[Spoilers] Feedback for "the thing"

[Arxfiend]

I'm going to make this quick. Any complaints? Yes? Suck it up, buttercup.
 

1. Operator should be a fully viable playstyle: Give the kid more health, and make that beam do more damage (or at least scale damage). Even on a 3-5 mission, I only made it through 16 enemies before I was forced back into my frame. I want to dominate Saturn, maybe even Pluto, without a Warframe. Come on, DE.
2. Alt-fire should effect the class. I mean, we're directly playing as the kid who just used Phoenix gaze. Can he only do that as a hologram?

I'll add more as I see fit.

[Xekrin]

10 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

Suck it up, buttercup.

I came in here expecting more of the same but surprisingly I agree with both points.  Though that is assuming the second one relates to focus, you called it alt-fire which made me think of the mouse wheel button.

Also, how did you know my high school nickname?! 

[bowiespoon]

Crouching and Rolling would also be great, or at least give the void dash a lower energy cost. Operators die easily not only because they have no health, but because they can't dodge anything.

It should be mentioned that they don't really have any advantages over a warframe. My warframe out damages, outmaneuvers, has a melee attack that doesn't require energy, and can take much more of a beating. Oh, and it has much stronger powers. I'd love for DE to work some magic on these guys - the groundwork is there for them to be amazing. Have the focus system tie into the operator's abilities, and give them an edge over our warframes in some way. Until they can outperform our frames in at least one way, they'll ultimately be nothing more than a gimmick. A fun gimmick, but a gimmick nonetheless.

I'd also like for mission types that specifically cater to operator gameplay. Require us to switch back and forth, with areas that only the warframe can access, and areas that only the operators can access.

Oh, and please let their heads move as we look around

[chainchompguy3]

2 hours ago, bowiespoon said:

I'd also like for mission types that specifically cater to operator gameplay. Require us to switch back and forth, with areas that only the warframe can access, and areas that only the operators can access.

While I would like some expansion on the concept, I would be highly opposed to, say, a room on each tileset that can only be entered via Operator or Warframe.

I am fully in support of having a system that highly encourages the use of one or the other, but just flat out restricting our options because DE wants us to use Operators is not so fun.

Especially seeing as how all of that content would only be available to post-TWW players.

 

I'm already not all that comfortable with the new Kuva guardians: I'd like there to be an option to take them out without operators, but have it be highly disadvantageous and difficult to pull off. That way, you are encouraged, but not forced, to use Operator.

 

2 hours ago, H2K3 said:

Operator should be a fully viable playstyle: Give the kid more health, and make that beam do more damage (or at least scale damage). Even on a 3-5 mission, I only made it through 16 enemies before I was forced back into my frame. I want to dominate Saturn, maybe even Pluto, without a Warframe. Come on, DE.

Would that not essentially be having a frame-within-a-frame, then?

I understand the desire to make the Operator mechanic more effective, but buffing them up to the durability and damage of a frame essentially makes them a frame.

Part of the reason we have such a semi-large number of frames to choose from is because we actually have to make a choice, and choose just 1, and just the right one, for the situation.

If you want access to 2 frames in the same mission, then I suggest playing equinox.

 

But then again, this is all just a difference of opinion. I view the Operator mechanic as a sort of augmenting side-arm to our warframes, giving us other choices to use in combat.

Whereas you seem to think of it as a new essential game mechanic which gives the ability to change playstyle mid-mission, and even allow DE to have more varied content.

[Insizer]

from what I've heard, the devs are planning to combine the Focus system with the Operator system.

[Arxfiend]

6 hours ago, chainchompguy3 said:

-snip-

Well, of course that content could only be accessed after TWW. But I'm pretty sure It'd be more like Lua than a tile on already-existent missions.

And while you seem to partially understand me, I'm not asking for a frame. I am asking for operator to be more viable in combat. Of course my warframe is going to be more maneuverable, able to take more of a beating, and can do more damage overall. But is it too much to ask that I be able to actually operate effectively? What if I want to be able to play as the operator for a few missions, and not the warframe?

The thing about the operator mechanic is that it can be both either way. I use my sidearm as a, well, side-arm. Others use only their sidearm. The secondary weapon is both, depending on your style

[chainchompguy3]

5 hours ago, H2K3 said:

Well, of course that content could only be accessed after TWW. But I'm pretty sure It'd be more like Lua than a tile on already-existent missions.

And while you seem to partially understand me, I'm not asking for a frame. I am asking for operator to be more viable in combat. Of course my warframe is going to be more maneuverable, able to take more of a beating, and can do more damage overall. But is it too much to ask that I be able to actually operate effectively? What if I want to be able to play as the operator for a few missions, and not the warframe?

The thing about the operator mechanic is that it can be both either way. I use my sidearm as a, well, side-arm. Others use only their sidearm. The secondary weapon is both, depending on your style

I had to do quite a bit of internalizing my own thoughts on this, to try and figure out how I felt about that. I came to this conclusion:

 

I brought up the "Operator as side-arm" analogy as a means of describing how it was used, but I did not mean "side-arm" in the warframe sense.

 

In Warframe, yes, the sidearm is a mostly viable alternative playstyle, and most sidearms stand up well as an actual weapon. They are only really weak by comparison to primaries.

 

But what I meant in the analogy was more of in the sense of my perception of real-life combat: you will almost always use your "Primary". The only times you would ever reach for your "sidearm" is if your current situation prevents your primary from being usable, such as having been disarmed.

In a weird way, this makes using the side-arm special. You use it rarely, but when you do, it is because you need something to fall back on and rely upon.

 

That is how I feel about the Operator. It is something I see as being intended to feel special. It should feel important when you climb out of your warframe and stop that X from hurting Y.

 

Thus, your frequent voicing of your desire to "run a mission Operator only" has been rubbing me the wrong way: To spend an entire mission as the operator would detract from it's special-ness, and thus defeat it's purpose (Well, the purpose that I have given it).

 

Now, if the Special-ness could be preserved, like how the entirety of TWW was a special mostly-operator-only event, then I would have no problem with it. But Warframe is a very grindy game, where things are repeated over and over. Boss-fights become warframe-part treadmills. Missions become Resource/exp farms. Almighty sorties become cheese-filled.

So I doubt that the Operator can be given significant combat-viability without tainting it. Thus, I would like to see future Operator Buffs to not be centered around combat, but around special utility, like how the current Rift-Crouch allows for stealth on previously non-stealthy frames, or how the Current Laser-beam completely screws Sentients over.

 

 

 

Hopefully this rant of mine wasn't too eye-breaking. I'm kind of groggy-feeling right now, so I'm not exactly at my best here. Sorry in advance.