Nerf Disruptors?

[CapricaSix]

It's funny because they can only do the drain once and then it goes on cooldown.

It's also funny because if you're blocking or rolling when the drain comes, it won't affect you.

 

NERF DISRUPTORS! I DON'T WANT TO BLOCK OR ROLL! AM LAZY ERMAGERD!

Blocking works against Ancient "beam attacks"...? ;o

[Edit]

LIES!

Edited June 22, 2013 by CapricaSix

[Madotsuki]

Blocking works against Ancient "beam attacks"...? ;o

Blocking is in this game?? O_O

But seriously, blocking is so pointless in 90% of this game, who would even remember this feature?

[CapricaSix]

Blocking is in this game?? O_O

But seriously, blocking is so pointless in 90% of this game, who would even remember this feature?

Exactly lol, %99 of the time it's either go head-on or retreat, not stand there and get surrounded by every single charger, leaper, ancient.

 

Does it really work against ancients though? I mean it barely blocks any projectiles, and blocking melee is just not worth it.

[Trylobyte]

Blocking is in this game?? O_O

But seriously, blocking is so pointless in 90% of this game, who would even remember this feature?

Like I said in an earlier post, blocking is so obscure that not only does the tutorial never mention it, not only is the game entirely and completely playable without it, but the command isn't even bound by default.  If that isn't a giant neon sign pointing at Block saying 'This Is Useless,' I don't know what is.  Expecting people to automatically know about this thing which is never explained or hinted at as well as the ONE circumstance where it is remotely useful is a pretty huge burden of knowledge.

Edited June 22, 2013 by Trylobyte

[Aspari]

The problem is Disruptors are way too sneaky. They make no sound and sometimes they spawn out of Satan's &#!

Lmao

[CapricaSix]

I just tested it out of curiousity, blocking dun do nuttin against Ancients, you still get knocked on your butt and lose all energy/shields.

[fatpig84]

I can't even remember the last time a disruptor caught me off guard.

But I am usually the one who runs Enemy Radar though while the rest are on Energy Siphon.

[Ghobe]

I just tested it out of curiousity, blocking dun do nuttin against Ancients, you still get knocked on your butt and lose all energy/shields.

Guess I'm glitched then. Blocking causes me to be knocked down but I don't lose shield/energy.

[CapricaSix]

Guess I'm glitched then. Blocking causes me to be knocked down but I don't lose shield/energy.

All ancients have 2 different attacks apparently. Disruptors can either knock you down, or stagger you and deplete all your energy/shield, but not both at the same time. Healers and Toxics don't seem to have anything special aside from Healers having much more health and a funky aura and toxics with poison.

 

Did you try blocking that same disruptor ancient for more than one hit?

[NalkorRN]

Really? I'm the one being attacked here?

 

It is an awareness problem. Awareness comes in more forms than just sound. It doesn't take much to 180 every now and then, and thoroughly clean out every area before advancing. Hell if you're just standing there shooting from some type of cover, you're doing it wrong, you're supposed to be mobile. They shouldn't be able to "sneak up from behind" you should be moving at full speed at all times in an infested level. Standing still is just going to get you mauled. The only things with ranged are the ancients and that's mid range.

 

 

 

Why don't you just take everything to an extreme. Just because something has a really punishing mechanic, doesn't mean everything needs to have one.

It doesn't matter how often you turn around, everything spawns wherever you cannot see. I've had Disruptors (two of them) spawn behind me in those Corpus Ships on an elevator I had just stepped off of and killed a trio of leapers with a pair of chargers. It's that kind of elevator where a side-room immediately to the left/right has a few lockers for potential goodies, you know the kind. I shouldn't have to worry about losing my shields, energy, getting a fuzzy HUD, and being knocked down because DE is S#&$ at programming reasonable enemy spawn points.

[holdenagincourt]

Well....wow. Damn it.

 

Yea, they screw up your HUD too.

 

I think Disruptors would be fine if it were more fair, maybe like when you kill them energy balls [plural, more than one] are guaranteed to drop from them.

