I Found Out Kunai Were Automatic

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And now I like them a lot less.

 

Whether you think Kunai are OP or balanced, they're undeniably a strong weapon.  I'd rather see weaker weapons like the Grakata or the Burston be brought up to Kunai's level rather than see Kunai nerfed, but whatever happens to them happens.  They're already very powerful, but to give them automatic fire just feels unnecessary.  Does anyone else feel this way?

 

They're friggin' throwing knives.  If the difference between automatic and semi-automatic is holding down a trigger and pulling it repeated, why give throwing knives that firing mode?  It makes no sense, and it feels weird to just hold down the mouse button and keep throwing knives, and since I found out about it I've been actively trying to avoid using them as automatic (convenient as it is).

[NovaKiller]

Yea, i was kinda like you, though i wouldn't say i like them less.

But my Kunai was rank 27 before i found out you could hold down the mouse to just throw quickly.

Didn't really feel a big loss or gain in the speed, except when i put on a fire rate.

The thing about buffing stuff to their level was in a way addressed, dunno in what kinda sense it would be though.

"DON'T NERF "X", MAKE "Y" AS GOOD AS "X": Message received and understood."

[psyanide]

Meh, I like the Ninja Gaiden feel of tossing out a ton of kunai/shurkens. One of the only 'super-ninja' feel weapons out there at the moment.

[ValhaHazred]

I'd kind of like other kinds of throwing blades with different properties.

How about some heavy throwing blades. Charge for more damage like Paris.

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Answer all the things!

 

Yea, i was kinda like you, though i wouldn't say i like them less.
But my Kunai was rank 27 before i found out you could hold down the mouse to just throw quickly.
Didn't really feel a big loss or gain in the speed, except when i put on a fire rate.

The thing about buffing stuff to their level was in a way addressed, dunno in what kinda sense it would be though.
"DON'T NERF "X", MAKE "Y" AS GOOD AS "X": Message received and understood."

It really doesn't affect fire rate (except as you said with a fire rate mod), but it just feels wrong.

 

Meh, I like the Ninja Gaiden feel of tossing out a ton of kunai/shurkens. One of the only 'super-ninja' feel weapons out there at the moment.

I have nothing against how fast the knives come out, I just think that you should have to throw each one.  It doesn't make much sense for it to be automatic.

 

I'd kind of like other kinds of throwing blades with different properties.

How about some heavy throwing blades. Charge for more damage like Paris.

I was actually hoping for the same thing, actually.  Like, when DE said "throwing weapons," I obviously thought of the Glaive, and figured they'd add a bunch of different thrown weapons.  I think it would be really cool to have something heavier, like an axe.  Maybe single Zoren that you throw or something?

[VScipii26]

I'd kind of like other kinds of throwing blades with different properties.

How about some heavy throwing blades. Charge for more damage like Paris.

Well someone likes their phallus weapons.

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Well someone likes their phallus weapons.

Most weapons are super duper phallic.

 

Guns extremely moreso than these, I'd say.

[Gearb0x]

Most weapons are super duper phallic.

 

Guns extremely moreso than these, I'd say.

 

Guns don't have an erect phallus, complete with gonads, sticking out of the side of them.  3 of the pictured "African Throwing Knives" pictured here do.

 

This weapon was traditionally tied to the manhood of the warrior, and required immense strength to use.  With an effective range of only 15 yards, they were as heavy as a cast iron skillet.  But if they hit you in the leg, that leg was pretty much gone and you were likely sprawled out and bleeding out.

 

So the warriors made one of the many blades a figurative expression of their physical manhood.

[matrixEXO]

Guns don't have an erect phallus, complete with gonads, sticking out of the side of them.  3 of the pictured "African Throwing Knives" pictured here do.

 

This weapon was traditionally tied to the manhood of the warrior, and required immense strength to use.  With an effective range of only 15 yards, they were as heavy as a cast iron skillet.  But if they hit you in the leg, that leg was pretty much gone and you were likely sprawled out and bleeding out.

 

So the warriors made one of the many blades a figurative expression of their physical manhood.

We need to get Rhino to toss one of these. Then we will really see how manly he is.

[DeadlyNerd]

So that's why I've been seeing people throw these at high rates without their aim flinching.

