Valkyr Is Ridiculously Op - Lvl 200+

[ClinkzEastwood]

Look where i started playing the game, now look back at you.

Since closed beta?

Well I still have those vandal lato to be the prove.

[(XBOX)Bladerunner777]

Alright why can't we all just agree on this, no matter what there's always going to be some aspect of each frame that can completely break the game or make the game "not fun" to some but others love that style of play. We have this topic for us to discuss how DE he fix/nerf/buff Valk. It seems everyone is split on this topic which is why we're here, but why not try to figure out a way to please both sides of the spectrum. What can DE do to make Valk a all around funner frame to play? What changes could/should be made to her. We each are entitled to opinions so no reason to dismiss someone just because their opinion differs and instantly go all turtle about someone having differing views

[Demdemeh]

What part do you disagree with?

 

With a good build you should never run out of energy.

Start reviving teammates constantly and you will. And quick. Also build her too much on efficiency and you will not deal enough damage to kill fast enough to get energy drops.

 

That's the same for almost any frame.

No. Valkyr survivability is based on Hysteria. Other frames (most of them) uses their abilities like tools, not like an extension of the frame itself.

 

Simply they don't scale as well as Valkyr.

Seriously? How can't a Mirage that stuns everything in a range of "the whole map" scale as well as Valkyr?

 

Melee that can do 7 figures crits.

And? I don't see the point. Excalibur does almost the same damage and in a range.

 

 

Immortal, can constantly revive the team, does an insane amount of damage. What more could you want?

So, according to that, a team of 4 Valkyr is just perfect. 

[IceColdHawk]

Since closed beta?

Well I still have those vandal lato to be the prove.

Nice, even better. Then you should know better that valkyr is the best for survival but not OP. She has her strengths but many other frames outclass her in other modes. Know what is funny? People argued mostly about valkyr because of her god mode. She had god mode since she got released. But they started making threads when she got ACTUALLY useful through some QoL changes. It's like people completely forgot that valkyr exists!

 

 

 What can DE do to make Valk a all around funner frame to play? What changes could/should be made to her. 

That's a good question. Personally, i never play valkyr. Too boring to use, even funnier to hear people want to nerf her... I would agree for a complete overhaul then, making hysteria worse won't make valkyr a better frame, just saying.

[Demdemeh]

Well you have more posts than me, so tell me about it.

People used to not playing her before because Hysteria was one of the worst melee weapon in the game.

It's different now. Hysteria is objectively the best melee in Warframe.

WAT?

Hysteria was bad? You just had to use a melee with appropriate base damage. Scindo Prime with Crit Build was the key.

Actually Hysteria BEFORE was more OP than it is now. You only had to build her on Duration because it didn't relay on Energy.

[(XBOX)AjarGman]

So... about ideas for a Hysteria change.

 

Duration based health drain that increases health lost while in Hysteria for each continuous minute spent in Hysteria, so the longer it's used per activation the more the Valkyr would need to hit enemies to heal.

 

Give that innate lifestrike more of a reason to be built in to the power.

 

 

 

Ill just keep bringing this back.

[(XBOX)MK Ultra K11]

WAT?

Hysteria was bad? You just had to use a melee with appropriate base damage. Scindo Prime with Crit Build was the key.

Actually Hysteria BEFORE was more OP than it is now. You only had to build her on Duration because it didn't relay on Energy.

Wait...hysteria now depends on energy....

So...its even more Op then I had imagined.

[(PSN)Andy2k7]

With a good build you should never run out of energy.

Start reviving teammates constantly and you will. And quick. Also build her too much on efficiency and you will not deal enough damage to kill fast enough to get energy drops.

I have 300% strength and max efficiency/duration

 

That's the same for almost any frame.

No. Valkyr survivability is based on Hysteria. Other frames (most of them) uses their abilities like tools, not like an extension of the frame itself.

Yes but a mirage with no energy is dead, as is trinity, loki.

 

Simply they don't scale as well as Valkyr.

Seriously? How can't a Mirage that stuns everything in a range of "the whole map" scale as well as Valkyr?

Because you may be able to stun them but you can't kill them.

 

Melee that can do 7 figures crits.

And? I don't see the point. Excalibur does almost the same damage and in a range.

Yes I agree Excalibur is also a really good frame.

 

Immortal, can constantly revive the team, does an insane amount of damage. What more could you want?

So, according to that, a team of 4 Valkyr is just perfect. 

Yes, team of 4 Valkyr's all with steel charge could go almost forever on T4 Survival. I think the player dying would happen before the Valkyrs did.

