Primed Heated Charge

[MaverickZero]

Read someone excusing powercreep by endless scaling Void missions. Now that's an idiotic notion I haven't read in a long time.

 

That logic is broken by the very definition of endless. Endless being the keyword here because whatever arbitrary point you choose someone can choose one higher and say 'We need level 20 serration to reach 5 hour T4D DE plz add' then 'Level 25 or level 30 serration'.

 

Regardless, even if we completely ignore the balance players are not supposed to go on long unhealthy sessions (you can't pause or take a break) and DE needs to keep that in mind. If you NoLife by choice then that is up to you (you're a special snowflake) but the average player shouldn't be expected to do that. The game should be setup for the majority of their target audience and not 30 people who can stay 6 hours in T4D (w/o nullifiers).

[xylonez]

-snip-

You're contradicting yourself. Previously, you hate power creep and now you want challenge. Both power creep and challenge can't exist at the same time. In fact, we're already power creeping, so those challenge you're talking about doesn't even exist. The fact that you don't struggle getting past an hour is proof of this.

 

The challenge you're talking about 2-3hours into t4s is bullS#&$. Because it's artificial challenge at best. You're basically doing the same thing over and over again. If you're spamming vortex at 30min mark, you'll be spamming vortex at 60min mark, 90min mark or even 180min mark. The only difference is the enemy's hp that's becoming higher and higher. Wait, that seems familiar? Yeah, you console players should know better, it feels like Destiny, starring bullet sponge.

 

I also don't see the relation between Viver LoS nerf and this. The LoS nerf is uncalled for because the broken system or the main issue is the syndicate, not the frame. This thread is about a completely different matter with different analogy too, because the issue is with the primed mods themselves.

[(PSN)torvahn]

Read someone excusing powercreep by endless scaling Void missions. Now that's an idiotic notion I haven't read in a long time.

 

That logic is broken by the very definition of endless. Endless being the keyword here because whatever arbitrary point you choose someone can choose one higher and say 'We need level 20 serration to reach 5 hour T4D DE plz add' then 'Level 25 or level 30 serration'.

 

Regardless, even if we completely ignore the balance players are not supposed to go on long unhealthy sessions (you can't pause or take a break) and DE needs to keep that in mind. If you NoLife by choice then that is up to you (you're a special snowflake) but the average player shouldn't be expected to do that. The game should be setup for the majority of their target audience and not 30 people who can stay 6 hours in T4D (w/o nullifiers).

powercreep doesnt exist and you suggesting that people like myself who play within the limits of the game and push those limits as far as we can would ever suggest something as stupid as level 20 serration is testament to you not understanding the whole point of my post.

Most of us don't complain about S#&$ and we have people like yourself who struggle to comprehend that your theory of powercreep is about as legitimate as the elo hell theory and how people defend their belief with such fervour and passion and end up ruining the game for people but we adapt and we keep going and you remain complaining about nonsense.

[letir]

powercreep doesnt exist and you suggesting that people like myself who play within the limits of the game and push those limits as far as we can would ever suggest something as stupid as level 20 serration is testament to you not understanding the whole point of my post.

It's not like Boltor P. much better then old Gorgon, right?

[Mickey33]

No more complaint about end-game. Credit farm at its finest!

[SleepingSentry]

From my experience at least half of you use boltor prime or synoid gammacor at all times.  Maybe toss in a paris prime or soma prime if you're feeling saucy.  Go to an earth alert where the enemies are level 10, same thing.  Complete overkill.  A lot of you don't seem to understand that.  Don't know why you'd be so concerned about "power creep".

 

It seems like a lot of you never learned to actually play because you were so obsessed with power and efficiency from the start.

 

Rep farm consists of 4 spam.  T4D consists of hiding in a globe or in the void and 4 spam.  Core farm T4S consists of camping in one little room and completely disabling all enemies as they come to you.  Credit farm consists of blazing through void capture missions ignoring all enemies, or running 5 (easy) rounds of infested defense.  

 

Where all of that work (it is most definitely a job not a game at that point) is leading you, I have no idea.

 

Any mission including endless ones can be destroyed using any frame with practically any gun under 40 waves or minutes, regardless of primed mods.  What the hell difference does a primed heated charge make?  Toss it into your gammacor and farm like a mindless zombie for 2.1 hours straight instead of 2. 

