Update 7.11.0: Vauban!

[PwnzAll]

I know its a free to play game with items for sale in game to generate money, but man try to hide the fact you are streamlining the game for people who are going to pay, seems like all the fun of this game is being taken out, im not to fussed about the rino patch as i dont use that warframe, but games like this need to tread a thin line in order not to look like its all about the money.

 

My biggest issue is making 90% of guns Bp which is just frustrating when the drop rate for some materials are so time consuming to farm.

 

I paid to support this game as it felt like these devs werent money whoring, and put actual time into making a good game, but i dont think i will spend anymore cash on this game, shame really was going to upgrade my account too. 

[wayneo]

I know its a free to play game with items for sale in game to generate money, but man try to hide the fact you are streamlining the game for people who are going to pay, seems like all the fun of this game is being taken out, im not to fussed about the rino patch as i dont use that warframe, but games like this need to tread a thin line in order not to look like its all about the money.

 

My biggest issue is making 90% of guns Bp which is just frustrating when the drop rate for some materials are so time consuming to farm.

 

I paid to support this game as it felt like these devs werent money whoring, and put actual time into making a good game, but i dont think i will spend anymore cash on this game, shame really was going to upgrade my account too. 

the weapons athey made into late Bp are mainly late game weapons not when you start off type, you should have enough material for one or two already, also is not that time consuming if you know where to look for the amterial if you just do little googling, if the material rare like morphics bosses always drop them, any rare material that you only need on for blueprint are droped by bosses as for the other materials each pickup has about 10-30, they also have about 30% chance of droping from containers, lockers and about 10% from enamies. (i think) when update 8 comes out they are also adding master thieft mod into game which give you a %chance of opening locked lockers for items.

Making the mods into Bp does not take up that mcuh time and to some players who dont use foundry much cause they know waht gears they want and stick to it, it wont effect them and by time they want to try something new im sure about half of them has the materials they need already. as for 12h wait for some weapons well jsut sleep on it, build it few hours before you sleep and next day supprise a new weappons waiting for you to use.

 

also what made this game fun for you? the ability to have everything easy?

Edited May 19, 2013 by wayneo

[Bloodywing]

Why do people keep saying this game is "Pay to win"? Everything in the game you can earn by just playing, even if some BP's you need to watch out for the special "?" alert, but still it's free. And these are just OPTIONAL items and you can play the game for free, forever! If you want handouts, watch out for the Live Streams where they give you Potatoes and Plat. 

 

About the Warframe changes, I think DE is just trying to find the sweet spot for every Frame/Weapon, like when the shotgun got nerfed, they cranked it up a little then everyone was happy again. Also i think they want us to have  a little challenge and maybe tweak our playstyles a little bit. I have no doubt in my mind that they will make changes to Rhino to make the Tankies happy. Just give 'em some time to find the sweet spot.

 

People threatening to leave the game because of the changes? You have to understand, this is still in BETA and things will change weather you like it or not. I suggest give it a chance to get the balancing right on target.

 

Also, I am a free player so my views are from a free to play perspective (I have to admit I bought plat to buy a few WF/Weapon slots)

 

 

 

 

 

 

VAUBAN PARTS... WHERE ART THOU??? 

[KvotheTheArcane1]

the weapons athey made into late Bp are mainly late game weapons not when you start off type,

Like the burtson or skana? yup skana is late game for sure...

you should have enough material for one or two already, also is not that time consuming if you know where to look for the amterial if you just do little googling,

Venus is the earliest source of alloy plates, and doesn't even drop that much.

if the material rare like morphics bosses always drop them (no, they have a higher chance, you can go a few runs without getting them), any rare material that you only need on for blueprint are droped by bosses as for the other materials each pickup has about 10-30, (10-20 for alloy it feels) they also have about 30% chance of droping from containers(Where are you getting this? rare mats have less than 30% to drop from containers), lockers and about 10% from enamies. (i think) when update 8 comes out they are also adding master thieft mod into game which give you a %chance of opening locked lockers for items. Where is this info?

