Why do I see so much Trinity hate on Xbox lately?

[Madway7]

5 minutes ago, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

I would play with your build some more my friend because Abating Link is (in my opinion) one of the best augments in game and completely negates the need to run CP in your aura slot. 

Usually if I play her I'm in a team that will handle most of the killing anyways. If Link took about 5 or 6 enemies at a time then I would have given it more consideration, but I just use it to negate status effects while I manage the teams health and DR.

So at least in my case I don't see much need for armor debuffing especially since my team will be doing most of the work.

But hey, I haven't played her in a while so I might just look at the builds I have on her again.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Madway7

[The_Madman_of_Chaos]

Just now, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

It is arguably criminal to build low duration Trinity especially now that Blessing gives a flat 75%(capped) DR buff. You no longer need to wait till your team need your divine intervention because they almost got dead. Just keep blessing up on your team the whole mission. You should never sacrifice her whole kit for just one ability.

EXACTLY MY POINT. 

Fair point, but it really depends on the mission in question. If it is a fun little group doing low level mission for whatever reason, going old EV builds would be better in my opinion. Your team dying isn't as much an issue, so keeping them full on energy to use powers and cleave through trash mobs would be better. For higher end missions, a more blessing focused build would be better.

[(XBOX)Mr Grouchy Bear]

1 minute ago, The_Madman_of_Chaos said:

Fair point, but it really depends on the mission in question. If it is a fun little group doing low level mission for whatever reason, going old EV builds would be better in my opinion. Your team dying isn't as much an issue, so keeping them full on energy to use powers and cleave through trash mobs would be better. For higher end missions, a more blessing focused build would be better.

I can see your point here but I guess I tend to use my weapons and not my abilities to tear through low level trash mobs.

[Sloan441]

EV Trins are usually a sign of an inexperienced Trin player that has bought into some crap he's read on the intardwebz.

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with the build, but it's a specialized build for use with...wait for it...premade teams. Taking one into a PuG intent on relatively high level content is unwise.

If you're on your own--and in a PuG you usually are--then you should be running a duration build intent on leveraging link and using blessing to help out any of your new PuGmates that might have clue and stay nearby. Regardless, you're going to be running and gunning (or hacking) and this is the usual Dominator Trinity playstyle--get in their face and dare them to do something about it...then gun them down. Rinse and repeat essentially forever or until hand cramps become an issue.

In a very low level game, it won't really matter since the enemies can't even reliably deal with her base shields. Once you hit 30ish, though, things change and while EV Trins are fine for helping out other 'frames built to work with her, teams not built with working with her in mind are going to leave her in a less than desirable place.

[Aesthetic_Dialectic]

What I find stupid about people complaining about max duration trinities is even after both Blessing nerfs, she's still the best tank in the game... Even at 50% DR from only healing yourself from blessing with link you're still far tankier than anything but Valkyr, however you can use rage and quick thinking combo as well as EV in order to never lose your tanking ability, and pairing this with the Simulor basically makes you unstoppable. And having an unkillable teammate is a worthy asset. I just wish well of life wasn't so god damn useless.

Edited November 2, 2016 by silkygoodness

[Yzjdriel]

1 hour ago, Minion135 said:

I don't get why you would do min duration anymore. Kill the EV target, bam insta-energy. No need to gimp all other abilities just for quicker regen on energy when you can already get it instantly by killing targets.

The reason for this is simple.  You can spam the ability to regain shields for your team quickly.  If I have to stop to shoot something every time I EV it, I'm losing both time and energy.

Add that to the fact that Bless Trin is now irrelevant due to the rework, and I see absolutely no reason to pretend as though I'm a Bless Trin anymore.  She was an abomination and needed to go, and as a Trinity main I can say that with impunity.  Bless Trin did three things: abuse game mechanics (strike 1), force a player to continually shoot themselves in the foot with their melee weapon - which required that melee weapon to be in hand and not quick melee'd (strike 2), and encourage people to take builds that were unintelligently designed to missions, counting on Bless Trin to save them from their inability to (a) build a Warframe to survive a mission above Level 20, (b) use cover to avoid being shot, and (c) learn to prioritize the enemies that will deal the most damage if not killed immediately (strike 3).  One, two, three strikes:  it's bad.