[(XBOX)Bladerunner777]

Nice, even better. Then you should know better that valkyr is the best for survival but not OP. She has her strengths but many other frames outclass her in other modes. Know what is funny? People argued mostly about valkyr because of her god mode. She had god mode since she got released. But they started making threads when she got ACTUALLY useful through some QoL changes. It's like people completely forgot that valkyr exists!

 

 

That's a good question. Personally, i never play valkyr. Too boring to use, even funnier to hear people want to nerf her... I would agree for a complete overhaul then, making hysteria worse won't make valkyr a better frame, just saying.

 

 

Alright so I've been reading through all the posts here and this is my idea for rework of Hysteria ( yes I understand one rework has already been done), but please hear me out.

Personally I'm neutral here on the " Nerf or Don't Nerf " groups and see both points of views.

Anywho, introduce a Health Gating mechanic to Hysteria that would have Valk take damage while in Hysteria, but she would still be nigh invincible.

For those of you who do not know what Health Gate is, I'll give a quick explanation. Say you take a bombard rocket straight to the mouth while in Hysteria, you could only lose a maximum X% of your maximum health in a given instance of damage, and can not take damage from any other sources for say 0.5 Seconds I say take this a little bit further and make a min amount taken to so Valks not still "GodMode" on lower lvl missions.

So there's a quick over view of Health Gate, so let's say we make Valks Health Gate while in Hysteria 10% of her Maximum Health in a given instance of Damage and can only receive that amount of Damage every 0.5 seconds. That means that if you would come to a complete stop in a mob with one shotting capabilities she can face tank for 5.0 seconds total. Here's where the fun begins :) we change around the innate Life Steal Valk has. We change it to where she can only gain upto 3% of her maximum health per strike to where as long as she can be putting out insane amounts of Dps she can still be nigh invincible. So if she's not dishing out the Dps she can be cut down, risk Vs. reward here would make for more frantic gameplay seeing as she is the beserker frame.

Also include a Min amount of health lost for lower level missions so she is still fun to play, say 0.75% max health lost??

So now she can still be killed while in Hysteria, but in the right deserving hands can be almost invincible. Key word almost :)

Not sure if this has ever been mentioned before, but if it has please don't send me to the corner :(

That's my original suggestion to please both sides of the Valk argument plus to promote a more frantic/thrilling beserker style game play.

[(XBOX)MK Ultra K11]

With a good build you should never run out of energy.

Start reviving teammates constantly and you will. And quick. Also build her too much on efficiency and you will not deal enough damage to kill fast enough to get energy drops.

I have 300% strength and max efficiency/duration

 

That's the same for almost any frame.

No. Valkyr survivability is based on Hysteria. Other frames (most of them) uses their abilities like tools, not like an extension of the frame itself.

Yes but a mirage with no energy is dead, as is trinity, loki.

 

Simply they don't scale as well as Valkyr.

Seriously? How can't a Mirage that stuns everything in a range of "the whole map" scale as well as Valkyr?

Because you may be able to stun them but you can't kill them.

 

Melee that can do 7 figures crits.

And? I don't see the point. Excalibur does almost the same damage and in a range.

Yes I agree Excalibur is also a really good frame.

 

Immortal, can constantly revive the team, does an insane amount of damage. What more could you want?

So, according to that, a team of 4 Valkyr is just perfect. 

Yes, team of 4 Valkyr's all with steel charge could go almost forever on T4 Survival. I think the player dying would happen before the Valkyrs did.

^This

[BaneOfOrion]

Nothing will change, she is not only a fanboy favorite but shes a office favorite as well.

This, essentially.

[(XBOX)MK Ultra K11]

This, essentially.

We can make change it depends on the community.

[(XBOX)Bladerunner777]

We can make change it depends on the community.

Yes we could change it, but why? What's ur reasoning of why it should be changed besides the lazy man's argument " invulnerability is unfair Gaaahhh"

[(PSN)obsidiancurse]

Nothing to d with favouritism, she won't be changed because there is nothing wrong with her.

The game isn't broken how it is, she isn't driving players away, the games thriving. She isn't the meta, she is not over centralising, recruit tab isn't full of "need Valk", you don't see squads of her, you see far more Rhinos, Trins, Novas etc.

Also, importantly to the Devs, she isn't a farming frame, she can't instantly clear an entire tile or destroy every mob at every spawn, and she doesn't encourage stationary, passive play. Far from it, she has to move, her kills are up close and she has to kill to survive. As her damage falls offs, so does her survivability, less kills, less orbs to replenish hysteria. There comes a point where she cannot kill fast enough to maintain the energy drain and then she dies.