 

Fun fact, they don't just knock you down, drain 100% of your energy, strip 100% of your shields and scramble your HUD. They also convert all energy you pick up during the period your HUD is scrambled to zero.

 

Is your mind blown yet, OP? :p

[CapricaSix]

because DE is S#&$ at programming reasonable enemy spawn points.

Wow, dude, beta.

[NalkorRN]

Wow, dude, beta.

After all the feedback and balancing by now, they've had more than enough time to apply proper balancing to the enemies, which is coming in bits and pieces, but I've yet to see anything truly convincing for Infested. Also, I fail to see the game as Beta, I see it as released by this point. Once you start charging money and allow as many people as possible (even from Steam) into a game, you've gone from beta to release. Now, most online games at release were still buggy and being balanced left and right as the developers were getting a broader amount of feedback.

I did an Everest run earlier for Neurode farming and I started the match as soon as I could and before anyone else joined, I had left one of those large vents with a fan blocking the end. Within 10 seconds of making sure the left and right were clear, I was taking shots at Grineer and suddenly I see hit indicators to my right. I turned a little and saw nothing, but the indicator was still there, I turned fully to the right and saw a Grineer Heavy Machinegunner between two of those covered Vent Fans and it made absolutely no sound when it spawned. It wasn't there before, it just well, popped into existence in a spot my screen wasn't showing, distance and logic be damned. There needs to be a minimum distance (varying between maps and faction as well) for enemies to spawn from players.

[CapricaSix]

After all the feedback and balancing by now, they've had more than enough time to apply proper balancing to the enemies, which is coming in bits and pieces, but I've yet to see anything truly convincing for Infested. Also, I fail to see the game as Beta, I see it as released by this point. Once you start charging money and allow as many people as possible (even from Steam) into a game, you've gone from beta to release. Now, most online games at release were still buggy and being balanced left and right as the developers were getting a broader amount of feedback.

I did an Everest run earlier for Neurode farming and I started the match as soon as I could and before anyone else joined, I had left one of those large vents with a fan blocking the end. Within 10 seconds of making sure the left and right were clear, I was taking shots at Grineer and suddenly I see hit indicators to my right. I turned a little and saw nothing, but the indicator was still there, I turned fully to the right and saw a Grineer Heavy Machinegunner between two of those covered Vent Fans and it made absolutely no sound when it spawned. It wasn't there before, it just well, popped into existence in a spot my screen wasn't showing, distance and logic be damned. There needs to be a minimum distance (varying between maps and faction as well) for enemies to spawn from players.

To be honest, from a customer's point of view, you're right. You just don't pay for beta games aside from early access and such, since it's an unfinished product. But I think special circumstances may apply here since DE doesn't actually have a publisher and they're pretty much alone in this, so the way it works is more similar to Kickstarter than anything, in my opinion.

 

Technically speaking, there's still tons of bugs to fix and the content seems to be only halfway done at best, I'd call that Beta.

Edited June 22, 2013 by CapricaSix

[holdenagincourt]

It is an awareness problem.  Awareness comes in more forms than just sound. It doesn't take much to 180 every now and then, and thoroughly clean out every area before advancing.

 

I would be more sympathetic to the awareness argument if Infested enemies in particular did not regularly spawn directly behind players, usually from rooms that were completely empty seconds before. I'm not sure why you imply that "thoroughly clean[ing] out every area before advancing" has any effect on whether enemies continue to spawn from those areas or not, because it doesn't.

 

I would also be more sympathetic to the awareness argument if the direction in which the Disruptor presents itself had any bearing on the player it was targeting, if its bending arm wasn't homing and couldn't target in a complete sphere (including on jumping/falling players), if there were any way to tell whether it was about to use its disrupting attack or just its knockdown attack, or if it could be killed in one mag with most guns in the game at higher levels, such that situational awareness itself could give you the ability to kill it rather than simply run away from it before it disrupted you.