Meanwhile, high duration builds are still fun.  Well of Life and EV both become stuns, allowing you to effectively keep two major targets in place - Synthesis targets being notable for this:  they'll now have 10x their already incredibly high health, which will stop any morons or trolls who happen to be in your cell from killing it before you can scan it.

Link Trin has also jumped in use since her rework.  I find it odd that people are suddenly realizing that you can tank with Trinity WITHOUT abusing game mechanics.

[Aesthetic_Dialectic]

2 minutes ago, Yzjdriel said:

The reason for this is simple.  You can spam the ability to regain shields for your team quickly.  If I have to stop to shoot something every time I EV it, I'm losing both time and energy.

Add that to the fact that Bless Trin is now irrelevant due to the rework, and I see absolutely no reason to pretend as though I'm a Bless Trin anymore.  She was an abomination and needed to go, and as a Trinity main I can say that with impunity.  Bless Trin did three things: abuse game mechanics (strike 1), force a player to continually shoot themselves in the foot with their melee weapon - which required that melee weapon to be in hand and not quick melee'd (strike 2), and encourage people to take builds that were unintelligently designed to missions, counting on Bless Trin to save them from their inability to (a) build a Warframe to survive a mission above Level 20, (b) use cover to avoid being shot, and (c) learn to prioritize the enemies that will deal the most damage if not killed immediately (strike 3).  One, two, three strikes:  it's bad.

Meanwhile, high duration builds are still fun.  Well of Life and EV both become stuns, allowing you to effectively keep two major targets in place - Synthesis targets being notable for this:  they'll now have 10x their already incredibly high health, which will stop any morons or trolls who happen to be in your cell from killing it before you can scan it.

Link Trin has also jumped in use since her rework.  I find it odd that people are suddenly realizing that you can tank with Trinity WITHOUT abusing game mechanics.

The thing about this though is that her, "cc" is completely pointless when in nearly every group you have a good CC frame like Vauban, Nyx, Nova, Loki, Mag, Rhino, Frost, Titania, Equinox and more I am sure I am forgetting. All of which have strong enough CC to make her tiny contribution redundant.

As well I agree, and I still think Blessing needs another rework. I think a AoE centered around her that does strong passive HP Regen and massive DR with maybe some other benefits. This would encourage people to stick by their tanks energy refilling friend.

[(XBOX)Mr Grouchy Bear]

3 minutes ago, Yzjdriel said:

The reason for this is simple.  You can spam the ability to regain shields for your team quickly.  If I have to stop to shoot something every time I EV it, I'm losing both time and energy.

Add that to the fact that Bless Trin is now irrelevant due to the rework, and I see absolutely no reason to pretend as though I'm a Bless Trin anymore.  She was an abomination and needed to go, and as a Trinity main I can say that with impunity.  Bless Trin did three things: abuse game mechanics (strike 1), force a player to continually shoot themselves in the foot with their melee weapon - which required that melee weapon to be in hand and not quick melee'd (strike 2), and encourage people to take builds that were unintelligently designed to missions, counting on Bless Trin to save them from their inability to (a) build a Warframe to survive a mission above Level 20, (b) use cover to avoid being shot, and (c) learn to prioritize the enemies that will deal the most damage if not killed immediately (strike 3).  One, two, three strikes:  it's bad.

Meanwhile, high duration builds are still fun.  Well of Life and EV both become stuns, allowing you to effectively keep two major targets in place - Synthesis targets being notable for this:  they'll now have 10x their already incredibly high health, which will stop any morons or trolls who happen to be in your cell from killing it before you can scan it.

Link Trin has also jumped in use since her rework.  I find it odd that people are suddenly realizing that you can tank with Trinity WITHOUT abusing game mechanics.

I agree that the old blessing trin was an abuse of game mechanics and needed a change however you are dead wrong when you say that Bless is now irrelevant. The EV build is also INCREDIBLY flawed. Why build around one ability at the expense of all others. Ok you fill your team's energy instantly and replenish shields but you cannot tank high dps/burst damage, cant stun a high priority target (like a bursa) and you can kiss your DR from blessing goodbye. 