 

Making the mods into Bp does not take up that mcuh time and to some players who dont use foundry much cause they know waht gears they want and stick to it (What about the new players? They don't know how the weapons handle), it wont effect them and by time they want to try something new im sure about half of them has the materials they need already (Sure OLD players do, not new players). as for 12h wait for some weapons well jsut sleep on it, build it few hours before you sleep and next day supprise a new weappons waiting for you to use.

 

also what made this game fun for you? the ability to have everything easy? No, the ability to get weapons REASONABLY does.

my stuff bold.

 

Did you even look at what  weapons are BPs? EVERY MELEE WEAPON IS A BP. Yes, the SKANA is a BP. Yes, the BO (fairly bad weapon imo) IS A BP.

[Dostoevski]

I don't have any issues with the Rhino nerf, even though I've been grinding specifically for the class. This is balance, it'll eventually work out, it's okay.

 

However, I was honestly about to buy some platinum to get a few colour packs and maybe a few other things. Convinced my brother to play with me, told him how cool a game it is and how fair the fremium model is, that you could buy news guns pretty quickly and that it's super fun. Suddenly we get a "market pricing overhaul" and everything is either blueprints or platinum. Game suddenly starts feeling like another cashgrab/gridfest and I immediately have no desire to buy any platinum at all.

 

Good job, lads.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Dostoevski

[wayneo]

my stuff bold.

 

Did you even look at what  weapons are BPs? EVERY MELEE WEAPON IS A BP. Yes, the SKANA is a BP. Yes, the BO (fairly bad weapon imo) IS A BP.

new players should do some research on youtube, wikias and many other sites, making the weapon easier to obtain is stupid, making the weapons testable is diffrent go and suggest to DE that we can test any weapons before we buy, like test them on the trianing grounds.

alloy plates do drop decent amount got 98 alloy plates from doing stages to unlock earth, was not farming for them not looking or breaking/opening lockers just speed run and killing everthing i see. (5 stages)

(Where are you getting this? rare mats have less than 30% to drop from containers), lockers and about 10% from enamies. (i think) I think in brackets is a estimate from my experice of the game also i ment non rare ones has 30%. bosses drop rare ones 100% for me anyway.

 

when update 8 comes out they are also adding master thieft mod into game which give you a %chance of opening locked lockers for items. Where is this info?

The DE said it during one of the live stream cannont rember which one but is the 2nd/1st most recent live stream they said they were adding two new mods and this was one of them.

 

Burstron is not a starting weapon starting weapons are weapons like bratron, boar. first weapons of each type.

as for melee weapons i cant remeber if they were or not blueprints thought they were all blueprints since beta, not like you need skana when you got a cronus

[KvotheTheArcane1]

new players should do some research on youtube, wikias and many other sites, making the weapon easier to obtain is stupid, making the weapons testable is diffrent go and suggest to DE that we can test any weapons before we buy, like test them on the trianing grounds.

alloy plates do drop decent amount got 98 alloy plates from doing stages to unlock earth, was not farming for them not looking or breaking/opening lockers just speed run and killing everthing i see. (5 stages)

(Where are you getting this? rare mats have less than 30% to drop from containers), lockers and about 10% from enamies. (i think) I think in brackets is a estimate from my experice of the game also i ment non rare ones has 30%. bosses drop rare ones 100% for me anyway.

 

when update 8 comes out they are also adding master thieft mod into game which give you a %chance of opening locked lockers for items. Where is this info?

The DE said it during one of the live stream cannont rember which one but is the 2nd/1st most recent live stream they said they were adding two new mods and this was one of them.

 

Burstron is not a starting weapon starting weapons are weapons like bratron, boar. first weapons of each type.

as for melee weapons i cant remeber if they were or not blueprints thought they were all blueprints since beta, not like you need skana when you got a cronus

1. Burston is a variant of the braton series (I think) and is STILL not end game I'd also say the furax is not endgame, same with the Bo, or the latron really.. And you do need a skana if you didn't level it to 30, and want to level every weapon to 30.