As she doesn't seem to be affecting the game negatively, the onus is on those calling for a nerf to present a compelling argument why. Having read this entire thread I honestly haven't seen one, it's all just people feeling that hysteria is OP and trivialising when there is no evidence to back this up. The devs aren't going to nerf a frame just because the idea of invulnerability upsets a few players gaming sensibilities. Prove/show its hurting the game and maybe they'll listen but this thread hasn't come close.

[(XBOX)MK Ultra K11]

Yes we could change it, but why? What's ur reasoning of why it should be changed besides the lazy man's argument " invulnerability is unfair Gaaahhh"

Well that's more of a simple argument and easy to understand not necessarily lazy. Oh and I forgot........ "Gaahhhh".

[(PSN)obsidiancurse]

Well that's more of a simple argument and easy to understand not necessarily lazy. Oh and I forgot........ "Gaahhhh".

It's certainly "simple" but it's far from an argument ;)

[Onixizi]

I'm confused why she needs health steal on melee when she never takes damage, I agree make it 95% resist so Valkyr has to work to survive higher levels.

I only use her 4th ability to heal to be honest. After I heal, I clear out the room before deactivating Hysteria. 

[(PSN)thefndodge]

Nothing to d with favouritism, she won't be changed because there is nothing wrong with her.

The game isn't broken how it is, she isn't driving players away, the games thriving. She isn't the meta, she is not over centralising, recruit tab isn't full of "need Valk", you don't see squads of her, you see far more Rhinos, Trins, Novas etc.

Also, importantly to the Devs, she isn't a farming frame, she can't instantly clear an entire tile or destroy every mob at every spawn, and she doesn't encourage stationary, passive play. Far from it, she has to move, her kills are up close and she has to kill to survive. As her damage falls offs, so does her survivability, less kills, less orbs to replenish hysteria. There comes a point where she cannot kill fast enough to maintain the energy drain and then she dies.

As she doesn't seem to be affecting the game negatively, the onus is on those calling for a nerf to present a compelling argument why. Having read this entire thread I honestly haven't seen one, it's all just people feeling that hysteria is OP and trivialising when there is no evidence to back this up. The devs aren't going to nerf a frame just because the idea of invulnerability upsets a few players gaming sensibilities. Prove/show its hurting the game and maybe they'll listen but this thread hasn't come close.

I have to agree with this. As he stated, Valkyr does not "clear an entire tile or destroy every mob" or "encourage stationary, passive play".  Valkyr doesn't do those things. The invulnerability does not hurt other people's gameplay.

 

In my opinion, there are a few frames and weapons in this game that do hurt others' gameplay, and they do need a good ol' nerf. Valkyr not really.

[(PSN)Xurokhan]

Again this? FOR REAL?

 

Ok.

 

Let's talk about some more stuff.

 

 

 

 

1 - Mirage at Interception (or anything else that requires CC).

 

Build her with max range/dura and stick a Natural Talent in her.

 

Tactic:

Prism > Stunn everyone > Don't kill enemies (so they can't respawn).

 

Repeat until the end of the mission. You can solo Sortie 3 Interception with this. Doesn't matter if they are level 1 or level 500 mobs.

 

 

 

 

2 - Trinity Bless

 

Build her around Duration. Don't use Vitality.

Build a thrown melee around poison.

 

Tactic:

Throw Glaive to the ground > 2 HP > Cast Bless > 28 Seconds of immortality for THE WHOLE TEAM.

 

Repeat until the end of the mission. If you time yourself properly starting charging Glaive at 0.7 Seconds you can do it

quite easily leaving the rest of the team basically immortal.

Meanwhile you can arm yourself with the heaviest weapons around. Who cares? You can't take damage.

Meanwhile you can also provide a decent amount of energy to the team due EV.

 

 

 

 

3 - Vauban Bastille

 

Build him around Range and Duration. Use Repelling Bastille augment mod.

 

Tactic:

Just cover the entire area with Bastille.

With the support of a Syndicate weapon and/or a Trinity you'll have enough room to freeze the entire stage.

 

 

 

 

4 - Loki

 

Build him as you want.

 

Tactic:

Just don't be an idiot and you can solo all kind of Spy with ease where other frames have actually a bad time.

You can also disarm the S#&$ out of anybody. Doesn't matter if is a lvl 1 Butcher (which can't be disarmed) or a lvl 500 Eximus Bombard. Just disarm EVERYTHING. Everything and FOREVER.