[(PSN)Magician_NG]

If I go into a mission and see a Trinity I expect zero support from that player.

That's just how things are now.

She's a solo tank with infinite energy, who doesn't contribute anything to the squad outside of an EV-spam-build.

[(XBOX)Mr Grouchy Bear]

24 minutes ago, silkygoodness said:

The thing about this though is that her, "cc" is completely pointless when in nearly every group you have a good CC frame like Vauban, Nyx, Nova, Loki, Mag, Rhino, Frost, Titania, Equinox and more I am sure I am forgetting. All of which have strong enough CC to make her tiny contribution redundant.

As well I agree, and I still think Blessing needs another rework. I think a AoE centered around her that does strong passive HP Regen and massive DR with maybe some other benefits. This would encourage people to stick by their tanks energy refilling friend.

I agree that viewing a duration build's EV and WoL as a CC is kind of pointless when you have CC frames on your team. But if you see a priority target before your cc oriented teammate does, stun the mo fo. I would love to see WoL reworked because that is the one ability in my kit I do not use regularly and has little if any utility. 

 

20 minutes ago, (PS4)Magician_NG said:

If I go into a mission and see a Trinity I expect zero support from that player.

That's just how things are now.

She's a solo tank with infinite energy, who doesn't contribute anything to the squad outside of an EV-spam-build.

Ah finally one of the naysayers emerge...... So I suppose that 75% DR for all teammates, ability to strip 100% of armor from enemies, replenish energy, shields and health all while tanking major amounts of damage are in no way useful to a squad? Yea you're right you can't rely on Trinity for anything........

Edited November 2, 2016 by (XB1)U Go Buh Bye

[(PSN)Magician_NG]

5 minutes ago, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

75% DR for all teammates, ability to strip 100% of armor from enemies, replenish energy, shields and health all while tanking major amounts of damage are in no way useful to a squad? Yea you're right you can't rely on Trinity for anything........

How often is every squad member within 50m of your Trinity to receive that Blessing?

In pug, running a non-defensive mission type, I'm assuming not very often.

In a coordinated squad sure she's great, but in a pug squad....people will be people.

Edited November 2, 2016 by (PS4)Magician_NG

[(XBOX)Mr Grouchy Bear]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Magician_NG said:

How often is every squad member within 50m of your Trinity to receive that Blessing?

In pug, running a non-defensive mission type, I'm assuming not very often.

In a coordinated squad sure she's great, but in a squad....people will be people.

Playing Trinity, positioning is your responsibility if your looking to spread the blessing buff and replenish team energy. Part of playing a support frame is moving about the map to, you know, support where needed. Likewise it is your squad's responsibility to keep tabs on where Trinity is and staying nearby to make life easier for both of you. That being said, if you run off on your own in a difficult offensive mission and get stomped you have only yourself to blame. If you are playing low level content and smashing through everything then you never needed support anyways and shouldn't need a squad to pull you through. 

[Yzjdriel]

22 minutes ago, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

I agree that the old blessing trin was an abuse of game mechanics and needed a change however you are dead wrong when you say that Bless is now irrelevant. The EV build is also INCREDIBLY flawed. Why build around one ability at the expense of all others. Ok you fill your team's energy instantly and replenish shields but you cannot tank high dps/burst damage, cant stun a high priority target (like a bursa) and you can kiss your DR from blessing goodbye. 

A Bless Trin (the build that specifically revolved around shooting yourself in the foot) IS irrelevant.  This is readily apparent from the lack of teams with three players who can't survive on their own with a Trinity backing them up.  A high-duration build, on the other hand, is still exactly as useful as it always was, but for different reasons.  Making everyone into a tank is awesome.  Making everyone able to survive anything even though they suck was not.

