Ash Overhaul

[r0ckwolf]

Don´t mistake my intend here, i am not suggesting that Ash sucks the way he is, i just think that he could be much better with just a few tweaks. I definetly dont want to Overpower him, just give him more reliable strength and tools to fulfill his role as the backstabing, badass spaceninja he is!

 

My Main Problem is with Shuriken and Smoke Cloud, the damage and range of the shuriken is just to low and smoke cloud lasts way too short.

 

Here would be my ideas:

 

Shuriken:

-throws 1/1/2/3 Shuriken in a cone in Front of you that home in on Targets and deal 300/400/500/500 dmg.

-increase the reach of the Shuriken, so they can hit enemys further away.

-make them attract to Mag´s Bullet attaractor, so you can combo with her!

-change the throwing animation please, so it looks more like in the Mod picture.

 

Smoke Cloud:

-increase the radius and duration of the smoke, including the stun duration.

-increase the duration of the invisibility.

-increase the mellee bonus damage while invis.

 

Teleport:

-stuns the targeted enemy for a short time (~2 sec).

-increase mellee damage for the 1 strike after teleporting by 100/150/200/300%.

 

(Blade Storm: is being worked on right now, according to the devs, to make it look more like in the new Trailer. So i will not give a comment about this ability, since my main Problem with it is the horrible fisheye animation.)

 

I think with these little changes Ash would really excell in creating confunsion on the battlefield, while quickly killing smaller groups of enemys.

 

Reply and discuss a lot guys, so the devs may notice us! ^^

 

Greetings from Germany

Edited June 9, 2013 by r0ckwolf

[--Sensei--]

My smokescreen lasts 10 secs and shuriken is pretty op with its homing abilities and already  1hitting 2 targets per shot.

 

 

For teleport I had a suggestion for that https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/23226-requestsuggestion-tweak-ashs-teleport-a-little-bit-fixed-title/

 

Sent this to DESteve awhile back in a PM said he would check it out and I heard there would be tweaks to Ash teleport in a livestream but I guess they never followed through. -shrugs-

 

 

fixed becuz I typoed smokescreen for teleport

Edited June 9, 2013 by --Sensei--

[r0ckwolf]

I like your Idea with the special attack animation at the end of Teleport, it is even better than mine.^^

Maybe we have to be more perstient, so they may change it after all.

 

But i dont think Shuriken is Op at all, compare it too Slash Dash or Tesla and it feels very weak, also i think all this worrying about making abilties Op goes a bit far, i mean this is a CoOp game after all. (Iron Skin was Op though!^^)

Edited June 9, 2013 by r0ckwolf

[--Sensei--]

I like your Idea with the special attack animation at the end of Teleport, it is even better than mine.^^

Maybe we have to be more perstient, so they may change it after all.

 

lol just realized I typed smokescreen instead of teleport.

[r0ckwolf]

lol just realized I typed smokescreen instead of teleport.

now i´m confused! o.O lol

[--Sensei--]

now i´m confused! o.O lol

 

no I mean in my other post I typed

 

" I heard there would be tweaks to Ash Smokescreen in a livestream"

 

when I mean't teleport which I already changed and edited

[r0ckwolf]

no I mean in my other post I typed

 

" I heard there would be tweaks to Ash Smokescreen in a livestream"

 

when I mean't teleport which I already changed and edited

Ok, i got it now. (i think^^) 

I hope you´re right. Any tweaks are welcome and the last Livestream left me with quiet a bit of optimissm that the devs have understood what needs to be done to bring all Frames to the same level.