 

 

 

 

5 - Ember

 

Build her around Power and decent efficiency. Stretch will be a plus.

 

Tactic:

Just walk around. Any kind of Exterminate will be just a joke. You don't really need to do anything else. Walk.

 

 

 

 

I may continue over and over with more examples of other frames which are totally unbalanced.

 

 

 

Now what can Valkyr do?

 

Invulnerability, as long as you have energy. Run out of energy and you are doomed.

Face a nullifier with a bit of lag and enter his field. Farewell world.

Damage. Yes, she has a goddamn high damage. And so? Shall I start talking about weapons like Tonkor or Simulor?

She is limited to melee.

All (ALL) her abilities are totally useless for the team, unless you have another Melee which gains benefits from War Cry (Attack Speed and Armor).

Revives. Well yes, that's the bright side of her. She's pretty good at reviving.

 

 

Stop with these annoying threads about Valkyr. Please. 

 

Just came here to make sure more people see your very valid post.

 

Also....

 

These "OP" talks just need to end, 

 

This an a game.

 

Not everything needs to be equal.

 

Not everything needs to be "Fair"

 

Just play solo and don't mod yourself into a god is you insist on complaining.

[(PSN)Xurokhan]

Oh! and can the gaming community come up with a better term than "Cheese" when talking about these things?

Seriously..... 

Edited January 22, 2016 by (PS4)Xurokhan

[DarthKadra]

Ahem. Valkyr is perfectly vaibly in any mission. Her DPS is huge. If you lack CC, take another Frame in the squad, since you can go as a group in any mission. She is often required for Trials, even if not as DPS, then as a revive bot, like you mentioned.

I don't know if you pay attention when you play with Valkyr, or read what people post here, but Leecher Eximus do nothing to Valkyr. And don't blame your inability to fight Nullifiers on the Frame.

Any frame is perfectly viable in any mission, as long as you take another frame in the squad to do the actual job of protecting the pod or console, for example, while you just do the damage at will.

I've mained Valkyr for two years now, I am perfectly capable of killing the nullies, thank you, what I'm saying is it gets so clemming boring after a couple of minutes not simply being confined to melee, which is fine for me, but having to take care of those bubbles all the clemming time without having any fun, cause you have to position yourself and take care not to get inside a bubble, while they keep coming and coming. As for the leeches, let me picture you a situation, you run out of energy, you take a hit and you can't go back into Hysteria, cause you're drained dry before you can cast it. paying attention...I'm not saying Valkyr sucks or anything, I love my Valkyr, it's my favourite frame, my point is she is nowhere near OP, she has her uses, but most of the time you could swap her for any other frame and lose nothing,

[EmptyDevil]

Still don't get why people are so desperate to keep invulnerability. There are a number of changes/tweaks that can be made to Valkyr's abilities but that invulnerability has to go or Hysteria needs a real drawback.

 

Possible tweaks that can be made:

 

Ripline

 

- Enemies within 5 meters of the target should also be affected by this ability.

 

 

Warcry

 

- Make this recastable (Only players that really know Valkyr well would know why this is a huge improvement).

 

 

Paralysis

 

- Enemies affected should be open to finishers and stealth multiplier damage for 10 seconds(The stagger duration should remain the same).

 

- 5 more meters added to range

 

 

Hysteria

 

- Remove stored damage mechanic (virtually useless and not a real drawback since it is easy to avoid).

 

- Valkyr is invulnerable but health drains at 12 per second as long as it is active(will not drop below 2 health) OR Valkyr is invulnerable for 5 seconds upon casting and then receives a 90% damage reduction.

 

- Movement speed is increased by 20%

 

- Every 100 health lost is added to Hysteria claws base damage to a max of 300 additional base damage.

[(XBOX)Bladerunner777]

Well that's more of a simple argument and easy to understand not necessarily lazy. Oh and I forgot........ "Gaahhhh".

Lol I'm sorry wasn't directing that towards u in any way. Just hate seeing that simplistic argument is all.

[Eftycchia]

Sorry for telling the truth, it's not my fault that the truth is painful.

Though it doesn't really change the way i play with my warframes. Certainly different, truth or not. Their abilities are fun to use, Not because they deal any or even nearly high enough damage as normal weapons. Just because they gize with me. So does most of your favorite frames' abilities.

 

I'm still disappointed people look down on the underused frames, never mentions Banshee, and yells about overpowered stuff in the game. Though it's just vocal minority.

[(PSN)vamp6x6x6x]

I don't know if anyone has noticed, but it seems like more enemies can knock her out of Hysteria lately.