The Butchery Of Frames

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

Let's not forget there's a separation of game and lore.

 

But in that particular quote, everyone gets so hung up on the "energy" bit they forget that he's talking about the divine energy of the warframes (the void powers).

so you're saying vor is breaking the fourth wall?

[vaugahn]

so you're saying vor is breaking the fourth wall?

 

No...the fourth wall is something else.

 

Vor is speculating about the power of the tenno. A while back, he had lines talking about how they dissected warframes but could not explain their powers. Now he's realizing the reason for that is because the powers come from the tenno inside the frame, not the actual frame itself.

 

-snip-

 

I think Chroma is extremely unattractive, and I'd take him over that design any day. I'm glad they went with something unique. 

Edited March 8, 2015 by vaugahn

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I think DE needs to learn something obvious: if they are going to take the theme from a very popular fan concept and make their own completely different version, they should do it better than the original. If they can't do that, they should swallow their pride, make the popular version, thank the person who created the concept, and perhaps give them a plat reward. There is no virtue in throwing away great art or ideas and substituting worse.

 

In this case Chroma's external design is widely considered to be hideous and inferior to one of the most popular fan concepts ever.

 

Here is a poll on Chroma's appearance: http://strawpoll.me/3807541

Here is the link to the most popular Dragon concept: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/37089-a-warframe-concept-the-dragon-20-%E2%80%94-final-update-2092015/

"Chroma's external design is widely considered to be hideous and inferior to one of the most popular fan concepts ever."from a 1000 people poll out of almost 8 mill players? yea accurate lol

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

No...the fourth wall is something else.

 

Vor is speculating about the power of the tenno. A while back, he had lines talking about how they dissected warframes but could not explain their powers. Now he's realizing the reason for that is because the powers come from the tenno inside the frame, not the actual frame itself.

well ill agree to disagree until DE explains further

Edited March 8, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades-

[jmforeman02]

"Chroma's external design is widely considered to be hideous and inferior to one of the most popular fan concepts ever."from a 1000 people poll out of almost 8 mill players? yea accurate lol

 

1,300 from 8 mil  is huge man. Do you realize that that is a much larger sample size to population ratio than most scientific studies use not to mention some political polls? 

 

A drug trial on 1,000 people is a HUGE drug trial. And the population there is 7 Billion, with a B!!!

Edited March 8, 2015 by jmforeman02

[vaugahn]

1,300 from 8 mil  is huge man. Do you realize that that is a much larger sample size to population ratio than most scientific studies use not to mention some political polls? 

 

A drug trial on 1,000 people is a HUGE drug trial. And the population there is 7 Billion, with a B!!!

 

An average telephone poll for a political issue will usually have several hundred thousand or more participants, chosen at random.

 

This poll has a tiny percentage of our total community, selected from a group of specifically unhappy people.

[jmforeman02]

An average telephone poll for a political issue will usually have several hundred thousand or more participants, chosen at random.

 

This poll has a tiny percentage of our total community, selected from a group of specifically unhappy people.

 

I said some political polls, not all. Telephone surveys are often considered bad anyway because it's mainly only old people who are home when they do the calling, during the day, and who even have home phones. They are just now starting to do cell phones and at a much lower percentage than home phones. You also have to remember the population of the US is 300m+ people.

 

Point is that the poll results are well within the bounds of what would be considered statistically significant. Sorry if most people don't agree with you, doesn't mean the poll is wrong though.

Edited March 8, 2015 by jmforeman02

[(PSN)Fizzer_XCIV]

I think DE needs to learn something obvious: if they are going to take the theme from a very popular fan concept and make their own completely different version, they should do it better than the original. If they can't do that, they should swallow their pride, make the popular version, thank the person who created the concept, and perhaps give them a plat reward. There is no virtue in throwing away great art or ideas and substituting worse.

 

In this case Chroma's external design is widely considered to be hideous and inferior to one of the most popular fan concepts ever.

 

Here is a poll on Chroma's appearance: http://strawpoll.me/3807541

Here is the link to the most popular Dragon concept: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/37089-a-warframe-concept-the-dragon-20-—-final-update-2092015/

Because DE didn't just want to do "Rhino with wings and fire".

I respect them for that. Thank them, actually. That fanmade concept was bad, IMO.

Rhino is painfully boring, and adding fire and wings would only make it a little less boring, but still boring

Chroma's design is new and interesting in every way, rather than a reskin of a frame we already have "with fire". He looks bestial and raw, rather than a boring dragon warrior.

I also happen go be lucky enough to be somebody who thinks he looks awesome, so that nice.

[OkamiMilo]

Omg. Chroma Looks Epic. Yeah. is rare is not a "dragon" but they never said him would have wings etc ,etc like a dragon. I Like His Desing. Looks Very Rare.

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I said some political polls, not all. Telephone surveys are often considered bad anyway because it's mainly only old people who are home when the do the calling, during the day, and who even have home phones. They are just now starting to do cell phones and at a much lower percentage than home phones. You also have to remember the population of the US is 300m+ people.