[nakatotaiyou]

firing off 3 shurikens maybe is too strong, as much as id like it, especially when there is one target left that would result in 1500 damage, 1950 with a maxed focus... shuriken is already very useful with 2 firing off, up to the devs to decide if it will be OP when firing 3 at once i guess. also what do you mean more range? it homes to targets, as far as i know it has infinite range, the only problem is when enemies are behind cover with their head sticking out shurikens will just hit the cover... which is not important anyway since ash has great mobility to deal with that.

about smoke screen, duration and stun is fine, duration can be increased with continuity and im fine without even that anyway, why would you need more stun when you are invisible? plus it would make excalibur's radial blind pretty redundant... although the melee bonus damage could use some increase i agree, maybe make focus affect it.

teleport is pretty amazing already, you can do some neat tricks with it. when facing groups you can activate smoke screen beforehand so when you teleport inside them you are invisible and in prime position to slash everything. if wyrm's crowd dispersion worked you could easily use that to your advantage to teleport into a group and stun them with crowd dispersion then kill them. also something i found today, you can jump and do the flying kick( jump>crouch) then teleport to some enemy while you are still in the air and doing the flying kick, after the teleport you will do the flip as usual but you will knock the enemy you teleported to down because of the flying kick and often any enemies around it, allowing you to follow up with a ground finisher or whatever you want to do., which is very useful when you have a weapon without a knockdown like dual heat swords. teleport is pretty amazing and fun right now. your idea of increasing damage of the next melee strike is amazing i think, it will have great synergy with the flying kick>teleport trick and the melee channel mod.

finally bladestorm... it simply kills groups too slow, most of the time you can kill groups faster using smoke screen/shuriken/weapons which is interesting since it makes ash more effective vs groups when he doesnt spam ubers like other frames. the advantages is you can cast it from any range and sometimes handles groups that are too spread out better than the rest of his abilities. i just hope they polish the animation but not make it even slower. and make it so the clones it leaves behind do not look like the default ash but like the one you are using!

Edited June 9, 2013 by nakatotaiyou

[r0ckwolf]

:O some neat tricks you got there with the teleport!

 i still think it would be cool if you got a small melle damage buff for the next attack, which i don´t think would op the spell.

 

You might be right about Shuriken, 2k damage is too much. But i think the Shurikens should just not be able to home in to the same target, unless Bullet Attractor is applied. This way the skill would be very usefull for small groups, and only deal really high damage if used in conjunction with a teammate.

 

Bladestorm is completely broken right now(due to a bug) and is up for a rework anyway so i think on that front it´s best to wait with what the devs come up.

[nakatotaiyou]

:O some neat tricks you got there with the teleport!

 i still think it would be cool if you got a small melle damage buff for the next attack, which i don´t think would op the spell.

 

You might be right about Shuriken, 2k damage is too much. But i think the Shurikens should just not be able to home in to the same target, unless Bullet Attractor is applied. This way the skill would be very usefull for small groups, and only deal really high damage if used in conjunction with a teammate.

 

Bladestorm is completely broken right now(due to a bug) and is up for a rework anyway so i think on that front it´s best to wait with what the devs come up.

as i said i love your suggestion to give the next melee attack damage buff after teleport. still cant decide if firing 3 shurikens will be OP, it may not be... they only home to a single target if its the only thing left, like an ancient in infested defense but thats rarely the case so you cant really abuse it... maybe if you walk up to a target and use shuriken at point blank range, and even then it will be just for one enemy so its not anything important, and ash could use some more effectiveness vs groups

im afraid we will have to wait for several updates or even update 9 to see such changes... well ash is my favourite even as he is right now so no big deal

[ASH_PRIME]

Shuriken has JUST been reworked and is finally a good ability, i dont think DE will be going to go back and redo it!!

Smoke is perfect as is  [hint: Ash has a V polarity slot for continuity mod for a reason!]

Teleport:  hmm...i actually LIKE your melee dmg idea, the only thing i DONT want to see with Ash's teleport is to turn it into a simple attack move, ie he will teleport and attack a target, his teleport is VERY flexible as it is by NOT being a simple attack move and i dont want that to change, my idea is to give players the ability to hit E and do a jumping/ground melee attack out of his teleport front flip if they WANT to

BladeStorm : yep its being worked on right now to make it look more like the awesome PS4 trailer version  [and currently is totally BROKEN after last patch unfortunately, hoping for a hotfix for the 'float in space' bug REALLY soon]

cool post, 90% better than the other Ash posts i have seen!