 

2. They said it in a livestream? I'll have to watch it then, think I missed one or two atleast.

 

3. While I agree research should be done, some people have an hour or two a day to play, so they might not even have the time to do any research on how a weapon handles. Even if they do, the prices are STILL way too high. (2 morphics and 80 alloy for the dual skana vs the chronus which is 1 morphics and thats the only rare mat it needs.)

[Xafei]

-OR purchase the Blueprint and await the drop of his components from "?" Alerts!

 

Seriously?

-Rhino Skin no longer grants full invincibility, but can now reach up to 80% Damage Reduction at highest Mod level.

 

Omg seriously?

-Banshee's Sound Quake has been balanced to do more intended damage amounts on use.

 

Omfg is it a joke?

 

-Weapons cost twice as much?

 

Pay2Win... are you fking kidding me?!?

 

The game is becoming a real crap. I leave the game(Master 7 account), and I think I will not be the only one to make this decision..

 

You could stop being a pussy and wait for 1-2 future updates and check how they fix or adjust it. I don't think they will keep their S#&$ like that if most of the community is against it.

So please, calm your boobs.

[t3ddie]

The Grakata's always cost 500 alloy plate.

my bad. still, the boar didn't cost 300, and pay-to-win looks pretty prominent right now.

[Bloodywing]

LOL calm your boobs, that's so funny. You just made my day :D

[keddren]

Right, but the paris isn't part of the new blueprints, check out the burston, 300 alloy plates, and try doing purely on venus. It's much harder than sedna/ceres

 

Venera.  You'll be swimming in plates.

[t3ddie]

They could actually implement Plat <-> Credit exchange:

1 plat converts into 100 credits while 1.000 credits turn into 1 plat. 

That way they could keep the "Platinum only" payment but make Platinum achievable ingame. ( I don't know how many credits you normally get a day so the prices would surely differ but you get the idea.)

With that a Bo-Staff would still cost 65.000 converted credits. Warframes would cost 75.000 -> 375.000.

75k sounds very cheap for a warframe so maybe a cost adjustment for everything would be needed aswell.

 

I know you would still have to farm/grind but you wouldn't have to farm specific materials who often drop like S#&$ or completely random.

 

I don't know the DEDevs because i just started playing but from what i have seen and heard of other players the market and payment system has to change.

 

 

I hope that doesn't sound too strange or dumb, if you wanna critizise feel free to do so.

a conversion from credits to plat would be nice. it would fix this market mess.

[keddren]

my bad. still, the boar didn't cost 300, and pay-to-win looks pretty prominent right now.

Pay to win means you pay real cash for things you can't get otherwise in game. What you're suggesting is more like, "pay for convenience."

 

Note: I'm not sure I'm pleased with blueprint-only items.  I do think it make the barrier of entry for new players higher, though, and that's not good.

[vaag256]

I don't think the developers realize how thin a line they are walking with changes such as these,

  having a happy/satisfied playerbase is a big deal if you want your game to be around for longer than a year.

 

Some points,

 

 - Making early game weapons hard to obtain doesn't exactly get new players hooked on the game.

 - I'd recommend having more weapons with a rank requirement that one can circumvent by buying with platinum.

 

 - Create Warframes and weapons at low prices, like league of legends or even tf2 do it,

    many players making small purchases likely beat out a few large purchases. (especially longterm)

 

 - Instead of nerfing the players, try making the enemies/environments harder.

 - Let some overpowered moves stay in the game, just balance them in different manners such as high energy costs

 - Don't balance the game for pvp. Doing so pretty much ruins the "fun" abilities for the pve aspect.

    (fun fact, introducing arenas is ghostcrawlers biggest regret in warcraft)

 

 - It's important to make players feel good about themselves, like they're making a difference.

    Warframes should be able to steal the spotlight from time to time, just not constantly.

    Every player should feel like they did something worthwhile at the end of a mission.

