Please Get Off The Bandwagon.

[BramBlackmon]

Oh, no malicious intent behind it? Of course not, how silly of me. He was very well intentioned when he said people who didn't agree with such a reward were children. How could that have malicious intent? I'm very sorry for "engaging in confrontation", I didn't realise the topics weren't for discussion! How could I have made this mistake? Here I was, thinking that it was normal to explain what those "children" were thinking when they said they didn't think the reward was any good.

 

In all seriousness, take a good hard look at what you're writing. It makes no sense whatsoever. Who are you trying to kid? He made a topic about people's reaction to the reward while insinuating they were wrong and childish but, even though they're childish, we still shouldn't be mean to them. How good of him, to insult everyone with such pretty words instead of harsh ones, that makes him a much better person. No, he insulted those who don't agree with him numerous times throughout his post. Is that to be commended? Really? No, it's not. His post is, for all purposes, an insult.

But hey, I'll let you prove me wrong. Just quote my first post and highlight my insults, and I'll do the same for his. Want to guess who's actually being more malicious? It's not that hard.

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, he didn't insinuate that those who are upset over the reward are children? Please explain these two sentences then, I'd very much like to hear your interpretation. I find them incredibly straight forward, but hey, take a shot, explain what they actually mean.

 

You're so angry right now, that you didn't realize the person you were replying to and the person who wrote the thread were the same person. 

 

I'm not replying to another thing you say. and I'm encouraging everyone else to do the same. The Moderators have already posted once asking everyone to be civil. 

[JerryMouse13]

Oh, no malicious intent behind it? Of course not, how silly of me. He was very well intentioned when he said people who didn't agree with such a reward were children. How could that have malicious intent? I'm very sorry for "engaging in confrontation", I didn't realise the topics weren't for discussion! How could I have made this mistake? Here I was, thinking that it was normal to explain what those "children" were thinking when they said they didn't think the reward was any good.

 

In all seriousness, take a good hard look at what you're writing. It makes no sense whatsoever. Who are you trying to kid? He made a topic about people's reaction to the reward while insinuating they were wrong and childish but, even though they're childish, we still shouldn't be mean to them. How good of him, to insult everyone with such pretty words instead of harsh ones, that makes him a much better person. No, he insulted those who don't agree with him numerous times throughout his post. Is that to be commended? Really? No, it's not. His post is, for all purposes, an insult.

But hey, I'll let you prove me wrong. Just quote my first post and highlight my insults, and I'll do the same for his. Want to guess who's actually being more malicious? It's not that hard.

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, he didn't insinuate that those who are upset over the reward are children? Please explain these two sentences then, I'd very much like to hear your interpretation. I find them incredibly straight forward, but hey, take a shot, explain what they actually mean.

 

When he made reference to "visibly upset" individuals, he was in fact not speaking of people with dissenting opinion, or legitimate concerns about the event and it's format. He was actually referring to those who post "DE sucks, they should go die in a ditch" or "These rewards are $&!*, frost sucks and credits are worthless,". By the same token he was also referring to those, who have spouted their own hate and vitriol in DE's defense. It's not about what your opinion is. It's about how you present it, and your ability to remain calm, rational, and above all respectful.

 

I myself have failed this upon numerous occasion, however I like to think that I at least make a conscious effort to at the very least begin any discussion completely reasonable, and consider the other parties platform. After all would I not wish for them to extend the same consideration to me?

Edited May 6, 2013 by JerryMouse13

[Argoms]

No, you are being a child. You took a general phrase with no malicious intent behind it, however poorly worded it may have been, and used it as a means of engaging in a confrontation with someone who up until five minutes ago did not know you existed to personally offend you. If you wish for me to respect your opinion, I'd have a much easier time seeing your point of view if it wasn't sandwiched in between personal insults.

Here's my view, which I believe is quite similar to his-

 

If we have prime versions of everything as beta exclusives, the originals become useless to us (the beta players). As this game grows (and leaves beta etc.), it turns into a small minority holding what could never possibly be obtained by an ordinary (non-beta) player, and having an innate advantage for that. I don't like the fact that if the pattern of current primes continue, it will eventually come to a point where if a new player joins, no matter how much they play the game, they will always do 10% less damage than a beta player with prime equipment. Obviously it can be compensated by skill, but it's unfair that a newer player will never be able to have gear as powerful as a beta player.

