If De Is Planing On Making All Future End Game Locked Behind A Pay/grind Wall Like The Void Missions, I Think That's A Big Mistake.

[plznohurtme]

It was my understanding that trips to the Void were meant to be a sort of bonus, hence the increased drop of mods and credit rewards. I don't think they were meant to be a manner of end-game for Warframe, if the rarity of obtaining Void Keys freely is any indication.

That would be fine if u8 introduced any other new content for people to play through in any way, but it simply didn't. This whole entire thread is about how they put out an update and all of the additional gameplay content was put behind a farming/pay wall.

Again I do not have a problem with the higher end parts being behind the pay/farm wall, but *all* of the new content is. This is the first time that DE has done it and it sets a bad precedent for future content being released in the same fashion. Actual missions to play through (new rewards aside) should not be limited in such a fashion. Personally I have no problems with limiting the loot that you get via pay/farm walls, that's kinda the nature of any game that you can acquire loot, it's when the new gameplay experience itself is behind it when problems come in.

Also another thing that may (and in the future) have helped with burnout is if only certain parts dropped in the void. I understand that they don't necessarily want to saturate other loot tables, but most regular missions feel mostly pointless unless they're an alert or needed to unlock missions on planets. Assassination/Defense/Raid/Mobile Defense end up being the only missions really "worth" doing as far as what you get out of it is concerned. Spy/Sabotage/Rescue/Capture/Deception/Exterminate all give you nothing in comparison and this could easily be changed and would also spread people out more.

Diversity and giving people something to do that isn't the same thing over and over is a good thing, u8 bucked against that by forcing $/defense/raid farming exclusively to go farm a new zone (which is quite fun, but the previous things kinda ruin it for me). It almost seems like DE needs to go less all in and only dip their toes in the water when it comes to adding things in the fashion in which they do.

[kennylagenz]

And how do I know you're not lying? Make no mistake, it's not that I distrust you, it's that I distrust anyone with a founders badge higher than Hunter.

Also, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, in either direction.

 whats not to trust maybe we just really like the game and thought having an influence on its future was really awesome the plat is just an extra bonus really , there are things in market place that are not obtainable through game play not to mention slots, i suppose you could friend his profile in game an look at the amount of hours he has played in game and if its really short he probably purchased

[Vincer]

I don't know how drop chances are working but seriously, the last 4-5 times ive run xini i got void keys ALL AND EVERY FREAKING TIME.

(which is quite funny since i was eager for some rare mods im lacking and not void keys that i rarely run, formaing frames and such im saving then for later)

[Clock-Work]

When Excalibur Prime was made available for only those that paid, it wasn't a problem because it was recognized as premium content. Void missions give you access to Prime weapons and Prime frames, but somehow these missions have to be availlable to the open  public. The problem isn't that Void missions are (for all practical purposes) avalailable only to those who play, it's that the Void missions are interpreted as the end-game. 

 

You're not mad because you can't access void missions. You're mad because you can't access what appears to be the only end-game there is.

 

With the coming of Update 9, we've seen that the Devs are fleshing out a different sort of end-game (Nightmare Mode), and they said in Their recent livestream that they plan on changing every frame so as to make them high tier material, while also raising the difficulty for those that can handle it.

 

What should actually happen is that the buffs on Prime weapons should be lessened, the Drop rates within void missions should be improved drastically so a to nearly always give something good, and the drop rates for void keys should be lessened. This way, you hardly ever get a void key, but when you do, you can be sure of walking away with lots of goodies. Lessening buffs will make them purely cosmetic. This of course, is in conjunction with the addition of a more accessible end-game.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Clock-Work

[xenapan]

I did 4 days of 4-5 hour grinds and got one key, that was when I quit. Not to mention it was one of the easiest type of keys to get, tier 1. Tier 3 keys are like 20 times harder to get.

 

1. you are silly.

2. tier 3 keys are 8% of the drop pool. tier 1 keys are not 1/20th of that.

3. play with your friends. farm defense in a group of 4. 1 key comes up = 4 runs. cuts the amount of grinding by 1/4th.

so of course you complain about 300% more grinding.

[Lers]

Hmm. Well i don't mind having the Primes behind the grindy walls of the Void... but i dislike the mods unique to the place.

 

Also, they are building great and extensive map sets for the Void, so it's much more than a mere "bonus area". I care little for the Void loot since RNG hates me and i didn't get ANY Latron parts (aside from the bp) in the last 70-80 runs. But still! I like the place, the enemies, the environmental hazards and puzzles.

 

It's just a shame to have such an interesting place locked behind hours of key grinding.