   (Whether that's reviving someone in the middle of a poison cloud with rhino, protecting the defense object with frost, killing an entire room with mag)

 

I thought warframe was a very fair freemium game before this change was implemented,

 yet now instead of appealing and teasing players with attractive items to buy,  it just seems like you're trying to force players into buying platinum.

 

I'm rather happy supporting a developer I like, and am more likely to buy from them, (I absolutely refuse to buy ea games for example)

 but I must say that this update has definitely made me lose some goodwill feeling towards DE.

Edited May 19, 2013 by vaag256

[wayneo]

1. Burston is a variant of the braton series (I think) and is STILL not end game I'd also say the furax is not endgame, same with the Bo, or the latron really.. And you do need a skana if you didn't level it to 30, and want to level every weapon to 30.

 

2. They said it in a livestream? I'll have to watch it then, think I missed one or two atleast.

 

3. While I agree research should be done, some people have an hour or two a day to play, so they might not even have the time to do any research on how a weapon handles. Even if they do, the prices are STILL way too high. (2 morphics and 80 alloy for the dual skana vs the chronus which is 1 morphics and thats the only rare mat it needs.)

1. bo melee so i dont know, starting weapon i ment only one of ever weapon not bp like boar and bratron maybe they should add a non-Bp sniper into game but then lex is close to that but is a secondary weapon. maybe they should make a primary non-Bp one too. If you wnat to get ever weapon level 30 then you will be spending alot of tiem any way, by time you get one to level 30 im sure any player (atleast me) would already have way more then enough material for next weapon.

 

3. prices? u talking about material or credits? as i said before somewhere credits are not that high compared to old times. as for rare mat just do two boss runs you have 100% cahcne of boss droping one rare mat which is always said on list of material aviable on planet. kill the first boss on mercury twice and you have both. you cant expect to get everything you need by going through the game once.

[Bloodywing]

I don't think the developers realize how thin a line they are walking with changes such as these,

  having a happy/satisfied playerbase is a big deal if you want your game to be around for longer than a year.

 

Some points,

 

 - Making early game weapons hard to obtain doesn't exactly get new players hooked on the game.

 - I'd recommend having more weapons with a rank requirement that one can circumvent by buying with platinum.

 

 - Create Warframes and weapons at low prices, like league of legends does it,

    many players making small purchases likely beat out a few large purchases. (especially longterm)

 

 - Instead of nerfing the players, try making the enemies/environments harder.

 - Let some overpowered moves stay in the game, just balance them in different manners such as high energy costs

 - Don't balance the game for pvp. Doing so pretty much ruins the "fun" abilities for the pve aspect.

    (fun fact, introducing arenas is ghostcrawlers biggest regret in warcraft)

 

 - It's important to make players feel good about themselves, like they're making a difference.

    Warframes should be able to steal the spotlight from time to time, just not constantly.

    Every player should feel like they did something worthwhile at the end of a mission.

   (Whether that's reviving someone in the middle of a poison cloud with rhino, protecting the defense object with frost, killing an entire room with mag)

 

I thought warframe was a very fair freemium game before this change was implemented,

 yet now instead of appealing and teasing players with attractive items to buy,  it just seems like you're trying to force players into buying platinum.

 

I'm rather happy supporting a developer I like, and am more likely to buy from them, (I absolutely refuse to buy ea games for example)

 but I must say that this update has definitely made me lose some goodwill feeling towards DE.

 

Good post! I agree to most of your points. I think they may just be testing out the waters and get user feedback. I'm sure they will make adjustments based on what the feedback from the community is, weather its positive or negative, they will straighten things out. 

[KvotheTheArcane1]

1. bo melee so i dont know, starting weapon i ment only one of ever weapon not bp like boar and bratron maybe they should add a non-Bp sniper into game but then lex is close to that but is a secondary weapon. maybe they should make a primary non-Bp one too. If you wnat to get ever weapon level 30 then you will be spending alot of tiem any way, by time you get one to level 30 im sure any player (atleast me) would already have way more then enough material for next weapon.