 

Thinking short-term, this also discourages buying/making warframes (and potentially weapons). With a new prime (which most of us thought would not happen, and that only the founders would get "prime" equipment), we don't know where this will stop (will we get everything prime? Or just the current 12 frames? Or nothing more?). It's possible that every warframe will get a prime version, and knowing this, would you spend money to buy a worse version? A similar idea applies to crafting a frame- I'm not going to try and run a boss mission 50+ times if I think there's a chance of a prime version of the frame I want in the next update (and remember, this game tends to update often).

[Canoas]

You're so angry right now, that you didn't realize the person you were replying to and the person who wrote the thread were the same person. 

 

I'm not replying to another thing you say. and I'm encouraging everyone else to do the same. The Moderators have already posted once asking everyone to be civil. 

I'm not angry at all, disappointed yes, but not angry. I didn't pay attention to people's names because, quiet honestly, I don't care what your name is.

But good job proving my point. If you were right you would have said something to prove your point by now, but instead you either ran away from incredibly simple questions or just kept insulting people.

 

I don't think you realise that you are included in "everyone" nor that you're the only person who is actually insulting others.

[Quetzhal]

I highly doubt that there will be another Prime warframe available to F2P players. Steve has said that future rewards for Operations won't be as good, as Frost Prime was originally intended to only be available for Platinum (or something like that).

[Canoas]

When he made reference to "visibly upset" individuals, he was in fact not speaking of people with dissenting opinion, or legitimate concerns about the event and it's format. He was actually referring to those who post "DE sucks, they should go die in a ditch" or "These rewards are $&!*, frost sucks and credits are worthless,". By the same token he was also referring to those, who have spouted their own hate and vitriol in DE's defense. It's not about what your opinion is. It's about how you present it, and your ability to remain calm, rational, and above all respectful.

 

I myself have failed this upon numerous occasion, however I like to think that I at least make a conscious effort to at the very least begin any discussion completely reasonable, and consider the other parties platform. After all would I not wish for them to extend the same consideration to me?

 

Okay, fair enough, but you're just being optimistic and using your own opinion as a basis for interpretation. Regardless of what you think he meant when he said that it still doesn't change what was written. His comment is very straight-forward and throughout his post he insulted those who were upset over the event and it's rewards several times. Even if you are correct this is in no way commendable behaviour, despite receiving a "thanks" from a moderator.

 

Still, if claim his post wasn't malicious then I see no reason for you to even think about condemning mine, which proves that you're not really being objective but you imposed your own opinion on his post and when I argued against it you felt personally attacked. The only thing my post does is validate and explain the reason why people are upset. I defend anyone for how they decided to voice their opinion, I only explained the opinion itself which is completely impartial.

[JerryMouse13]

Here's my view, which I believe is quite similar to his-

 

If we have prime versions of everything as beta exclusives, the originals become useless to us (the beta players). As this game grows (and leaves beta etc.), it turns into a small minority holding what could never possibly be obtained by an ordinary (non-beta) player, and having an innate advantage for that. I don't like the fact that if the pattern of current primes continue, it will eventually come to a point where if a new player joins, no matter how much they play the game, they will always do 10% less damage than a beta player with prime equipment. Obviously it can be compensated by skill, but it's unfair that a newer player will never be able to have gear as powerful as a beta player.

 

Thinking short-term, this also discourages buying/making warframes (and potentially weapons). With a new prime (which most of us thought would not happen, and that only the founders would get "prime" equipment), we don't know where this will stop (will we get everything prime? Or just the current 12 frames? Or nothing more?). It's possible that every warframe will get a prime version, and knowing this, would you spend money to buy a worse version? A similar idea applies to crafting a frame- I'm not going to try and run a boss mission 50+ times if I think there's a chance of a prime version of the frame I want in the next update (and remember, this game tends to update often).

 

I'm very sorry but I'm going to use you as a demonstration...

 

See this class? ^^

 

This is a good post. It is respectful, it is well explained, it caused me to think in a way I hadn't before, and I actually enjoyed reading it.