"Telephone surveys are often considered bad anyway because it's mainly only old people who are home" same thing could be said about the chroma poll because majority of the people voting are people who are unhappy.Do you see big mega threads of appreciation?No you don't only of people outraged by how something isn't how they wanted it.

[vaugahn]

I said some political polls, not all. Telephone surveys are often considered bad anyway because it's mainly only old people who are home when they do the calling, during the day, and who even have home phones. They are just now starting to do cell phones and at a much lower percentage than home phones. You also have to remember the population of the US is 300m+ people.

 

Point is that the poll results are well within the bounds of what would be considered statistically significant. Sorry if most people don't agree with you, doesn't mean the poll is wrong though.

 

I would very much hesitate to call that poll statistically significant, given the conditions under which it was performed and the size of the sample.

 

Fan-made polls in general aren't particularly trustworthy, I've found.

 

And for the record, I voted "ugly".

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

Omg. Chroma Looks Epic. Yeah. is rare is not a "dragon" but they never said him would have wings etc ,etc like a dragon. I Like His Desing. Looks Very Rare.

The only things rare are the BBQ ribs, pork chops and bacon he's got all over his body. It's a good thing he breathes fire cuz who else is gonna cook all that meat?

XD

Edited March 8, 2015 by sushidubya

[jmforeman02]

Because DE didn't just want to do "Rhino with wings and fire".

I respect them for that. Thank them, actually. That fanmade concept was bad, IMO.

Rhino is painfully boring, and adding fire and wings would only make it a little less boring, but still boring

Chroma's design is new and interesting in every way, rather than a reskin of a frame we already have "with fire". He looks bestial and raw, rather than a boring dragon warrior.

I also happen go be lucky enough to be somebody who thinks he looks awesome, so that nice.

I didn't say that they should copy it, unless they couldn't do better. I think making him thinner and less Rhino like would be acceptable. Just look at this art someone did. Dragon-esque and yet looks nothing like Rhino.

 

 

"Telephone surveys are often considered bad anyway because it's mainly only old people who are home" same thing could be said about the chroma poll because majority of the people voting are people who are unhappy.Do you see big mega threads of appreciation?No you don't only of people outraged by how something isn't how they wanted it.

 

Right now, I'm seeing just the opposite actually. But that's the great thing about polls like this. They don't look at the number of comments or how vociferously people argue something, instead they count the number of supporters of each position. The forums don't do that well.

 

 

I would very much hesitate to call that poll statistically significant, given the conditions under which it was performed and the size of the sample.

 

Fan-made polls in general aren't particularly trustworthy, I've found.

 

And for the record, I voted "ugly".

Believe me, I wouldn't say the poll is perfect, but it's the best data we have. Most polls don't have ideal conditions, most are voluntary and with non-random samples which is the opposite of what you want, but we have to work with what we have. The sample size is quite large though, 1341 and rising. More is always better, but this is plenty to get a decent idea of the popularity. Especially given that "Ugly" is the front runner by 25 points. It's not exactly a dead heat.

Edited March 8, 2015 by jmforeman02

[KiteoHatto]

I didn't say that they should copy it, unless they couldn't do better. I think making him thinner and less Rhino like would be acceptable. Just look at this art someone did. Dragon-esque and yet looks nothing like Rhino.

 

 

 

Right now, I'm seeing just the opposite actually. But that's the great thing about polls like this. They don't look at the number of comments or how vociferously people argue something, instead they count the number of supporters of each position. The forums don't do that well.

It's still too rhino-like, the drawing shares too many details that are present on rhino.

DE should be able to create something original and easily recognizable(theme and inspiration related), but they just missed the middleground on this one by a landing strip.

 

They went from limbo and mesa designs to another end of the spectrum.

Edited March 8, 2015 by kiteohatto

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I didn't say that they should copy it, unless they couldn't do better. I think making him thinner and less Rhino like would be acceptable. Just look at this art someone did. Dragon-esque and yet looks nothing like Rhino.

-snip-

 

 

Right now, I'm seeing just the opposite actually. But that's the great thing about polls like this. They don't look at the number of comments or how vociferously people argue something, instead they count the number of supporters of each position. The forums don't do that well.

even so unless DE supports the poll or hosts their own I don't see it holding any gravity in its current state.

[jmforeman02]

even so unless DE supports the poll or hosts their own I don't see it holding any gravity in its current state.

 

I doubt they'd change his design much at this stage no matter what, though I hope I'm wrong. I was trying to make a point for the future. There is no shame in adopting good ideas. If you're not going to do that, then you should be able to do better. Don't ignore a good idea and put out something worse.

[Darkmoone1]

Don't ignore a good idea and put out something worse.

That is subjective. 

[jmforeman02]

It's still too rhino-like, the drawing shares too many details that are present on rhino.

DE should be able to create something original and easily recognizable(theme and inspiration related), but they just missed the middleground on this one by a landing strip.