 

I'm all for threatening enemies but I agree with many others that the Ancient Disruptor needs to be tweaked. Even a penalty of 50% energy/shields + HUD scramble + energy block for scramble duration would make it the number one target among Infested and an imposing--though not as cheap as now--enemy.

[NalkorRN]

To be honest, from a customer's point of view, you're right. You just don't pay for beta games aside from early access and such, since it's an unfinished product. But I think special circumstances may apply here since DE doesn't actually have a publisher and they're pretty much alone in this, so the way it works is more similar to Kickstarter than anything, in my opinion.

 

Technically speaking, there's still tons of bugs to fix and the content seems to be only halfway done at best, I'd call that Beta.

Simply put, DE is in a bad spot, a damned if you do, damned if you don't. I'd say the game is released since (most) of all the gamebreaking bugs have been patched. I'm not talking IS being Invulnerability-mode, I mean like, 'shoot reinforced glass with a Boar modded for fire damage and somehow cause a Bluescreen of Death', stuff that can be horrendous if left alone to fester. They've got bugs from a beta stage, but given how stable the game is, I'd say they're doing better than most big-name MMOs do when released.

[CapricaSix]

Simply put, DE is in a bad spot, a damned if you do, damned if you don't. I'd say the game is released since (most) of all the gamebreaking bugs have been patched. I'm not talking IS being Invulnerability-mode, I mean like, 'shoot reinforced glass with a Boar modded for fire damage and somehow cause a Bluescreen of Death', stuff that can be horrendous if left alone to fester. They've got bugs from a beta stage, but given how stable the game is, I'd say they're doing better than most big-name MMOs do when released.

Well it's certainly the best Beta game I've ever tried, but it's still beta until they say otherwise. Can't really compare it to garbage like WarZ or Defiance whose devs are apparently content with releasing rushed buggy games and not even as F2P titles. Also there's lots of people having issues with client crashes, I wouldn't exactly call it stable even though I have no problems personally :P just saying.

[NalkorRN]

Well it's certainly the best Beta game I've ever tried, but it's still beta until they say otherwise. Can't really compare it to garbage like WarZ or Defiance whose devs are apparently content with releasing rushed buggy games and not even as F2P titles. Also there's lots of people having issues with client crashes, I wouldn't exactly call it stable even though I have no problems personally :P just saying.

Do not mention Defiance, please don't. That is the first and last time I ever pre-order a game, ever. Ugh, the nerfs to stuff here at least make some sense. There? I can't even be certain the nerfs aren't in response to PvP complaints and them failing to realize the weapons being nerfed are OP because of exploiters using trainers/hacks to one-shot and fly, etc.

If any game had the potential to make me want to start drinking, it'd be Defiance.

[CapricaSix]

Do not mention Defiance, please don't. That is the first and last time I ever pre-order a game, ever. Ugh, the nerfs to stuff here at least make some sense. There? I can't even be certain the nerfs aren't in response to PvP complaints and them failing to realize the weapons being nerfed are OP because of exploiters using trainers/hacks to one-shot and fly, etc.

If any game had the potential to make me want to start drinking, it'd be Defiance.

lol PVP in defiance = cloaked bunnyhopping shotgunners everywhere. To think I even got the season pass for it... But yeah these would be the worst examples I guess :P

[Ghobe]

All ancients have 2 different attacks apparently. Disruptors can either knock you down, or stagger you and deplete all your energy/shield, but not both at the same time. Healers and Toxics don't seem to have anything special aside from Healers having much more health and a funky aura and toxics with poison.

 

Did you try blocking that same disruptor ancient for more than one hit?

The first hit from disruptors is ALWAYS the disruption hit.

 

It doesn't matter how often you turn around, everything spawns wherever you cannot see. I've had Disruptors (two of them) spawn behind me in those Corpus Ships on an elevator I had just stepped off of and killed a trio of leapers with a pair of chargers. It's that kind of elevator where a side-room immediately to the left/right has a few lockers for potential goodies, you know the kind. I shouldn't have to worry about losing my shields, energy, getting a fuzzy HUD, and being knocked down because DE is S#&$ at programming reasonable enemy spawn points.