 

 

Back to your topic:

If the Prime series actually does pan out the way you believe it will, then yes that is a major concern, and I will join you in voicing it should it come to pass. However, given that DESteve has already hinted that Orokin technology will interact with Prime Warframes in a special manner, it seems like it would be a massive oversight on DE's part to not make them available to players latter down the road. Also given that the parts for Frost Prime must apparently be earned, it stands to reason that there will be a way to obtain the BP for it as well. This of course is just conjecture on my part, but the only way we're going to know for certain is when U8 drops.

Edited May 6, 2013 by JerryMouse13

[Argoms]

Yeah, that's why I don't feel very worried about it at the moment.

 

However, I do feel sorry for people should their favorite frame be excalibur, since it's a founder reward and therefore not likely to be re-released.

[FierceRadiance]

See, the thing about opinions is....they aren't all the same.  They aren't equal.  Just because everybody has one doesn't mean that one is as good as another.  And we all believe that our own opinion is just a little bit better than THAT guy's (or gal's) because we're, well, us.  But THAT guy or gal feels exactly the same way about his or her own opinion - and thinks just that same little bit less of yours.  It's not wrong, it's human nature.

 

(You already know this to be true, and you use it every day.  Some people's opinions get published as movie reviews, or video game reviews, or in newspaper articles.  Most -mine included, sadly- don't.  And we're okay with that.  You don't have to agree with those opinions to make use of them.  We all have opinions we trust above the rest in one matter or another.  You trust your friend's opinions over that idiot on TV, right?  So you know it's going to be true here on WF's forums as well.  Most of us won't end up having our words as respected as much as a few of us will.) 

 

Opinions often say a lot more about the person stating them than they say about the topic being discussed.  And of course, how you meant something you wrote or said is only part of the issue; how each and every person who reads or hears it receives your opinion is the other part, and you have no control over that end of things. 

 

So what does all this mean?  Well, that depends on you.

 

If you don't give a crap about what somebody else says, then eventually that attitude will likely come around to bite you in the shorts, because we are none of us stupid.  We will figure you out eventually, and then we'll treat you the way you've treated us.  You're opinion will get skipped over and ignored.  So don't do that.  Stop and take a moment.  Think.

 

If you take a moment, or even a couple of moments, to try and understand how that other person came to have the opinion they do....then maybe real communication has taken place.  Maybe you can figure out what they meant, instead of just reacting to it.  Because simplistic reactions don't get -nor should they get- the same consideration as thought-out opinions.  All opinions do not count the same.

 

Commentary, we consider.  Reactions, we filter out.

 

So when you comment, don't be personal.  Don't put someone down merely because you don't agree.  Any fool can do that, and you're not a fool, right?  So pause, think, and make sure you don't come across as some fool.

 

'Nuff said.

[BramBlackmon]

See, the thing about opinions is....they aren't all the same.  They aren't equal.  Just because everybody has one doesn't mean that one is as good as another.  And we all believe that our own opinion is just a little bit better than THAT guy's (or gal's) because we're, well, us.  But THAT guy or gal feels exactly the same way about his or her own opinion - and thinks just that same little bit less of yours.  It's not wrong, it's human nature.

 

(You already know this to be true, and you use it every day.  Some people's opinions get published as movie reviews, or video game reviews, or in newspaper articles.  Most -mine included, sadly- don't.  And we're okay with that.  You don't have to agree with those opinions to make use of them.  We all have opinions we trust above the rest in one matter or another.  You trust your friend's opinions over that idiot on TV, right?  So you know it's going to be true here on WF's forums as well.  Most of us won't end up having our words as respected as much as a few of us will.) 

 

Opinions often say a lot more about the person stating them than they say about the topic being discussed.  And of course, how you meant something you wrote or said is only part of the issue; how each and every person who reads or hears it receives your opinion is the other part, and you have no control over that end of things. 

 

So what does all this mean?  Well, that depends on you.

 

If you don't give a crap about what somebody else says, then eventually that attitude will likely come around to bite you in the shorts, because we are none of us stupid.  We will figure you out eventually, and then we'll treat you the way you've treated us.  You're opinion will get skipped over and ignored.  So don't do that.  Stop and take a moment.  Think.

 

If you take a moment, or even a couple of moments, to try and understand how that other person came to have the opinion they do....then maybe real communication has taken place.  Maybe you can figure out what they meant, instead of just reacting to it.  Because simplistic reactions don't get -nor should they get- the same consideration as thought-out opinions.  All opinions do not count the same.