[(XBOX)Mr Grouchy Bear]

1 minute ago, Yzjdriel said:

A Bless Trin (the build that specifically revolved around shooting yourself in the foot) IS irrelevant.  This is readily apparent from the lack of teams with three players who can't survive on their own with a Trinity backing them up.  A high-duration build, on the other hand, is still exactly as useful as it always was, but for different reasons.  Making everyone into a tank is awesome.  Making everyone able to survive anything even though they suck was not.

I see I misunderstood you when you said Bless is irrelevant. Yes the old suicide bless trin build is where it belongs, in the trash. 

[Yzjdriel]

28 minutes ago, silkygoodness said:

The thing about this though is that her, "cc" is completely pointless when in nearly every group you have a good CC frame like Vauban, Nyx, Nova, Loki, Mag, Rhino, Frost, Titania, Equinox and more I am sure I am forgetting. All of which have strong enough CC to make her tiny contribution redundant.

As well I agree, and I still think Blessing needs another rework. I think a AoE centered around her that does strong passive HP Regen and massive DR with maybe some other benefits. This would encourage people to stick by their tanks energy refilling friend.

Blessing needs to scale off range mods.  End of discussion.  My pre-rework playstyle hinged on the ability to refill my teammates' health and energy from anywhere within line of sight.  This 50m stuff is great for team-building as it forces the rushers to either slow down or learn to survive (either of which I'm perfectly okay with), but in high-level content it's too restricting.  If we're doing an ODD we should be able to roam about the tile freely to mop up enemies or activate killframe without having to stick near the pod 25/8 (let's be honest here - one properly modded Frost bubble will cover the 'defend the objective' part for ten waves at the least).

Edited November 2, 2016 by Yzjdriel

[Yzjdriel]

1 minute ago, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

I see I misunderstood you when you said Bless is irrelevant. Yes the old suicide bless trin build is where it belongs, in the trash. 

...

...

Someone on the Forums actually plays Trinity instead of "break the game to help my equally incompetent teammates win!" other than me??

HOLY CARP!

 

In all seriousness, though, you're awesome.  Keep up the arse-kicking.

 

And all you other Trins who didn't do that either, but just derp around in tank mode, you're awesome too.  I'm just excited that I finally found someone who agreed with me that Bless Trin was a crime against gaming.

[(PSN)Magician_NG]

5 minutes ago, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

Playing Trinity, positioning is your responsibility if your looking to spread the blessing buff and replenish team energy.

Too many expectations from my video game.

I assume jack and squat from a Trinity player, and I feel people would be less upset about Trinity if they did the same.

 

[(XBOX)Mr Grouchy Bear]

1 minute ago, Yzjdriel said:

Blessing needs to scale off range mods.  End of discussion.  My playstyle hinged on the ability to refill my teammates' health and energy from anywhere within line of sight.  This 50m stuff is great for team-building as it forces the rushers to either slow down or learn to survive (either of which I'm perfectly okay with), but in high-level content it's too restricting.  If we're doing an ODD we should be able to roam about the tile freely to mop up enemies or activate killframe without having to stick near the pod 25/8 (let's be honest here - one properly modded Frost bubble will cover the 'defend the objective' part for ten waves at the least).

I agree that it might be nice to have blessing build off of range mods but I do so reluctantly. Having the range of blessing independent of range mods has allowed me to build a link tank build that works with slightly negative range. 50m is pretty huge as it is and don't quote me on this but I'm pretty sure the Vazarin tree can extend the range of blessing.

[(XBOX)Mr Grouchy Bear]

 

4 minutes ago, (PS4)Magician_NG said:

Too many expectations from my video game.

I assume jack and squat from a Trinity player, and I feel people would be less upset about Trinity if they did the same.

 

I like how you zero in on that one line from my response and then add nothing more to validate your side of the argument. Too many expectations hm? I suppose you specialize in press-4-to-win frames. Or maybe your that guy that runs low level extermination missions with a world on fire ember.....

[Tode_Gleich]

Did this thread just turn into a Energy Vampire/Vampire Leech hate thread? That is a valuable skill within itself.

[(PSN)Bosnia_Akhalar]

2 hours ago, Minion135 said:

I don't get why you would do min duration anymore. Kill the EV target, bam insta-energy. No need to gimp all other abilities just for quicker regen on energy when you can already get it instantly by killing targets.