You know, I have never had an enemy spawn in the same room as me, ever. A side room just off the path I'm on, sure, but never the same room.

 

I would be more sympathetic to the awareness argument if Infested enemies in particular did not regularly spawn directly behind players, usually from rooms that were completely empty seconds before. I'm not sure why you imply that "thoroughly clean[ing] out every area before advancing" has any effect on whether enemies continue to spawn from those areas or not, because it doesn't.

It does. There are only 3 reasons for an enemy to appear behind you:

#1 You didn't actually clear the area.

#2 You alerted the ship since you've cleared it.

#3 You cleared an objective since you've cleared it.

I have NEVER had an enemy spawn behind me outside of those situations.

 

if there were any way to tell whether it was about to use its disrupting attack or just its knockdown attack

They will always do it first and once they do, they can't use it for a LONG period of time, much longer than unloading your clip and reloading twice.

 

I'm all for threatening enemies but I agree with many others that the Ancient Disruptor needs to be tweaked. Even a penalty of 50% energy/shields + HUD scramble + energy block for scramble duration would make it the number one target among Infested and an imposing--though not as cheap as now--enemy.

The only tweak he needs is that his energy and shield steals need a cap that increases with their level.

[NalkorRN]

The first hit from disruptors is ALWAYS the disruption hit.

 

 

 

You know, I have never had an enemy spawn in the same room as me, ever. A side room just off the path I'm on, sure, but never the same room.

 

 

 

It does. There are only 3 reasons for an enemy to appear behind you:

#1 You didn't actually clear the area.

#2 You alerted the ship since you've cleared it.

#3 You cleared an objective since you've cleared it.

I have NEVER had an enemy spawn behind me outside of those situations.

 

 

 

They will always do it first and once they do, they can't use it for a LONG period of time, much longer than unloading your clip and reloading twice.

 

 

 

The only tweak he needs is that his energy and shield steals need a cap that increases with their level.

In response to what you said in replying to me: Count yourself lucky if they never spawned right next to you.

[Madotsuki]

In response to what you said in replying to me: Count yourself lucky if they never spawned right next to you.

I've had enemies spawn ON SCREEN. I don't even have to look away, they just spawn on screen (i was in solo too, so no lag). It's extremely obvious if you use Enemy Radar, you can see red dots pop into existence all the time at ranges unquestionably within the radar radius.

[McCrabby]

I've had enemies spawn ON SCREEN. I don't even have to look away, they just spawn on screen (i was in solo too, so no lag). It's extremely obvious if you use Enemy Radar, you can see red dots pop into existence all the time at ranges unquestionably within the radar radius.

 

I've never had an enemy spawn behind me and take me by surprise.  Then again I never use enemy radar, so I can't confirm or deny their spawning.  Disruptors are stupidly easy for me too, but I remember a time when I hated them.  I think this could all be fixed when they implement difficulty scales and levels.  

Edited June 22, 2013 by McCrabby

[Hauteclere]

So Enemy Radar should be mandatory now if you don't want to get backstabbed repeatedly?

"lololol the gaem iz so easy, disrupters r the only challenge, lrn2play nubs lol"

Y'know what, the problem here is that Disruptors actually are not challenging at all. They are just frustrating. If i see one coming it is EXTREMELY easy to kill them, just use an ice mod, shoot them in the knee, stagger-spam them with melee etc. Long as you got enough ammo to feed these bullet sponges you're fine. If you see one attacking, just outrun its range, it's the only way to guarantee a dodge so that's boring but at least it works.