[MeteorKing]

This thread was necro'd from June 4th. The game, and it's drop tables, are vastly different now. Stop replying to things people said almost two months ago.

[__Kanade__]

I find Valefor pretty much drops a T2 key of some kind after the first 5 waves. Now I have several keys. mostly Exterminations.

[rpglord]

This thread was necro'd from June 4th. The game, and it's drop tables, are vastly different now. Stop replying to things people said almost two months ago.

Yeah, situation is actually worse now then it was...

Edited July 20, 2013 by rpglord

[MeteorKing]

Yeah, situation is actually worse now then it was...

In what regard? Sure, plastids are a little wonky at the moment, but otherwise DE has been fairly helpful with their drop rates. Alloy plate was boosted, rube has it's own planet, each rare mat has a boss and drops slighty more commonly from the planets they are on. Void keys can easily be acquired from defense missions. Dojo resource costs have been slashed. What exactly are you complaining about? That vaub bp is only on alert and banshee is minorly more difficult to acquire than ember?

[rpglord]

In what regard? Sure, plastids are a little wonky at the moment, but otherwise DE has been fairly helpful with their drop rates. Alloy plate was boosted, rube has it's own planet, each rare mat has a boss and drops slighty more commonly from the planets they are on. Void keys can easily be acquired from defense missions. Dojo resource costs have been slashed. What exactly are you complaining about? That vaub bp is only on alert and banshee is minorly more difficult to acquire than ember?

 

Didn't read entire thread, I thought original poster complained only about void keys ?

Situation is certainly worse then it ever was regarding these since they added new types and new prime weapons.

Drop chances are much lower for new keys then for old ones.

And its RNG on top of RNG, first you have to hope to even get the new key which is only 1-3% drop chance, and even then you have to hope to get the part you want to build new prime weapon.

 

Old void t2 keys have like 15% new like 1,8% drop chance ???

They need to fix this, more users are also complaining look through forums, you can't even buy the keys unless you want to spend hundreds of dollars.

Edited July 20, 2013 by rpglord

[Urash]

Pluto would act as sort of the max level planet for the hardest the basic game can offer. The rewards here would be much higher also.

 

Well, there's your problem.

 

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go back to farming Pluto for True Steel mods.

[MeteorKing]

@rpglord

We're are you getting your numbers? It is ABSOLUTELY NOT 1-3%. I've had about a dozen new keys and there's no way in hell I've done 2000 (12 keys at 3%. 3 in 100 rewards. i have 12, so x4=400. rewards are every 5 waves, so x5=2000) waves of defense. Don't spew nonsense. Go play the game. If you think it's too tedious, bring some friends, so when you do get a key you can all bring each other to your missions.

Edit: structure and spelling.

Edited July 20, 2013 by MeteorKing

[rpglord]

Well then either wiki is wrong or you have been extremely lucky ( which is posible its how RNG is )

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Endless_Defense

[MeteorKing]

Wiki isn't official, its a players' database constructed purely from feedback and speculation, thus It's wrong all the time. The wiki is a great hand guide and i use it constantly, but it's wrong all the time. If you just play for yourself you would know how remarkably simple it is to get keys and that it's nothing to worry yourself over. From my experience new keys drop at around 10-15%, that's just a guess, do not hold me to it. I'll be on later tonight, we can do some defense if you want. We'll get new keys, promise.

Edit: phone moved my '

Edited July 20, 2013 by MeteorKing

[Sophax]

Let the Anti-Christ (PvP) save you all!

[rpglord]

Wiki isn't official, its a players' database constructed purely from feedback and speculation, thus It's wrong all the time. The wiki is a great hand guide and i use it constantly, but it's wrong all the time. If you just play for yourself you would know how remarkably simple it is to get keys and that it's nothing to worry yourself over. From my experience new keys drop at around 10-15%, that's just a guess, do not hold me to it. I'll be on later tonight, we can do some defense if you want. We'll get new keys, promise.

Edit: phone moved my '

 

It might be wrong for t1 or t2 keys, but it shouldn't since it is datamined data, not speculation as you think.

But lets say they are wrong on t1 or t2 drop rates, t3 rates are certanly correct, and it's only 2%.

Since you need that specific t3 key to complete weapon, it doesn't metter if you for example get t3 mobile defense when you need t3 capture

 

Like I said, it RNG on top of RNG, you need specific t3 key, and once you get it, you need specific part to drop once you do the mission.

 

I have been playing xini+void for about 30 hours in game time over past 5 days or so, and still can't assemble braton prime

 

I mean keys themselves are not the issue, of course you will get them, but its just one part of the RNG process.

 

You say you already have dozens, but how many new prime weapons you got ?