EV target is not always near EV to kill. Some time, example, in phase 1 stage 2 LOR ( stand on pads to unlock the door ), EV bring energy to the team while standing. Also in some missions, EV can't kill target fast enough if not bring Tigris prime. Some mission, EV uses spell to deal damage to enemy faster than shooting ( Sentient ) ... just some examples.

 

I use hybrid Trinity ( max duration, some range, some power strength ), I see it is not easy to kill target fast in Sortie 3 Eximus ( or Enemy Armor Enhance )

1 hour ago, The_Madman_of_Chaos said:

Really, play the game how you want. High end, min-max modding is not for everyone, every mission, or every frame. If you are having fun, and not dying once a minute(Unless you have some sort of "Beyond the Grave" build with long bleed out time and high damage boost...) then you'll be doing fine.

oh yeah, waste 1 team slot for a frame can't help to do mission. just like Eximus Sortie, if the team doesnt have 1 EV, then others will burn a lot of enery pads. I'm sick of those players still try to have fun while ruining other's fun.

[Korakian]

I've never seen anyone complain about a trinity in their squad, never even seen that much of "EV!!!!!!" in public matches. The only place where i've seen the hate on EV trin not doing his/her job is LoR, because there it is their job to keep the squads energy maxed.

[Sloan441]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Magician_NG said:

If I go into a mission and see a Trinity I expect zero support from that player.

 

Actually, when I go into a mission with Trinity, I expect to offer zero support since I probably won't see my teammates after the first 15 seconds.

[(PSN)Magician_NG]

31 minutes ago, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

I like how you zero in on that one line from my response and then add nothing more to validate your side of the argument. Too many expectations hm? I suppose you specialize in press-4-to-win frames. Or maybe your that guy that runs low level extermination missions with a world on fire ember.....

Were we having an argument?

I felt no need to validate anything.

And I'm not the one who's instigating an argument with insults here.

[Aesthetic_Dialectic]

52 minutes ago, Yzjdriel said:

Blessing needs to scale off range mods.  End of discussion.  My pre-rework playstyle hinged on the ability to refill my teammates' health and energy from anywhere within line of sight.  This 50m stuff is great for team-building as it forces the rushers to either slow down or learn to survive (either of which I'm perfectly okay with), but in high-level content it's too restricting.  If we're doing an ODD we should be able to roam about the tile freely to mop up enemies or activate killframe without having to stick near the pod 25/8 (let's be honest here - one properly modded Frost bubble will cover the 'defend the objective' part for ten waves at the least).

The range of Blessing isn't even close to it's biggest problem. It promotes bad game play behaviour. I tells you to lets your teammates(or you) get low health on health in order to get the benefits instead of ya know BEING PROACTIVE. 

1 hour ago, (XB1)U Go Buh Bye said:

I agree that viewing a duration build's EV and WoL as a CC is kind of pointless when you have CC frames on your team. But if you see a priority target before your cc oriented teammate does, stun the mo fo. I would love to see WoL reworked because that is the one ability in my kit I do not use regularly and has little if any utility. 

 

Ah finally one of the naysayers emerge...... So I suppose that 75% DR for all teammates, ability to strip 100% of armor from enemies, replenish energy, shields and health all while tanking major amounts of damage are in no way useful to a squad? Yea you're right you can't rely on Trinity for anything........

Typically I build my CC frames to keep entire rooms CC'd constantly. But usually that's a Nyx or Vauban(my two favorite frames), but I can see in like a level 100 mission making sure a heavy gunner or two don't wreak too much havoc, but really with good players this shouldn't be necessary. I really think Well of Life should be replaced with a better CC ability because it's healing is redundant with Blessing which keeps everyone topped off always. She should be a swiss army knife support frame who focuses on buffs, survivability and healing. She doesn't need synergies or to stack healing if she has one amazing source and instead could expand her kit to help with more situations. Or maybe receive a utility power if we want to leave CC to our Vaubans and Nyxes.

 

Also this thread moves too fast, I'm a busy man. =(

Edited November 2, 2016 by silkygoodness