 

The problem isn't "power creep".  The problem is the risk vs. reward in this game is completely off balance.

Edited January 24, 2015 by SleepingSentry

[xylonez]

The problem isn't "power creep".  The problem is the risk vs. reward in this game is completely off balance.

Removing power creep may not solve the problem completely. It's a complex problem. But more power creep is just going to make the problem even worse.

 

Any mission including endless ones can be destroyed using any frame with practically any gun under 40 waves or minutes, regardless of primed mods.  What the hell difference does a primed heated charge make?  Toss it into your gammacor and farm like a mindless zombie for 2.1 hours straight instead of 2. 

Did you even read the first post? Or do you just come here, see the last post, and post whatever you think about the last post? If you think this trend is going to end with Primed Heated Charge, then you're wrong.

[Repligon]

<...>

You are saying about challange... and protecting system that turns game into easymode.

You are talking about gettig further than 40 minutes to get challange. And consider that it's ok for T4 base enemies consist almost completely of oneshot cannon fodder (exept nullifier. He is 7 shot cannon fodder).

I don't understand you. What you are telling means that you are ok with major part of the game (everything non-endless) become more and more easy with every update (which is sign of power creep). And trying to protect this by using "challange" as an argument.

 

The game needs a major rebalance of power. It needs to be like pre-Mods 2.0. When word "Heavy" in "Heavy gunner" meant that this enemy is harder to kill, not easier because he don't use cover. When "Heavy unit approaching" line from Lotus was helpful and meant that you have to be more careful and prepare for strategy change. When you could return from high level planet to Mercury alert and not die of boredoom because of how easy it is. When I am being experienced player could look at alert on Pluto and think "no it would be too hard for me". When challange was right here - on starchart, not somewere far behind 40 minutes mark of survival.

 

And with all this R10 mods added all investments of time and sometimes even real money are making mod system less fluid. And the farther it goes the harder would be to change and rebalance something without letting easy-mode lovers to use "but I spended time/money on this!" argumaent.

Edited January 24, 2015 by Repligon

[cyrus106]

Don't think these players in this thread know about that.   They're like kids.   Whine when their frame/weapon loses damage or doesn't gain damage "compared" to other guns.  Whines when DE releases a buffed mod that could potentially go toe 2 toe with said "compared" gun.

 

Scream Power Creep like a nimrod without showing any evidence.

 

Damage increased by 35%  O_O POWER CREEP PREPARE YOUR SOULS.  

-Wait isn't this a PVE game wouldn't the damage help us defeat corrupted nulli-

SHUT UP FOOL POWER CREEP PVP IS DOOMED

-But it's a team based game, players are having issues killing those new inf-

SHUT UP FOOL WE DONT NEED STRONGER MODS, WE NEED STRONGER.........uh...STUFF THAT ISN'T POWER CREEP

-What is a Power Cree-

-SHUT UP FOOL POWER CREEP IS WHEN.......JUST YOU WAIT! THEY WILL RELEASE ALL PRIMED ELEMENT MODS AND ITS OUR DOOM TO BE STRONG. WE MUST BE WEAK..TO REVERSE PSYCHOLOGICALLY TRICK THE ENEMIES TO THINKING WE ARE STRONG THEN WE WONT HAVE TO LEAVE EVERY DEFENSE WAVE at 5!

 

I want to keep going on but I'm hungry.

Ehhhh gonna have to disagree with you here. Power creep has nothing to do with pvp tbh, and we dont need more damage, enemy scaling needs to be tweaked. So the primed elementals and damage mods ARE power creep just for the sake of power creep

[Dromeos-Prime]

dat Nekro...

[cyrus106]

dat Nekro...

Eh, there isnt enough good discussions these days. Its not even a month old anyway

Edited February 20, 2015 by cyrus106

[Dromeos-Prime]

Could've just started a brand new topic on how powercreep does have an effect on PVE instead of reviving a month old topic.

Edited February 20, 2015 by reptillicus

[r0ckwolf]

To be honest, while I do share your concern about power creep, I would like a shift towards elemental mods.

Take Archwing for example: the regular damage mods are not as strong, while the elements offer big boosts.