 

Commentary, we consider.  Reactions, we filter out.

 

So when you comment, don't be personal.  Don't put someone down merely because you don't agree.  Any fool can do that, and you're not a fool, right?  So pause, think, and make sure you don't come across as some fool.

 

'Nuff said.

 

I like your opinion. It is more valuable to me than other people's opinions. 

 

Seriously. +1 on this mate. It's really well thought out.

[Scyris]

I like free stuff.

 

I'll pay $50 to go to a baseball game if they're giving away bobbleheads.

 

Umm, if you did that technacally wouldn't the bobblehead not be free since you had to pay 50 bucks to get in to get it in the first place?

 

I liked the event, fusion moa's were fun to kill. Though I have to ask, of all the frames why frost prime? I personally have no interest in frost at all. I got 1 frame slot left that I am either putting excalibur or rhino in. Can't decide which, rhino's first ability is bascally the same as excals, however his invinicbility thing is nice. I heard if you use the right mods you can keep that invulnerability up for minutes at a time.

[JerryMouse13]

Umm, if you did that technacally wouldn't the bobblehead not be free since you had to pay 50 bucks to get in to get it in the first place?

 

I liked the event, fusion moa's were fun to kill. Though I have to ask, of all the frames why frost prime? I personally have no interest in frost at all. I got 1 frame slot left that I am either putting excalibur or rhino in. Can't decide which, rhino's first ability is bascally the same as excals, however his invinicbility thing is nice. I heard if you use the right mods you can keep that invulnerability up for minutes at a time.

 

This sadly is no longer the case. In the pre U7 days it was possible to get enough power duration mods to make that feasible, but now with the whole no stacking same type mods thing, the most you can get is 20 seconds I think. Still long enough to dish out some pain to mooks and bosses alike. Just no where near the 'LOL god mode activate' that he was.

Edited May 6, 2013 by JerryMouse13

[FrostWolf]

WHAT is an opinion!? Nothing but a miserable pile of perspectives! Look at facts!

But enough Talk!

 

HAVE AT YOU!

[Karko]

Objectivity.

 

On my internet.

 

Get out.

[BramBlackmon]

Objectivity.

 

On my internet.

 

Get out.

 

[Skreshavik]

People think the reward is bad? 100k credits is like...a free warframe or a new set of weapons. And then there's the Frost Prime BP's.

[GTG3000]

*shivers*

People and their love to explain obvious.

 

Great post!

[Phoenix86]

The Internet is a mad raging beast when it comes down to 'my opinion Vs your opinion'

 

Honestly i take it for what it is and so should you, no worries :)

 

Anyway nice write up man

[Canoas]

People think the reward is bad? 100k credits is like...a free warframe or a new set of weapons. And then there's the Frost Prime BP's.

 

Yes, this warframe prime reward system is bad. I like the reward itself, frost is my favourite warframe and if there's going to be a prime warframe given away then I'm happy it's frost. However, it's still a bad reward system that will ultimately ruin the game.

[Kantazo]

It was a good reward and will not ruin the game.

[Canoas]

It was a good reward and will not ruin the game.

 

and why is that?

[Kantazo]

How many games online have you played?

[Skreshavik]

and why is that?

I don't see how this will ruin the game. You are extremely vague on the reasoning behind this.

[BramBlackmon]

How many games online have you played?

 

Not sure what this has to do with anything but I've played more than a few. 

 

Gunz, Wolf team, Last chaos, Metal assault, Accardia, A.V.A. GW2, WoW for a bit, VIndictus, Project Blackout, BlackLight Retribution, City of Heroes and the expansions,  Dead Frontier, Wakfu, Haven and Hearth, APB Reloaded. Fallen Earth, Face of Mankind. I could go on, but I think you get the ideal.

[Kantazo]

Not sure what this has to do with anything but I've played more than a few. 

 

Gunz, Wolf team, Last chaos, Metal assault, Accardia, A.V.A. GW2, WoW for a bit, VIndictus, Project Blackout, BlackLight Retribution, City of Heroes and the expansions,  Dead Frontier, Wakfu, Haven and Hearth, APB Reloaded. Fallen Earth, Face of Mankind. I could go on, but I think you get the ideal.

 

Then you know every company does the same.