 

3. prices? u talking about material or credits? as i said before somewhere credits are not that high compared to old times. as for rare mat just do two boss runs you have 100% cahcne of boss droping one rare mat which is always said on list of material aviable on planet. kill the first boss on mercury twice and you have both. you cant expect to get everything you need by going through the game once.

I'm talking about mats. The bolded part is 100% false. 100% He has a higher than average chance, not 100% fairly often he can just drop like ferrite (or whatever common mat is on mercury)

 

Venera.  You'll be swimming in plates.

 

Hm I guess so, but still, 300 alloy plates is a lot for a single new weapon.

 

edit: gonna run Venera a few times later and see how much I get on average

Edited May 19, 2013 by KvotheTheArcane1

[wayneo]

I don't think the developers realize how thin a line they are walking with changes such as these,

  having a happy/satisfied playerbase is a big deal if you want your game to be around for longer than a year.

 

Some points,

 

 - Making early game weapons hard to obtain doesn't exactly get new players hooked on the game.

 - I'd recommend having more weapons with a rank requirement that one can circumvent by buying with platinum.

 

 - Create Warframes and weapons at low prices, like league of legends or even tf2 do it,

    many players making small purchases likely beat out a few large purchases. (especially longterm)

 

 - Instead of nerfing the players, try making the enemies/environments harder.

 - Let some overpowered moves stay in the game, just balance them in different manners such as high energy costs

 - Don't balance the game for pvp. Doing so pretty much ruins the "fun" abilities for the pve aspect.

    (fun fact, introducing arenas is ghostcrawlers biggest regret in warcraft)

 

 - It's important to make players feel good about themselves, like they're making a difference.

    Warframes should be able to steal the spotlight from time to time, just not constantly.

    Every player should feel like they did something worthwhile at the end of a mission.

   (Whether that's reviving someone in the middle of a poison cloud with rhino, protecting the defense object with frost, killing an entire room with mag)

 

I thought warframe was a very fair freemium game before this change was implemented,

 yet now instead of appealing and teasing players with attractive items to buy,  it just seems like you're trying to force players into buying platinum.

 

I'm rather happy supporting a developer I like, and am more likely to buy from them, (I absolutely refuse to buy ea games for example)

 but I must say that this update has definitely made me lose some goodwill feeling towards DE.

cost £9 to buy a new/good hero for first time, then bit less for next because of left over RP but i find that game boring anyway, coumnity kind of sucks player blaming others alot when they do terrible themselfs and not others, also the game design is like a striped dota. dota 2 is better by far also no need to buy heroes you get all only thing money does is by cosmetic.

also leagues nerfs heroes alot after release money not well spent, heroes are sometimes overpowered on release and gets nerfed later, thats a terrible thing to do in a PvP game you win ranked games with overpowered heroes if people dint ban, then he gets nerfed and another hero comes out. This game is PvE so if one warframe is nerfed it dont realy matters as much.

Edited May 19, 2013 by wayneo

[wayneo]

I'm talking about mats. The bolded part is 100% false. 100% He has a higher than average chance, not 100% fairly often he can just drop like ferrite (or whatever common mat is on mercury)

 

 

Hm I guess so, but still, 300 alloy plates is a lot for a single new weapon.

 

edit: gonna run Venera a few times later and see how much I get on average

well seems like 100% drop thing questionable but for me is been 100% upto now and since closed beta maybe just lucky. well while your doing boss runs for the rare mat you would be also getting other things mods seems to drop more for boss stages and you find some mats along the way anyway.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

well seems like 100% drop thing questionable but for me is been 100% upto now and since closed beta maybe just lucky. well while your doing boss runs for the rare mat you would be also getting other things mods seems to drop more for boss stages and you find some mats along the way anyway.

boss stages are generally shorter, so fewer enemies, and some like the jackal don't drop any mods. Regardless of how you feel about the drop rate, or if it's been kind to you, the fact is it's VERY grindy to get even one new weapon for a new player, unless they grind one certain area for awhile (which artificially extends how long they play the game)