 

They went from limbo and mesa designs to another end of the spectrum.

I don't see what's Rhino-like about that one. I mean he has shoulder armor, chest armor, leg armor, and gauntlets, but those are reasonably common.

 

 

That is subjective. 

 

All of this is subjective, but since this is a business based on it's popularity with it's potential users, subjective matters.

Edited March 8, 2015 by jmforeman02

[(PSN)Fizzer_XCIV]

I don't see what's Rhino-like about that one. I mean he has shoulder armor, chest armor, leg armor, and gauntlets, but those are reasonably common.

That's just it. People want a "Dragon-Knight", rather than a Dragon Frame.

They want a Frame based off of an already existing fantasy subclass, rather than them basing the Frame of of just Dragons.

I personally prefer the route they went with, due to its originality, and that I think it actually looks cool...

Not to say I don't think the whole "dragon knight" thing isn't cool, I just think that what they went with fits Warframe better.

And the second image you posted isn't nearly as Rhino like as the concept linked earlier, but that might be because the second image is of a female Warframe.

Speaking of female Warframe a, I wouldn't mind an actual warrior-woman. Amazonian-ish and muscled, and all that cool stuff.

Edited March 8, 2015 by (PS4)Fizzer_XCIV

[(PSN)Aryonas]

I entirely agree with the poster.   I was VERY disappointed when I saw Chroma during the reveal.  Zephyr and Chroma are far too busy. There is no distinct shapes or curves, there are too many layers and "folds" rather than defining edges.  Mesa looks great, but I don't understand why she is covered in "cans" or "canisters."

 

I don't believe we're the only ones who think this, since when they revealed Chroma there was utter silence in the whole audience.  

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I doubt they'd change his design much at this stage no matter what, though I hope I'm wrong. I was trying to make a point for the future. There is no shame in adopting good ideas. If you're not going to do that, then you should be able to do better. Don't ignore a good idea and put out something worse.

what kind of good ideas should DE adopt? just out of curiosity

[jmforeman02]

That's just it. People want a "Dragon-Knight", rather than a Dragon Frame.

They want a Frame based off of an already existing fantasy subclass, rather than them basing the Frame of of just Dragons.

I personally prefer the route they went with, due to its originality, and that I think it actually looks cool...

Not to say I don't think the whole "dragon knight" thing isn't cool, I just think that what they went with fits Warframe better.

And the second image you posted isn't nearly as Rhino like as the concept linked earlier, but that might be because the second image is of a female Warframe.

Speaking of female Warframe a, I wouldn't mind an actual warrior-woman. Amazonian-ish and muscled, and all that cool stuff.

 

It think most people would be okay with it if it looked like a dragon and wasn't ugly personally. I think most people could tolerate a dragon support frame. That's just my opinion though. I could be wrong. I do agree though that people would probably be happiest with a dragon-knight type frame. Not sure why that would be a bad thing. 

 

It doesn't matter that the frame was female, just that it was less rhino looking. You could remove the breasts and it would look male.

 

I'd also support a larger more muscular female frame. Could be cool.

[jmforeman02]

what kind of good ideas should DE adopt? just out of curiosity

 

All kinds really. There are tons of them on the forums, some quite popular. In the case of chroma though I was saying the most popular dragon fan concept was better. Not amazing, I think it could be improved and I think it is too rhino-like, but it's better than Chroma imo, and in the opinion of a large number of people. I posted a link to it in a previous post on this thread.

[(PSN)Fizzer_XCIV]

It think most people would be okay with it if it looked like a dragon and wasn't ugly personally. I think most people could tolerate a dragon support frame. That's just my opinion though. I could be wrong. I do agree though that people would probably be happiest with a dragon-knight type frame. Not sure why that would be a bad thing.

It doesn't matter that the frame was female, just that it was less rhino looking. You could remove the breasts and it would look male.

I'd also support a larger more muscular female frame. Could be cool.

Maybe they could make a Female Dragon Knight, like in the image?

That would leave room for an interlocking story between the two frames...

Dragon-knights aren't called that without reason. They typically ride dragons into battle, or fight dragons.

Perhaps they were a team, or rivals.

Either way, it could be interesting lore.

And the reason I think a Dragon frame fits Warframe better than a dragon knight, is that there aren't any dragons.. yet. Usually you need dragons to have knights based on combat with or against dragons.

Edited March 8, 2015 by (PS4)Fizzer_XCIV

[jmforeman02]

And the reason I think a Dragon frame fits Warframe better than a dragon knight, is that there aren't any dragons.. yet. Usually you need dragons to have knights based on combat with or against dragons.

 

Nah, all the characters in this game are earth derived. The idea of dragons has been around for centuries, no reason it wouldn't carry on a few more centuries. It wouldn't be surprising if the Orokin or Tenno made something with a dragon theme, just like we do here and now even without the actual existence of dragons.

Edited March 8, 2015 by jmforeman02