The result is, that the player has to focus much more on using the right elemental combination to counter enemy resistances,rather then just cranking up damage all over the place.

This kind of specialization is much more interesting for the player and I would like to see more of it in the game.

[cyrus106]

Could've just started a brand new topic on how powercreep does have an effect on PVE instead of reviving a month old topic.

Why start a new topic when there is plenty here. I could see if it was 6 months old but its fairly recent discussion.

[Darkholde]

What is with all the crying about power creep?

 

It is a natural progression and needs to happen. Every MMO style game out there has it, otherwise the game becomes stagnant and just dies. Just makes sense they are looking to increase difficulties. No content is invalidated because you already bring your boltor prime that's been potato'd and 6 forma to mars missions already, so don't sweat the upgrades.

 

We are also getting 8 main raids which they already said are going to be much more difficult than anything currently.

 

And lastly, pretty much any weapon potato'd and forma'd are viable to high end stuff like T4's.

 

So Primed Heated Charge does nothing that you can't do already on venus and T4's it's not going to make that much difference at the major rotation points for mob strength. What it does is starts getting us ready for the 8 man raids coming, gives the vets something more to work towards as they will need to forma more things to make all the primed mods fit ext.

[cyrus106]

What is with all the crying about power creep?

 

It is a natural progression and needs to happen. Every MMO style game out there has it, otherwise the game becomes stagnant and just dies. Just makes sense they are looking to increase difficulties. No content is invalidated because you already bring your boltor prime that's been potato'd and 6 forma to mars missions already, so don't sweat the upgrades.

 

We are also getting 8 main raids which they already said are going to be much more difficult than anything currently.

 

And lastly, pretty much any weapon potato'd and forma'd are viable to high end stuff like T4's.

 

So Primed Heated Charge does nothing that you can't do already on venus and T4's it's not going to make that much difference at the major rotation points for mob strength. What it does is starts getting us ready for the 8 man raids coming, gives the vets something more to work towards as they will need to forma more things to make all the primed mods fit ext.

There are better ways to add progression without adding blatant power creep

[noteom]

People say you gotta give credit where credit is due, and while I'm thankful with the sugatra, I gotta say "What the F, DE?"

That's pretty much my reaction when I saw primed heated charge. I know I should've seen it coming, since information about it has been datamined and all, but I can't believe they actually put it.

 

What's coming next? Primed Infected Clip, Stormbringer, and Cryo Rounds? Primed Bane of Grineer/Corpus/Infested? Primed Speed Trigger/Shred? Primed Point Strike and Vital Sense? The primed version of the same thing for secondary and melee?

 

I, for one, am very concerned about this, because 2015 may very well be the year where the majority of our mods is primed mods. More importantly, I see power creeping written all over these mods. Honestly speaking, I don't like where this is going. Unfortunately, this quickly starts becoming a trend, and band-aids for those mods that needs to be buffed in the first place (i.e Fast Hands, Point Blank).

 

What do you guys think about this? Am I the only one that feels like this, cause I sure as hell hope not.

 

Also, please keep this discussion civil.

 

don't be racist against mods, dude

[SleepingSentry]

There are better ways to add progression without adding blatant power creep

 

That is literally what (character) progression means in video game terminology.  More power.

 

The issue is that there's currently no new challenge to match the progression.  I hope it has been established that primed mods are wholly unnecessary.  They serve their purpose just fine, a reason for people who play this game a lot to continue playing.  A lot of my weapons are just 2-3 forma'd or less and I can still use them to decimate all missions, including endless ones for hours with the right team.  

 

What I'd like to see is increased starting level of enemies in endless missions so it doesn't take 40 minutes to become a challenge (or perhaps a choice of what level the enemies start at).   Scaling rewards for endless missions so you're encouraged to make the game as difficult as you can handle - the longer you go the better the reward.  More nightmare mode modifiers, more reward for doing those in general, and possibly adding in nightmare variants to the void too.  Increased enemy health in co-op so you actually have to work together to take down enemies instead of 1 saryn spamming 4 over and over again doing the job of 4 players (in something like T4E).  Etc.

 

Like I mentioned earlier, the game should be higher risk higher reward like any other good action RPG.  Not low risk high reward like the game is now.

Edited February 20, 2015 by SleepingSentry