAlien Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 (edited) I don't have a Braton Vandal, but I am against reintroducing it. It's rather hypocritical to call Vandal owners selfish for wanting their Vandals to be exclusive, because you're pretty much asking to get a powerful/prestigious weapon for yourself, and taking away the uniqueness of these weapons. I'm all for introducing another set of differently named, slightly nerfed (or maybe even same stats, the name alone may be enough bragging rights) versions to be given to all Open Beta players, but I also wouldn't mind if they don't. Edited April 27, 2013 by PaperAlien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 (edited) He said "We give THEM out." We talked about Vandals.Easy to understand. Why you "hope" they will not give them out again?Are you guys really so greedy ,so epen lovely?Cmon.Be happy about when another people can be happy too.Think about it. Greetings To clarify, I was saying he might have been talking about other vandal items - Skanas, Latrons, pistol ammo boxes, whatever. And that's fine, I'm not opposing that at all. To reiterate again: The point of the Braton Vandal being exclusive is that it is exclusive. To reintroduce it in another event would make its original purpose/identity/what-have-you (Namely, "You guys participated in the open beta test and we'd like to give you this exclusive item to thank you and identify you as having participated in that") meaningless. As to the "you're greedy, something about epeens, happiness and flowers" thing, see PaperAlien's post. Thanks PaperAlien. Edited April 27, 2013 by Thor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValhaHazred Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 I also missed out on the Braton Vandal. I give zero F*bleep*s. It was a gift for those who could be there. You complainers must be hilarious at other people's birthday parties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 I also missed out on the Braton Vandal. I give zero F*bleep*s. It was a gift for those who could be there. You complainers must be hilarious at other people's birthday parties. You are currently my favorite person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyXmaN Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Why not create a buffed polarity-slotted braton and name it "advanced braton"? sell it for 225 plat with a 25,000 credits blueprint in market? That way those who have vandal will keep their vandal in its uniqueness. Those that dont have vandal will get a similar gun. Everybody is happy, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Why not create a buffed polarity-slotted braton and name it "advanced braton"? sell it for 225 plat with a 25,000 credits blueprint in market? That way those who have vandal will keep their vandal in its uniqueness. Those that dont have vandal will get a similar gun. Everybody is happy, no? If the "prestiging" system they mentioned in (I think) Livestream 3 works as it sounds like it will, the polarity of the Vandal will become less relevant. Other than that? Sure. The alternative (Which others have suggested and I have no objection to) is to offer the same or similar stat changes in the form of a new skin, since the Vandal is essentially a skin anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amistyrja Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Could we have a Ladnav Notarb that has the same stats as Braton Vandal but without the unique appearance and costs 30k credits? Maybe that would be unfair to people who have potato'd their Bratons. Then maybe there should be a Ladnav Notarb blueprint that requires a Braton to make and will carry potato over to the new weapon ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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