Edited July 20, 2013 by rpglord

[shinydunsparce]

In what regard? Sure, plastids are a little wonky at the moment, but otherwise DE has been fairly helpful with their drop rates. Alloy plate was boosted, rube has it's own planet, each rare mat has a boss and drops slighty more commonly from the planets they are on. Void keys can easily be acquired from defense missions. Dojo resource costs have been slashed. What exactly are you complaining about? That vaub bp is only on alert and banshee is minorly more difficult to acquire than ember?

 

Wiki isn't official, its a players' database constructed purely from feedback and speculation, thus It's wrong all the time. The wiki is a great hand guide and i use it constantly, but it's wrong all the time. If you just play for yourself you would know how remarkably simple it is to get keys and that it's nothing to worry yourself over. From my experience new keys drop at around 10-15%, that's just a guess, do not hold me to it. I'll be on later tonight, we can do some defense if you want. We'll get new keys, promise.

Edit: phone moved my '

 

It's not speculation at all, the drops rates were datamined and correct. The rates are update 8 levels of stupid. De changed the first group of keys from 1%-15%, so I hope they will with these keys too. There's no sense in making a mission that only has 7% chance to drop something you want to only be accessible 1% of the time.

[Kickboxing_Banana]

It would be a bigger mistake to make it easily accessible. DE has to earn money from something so they can keep the game running with regular updates. If you don't like grinding, you are playing wrong kind of a game.

Edited July 20, 2013 by GalliumGD

[Venarge]

Didn't read entire thread, I thought original poster complained only about void keys ?

Situation is certainly worse then it ever was regarding these since they added new types and new prime weapons.

Drop chances are much lower for new keys then for old ones.

Sorry but I cant hear you over all the keys I got from xini the last few days....

[xGryphus]

Sorry but I cant hear you over all the keys I got from xini the last few days....

Agree - drop rate of Void Keys on Xini is ridiculously high

[Kickboxing_Banana]

Sorry but I cant hear you over all the keys I got from xini the last few days....

 

Haha so true :P

I wish that people could realise that the chance of getting T3 keys is much higher now. Before U9 there was only one kind of T3 which had drop rate of around 3%. Now there are 4 different types of T3 keys that all have drop rate of 2,21%, which equals total chance of getting a T3 key 8,84%.

[MeteorKing]

It might be wrong for t1 or t2 keys, but it shouldn't since it is datamined data, not speculation as you think.

But lets say they are wrong on t1 or t2 drop rates, t3 rates are certanly correct, and it's only 2%.

Since you need that specific t3 key to complete weapon, it doesn't metter if you for example get t3 mobile defense when you need t3 capture

 

Like I said, it RNG on top of RNG, you need specific t3 key, and once you get it, you need specific part to drop once you do the mission.

 

I have been playing xini+void for about 30 hours in game time over past 5 days or so, and still can't assemble braton prime

 

I mean keys themselves are not the issue, of course you will get them, but its just one part of the RNG process.

 

You say you already have dozens, but how many new prime weapons you got ?

 

I said I've had about A dozen, not dozens.  I can make the bronco prime, I choose not to, need the bp for fang prime, need the upper limb for paris prime, have orthos prime bp, have the bp and I think barrel of braton.  AFAIK the parts and bp drop from ANY of the new missions, not a specific one.  If you're trying to build a specific gun, sometimes S#&$ happens.  I had to run phorid almost 50 times to get nyx systems.  Keys, as you say, are not an issue, so why complain about them?  Make friends, share keys, help each other get keys.  If you really think that you should just be handed all the new fancy weapons just because you want them, too bad.  I really want the fang prime and go swishswishswishswish, I want the new shiny braton that goes pewpewpew.  I didnt get them yet, and I bet I've done more new void missions than you have.  But I sure as hell think that the system, in it's current state and only with regard to the aquisition of keys and prime weapons, is fine.

 

There's a guy in my clan who has all the new prime weps EXCEPT braton.  He only has 1 part for that.  It happens, deal with it.

 

Edit: Just got paris bp, braton stock.  I'm now making the braton prime.

Edited July 20, 2013 by MeteorKing

[Grodgen]

So if I told people I have about 58 keys, never seen a T1 key, and they are all varying....... I don't see what the issue is with the keys... I can't get rid of them fast enough.

Edited July 21, 2013 by Grodgen

[shinydunsparce]

For all the people who are getting 'ridiculous amounts' of keys, how many of them are raid / exterminate? Because the drop rate on those for t1-t2 is about 30%. The drop rates for the new keys t1-t3 are ~3-9%

Edited July 20, 2013 by shinydunsparce