Disruptors are only a threat when they attack while you're getting CC'ed to hell by the other infested staggers/knockdowns, or when one randomly sneaks up on you, which is not an uncommon occurence since they make no unique sounds at all and the game just LOVES randomly spawning hordes behind you in the room you cleared less than 20 seconds ago. And when they sneak up on you and hit you, in ONE SINGLE HIT: you are knocked down (which guarantees an unavoidable second hit from the Disruptor as long as you're not knocked out of range); have all of your shields taken down so if there were other infested around (especially chargers) or you're playing a frame with low health like Mag, you are just boned; have all your energy removed which, not only makes the rest of the fight extremely boring as abilities are one of the few things keeping the game unique, and replenishing energy is completely based on RNG drops unless you just happen to have the Energy Siphon artifact equipped, and if you're using an ability-based frame like Loki you are also immediately screwed; and you get your screen scrambled which makes it extremely hard to see anything or escape. ONE HIT.

How are they "challenging" in any way? If something like this counts as challenge, you may as well just make every Ancient insta-kill you on hit. Bring back the Nervos, let every Grineer deploy them, it's your fault if they latch on to you. Scorpions should take all your energy and shields on hit too, because it's your fault for not dodging the completely silent hook attack. Glorious challenge, huh?

 

Way to put words in my mouth~. Its funny you're even uttering the word challenge considering I never really claimed Distruptors were such a thing. I just happen to think if you did more than run into a crowd of infested with your head stuck in your &#! you'd likely have a better shot at survival; without getting hit by a Disruptor at all.

 

You didn't even mention the one tactic I brought up, and frankly yeah if you have Enemy Radar on its a sign that you actually care enough about your surroundings to have something to support you if you're not aware of what's going on. What's wrong with using something for what it's meant to be used?

 

Otherwise you're just going to have to be more observant.

 

But since you want to be in the position of the antagonized victim, yes.

 

You need to learn how to play better.

 

Your problem is that you're letting yourself be CC'd to hell by an enemy you could easily control the actions of, just by virtue that you know they're gonna follow you everywhere, they can spawn from a room behind you, they're going to try to surround you, and stun lock you with sheer numbers. and frankly provided you actually think about anything when you're fighting---you'd know that they all seem to automatically know where you are and generally all come from the same directions in groups provided you pay attention.

 

If you know all of this, what exactly is the problem, bro? Can you just not learn how things work in a fight? Is it that difficult to use what you know? Is it that hard for you to just freak'n dodge? Its really not as hard as you're trying to make it sound---because actually if you do a tight circular dodge/run  fairly close they will always miss. Further I'm guessing you don't know how to side dodge either, do you? Y'know when you go into first person view and dodge left? 

 

That's actually pretty useful if you bother to do it.

 

By the way...Disruptors do make a sound, they make the sound all Ancients make when they're running at you, which is usually the only time I can imagine one actually 'sneaking up on you' if you're so busy trying to deal with the other infested. When you hear that sound it should be enough to make you go 'Huh I should probably try to make some space for myself.'

 

The spawn rate of infested in general when you're playing the game isn't so high that you can't have time to pan around the room after you've killed crap to see what's going on around you. I'd know~. I've played this game long enough, and killed quite my share of infested. 

 

Oh, and here's the kicker! I play a mag, I even solo with her all the time, so what's all this crap about being screwed? I'm not even that good a player and I've rarely found myself in any such position where I've been hit more than just once by a disruptor if I've been hit at all. So where's your guaranteed second hit? Oh! Probably where you dropped your sense of tactics and common sense.

 

Now while I can agree losing all of your energy in one hit is a bit much, and could be tweaked, I won't be making wild accusations about how difficult something is. Especially when apparently you have no idea what the hell a challenge is and certainly aren't the person to go to when it comes to being observant.

 

If you're so bored without your abilities, maybe it'd be important enough to you to learn how to pay attention to the world around you and stop flocking around hoping the AI'll be stupid enough to just sit there and look at you realize they just might knock you on your butt. (Which frankly at times they already practically do.)

 

I wasn't out to call anyone a nub, or make fun of anyone's inexperience--but if you really want to be put in that position I'll give you what you want.

Edited June 22, 2013 by Hauteclere

[Mhak]

I only get tagged by disruptors if I seriously screw up and to be honest I never really get upset about it. Almost always it means I wasn't paying attention and I deserved it.