 

I think making kunai semi auto would serve as an adequate nerf, without touching stats.

[BlueCremeSoda]

So that's why I've been seeing people throw these at high rates without their aim flinching.

 

I think making kunai semi auto would serve as an adequate nerf, without touching stats.

It would serve as an annoyance more than anything due to their fire rate. It's not as if everything needs to be nerfed to match other things especially if they're intending to add much harder late game content. Does no one consider this when talking about nerfing them?

[Tyrian3k]

It would serve as an annoyance more than anything due to their fire rate. It's not as if everything needs to be nerfed to match other things especially if they're intending to add much harder late game content. Does no one consider this when talking about nerfing them?

 

The Kunai should not fire automatically if semi-automatic pistols don't.

 

 

I'd rather see weaker weapons like the Grakata or the Burston be brought up to Kunai's level rather than see Kunai nerfed, but whatever happens to them happens.

 

This is something I'd also like to see, as I think that buffing too bad guns is more important than nerfing too good ones.

 

I made a thread on those two particular guns a while back, but I don't know if it got noticed by DE in any way at all.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Tyrian3k

[theangelbelow88]

Kunai are automatic?!?!?! That's so lame, WHY?!?! WHY?!?!?!... But in all honesty that's pretty awful, I just found this out bu reading this forum and I ask, why take the feeling of throwing out knifes by making them automatic? And I do love the weapon but this sucks...

[theangelbelow88]

I'd rather see weaker weapons like the Grakata or the Burston be brought up to Kunai's level rather than see Kunai nerfed.

I also agree, Grakata and Burston need some love, I love both weapons and have them at rank 30 with a potato but I know they are subpar  when compared the other full automatic rifles.

[BlueCremeSoda]

The Kunai should not fire automatically if semi-automatic pistols don't.

 

 

Are you comparing a kunai to a weapon with a single trigger? The kunai, the weapon with a holster on each thigh for quick reach and everything, throwing them two handed, throw one pick another one out of the holster while throwing with the other hand and repeating, is the same as a semi automatic gun? The function is HARDLY the same at all. You literally cannot even compare the two to say something that asinine.

 

Clicking the mouse to fire is simulating hitting the trigger. You can't do that with a KUNAI. And with their design emphasis on speed you literally can't make the comparison to any of the semi automatic guns.

Edited May 30, 2013 by BlueCremeSoda

[LasersGoPewPew]

or they should reduce the clip size to two and make it throw in a  two "shot" burst, it reloads fast enough as is and two kunai is enough to get at least one or two kills depending on your aim it would reduce its' spammability while keeping its lethality. that way people themselves can choose "do i want a 30 bullet clip twin viper for CC and decimation? or do i want high burst damage with a fast reload and armor ignore?" the vipers that people compare its reload time to would have the advtantage of being able to take out more enemies per reload and the knives could still do their job and kill their targets, albeit with less "OVERPOWERED" stamped onto it.

[ApocDream]

 

It really doesn't affect fire rate (except as you said with a fire rate mod), but it just feels wrong.

 

I have nothing against how fast the knives come out, I just think that you should have to throw each one.  It doesn't make much sense for it to be automatic.

 

 

If it doesn't affect fire rate and you have nothing against how fast they are thrown then why don't YOU just not hold down the trigger and manually press for each knife?

[theangelbelow88]

or they should reduce the clip size to two and make it throw in a  two "shot" burst, it reloads fast enough as is and two kunai is enough to get at least one or two kills depending on your aim it would reduce its' spammability while keeping its lethality. that way people themselves can choose "do i want a 30 bullet clip twin viper for CC and decimation? or do i want high burst damage with a fast reload and armor ignore?" the vipers that people compare its reload time to would have the advtantage of being able to take out more enemies per reload and the knives could still do their job and kill their targets, albeit with less "OVERPOWERED" stamped onto it.

I agree with this, I also think reducing its damage would be a big mistake, as with stealth weapons you want to put down your target as quickly as possible before they have time to react or alert any nearby enemies, and with reduced damaged that would mean you would have to spam the target with multiple shots, but if you have less knifes in your hand but hit harder then you could put down your target fast, like a good stealth weapon should.