P.S  Try my Teleport 'trick'  
Equip Dethcube and put VAPORIZE in the top left slot so it has highest priorty

Teleport to enemy target: Dethcube will vaporize them before you have even landed!  great fun

Edited June 10, 2013 by ZetaReticulan

[r0ckwolf]

Shuriken has JUST been reworked and is finally a good ability, i dont think DE will be going to go back and redo it!!

Smoke is perfect as is  [hint: Ash has a V polarity slot for continuity mod for a reason!]

Teleport:  hmm...i actually LIKE your melee dmg idea, the only thing i DONT want to see with Ash's teleport is to turn it into a simple attack move, ie he will teleport and attack a target, his teleport is VERY flexible as it is by NOT being a simple attack move and i dont want that to change, my idea is to give players the ability to hit E and do a jumping/ground melee attack out of his teleport front flip if they WANT to

BladeStorm : yep its being worked on right now to make it look more like the awesome PS4 trailer version  [and currently is totally BROKEN after last patch unfortunately, hoping for a hotfix for the 'float in space' bug REALLY soon]

cool post, 90% better than the other Ash posts i have seen!

P.S  Try my Teleport 'trick'  

Equip Dethcube and put VAPORIZE in the top left slot so it has highest priorty

Teleport to enemy target: Dethcube will vaporize them before you have even landed!  great fun

 

Hahaha, nice use of vaporize there.^^ 

About Teleport, i don´t want to seel loose it´s utility either. I just thought a dmg buff for your next attack might increase it´s already good utiltiy, sine it´s meant to bring you up close in mellee range.

As i said in the beginning, i lie ash a lot and i don´t want to see him loose a single one of his abiltiys. I just think he could be improved upon (a tiny bit!^^) 

But let´s just see what the devs come up with for his ult for now.

[r0ckwolf]

One more thing about Shuriken:

i know it has been Updated recently and it has become a lot better for sure. But a few things still bother me. For example, why does he have to throw the shuriken so bored? I mean he looks like he´s throwing sand in the enemys face and not like he´s throwing a NINJA STAR OF DEATH!

 

And i can´t help to compare it to other 1, in which case it´s still not that great. I know you´re probably right that another tweak is unlikely in the near future, but i still hope that DEScott may sees this Thread and may at least consider it.^^

[Shadow-Blades]

I agree about the part where you throw 1/1/2/3 shurikens. That would be really cool. I also think that the smokescreen could be a bit longer and that teleport needs a buff.

[-Strayed-]

Yeah a lot of people are upset about blade storm's bug, but on the bright side, you have a flying space ninja.

[ASH_PRIME]

Hahaha, nice use of vaporize there.^^ 

About Teleport, i don´t want to seel loose it´s utility either. I just thought a dmg buff for your next attack might increase it´s already good utiltiy, sine it´s meant to bring you up close in mellee range.

As i said in the beginning, i lie ash a lot and i don´t want to see him loose a single one of his abiltiys. I just think he could be improved upon (a tiny bit!^^) 

But let´s just see what the devs come up with for his ult for now.

Try the Vape trick out its great fun!

Yeah i like your idea alot more than all the [usually non ash users] 'make it an attack move' poop

Would also make Ash even more brutal for Melee... picture...   Smokebomb...to teleport...to charged slash...  would be lethal damage!!!

P.S  Bladestorm has been fixed today thank the Lotus!

 

[r0ckwolf]

y, the fix was really needed. Thx Lotus. 

I still think 3 Shurikens and about a 2 sec longer Smokecloud would do a lot for Ash.

Teleport needs definetly some tweaking though!