 

Also, on the drop rate for bosses, it's high that they will drop the rare mat, ~35% I think in my experience, maybe a little more for some (up to maybe 50% from like the golem), less for others (like vay hek in my experience, he's like 20% in my experience). For a full new setup,Bo Burston and a Furis,

 

750 alloy plates

100 polymer bundles (COMMON MAT and it's less than the alloy plates of JUST the weapon that requires it??),

600 nano spores,

1 morhpics,

2(!!!!) neurodes,

1,300 salvage,

1,350 ferrite,

1 orokin cell,

105,000 credits (as much as a warframe)

and 12hours of build time (not a prob there really)

 

The Afuris requires 4 neurodes, 600 alloy plates, 800 salvage, 1500 ferrite, 1 orokin cell, 70,000 credits, and 36hrs to build. That's pretty expensive in my view.

Edited May 19, 2013 by KvotheTheArcane1

[MisterHandagote]

Pleased with some of the changes, but don't think Rhino was nerfed correctly, and a considerable amount of items in the market are getting harder and harder to obtain, to say nothing of how they are barely incentivised in the first place. Concerning, but I guess we'll see how it pans out.

[blendavy]

I want Rhino Skin with the old settings !

[Dostoevski]

Pay to win means you pay real cash for things you can't get otherwise in game. What you're suggesting is more like, "pay for convenience."

 

Note: I'm not sure I'm pleased with blueprint-only items.  I do think it make the barrier of entry for new players higher, though, and that's not good.

 

Pay2Win means you pay for winning. Full stop.

[(NSW)Canadabis]

When you nerf you are taking away from players. Nerfing + buffing a different aspect of the same object is a better idea. Take rhinos invulnerability? Ok, how about his shield regen being active while his iron skin is active? There, now you will see some toying around with people using iron skin and fast deflection.

 

Just flat out taking something away and giving nothing in return is clumsy and hamfisted.

 

But anyway, big thing here, tough concept maybe. More guns. Yep. That's it. More guns, big guns, small guns, some as big as your head. All kinds of guns.

 

There are like, the number of automatic weapons cubed in warframes that can carry them, just sayin'.

 

End game content being basically defense for the fun of it, with frost snowglobe being commonly used with people shooting out of it, it becomes pretty plain that there are "like no guns man".

[Grandarex]

I don't think the developers realize how thin a line they are walking with changes such as these,

  having a happy/satisfied playerbase is a big deal if you want your game to be around for longer than a year.

 

Some points,

 

 - Making early game weapons hard to obtain doesn't exactly get new players hooked on the game.

 - I'd recommend having more weapons with a rank requirement that one can circumvent by buying with platinum.

 

 - Create Warframes and weapons at low prices, like league of legends or even tf2 do it,

    many players making small purchases likely beat out a few large purchases. (especially longterm)

 

 - Instead of nerfing the players, try making the enemies/environments harder.

 - Let some overpowered moves stay in the game, just balance them in different manners such as high energy costs

 - Don't balance the game for pvp. Doing so pretty much ruins the "fun" abilities for the pve aspect.

    (fun fact, introducing arenas is ghostcrawlers biggest regret in warcraft)

 

 - It's important to make players feel good about themselves, like they're making a difference.

    Warframes should be able to steal the spotlight from time to time, just not constantly.

    Every player should feel like they did something worthwhile at the end of a mission.

   (Whether that's reviving someone in the middle of a poison cloud with rhino, protecting the defense object with frost, killing an entire room with mag)

 

I thought warframe was a very fair freemium game before this change was implemented,

 yet now instead of appealing and teasing players with attractive items to buy,  it just seems like you're trying to force players into buying platinum.

 

I'm rather happy supporting a developer I like, and am more likely to buy from them, (I absolutely refuse to buy ea games for example)

 but I must say that this update has definitely made me lose some goodwill feeling towards DE.

 

Tell me your address so I can send you a bloody medal!

 

Good post sir.