[Tyrian3k]

Are you comparing a kunai to a weapon with a single trigger? The kunai, the weapon with a holster on each thigh for quick reach and everything, throwing them two handed, throw one pick another one out of the holster while throwing with the other hand and repeating, is the same as a semi automatic gun? The function is HARDLY the same at all. You literally cannot even compare the two to say something that asinine.

 

Clicking the mouse to fire is simulating hitting the trigger. You can't do that with a KUNAI. And with their design emphasis on speed you literally can't make the comparison to any of the semi automatic guns.

 

Can you throw knives without moving any of your bodyparts? No you can't, you have to repeat the same movement over and over, just like pressing the trigger on a semi-automatic pistol.

[BlueCremeSoda]

Can you throw knives without moving any of your bodyparts? No you can't, you have to repeat the same movement over and over, just like pressing the trigger on a semi-automatic pistol.

It's two entirely different mechanics and your comparison isn't even in the same realm. It's not automatic or semi automatic. You can't compare it to a GUN.

[Lord.Finster]

Wrong direction guys.

Just because weapons are 'semi-automatic' in the real-world doesn't mean I want a clickfest to use them in a game.

It's not only a matter of convenience but a matter of health as well. Massive clickorgies aren't good for your fingers.

 

In fact, I'd greatly appreciate it if the 'semi-automatic'-game mechanics of this game would go away completely.

 

I mean it's ok to be able to make single shots by 'tapping' your mouse button but if I hold down the mouse button I'd rather prefer every weapon to be 'fully automatic', exactly like the kunai are now. If all weapons were fully automatic that would mean DE has full control over their cadence and can provide better balancing, effectively declawing makros.

 

Kunai need a nerf in damage and/or shouldn't be armour ignoring.

But I also expected to see them work more like the bows, with a charged up attack.

 

Combined with the autofire it would mean that the player is able to queue charged up attacks by simply keeping his mouse button down.

The warframe would simply start charging the next shot once the first is fired. Of course that would mean that the bow would work like a melee weapon, meaning that a shot is automatically released once fully charged, unless the player triggers it sooner by releasing the mousebutton.

[Tyrian3k]

It's two entirely different mechanics and your comparison isn't even in the same realm. It's not automatic or semi automatic. You can't compare it to a GUN.

 

You give me a reason for it to be "automatic" that is not just convenience then...

Edited May 31, 2013 by Tyrian3k

[neKroMancer]

I think it should have clipsize of two, you throw two Kunai from each hand and there is short reload while you pick the next pair up. 

 

Charge mechanic will certainly add depth to this weapon. 

[BlueCremeSoda]

You give me a reason for it to be "automatic" that is not just convenience then...

Your argument is that it's "semi automatic" which it's a completely different mechanic and there's no reasonable explanation as to why it actually compares to a GUN which has MECHANICS that are replicated by the controls? You can't shoot a kunai. You can't compare it to a gun. Someone else has already posted that constant clicking is a healthy issue as well. A fire rate that fast it also makes no sense to limit it to click per throw. It's going to create fatigue, promote carpal tunnel, any number of issues if people have to constantly click at that kind of speed. Hell, all weapons could be "automatic" and fire while the mouse is clicked rather than forcing a click each time. The kunai function as an automatic weapon. Look at the viper, the fire rate isn't too far off from that. You're comparing it to a semi auto gun when it's not even remotely close to the same thing.

[Cytobel]

Ya know, I don't really care too much.

 

I don't know if anybody's played with these irl, but you can just keep tossing until you're hands are empty.  Might make more sence to have a hold-down "dump" all knives you're holding with two throws, but the term OP comes to mind.

 

Really, I don't think automatic works for pistols in general, with machine pistols being the exception that proves the rule.  That said, If a space ninja can windmill his or her arms with a single mouse click, why cannot he or she just keep squeezing triggers for the same input from the player?

 

Not really agreeing or disagreeing with the base idea of this thread, I just feel like this isn't as important as fixing major bugs or balancing Warframes.

 

Hmmm....

Dammit, I was just fine with it until somebody brought it up...  Gonna go ahead and label this one as another philosophical question.  It's making my head hurt like somebody asked "what's the meaning of life" or "if truth is beauty, then is beauty truth".  I don't think I can say one way or another.